SoberNotMature - Episode 175 (Serene Curmudgeons)

 

00:00:01.96
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:00:04.63
Bill
All right, everyone. Welcome once again to another episode of Sober Not Mature. The reason we were laughing coming in is because so we'll we'll talk about the the guest here in a minute, or say what happened with the guest, not talk about the guest.

00:00:18.65
Mike
oh ha

00:00:19.50
Bill
That sounded bad.

00:00:19.62
Mike
shit

00:00:20.48
Bill
But Mike bi he needed to go grab his book because we're doing a solo episode with us, and he um He goes, okay, i'm back. I'm like, just get but get this bitch rolling. I hit start. He's like, wait a minute. and I'm like, fuck it.

00:00:30.99
Bill
It's already going, man.

00:00:31.21
Mike
yeah

00:00:32.23
Bill
Nothing I could do. So welcome. And I'm not cutting that out. You're going to hear us fucking laughing at the beginning. So fuck it. All right.

00:00:38.99
Mike
Yep.

00:00:39.92
Bill
So anyhow, um we, ah well, I guess I'll do my standard. Hey, Mike, are you, are you Kate?

00:00:44.23
Mike
Hey.

00:00:45.42
Bill
Yeah.

00:00:46.20
Mike
I am not Kate. Wait, hang on. it Let me look. no Nope. There's a thing here. Hang on.

00:00:50.63
Bill
yeah And i I am not Kate. So here here's the deal. We had it we had a technical um issue. Not a big deal. We will have Kate on again. um it was just a basically an equipment type of setup and we weren't going to get the the right audio.

00:01:03.69
Bill
um And we've we've said this openly, obviously, to to anyone that's listened to us for a while. um Our goal Since I mean, well, two things, whether we were just audio only or not, right? Because even if we had video, you know, people don't just want to look at these smiling faces, um which us, which us they don't want to anyhow, but that that's a whole nother story.

00:01:13.97
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:01:17.43
Mike
ah

00:01:20.14
Mike
No.

00:01:21.73
Bill
But um yeah, we want the audio to be right because we want the the story to get across, you know.

00:01:26.10
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:01:26.29
Bill
um And if the audio is not right, you know, it just, ah we, we lose, we could lose an audience and it takes away from the individual that we have. So we're going to reschedule. So not a big deal.

00:01:35.80
Mike
Yep.

00:01:36.36
Bill
um Kate was kind enough to, you know obviously agree. Number one, to you know, to come on with us and obviously now agree to, to come back.

00:01:42.83
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:01:44.16
Bill
And I, she's got a good story. She does a lot of things that we, we will have her on again. So stay tuned. I'll promote the shit out of it again when, when it happens again. So.

00:01:52.52
Mike
Yes.

00:01:54.23
Bill
But anyhow, um hi Hello, everyone.

00:01:56.64
Mike
Hi there.

00:01:57.42
Bill
This is this is sober, not mature.

00:02:00.84
Mike
It is. Yes. And I'm fucking tired, man. I was hoping to like kick back because we were going have a guest, but all right, I will muster.

00:02:05.16
Bill
yeah

00:02:08.91
Mike
Let me gird my loins here. And, uh, uh,

00:02:13.16
Bill
i You know what? I guess I know what that means, but that sounds really bad. There'll be no gerging on our time.

00:02:18.40
Mike
ah GERD, not GERG.

00:02:22.68
Bill
Oh, I thought said gerging. What the fuck is gerging?

00:02:24.50
Mike
don't know. GERD.

00:02:26.24
Bill
Okay, gerd.

00:02:26.61
Mike
G-U-R-D.

00:02:28.45
Bill
Okay, even even so. leave Leave your fucking loins out of this.

00:02:31.81
Mike
yeah All right, fine.

00:02:34.58
Bill
But you know what? Here's here's the good news, Mike.

00:02:36.93
Mike
Yes.

00:02:37.01
Bill
I think you've you've known me for how long now?

00:02:37.32
Mike
15 years.

00:02:43.46
Bill
Have I ever been at a loss for words?

00:02:46.92
Mike
no never

00:02:47.86
Bill
Okay. Even, even in the worst of fucking times, actually in the worst of times, I probably talk fucking more because I don't know what, I don't know how to handle myself.

00:02:54.18
Mike
uh huh

00:02:55.05
Bill
So I think I talk more if, uh, if, you know, if I'm, if I'm going through some shit. So, um, I, yeah, I don't, I've never been to loss for words. So my point is, is you can still relax. You ever just, just do every once in a while.

00:03:06.25
Bill
Do you just go, uh, uh, yeah. Oh, okay. Yeah. But um you know what? i The thing of it is, and I do it all the time now and probably wasting paper half the time, but I printed out my stuff.

00:03:18.90
Bill
So I got some things. I know maybe you got some things and you got a book. You went and grabbed a book. So why don't we, let's let's calm the fuck down for a minute, okay?

00:03:23.52
Mike
I did grab a book. If

00:03:27.87
Bill
Everyone just calm down.

00:03:29.58
Mike
I calm, more calm, I'm going to go to sleep.

00:03:32.67
Bill
Settle down, calm down.

00:03:33.95
Mike
fifteen things

00:03:33.99
Bill
Let's get back back into the groove. And let's let's start this off with something familiar, something something good, something routine, right?

00:03:42.11
Mike
Right.

00:03:43.01
Bill
A reading.

00:03:46.30
Bill
if you get If you got one, you got one, right?

00:03:47.64
Mike
Well, I mean, i have a book. We're going to spin the wheel.

00:03:49.92
Bill
Just... That's fine.

00:03:51.93
Mike
Because, again, we thought we had a guest. So, yes, I've got nothing prepared. So, um let's try it pretty much.

00:03:59.29
Bill
It's the story of our lives, anyhow. Welcome to Sober Not Mature. We have nothing prepared. Okay.

00:04:06.53
Mike
Okay, um here this will work. ah August 9th. Sure, why not? um Wait, no, shit. I didn't spin the wheel. Hang on, here we go. Let me reach over here, grab the wheel, give it a good, grab gird my wheel, and here we go.

00:04:18.25
Bill
Grab your loins.

00:04:22.38
Mike
All right, here we go. um august night I don't know. Let's see what this says.

00:04:34.33
Mike
The problem is not that there are problems. The problem is expecting otherwise and thinking that having problems is a problem. Theodore Rubin. Clearly didn't have time to look him up.

00:04:47.12
Mike
Google that shit. All right. As long as we live and breathe, we'll have problems. They are simply a part of life. We need to get used to the fact and stop getting upset about every problem that comes along.

00:05:02.52
Mike
We can use the same process to solve our problems as we use to stay sober. First, we take a good look at the issue and decide how big it really is. Then we decide whether it is something we can handle by ourselves.

00:05:16.93
Mike
If we need help, we get it Then we think through all the parts of the problem and decide how to fix it. We can talk it over with someone else for feedback. Now we take action.

00:05:29.84
Mike
Sometimes fixing a problem takes time and we have to have patience. Sometimes it can't be fixed and we need to learn to live with it. Remember, having problems just a part of life.

00:05:42.72
Mike
And overall, life is a lot better than it used to be. Prayer for the day. Higher power. Help me pay attention and do what I need to do about my problems and then let go. Today's action.

00:05:58.79
Mike
Today i will make a list of my problems. I will decide if I'm doing the right things to work on them today. Then I will relax and do something fun.

00:06:11.19
Bill
I'm going to stress myself out with my problems.

00:06:13.31
Mike
Yes.

00:06:14.11
Bill
Then I'm going to relax.

00:06:15.30
Mike
Yes.

00:06:16.71
Bill
Sit down. Fucking relax. You just got this whole bowl of problems over here. Now sit down and relax.

00:06:20.62
Mike
Uh-huh. Mm-hmm.

00:06:22.52
Bill
Okay, so um first of all, that was a good one. And I remember that's one of those readings that every year when it comes around, I like it because it just, I don't know, every every single part of it is just, it's it's something that I know I need to do.

00:06:25.19
Mike
Yep.

00:06:36.68
Bill
I think we collectively need to do

00:06:37.45
Mike
Uh-huh. Sure.

00:06:38.98
Bill
Um, and it's a hell of a fucking reminder. Um, okay. But the, the end thing, the action part, do you have, I mean, if you had to sit down right now and make a list of your problems, um, would you, I'm not going to ask you what your problems might be, but would you have a list, you know, do you think that you should or could write down?

00:06:51.13
Mike
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

00:06:58.16
Mike
Um, not much. I mean, yeah, not really a whole hell of a lot.

00:07:01.07
Bill
Right. Right.

00:07:04.01
Mike
I mean, you know, clearly life is not, you know, uh, strawberries and orgasms all the time. Um, you know, yes, exactly.

00:07:11.25
Bill
Thank you, Heidi.

00:07:13.05
Mike
Um, you know, I certainly have, uh, strawberries and I certainly have orgasms. Um, just not constantly, which is good because, you know, i'd be fat and and dumb.

00:07:25.15
Mike
Um,

00:07:28.10
Mike
Right. But yeah, you know, I, of course I have problems, you know, we can all use a little bit more money. Um, you know, yeah it always comes to mind.

00:07:34.25
Bill
Right?

00:07:36.15
Mike
um but you know, I got enough. Um, Yeah, you know, yes, of course I have problems, but nothing huge. And, you know, like used to tell the guys in group, right, all the time, um you know, all that shit you're worried about, all that shit that you've got to, here's my first air quotes, take care of, 90% of it's going to take care of itself.

00:07:59.58
Bill
Right.

00:07:59.60
Mike
You know, have we we're not in control. um You know, and that 10%, Gosh, shit, like the reading said, you know, some you more than likely, if it is something that we can actually do something about, it's probably going to take some time to get it worked out. So, you know, fucking A, man. Chill out.

00:08:18.37
Mike
It's all good.

00:08:18.63
Bill
right

00:08:19.39
Mike
Yeah. Yeah. But I mean, you know, so, yes, I have small problems here and there, but 90% of it works itself out in that 10% I'm working working on

00:08:30.39
Bill
Right. And that's a that's actually a great way to put it. I mean, ah in to say that, um I mean, I could I could sit here and and lie and say I have no problems, which is a is a fucking lie.

00:08:40.74
Bill
Everyone has something going on.

00:08:40.95
Mike
Of course. Yeah, right.

00:08:43.05
Bill
and But, you know, it it is. It's what what degree is it? Is it you know, it's like when the old the meme or the saying it's like, did did you have a bad day or did one thing happen and you fucking milked it the entire day?

00:08:54.40
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:08:54.79
Bill
You know, do you really have a major problem where you've got this thing and you just decided to to blow it out of proportion? You know?

00:09:00.58
Mike
Right. Yeah.

00:09:01.49
Bill
You know, or, um you know, think about the future and freak out for no goddamn reason when, because we were talking about that.

00:09:06.75
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:09:08.27
Bill
We've talked about it plenty of times.

00:09:09.74
Mike
Yeah.

00:09:10.01
Bill
All these things that could happen, whether it be, you know, somebody who's newly elected to this national office, um the things that are going on in the world in general, maybe a job situation.

00:09:18.80
Mike
Right.

00:09:20.05
Bill
Shit, you guys had a fucking meeting how many months ago.

00:09:22.52
Mike
Yeah.

00:09:22.83
Bill
um You could have freaked out or you could have just went out your way and they just you just went out your and they worked your fucking ass off since then.

00:09:27.57
Mike
Yeah, pretty much.

00:09:27.83
Bill
Yeah. They're like, hey, we might have a problem, but we're going to work you like a fucking dog anyhow, you know.

00:09:33.70
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:09:33.99
Bill
But um so, you know, again, all these different things. And you were the one that said it's like none of these things have happened yet, you know.

00:09:39.59
Mike
Right.

00:09:40.23
Bill
And that's that is one of my one of my biggest problems, I guess, as I'm thinking about it, is the fact that I blow problems out of proportion, you know.

00:09:44.19
Mike
ah see Right.

00:09:48.49
Bill
um However, I've learned to voice those usually to you. And a lot of times onm here, know. And, you know, they come out of my mouth. I'm like, that's so fucking stupid.

00:09:59.33
Bill
That's just...

00:10:00.20
Mike
Hand.

00:10:01.00
Bill
like Jesus Christ, I can't even believe I just wasted, you know, four minutes of, of you know, quote unquote airtime on on that because it was stupid.

00:10:07.01
Mike
our time mr hand

00:10:07.32
Bill
It was, yes, I just wasted our time on that bullshit that I talked about, um you know, but but yes, I like how you said, too, that, you know, the problems that we have, we're we're working through them.

00:10:12.08
Mike
ah huh

00:10:19.20
Bill
And the the end result, I think that you said it before, is there you have the the faith, I think you've said, you know, knowing that things are going to work out right.

00:10:25.72
Mike
Yeah. Right. Exactly. and you know Marty used to always say, man, trust in the process.

00:10:32.69
Bill
Right.

00:10:32.91
Mike
Yeah. You know, do what you're supposed to do and shit's going to work out. It may not work out the way you want it to, but who the fuck are you?

00:10:39.70
Bill
Right.

00:10:40.27
Mike
Yeah.

00:10:40.61
Bill
Yeah. And, you know, and in nine times out of 10, and we've, we've been around and not that we've been around a long time, but we've been around long enough.

00:10:47.81
Mike
Yeah.

00:10:48.03
Bill
And even, even in the beginning that when we let shit alone, when we let shit be and get out of our own way, that not only, and you say it all the time, and I think Marty did too, um a lot of times it works out better than, you know, different, but it's better.

00:10:54.57
Mike
Yep.

00:10:57.63
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:10:59.98
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

00:11:01.38
Bill
Yeah.

00:11:01.79
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

00:11:03.09
Bill
you you didn't you didn't really need that thing anyhow. You needed this. And I'm like, oh yeah, I guess I guess i did.

00:11:06.99
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

00:11:08.25
Bill
that's That's a little bit better. I like that.

00:11:09.64
Mike
Yeah, this is way fucking shinier than that shit I was looking at before.

00:11:13.60
Bill
Yeah. And I mean, that's, that's all, that's all this and that's all that, but along with this and that over here becomes all this fucking other things that go along with it. You know, and that's the thing too, if people talk about, you know, and maybe we've talked about it on here, but you know, you look at um it's, in it's, I, I, I don't know. I guess I've been honest every once in a while that, um,

00:11:33.27
Bill
As I look at, um you know, knowing what what I went through from, you know, financial standpoint, you know a couple divorces, raging alcoholic, losing all this shit or giving it away, better way to put it, you know, over the years.

00:11:39.38
Mike
Right. Right.

00:11:43.97
Mike
Right.

00:11:46.02
Bill
And then, you know, being whatever age I am now or whatever age I was when I got sober. And then you look at other people like, well, they got they're married, they got a house and they get this, they got that. I'm like, but God, I don't want, I don't.

00:11:57.80
Bill
I don't really want all that. You know, I'm not saying that I wouldn't, um you know, like a significant other in my life. But I mean, like marriage is not number one on my list.

00:12:04.81
Mike
isn

00:12:06.69
Bill
It's not out of the question.

00:12:06.89
Mike
right

00:12:07.94
Bill
i don't know what's fucking going to happen.

00:12:09.55
Mike
Right.

00:12:09.60
Bill
um But right now at this moment, I don't want a house. If I had one, i don't know what the fuck I do.

00:12:13.35
Mike
Yeah.

00:12:15.72
Bill
I wouldn't be able to do what I'm doing.

00:12:17.19
Mike
Right.

00:12:17.67
Bill
Um, I was talking to somebody the other day and we were talking about animals and I'm like, like, I fucking love animals. These do all my, uh, when I was in Wisconsin, I'll tell you about, uh, I, I hung out with my friend Kathleen.

00:12:24.06
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:12:29.16
Bill
She's one that talking about it.

00:12:29.50
Mike
Right.

00:12:30.66
Bill
And, um, you know, I said, I just, uh, these dogs, her dog fucking loves me. You know, I've, I met this dog one time ah seven or eight years ago and then, you know, saw her again and she fucking loves me, you know?

00:12:34.20
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:12:38.06
Mike
Heh.

00:12:40.35
Mike
Yeah.

00:12:40.70
Bill
Um, but I'm like, I, I don't, I don't want to have to deal with a dog, you know, all the time, but I love Kathy's dogs.

00:12:44.47
Mike
Yeah. Mm-hmm.

00:12:47.24
Bill
I love my kids' dogs, all this shit, you know?

00:12:47.67
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right. Right.

00:12:49.84
Bill
Um, so all these things that these other people have, I'm, I'm happy. Yes. You, to your point, I'll use little bit more money. I think that goes without saying everyone out there, right.

00:12:58.37
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:12:59.18
Bill
Raise your fucking hand.

00:12:59.57
Mike
Right. Uh-huh.

00:13:02.06
Bill
who Who's going to say unless maybe maybe Father Bill, when he was trying to do is either his pilgrimage or whatever he was doing, when they're doing the vow of poverty, then they don't want.

00:13:08.23
Mike
Right.

00:13:10.92
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:13:11.27
Bill
But you're normal everyday human being, you know.

00:13:12.08
Mike
Yeah. I mean, my last name's not Bezos, so I could always use a little more money.

00:13:17.44
Bill
Yeah, you know, that motherfucker's that. He's not laying down. neither is Neither is fucking Elon Musk or, you know, fucking Bill Gates or any of these motherfuckers.

00:13:20.54
Mike
Mm-mm. Right.

00:13:24.91
Bill
I mean, they're all, they they never, they're not stopping trying to make money.

00:13:28.61
Mike
Yeah, exactly. Uh-huh.

00:13:30.54
Bill
ah Yeah. I Zuckerberg one day going, I think I got enough money. I'm good. It's not going to happen.

00:13:36.63
Mike
I'm going to shut this all down because I don't need anything else.

00:13:36.67
Bill
yeah

00:13:40.30
Bill
Yeah, I'm good. I'm good with the, you know, whatever, whatever billions I have on that's, that's enough.

00:13:43.97
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:13:46.14
Bill
But, um, so the other thing too, is that it mentioned to hear about, um, you know, obviously the, the whole thing about, I like the problems about problems or whatever they said problems like seven times.

00:13:53.55
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:13:54.38
Bill
That was funny.

00:13:55.26
Mike
Right.

00:13:55.42
Bill
Um, but, you know, try not to get upset about things. Um, and basically the, there was the analyzation of, of the problem.

00:14:03.26
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

00:14:04.46
Bill
How big is it? Do I need help? How do I fix it?

00:14:06.31
Mike
Yeah.

00:14:06.98
Bill
Take the action. But really it was kind of a, if I, were if I, well, hopefully I listened correctly. It was kind of a to-do list, right? Top to bottom on dealing with problems, right?

00:14:13.89
Mike
Yeah. Oh, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Don't sit there and get all fucking emotional about it because that's not going to do anything. yeah ah except Yeah.

00:14:20.57
Bill
Right.

00:14:21.31
Mike
Yeah. Okay. So stop, look at it, see exactly what it is. You know, is there anything I can do about it? Okay. If there is, then what can I do about it? And then fucking do it.

00:14:32.87
Bill
Right. Yeah. and if there And if there isn't, sometimes you just, as hard as it is, you just got to sit back and be like, okay, you know, I can't i can't do anything about this thing, you know?

00:14:37.71
Mike
hmm. Mm

00:14:42.24
Mike
hmm. Right. Yeah. Yeah. But yeah that you have to come to that conclusion after you try.

00:14:49.35
Bill
Right.

00:14:49.36
Mike
Yeah. Exactly.

00:14:50.07
Bill
Yeah.

00:14:50.83
Mike
Yeah. Because, you know, really it's double-edged sword there. We can easily, well, fucking nothing I can do about it.

00:14:56.08
Bill
Yeah.

00:14:56.19
Mike
La, la, la, la, la.

00:14:57.74
Bill
yeah yeah Yeah, we don't want to do that. We don't, we don't let's say, like maybe maybe this is easy easy way to put it.

00:15:01.29
Mike
No.

00:15:03.93
Bill
We don't want the extremes, right?

00:15:05.48
Mike
Right. Exactly.

00:15:06.17
Bill
one

00:15:06.56
Mike
Hmm.

00:15:06.96
Bill
I heard somebody say, probably you a handful of times, twice maybe, stay in the middle, right?

00:15:09.72
Mike
Hmm.

00:15:11.31
Bill
Just be right in the middle of that bed.

00:15:11.62
Mike
Yep.

00:15:14.68
Bill
that was ah That was a Mike original, wasn't it? Is that all yours?

00:15:17.77
Mike
I don't think so.

00:15:20.56
Bill
yeah was trying to build up your ego and give that one to you, but...

00:15:24.04
Mike
Nope.

00:15:25.30
Bill
no.

00:15:26.29
Mike
I didn't earn it.

00:15:26.37
Bill
no

00:15:27.09
Mike
I can't take it.

00:15:30.00
Bill
but No, and just real quick about Kathleen's dog. She has a dachshund. So I got her this, and I've done it over the years.

00:15:34.01
Mike
Hmm.

00:15:36.27
Bill
I mean, she she has different things.

00:15:38.37
Mike
She played with her wiener. All right.

00:15:40.09
Bill
I did. And that's, she she loves those those stupid jokes, you know, because she's had her dog Winnie for a long time and had another one, or I think her daughter has her her other dachshund now.

00:15:45.90
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:15:51.72
Bill
But, um you know, she's all about, you know, these, you know, the fucking wiener dog jokes.

00:15:52.44
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:15:55.89
Mike
Sure.

00:15:56.27
Bill
So I ordered her a hand towel that said, it said, i'm I'm attracted to, I'm attracted to wieners or something like that.

00:15:59.01
Mike
yeah Nice.

00:16:04.88
Bill
So that's like, that was her, like her, um her housewarming present that I got her. I'm like, it's nothing big. It's that she's like, oh my God.

00:16:10.42
Mike
Yeah.

00:16:11.69
Bill
She's like, I love it.

00:16:12.80
Mike
Yeah.

00:16:12.84
Bill
She took it out right away and hung it on her stove.

00:16:14.94
Mike
So it wasn't big.

00:16:15.46
Bill
Yeah.

00:16:17.74
Mike
She took it out right away.

00:16:19.85
Bill
yeah Wasn't, wasn't a big deal. Took it out right away and hung it right on her stove.

00:16:21.46
Mike
o so it was hung.

00:16:26.15
Bill
Yeah. and And thanked me for it and man thanked me for it.

00:16:26.77
Mike
All right. yeah Yep.

00:16:29.88
Bill
And yeah, Kathleen, if you ever listened to this, sorry, it's, we were, we didn't mean to go.

00:16:32.48
Mike
yeah yeah Yeah, we did.

00:16:34.01
Bill
Well, yeah, we did. Of course we did.

00:16:35.43
Mike
Of course we did.

00:16:36.92
Bill
But when, when I first gotten there and you know, again, I so i so saw her dog, I don't know, whatever it was, was six, seven years ago, ah maybe five years ago, doesn't really matter. But um and so she was, her dog is, she was probably only a couple of years old at the time, probably more skittish than she is now.

00:16:50.52
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

00:16:52.95
Bill
Um, but we were sitting down on the couch and shooting the shit and, um, or dog kind of came up by me. was looking, I'm like, Oh, you can come up. So she came up on sitting on the couch and kind of playing a little bit, um, just a little bit at night. And then, um, in the morning we were again, sitting there just shooting the shit before I left.

00:17:03.55
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:17:07.76
Bill
And, you know, same thing. Her dog came up sitting on me in my, in my lap. She's fucking dogs licking my knee. And, uh, she's like, Winnie, stop it.

00:17:14.51
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:17:15.99
Bill
I'm like, she's fine. So, but she's laying on me, all snuggling up on me.

00:17:17.38
Mike
ah hu

00:17:19.03
Bill
And I'm, she's like, She's like, you she really likes she she like you.

00:17:21.87
Mike
right right

00:17:22.05
Bill
know I'm like, I don't know what it is with these fucking dogs. w It just seems like these these dogs like me. and She's like, I don't know. She said, dogs can tell like a vibe of people. I'm like, yeah.

00:17:30.49
Mike
mm-hmm

00:17:30.76
Bill
It means I'm a hell of a nice person. She just laughed.

00:17:32.74
Mike
right

00:17:35.20
Bill
But um I don't know. It's just, it was just kind of funny because it's just this little fucking a dog. But yeah, again, I don't want to have to deal with a dog, but I love them. So going back to that stuff, you know, wanting shit that I, you know, supposedly wanting shit that I don't have.

00:17:43.42
Mike
right

00:17:47.38
Mike
the

00:17:47.94
Bill
um But so the, the biggest thing that I, that I try to focus on with that, with that reading every time I read it is the, the time and patience, you know, and to the things that I fucking hate sometimes.

00:17:56.34
Mike
Yeah.

00:18:00.47
Mike
Right. Yep.

00:18:02.09
Bill
Yeah. I've said it before, my biggest, ah certainly my biggest character defect, you know, is, is lack of patience, if that. And, you know, I mean, things from, from day one, you know, everything, nothing happens in, you know, quick enough for me.

00:18:14.30
Mike
see

00:18:16.63
Bill
And I, which again, all that, both of those things go, go along with patience.

00:18:17.21
Mike
right

00:18:20.24
Bill
So yeah, I get it. Right.

00:18:21.72
Mike
ye Yeah, but, you know, I've found that, yeah, if I just, you know, step back and let shit play out, it takes care of itself most of the time.

00:18:31.57
Bill
Right.

00:18:33.14
Mike
Yeah, I'm not that fucking important. I'm not going to do very much one way or the other.

00:18:36.95
Bill
right

00:18:40.71
Mike
So, yes, let it play out. you know if If there's something I could do to make it, you know, you know to positively affect it in in a positive direction, then I will do my best to do that. But, yeah again, that nine times out of ten, I'm not going to be able to do shit. So, hmm.

00:18:59.80
Bill
right Yeah, like you said, it's just ah I like the fact that you said the double-edged sword thing, too, because, yeah, we we need ah need to be careful about that. i can easily I could easily do something like that.

00:19:10.60
Bill
Well, i fuck it. I can't do anything about it anyhow. So um just I'm I'm not doing goddamn thing.

00:19:12.89
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:19:16.51
Mike
Right.

00:19:18.14
Bill
Which, yeah, you don't you don't want to do that. we don't want to go again to that extreme.

00:19:20.46
Mike
No.

00:19:21.70
Bill
So, again, stick in the middle, I think. Once again, we heard that someplace, sometime, several times, if nothing else.

00:19:24.36
Mike
Yes.

00:19:28.08
Mike
Yes. Many times.

00:19:29.33
Bill
So, yeah. Many, many times. So, but, um, all right. So any, anything else on the reading? I mean, it was a good one again, but, uh,

00:19:37.39
Mike
Right. yeah And it brings back to the, you know, why not me? You know, again, when we get a problem, when there's some difficulty in life, why the fuck not me?

00:19:41.83
Bill
right.

00:19:47.90
Mike
and And like I said, you know, ah when I heard that lead, he took it to the next extreme.

00:19:48.10
Bill
Yeah.

00:19:53.03
Mike
And okay, if not me, then who? Who do I wish it on? You know, that this yeah. Who do I would put? Who would I rather have this problem than me? No one.

00:20:04.37
Mike
It's a problem. I will handle it. Yeah.

00:20:07.78
Bill
right

00:20:08.37
Mike
It's my fucking problem. I'll deal with it.

00:20:12.16
Bill
Yeah. And that, that is, I mean, and that was a, that was a hard thing. You know, I don't remember when we've talked about it several times that, you know, the, the why me part, though of course the why not me is the easiest answer.

00:20:21.82
Mike
you know this Yeah.

00:20:22.65
Bill
I don't remember, you know, when we heard that or when we got that, that mindset, it's a tough one, you know, to, to swallow sometimes, you know, because I mean, we're all, um what you know, slide into a little bit of self pity every once in a while, but you know um it's no good.

00:20:35.83
Mike
Sure.

00:20:38.23
Bill
No good for especially people like us, you know, but, um but yeah, I mean, same thing, but I mean, turn it turned around on the good stuff.

00:20:45.23
Mike
Yeah.

00:20:45.31
Bill
You know, um why, why not me um for for the good stuff? You know, somebody is looking at me like, Oh, why does, why does he get to stay sober?

00:20:49.41
Mike
Yep.

00:20:52.48
Bill
Why know the answer? You know, I can, that, that answer is easy.

00:20:53.51
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm. Yep. Yep.

00:20:55.60
Bill
That's a bad example.

00:20:56.60
Mike
right

00:20:56.65
Bill
You know, cause it's not just given to me. It is, but it isn't, you know?

00:20:59.76
Mike
see

00:21:00.40
Bill
Um, I mean the, all these things were freely given to us, but you know, we can't just walk away with an armful of recovery and be like, Hey, we're good.

00:21:08.41
Mike
ye

00:21:08.43
Bill
See you in 15 years. I'll be fine. Yeah. yeah That's, that's even funny. Just thinking about that.

00:21:15.93
Mike
ye

00:21:16.04
Bill
Is it go to your first day meeting, get a basket of recovery and just be like, Hey, thanks guys.

00:21:20.62
Mike
Yep, skipping down the road with your little basket.

00:21:20.94
Bill
Whew.

00:21:23.19
Bill
Yeah. A little tip of the hat going, thank you, gentlemen. I'll check back in 15 years.

00:21:27.48
Mike
Yes.

00:21:30.24
Bill
I don't make it 15 fucking minutes well without without some sort of goddamn program.

00:21:33.12
Mike
Mm-mm.

00:21:35.33
Bill
so But yeah, exactly. so ah But yeah, good reading. I mean, for ah for just a random you know spin of the wheel and all that stuff this time.

00:21:41.39
Mike
Yep.

00:21:43.22
Bill
And i you know what? You're only, out of all the times that you've done that, it's only so the one shitter that you had.

00:21:46.89
Mike
Mm-mm. Yeah, right.

00:21:49.08
Bill
That that one was

00:21:50.12
Mike
Yeah, got to get a turd once in a while.

00:21:53.29
Bill
Yeah, but we had fun with that one, though.

00:21:55.34
Mike
We did.

00:21:56.57
Bill
I remember what it was about, but we had fun just kind of ripping it up, ripping it up and down. So, but, um you know, so so speaking of the the why me or the why not me type of thing, did I, have we talked since I had my doctor's appointment?

00:22:09.25
Mike
ah Yeah, little well, I don't think we did it on here. I think we did it afterwards when you gave me little more detail

00:22:16.87
Bill
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah, we did. deal It was just a after, yeah, whatever it was, after we talked to, yeah I think, last time.

00:22:20.58
Mike
Yeah.

00:22:22.21
Bill
So this will be, I mean, I promise, if this goes longer than the four or five minutes, it'd cut me off.

00:22:26.46
Mike
Four or five seconds.

00:22:27.08
Bill
um

00:22:29.10
Mike
Go ahead.

00:22:30.40
Bill
But um so I, you know, I went in, waited two hours for the appointment. That was that was a thing in itself. But got into the doctor, came in and, you know, they took the bandage off and um he looked at it. and He did this.

00:22:40.96
Bill
Basically, it's just cleaning out like the dead skin and stuff. And again, remember, this is a pretty good size open wound, a little bit deep.

00:22:43.75
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:22:46.57
Mike
Yep.

00:22:46.68
Bill
They measured the whole thing, even the depth and all that shit. Because, I mean, obviously, they'll they'll check it on the follow up. But um all said and done, you know, they numbed it out. And so they did that. um And then he he's looking at he's telling me stuff to do. And, you know, these certain bandages that have, it's like this silver, I can't think of the name. I don't know where my bandages are, but they're little squares. They have silver in them. And basically pulls moisture and stuff out of the wound.

00:23:09.62
Bill
And he just says, you know, gauze, make sure it breathes. I was putting the wrong bandages on it that sort of thing. Plus he said, make sure you use, he gave me a compression sock. He said that helps blood flow. Don't use an ACE bandage.

00:23:20.16
Bill
So he said, basically I was putting up like a tourniquet around my leg, which was preventing probably blood flow coming back up out of my foot, you know?

00:23:27.00
Mike
Right.

00:23:27.56
Bill
So just little things. I was missing the mark just, just a little bit here and there. um But he, he looked at and said, he goes, he goes every, he goes, it, it, antibiotics he got but just got off of him he goes because it doesn't really look that bad he goes it doesn't look that bad he goes it you know it's clean um it's not really that infected but she just came off on it antibiotics here's what we're going to try and then come back and see me in two weeks we'll go from there blah blah blah um the only thing he told me was this was this was kind of the funny part he said uh because i was taking the bandage off while i was showering because figured you know let the water hit it clean it out whatever

00:23:59.47
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:24:00.22
Bill
And he said, du you know, use either get you can go buy like a plastic boot around it or whatever. He goes, you just use saran wrap, which, by the way, doesn't work.

00:24:07.29
Mike
Yeah.

00:24:07.95
Bill
It still gets fucking wet.

00:24:09.44
Mike
ahha

00:24:09.64
Bill
I even like tape it around there to try. It doesn't matter. It gets a little wet, whatever. um But so he's explaining all this stuff. He's like, yeah, you know, dirt comes down. And then with a straight face as he's explaining and kind of wrapping my my leg up and do whatever. he's like, you know, he goes he goes mainly from the anus.

00:24:25.02
Mike
Uh-huh. Yeah.

00:24:26.51
Bill
And he said, du he goes, that's what happens. He goes, you get you know, you mainly get in the dirt, you know, the bacteria from the anus. um So he goes, that's why you don't want to. I'm just, I'm trying not to laugh because I'm like, I i don't know.

00:24:35.87
Mike
Sure. Right.

00:24:37.03
Bill
It's funny.

00:24:37.29
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:24:37.51
Bill
I'm like, it it makes perfect sense. I mean, I don't want, I don't want my anus bacteria on my cut.

00:24:39.62
Mike
sure

00:24:42.81
Bill
But, but he's like, yeah, just nonchalant.

00:24:43.34
Mike
right

00:24:45.39
Bill
Just it's from the anus mainly. Okay. Okay. So um bottom line, I got to go back on Wednesday morning, this coming Wednesday. it just should be just a quick appointment follow up. But already I took a picture of it, you know, like right before think we got back from Founders Day. So right before my appointment.

00:25:03.69
Mike
ah hu

00:25:03.88
Bill
And then took a picture of it last night and compared them. Huge difference already.

00:25:07.19
Mike
Good.

00:25:07.29
Bill
It's not, it's not closed up, but it's ah the depth is gone and it's a little bit smaller. And so it's starting to kind of come together. I'm i'm actually kind of pleased with it, but um I just, I wasn't keeping it wrapped. It was just, I was missing the mark just a little bit here and there.

00:25:19.25
Mike
All right.

00:25:19.77
Bill
So I'm glad I went in and everything's cool. But um he didn't say anything out of the ordinary. The only thing he said was he goes, if it's not healing, I'm He said we might want to do the, you know, the x-ray, the check the blood flow and whatever.

00:25:31.13
Bill
But um he didn't say there's anything else out of the ordinary right now.

00:25:31.69
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:25:34.93
Bill
um You know, but yeah, I mean, all said and done, it was just, it was very positive. I had to wait for fucking ever, I mean, to get in there. But, um you know, it was was good. So, yeah, I'm on the mend.

00:25:44.64
Mike
Alright.

00:25:45.93
Bill
And that was three minutes and that was less than four minutes. So, come on, give me, give me a, come on, round of applause.

00:25:48.94
Mike
Alright. Yeah. Alright.

00:25:53.81
Bill
So i'm not I'm not going to die yet. I don't necessarily, I haven't been diagnosed with diabetes or heart disease yet. Anything of those yet. um I'm not dying. Well, we're all dying, but I'm not i'm not not dying a quicker death at the at the moment.

00:26:03.44
Mike
while dying

00:26:06.95
Bill
So I think I'm in good shape. so

00:26:08.30
Mike
all right

00:26:09.57
Bill
But tom yeah yeah the the Keating Center golf thing i got canceled. That kind of blew my mind when I saw that.

00:26:14.36
Mike
Yeah.

00:26:14.82
Bill
And I was going ask you how the golf thing went. and I'm like, well, fuck, we don't we have to talk about that.

00:26:16.64
Mike
Great.

00:26:19.04
Mike
Uh-huh. We do not.

00:26:20.19
Bill
So just weather, huh? Was it like,

00:26:21.56
Mike
Yeah, yeah. It was, yeah, there was thunderstorms and stuff moving through and yeah.

00:26:25.00
Bill
Oh, was it? Okay.

00:26:26.66
Mike
Yeah. So there, yeah. So it's rescheduled for September 20th, I believe.

00:26:33.03
Bill
Yeah, i was going to say, I knew it was sometime in September, but i couldn't I couldn't remember exactly when.

00:26:36.48
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:26:36.75
Bill
But yeah, I just didn't know. i didn't know if it was, if it was, you know, like a lot of rain in the course, just like, yeah, we don't we don't want to have a golf outing because it'll fuck up the course.

00:26:45.32
Mike
Right. Right.

00:26:45.84
Bill
I mean, that's happened before. You know, golf courses will shut down or won't have a golf outing.

00:26:48.65
Mike
I mean, yeah, you know, I mean, there's it been to thunderstorms before. I remember one year I showed up. ah i Actually, it was to probably 10 years ago. um Yeah, I showed up for the steak dinner.

00:27:01.91
Mike
um I didn't do anything else. And yeah, we were under a pavilion and it was pouring and thunderstorms. And yeah, but, you know, Marty's out there grilling the steaks in the rain.

00:27:14.03
Mike
It was...

00:27:14.65
Bill
Right.

00:27:15.40
Mike
Yo, I got mine.

00:27:20.11
Bill
Yeah, I mean, i've I've been on a golf course before when when a storm rolls and just regular rain and it just kind of fucking is what it is. You're either going to get wet or you got an umbrella with you or whatever.

00:27:29.44
Mike
Right.

00:27:29.55
Bill
um But yeah, most golf courses, if there's something bad rolling in, they'll they'll run sirens to get people off the course.

00:27:35.04
Mike
Yeah.

00:27:35.96
Bill
you know But I've had that happen probably once, maybe twice.

00:27:36.00
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:27:39.36
Bill
you know But it's nothing to fuck around with. I mean, you're out in the big old open field with metal clubs.

00:27:44.03
Mike
Yeah,

00:27:45.22
Bill
You know, ah, caddy shack, you know?

00:27:47.51
Mike
exactly.

00:27:47.58
Bill
Yeah.

00:27:51.69
Bill
But yeah, because that was that week that yeah we recorded and we recorded early early that week because yeah.

00:27:55.70
Mike
Yeah, right, because I was going to be there for registration, which is what I do on Saturday mornings, but nope, didn't happen.

00:27:58.84
Bill
yeah

00:28:03.35
Mike
It was fine.

00:28:03.58
Bill
yeah No, and again, I mean, it's when we're going to do it, know, we were just talking about, we're going to record on, you know, Wednesday, this, this coming week because, you know, 4th of July weekend and stuff. But yeah, I mean, it's fine.

00:28:13.79
Mike
ye

00:28:15.45
Bill
It's, it didn't affect me one way or the other. It just kind of eases up the Friday and it's just weird. You know, I mean, I kind of take my time. still, I still eat at the same goddamn time because it's like my, my body clock or whatever.

00:28:23.61
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:28:25.87
Bill
it's just on a Friday.

00:28:26.16
Mike
and

00:28:26.71
Bill
I don't eat it, you know, fucking 4.30 on a, on a normal day, but, you know, sit down and eat at 4.30 on ah so Friday, just cause I'm used to it, I guess. So, all right.

00:28:37.22
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:28:38.35
Bill
So you didn't get a chance to be of service, but you will again shortly or in a couple of months.

00:28:41.24
Mike
now sure right exactly

00:28:42.59
Bill
So, okay. All right. So, um, I know there was other stuff that kind of crossed my mind here. Oh, um this came up on ah on a podcast recently, and I just thought it was kind of interesting.

00:28:55.91
Bill
So um the person was reading the quote, and I can't remember what podcast it was, not that it matters, but it said the the quote says, why do you always, like a person says, why do you always insist on taking the hard road?

00:29:09.14
Bill
And then the person replies, why do you assume i see two roads? And I'm like, you know, part of it, I laughed and I'm like, God, that's a, that's actually, that's a, that's a thinker for a minute, you know?

00:29:21.64
Mike
who

00:29:22.23
Bill
Um, so my, my question there was, I mean, do you think that during, or even now, I mean, during your active addiction, I guess, number one, um, did you, do you think you saw another way or was just, was it just one road?

00:29:33.28
Mike
Now, of course.

00:29:34.72
Bill
Okay.

00:29:34.73
Mike
Yeah, it was one fucking road. Yeah.

00:29:36.64
Bill
Okay.

00:29:36.72
Mike
but Yeah, exactly. No, of course I didn't see it another way. you know, it's Tough to see out of a brown paper bag. um

00:29:45.26
Bill
Yeah, yeah that's it's it's a good point. It's a good point.

00:29:48.89
Mike
Right. um And, um you know, ah I think it's the 12 and 12 talks about, you know, you don't have to you don't have to totally hit bottom to change. You know, you start getting.

00:30:02.83
Mike
through this process, I've found that we, we start, we don't have to bottom out. We don't have to, you know, hit that brick wall every time, you know, we can, we can see, we can see clearly now we can see the brick wall and we can start slowing down and go, okay, how do I get around this fucking thing?

00:30:20.88
Mike
I don't need to run into it every time in order to change.

00:30:22.93
Bill
right

00:30:24.72
Mike
Um, mixing my metaphors there a little bit, but yeah. Um, Right. You know, we don't have to we don't have to take the hard road anymore. We don't have to learn those hard lessons anymore. One of the benefits of this program is we're able to look at other people's mistakes and other, you know, and, and learn from not only our own mistakes, but other people's, we go, Oh yeah, I don't need to do it that way because clearly that doesn't work.

00:30:51.92
Bill
right

00:30:51.91
Mike
Um, you know, so yeah, we, we don't have to take the hard road anymore. Sometimes we do. Um, cause we're still, we're still alcoholics and drug addicts and stubborn and, and yeah, you know, we think our way is the right way still, even though it's proven time and time again, that it's probably not.

00:31:14.09
Mike
um well, well, but yes, we can, we can learn lessons from other people. We can learn lessons from ourselves. We can learn to see that brick wall in the distance and we don't have to run into it every goddamn time, every, all the time again and again and again.

00:31:31.48
Bill
Right. Yeah. And that's, ah I mean, that's a good point. I'm glad you brought up, up you know, obviously lessons from other people because I mean, that's one of the, one of the things that is brought up a lot on here.

00:31:36.83
Mike
and is

00:31:40.62
Bill
And I think to begin with, you're the one that started bringing it up about, you know, no bad examples. And I know, you know, that's not necessarily, it's not it's not a Mike-ism, you know, it's not something that you developed.

00:31:45.19
Mike
Right.

00:31:50.04
Mike
Mm-mm.

00:31:51.08
Bill
I know that, but, um but I think you started talking about it on here that there are, you know, no bad examples.

00:31:55.04
Mike
Yeah.

00:31:56.56
Bill
And um, you know, i mean, watching people, I mean, to begin with when we, when we first got sober, you know, watching, I was, I was all fucking wigged out about why people were, were really relapsing.

00:32:03.53
Mike
ah

00:32:07.30
Bill
And that was the whole, you know, can it be that simple thing, you know?

00:32:07.69
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

00:32:10.22
Bill
Um, and you know, to, to this day, um and you know, i just, I I'll say yet before I even say it, I haven't relapsed yet, you know? And, um, but the thing of it is, is I don't,

00:32:17.31
Mike
Right.

00:32:20.64
Bill
so many people are thankful for their, at least their last relapse. If they've got, you know, continued sobriety after that, because whatever was happening, um, they needed that relapse to learn some additional thing.

00:32:25.44
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:32:32.91
Bill
And I can, I can not only understand that and accept it.

00:32:33.49
Mike
Yeah.

00:32:36.52
Bill
Um, I don't have issue with that. I don't be like, well, you, why couldn't you learn that without doing it?

00:32:38.54
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:32:40.51
Bill
You know, um, I'm, well, you know what i mean?

00:32:40.50
Mike
Right. good

00:32:43.24
Bill
in to In the beginning, when I first got sober,

00:32:43.82
Mike
Well, yeah, ah we we know the answer to that, right? why Why couldn't we learn it without learning it? Right.

00:32:51.14
Bill
Right. But I mean, I could easily, the fact that, you know, I haven't had that experience, be like, well, why can't you just do this? Well, the the thing of it is, is that every once in a while, yeah, some people, you you have to do that, you know?

00:32:56.70
Mike
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

00:33:01.13
Mike
Yeah.

00:33:01.47
Bill
um I'm grateful that I haven't had to. I'm grateful that I've had, you know um you know, good people in all along the road, including that silly conversation that you and I had that was huge, you know, because I don't know.

00:33:11.94
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:33:13.78
Bill
I mean, without that or without all the words from all these other people, um would I have taken another swing at it? Why the fuck wouldn't I have?

00:33:20.90
Mike
Right.

00:33:21.83
Bill
I mean, really, there do if I wouldn't have you know taken the time to get the shit out of my ears and actually take the take the time and the effort you know to entrust people that wanted you know what's best for me and actually be able to look at somebody and say, OK, this is what happens.

00:33:22.65
Mike
Yeah.

00:33:31.99
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:33:38.42
Bill
I don't need to run into a burning building to realize that it's probably not a great idea.

00:33:42.58
Mike
Yeah, it's probably a little warm in there.

00:33:42.81
Bill
i mean, yeah, if I had loved one in there. if If I had a loved one in there, you know things like, okay, I get why people do that.

00:33:48.22
Mike
Hmm.

00:33:49.31
Bill
But, you know, I'm not just going to, I'm not going to do stupid things. I'm not going to try to jump across a cliff. You know, i seen I've seen people fall before. it I see what happens when people try to pet pet a bison at the, you know, Yellowstone.

00:34:01.84
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:34:02.13
Bill
Or take ah take a selfie with an elk.

00:34:05.11
Mike
Right.

00:34:06.46
Bill
I don't need to try that.

00:34:08.26
Mike
Now.

00:34:09.64
Bill
But dumb yeah, it's a, it really is. It's a, it's about taking, taking that time and, you know, really understanding that, um you know, other people have taken that, that hard road. And I mean, granted now we get to see the two roads, which is cool.

00:34:23.24
Mike
Mm-hmm. No.

00:34:23.71
Bill
But yeah, when I, when I heard that quote, I was just like, God damn, that's, that's really interesting. Cause the first thing I thought about was there's no way in the world. I saw two roads before.

00:34:31.24
Mike
no

00:34:35.36
Bill
So I don't know. they I wish I could remember, not that it would matter, but I kind of wish I could remember now where I where i heard that from. But I don't know.

00:34:42.12
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:34:43.08
Bill
if it was an it was an interesting quote, and hopefully I i will remember it at least to the end of this episode.

00:34:46.96
Mike
Yeah, right. And really, the nice thing is there's actually more than two roads now. sir there's Yeah, there's all kinds of roads out there.

00:34:54.66
Bill
Right.

00:34:57.69
Mike
Yeah, I drive them every day.

00:34:57.87
Bill
Yeah.

00:34:59.33
Mike
But yes, there are roads all over the damn place. And, you know, that ah again, you know, I mean, the road you're on right now, you know, with the traveling and stuff, I mean, that was certainly couldn't have saw that.

00:35:11.81
Mike
but Fuck, what, 10 years ago?

00:35:14.47
Bill
No, no, no, no.

00:35:15.07
Mike
Yeah, right. Exactly. All sorts of roads open up for us. It's a beautiful thing.

00:35:21.85
Bill
Yeah. And that was, uh, and literally, I just, I remember, um, remember the exact moment that it happened, but I remember the, ah you know, roughly, you know, what happened at that timeframe was just, it was right around the time that either right before or right after Derek graduated.

00:35:35.77
Bill
And I was just kind of like, um, you know, I mean, I, on purpose, I, when I, I came back to Wisconsin to be closer to him, um you know, got, got as far away as Madison, which was an hour and a half.

00:35:43.28
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:35:46.74
Bill
I moved to Jefferson, which is a half hour closer, went back to Germantown to be closer to him.

00:35:52.11
Mike
Right?

00:35:52.36
Bill
So I made all these specific moves to literally, you know, um I don't want to say follow my child and my by kids, um but that was that was the point, you know, because I wanted to be

00:35:58.12
Mike
Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. To be near them.

00:36:02.83
Bill
Yeah, I wanted to be around him through those, you know, those formative years for ah for a young man and a young boy, but also be closer to my daughter and Brian. And and I accomplished that, you know, but it was just like after that, not that I, not that I had any issue being in, you know, in Germantown, but I'm like, well, I don't, I don't have to be here anymore.

00:36:11.66
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:36:22.11
Bill
Yeah.

00:36:22.42
Mike
Right.

00:36:22.58
Bill
You know, not going to abandon my children, but, um you know, and I've i've done, you know, it's been literally, it's just, I ah had all the memories come up. It was within the last, i don't know, handful of days that I came down here three years ago to Indiana.

00:36:35.71
Mike
Right.

00:36:36.48
Bill
um You know, and I, I've kept in touch with my kids. I haven't, you know, blown up my relationship with them.

00:36:42.80
Mike
Right.

00:36:42.94
Bill
Um, you know i go back there, um, as much as I can and as much as I, as I, I want to say need to, but I can go back anytime I want, you know, and I've seen them and all that stuff.

00:36:50.57
Mike
right

00:36:52.69
Bill
So, um, yeah, but shit, 10 years ago.

00:36:57.44
Mike
Right.

00:36:58.02
Bill
know what the fuck I was doing 10 years ago. What year was that?

00:37:00.10
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:37:00.82
Bill
2000? That's when I just, ah, I just moved to Germantown 10 years ago. So there, that's what I was doing then.

00:37:06.42
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:37:07.42
Bill
But yeah, you're right. Yeah. tons Tons of roads. And I don't know if it's ah the the roads that we're on right now or, you know, they're not, not always smooth, but pretty goddamn nice. Right.

00:37:17.40
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:37:18.61
Bill
ah Grateful to be us.

00:37:21.49
Mike
a

00:37:23.39
Bill
Slightly egotistical, but it's slightly true. Slightly true.

00:37:26.11
Mike
Yes. Yeah.

00:37:28.08
Bill
All right. um So this, I don't, this came from Touchstones. I don't know how recently this was, but it says, my father didn't tell me how to live. He lived and let me watch him do it.

00:37:41.18
Bill
We've talked about both of our fathers when we were younger. This is my, my parentheses part to you and I.

00:37:46.40
Mike
Hmm.

00:37:46.49
Bill
So we talked about both of our fathers when we were younger and possibly the lack of positive influence.

00:37:51.44
Mike
Hmm.

00:37:51.63
Bill
um And this was my thought. So where do you think you got your positive male influence from as a child? Was it from your dad? Was it from other people in your life?

00:38:00.14
Mike
No.

00:38:01.14
Bill
or

00:38:01.80
Mike
Well, I didn't know my dad.

00:38:01.86
Bill
um and

00:38:04.46
Bill
Never? i guess I didn't.

00:38:05.27
Mike
I mean, I met him like three or four times.

00:38:08.34
Bill
Okay. Okay.

00:38:08.88
Mike
And the last time i was like five years old. So no, no.

00:38:12.25
Bill
Oh, okay. Okay.

00:38:13.27
Mike
Yeah. Now, um, I have a positive male. Um, Hey, um, I mean, my stepfather came into my life when I was 11 or 12, something like that.

00:38:27.67
Mike
He was all right. You know, he was, uh, yeah, you know, um he was a stepfather and I was, you know, about to be, you know, 12, 13, 14.

00:38:32.38
Bill
Right.

00:38:36.30
Mike
Um, so whatever, but yeah, he was a good dude, you know, so I learned shit from him. Um, Yeah, I don't know. Keith Moon. That's square by pie. Right. Right.

00:38:48.98
Mike
right

00:38:50.02
Bill
Right. No, it's just, to and I, I, when I, when I read that quote from there, it just, it, it made me think of that because so when, I mean, our, ah our mom and our dad, got divorced when I was eight,

00:39:05.04
Mike
right

00:39:05.34
Bill
my dad My dad worked a lot, but, I mean, we always did the camping type of thing. The one thing that I remember from, you know, like after they split up and stuff like that, I i specifically remembered being irritated by the fact that I never remembered playing catch with them, you know, whether there it's baseball, football, that sort of thing.

00:39:21.96
Mike
All

00:39:23.67
Bill
I don't know why, you know, whether it was just TV shit, you watch people do it, but um it was sometimes these little things like that.

00:39:26.96
Mike
right.

00:39:29.06
Bill
But then again, I mean, ah my dad was a fucking alcoholic, you know.

00:39:32.08
Mike
Right.

00:39:32.61
Bill
um He did what he did, and you know he spent his time with us and stuff like that. I don't know if he was a model father. Probably not. was he ah Was he a decent dude most of the time for that era? Probably.

00:39:44.03
Bill
you know But um i mean I don't know. you know that The positive male influence is probably Uncle John. you know He was in our life.

00:39:48.86
Mike
Right.

00:39:50.01
Bill
ah Uncle Mike is is fucking wild as he was. um He was really good to us and really good for us.

00:39:57.73
Mike
Right.

00:39:57.80
Bill
never... you know he never um You know, I mean, later years, we we saw him, you know, get wild and when we were adults and shit like that. But when we were kids, ever tell you about the story when mom looked for the house in Wisconsin and he came up to Pittsburgh?

00:40:11.95
Bill
So first of all, um he had an El Camino. Um, which and that was his, it was like, it so it was a bra, I think of Brown el El Camino, nothing great, but he loved the car, you know?

00:40:21.51
Mike
Right.

00:40:21.64
Bill
So, um, so he drove up there and mom was coming up to, uh, Wisconsin. We lived in Pittsburgh at the time and she was house hunting. So whatever it was, she was gone, i think for a week, um, you know, up there when do some work at GE up there and blah, blah, blah.

00:40:34.02
Bill
Um, so when, when he got there, um, he basically told us, he said, oh he said, okay, he goes, we're, we're going have fun. We're going to do this and that. He goes, I don't care. You know what you guys do for the most part, probably laid down a couple of rules.

00:40:46.74
Mike
All

00:40:46.87
Bill
Um, but he said, you know, your mom's going to be back on, let's say Sunday. So he said, Saturday, um, no questions asked. He said, we're cleaning the entire house. Anything that's around, we're getting shit back in order.

00:40:55.60
Mike
right.

00:40:58.17
Bill
I don't care what happens up until then. He goes, I'm not going to get on you guys about, he goes, but this place will be spotless before she gets back. cool.

00:41:04.12
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:41:04.92
Bill
yeah And then I don't know if this was a Cleveland at one time or when, when we were there or when he was there, um, we went through a car wash. We're pulling into the car wash and his El Camino, you know, it's the three of us sitting in the, you know, I think I was, I was in the middle of Kathy on the passenger side, obviously him driving.

00:41:20.49
Mike
Right.

00:41:20.54
Bill
So we start pulling into the car wash and he hands Kathy a towel and he's like, put this up on the window. And he grabs a towel and puts one up his windows leaked. Okay. And

00:41:28.67
Mike
Right.

00:41:29.56
Bill
So you had to jam a towel up on the, you know, the whole rim of the window or, and water is still kind of pouring in his car, but he needed a car wash.

00:41:34.03
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:41:38.28
Mike
right

00:41:39.91
Bill
But yeah, a guy like that, though, he was still he was a very positive influence to us.

00:41:43.71
Mike
i hate

00:41:44.34
Bill
He really was. it was a lot. It was a lot of fun. you He was a good dude. I obviously I missed both of them. But, you know, just yeah, he was so those times.

00:41:49.73
Mike
and see

00:41:51.93
Bill
So again, good, good, positive influences. So.

00:41:54.01
Mike
Sure.

00:41:55.17
Bill
All right. So again, that was just kind of a i don't know, just a just an odd question, if nothing else. But just one that kind of crossed my mind. So um actually, you know what? i'm looking at I'm looking at the time, Mike.

00:42:06.47
Bill
Are you looking at the time?

00:42:06.65
Mike
Ah, I am now.

00:42:09.88
Bill
Well, why don't we look at the time and maybe, i don't know, do a break.

00:42:13.67
Mike
You know what? We're going to be right back after these words from our sponsors.

00:42:28.32
Bill
All right, everyone. Welcome back. yeah I guess I wasn't paying attention until I just kind of looked up and i'm like, yeah, you've,

00:42:35.80
Mike
It's all right. I dozed off there well while those commercials were playing.

00:42:36.59
Bill
hey yeah

00:42:41.17
Bill
hey I, yeah I, you know, hear you yawn every once in a while.

00:42:43.44
Mike
ah

00:42:43.56
Bill
Usually it's what, usually it's what I'm telling a story, but you've, you've yawned, uh, I think more tonight than, than I've ever heard you.

00:42:47.90
Mike
I have. ive die I'm freaking tired, man. I started off this episode saying that. It's all good.

00:42:54.11
Bill
No, I know. Is it just been like, well, what just long? I mean, I'm not asking you to explain your yawning.

00:42:57.92
Mike
Yeah, well, yeah I mean, yeah, it's, it works been long.

00:42:58.03
Bill
I think it's funny.

00:43:01.16
Mike
It's been, you know, hotter than the devil's taint here for the last four days.

00:43:04.87
Bill
Yep.

00:43:06.32
Mike
So yeah, you know, it takes a lot out you.

00:43:06.36
Bill
yeah

00:43:08.97
Mike
I mean, yes, um, you know, 80% of the time, 85% of the time I'm sitting in an air conditioned truck. It's fine, but I have to get out working this shit. So I'm in, yeah.

00:43:21.22
Bill
yep

00:43:22.26
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:43:23.20
Bill
Yeah, no, height I know. And it's, it is, I mean, I, I don't know, I forget when it was that probably a handful, a handful of years ago when I was, I was working for that company that we were selling business phone service and, you know, i was out in the field, you know, and I i did it, I started there in the summer and I did two summers there.

00:43:36.61
Mike
Right.

00:43:40.60
Bill
And, um, it was, you know, it was Wisconsin. It's, you know, same as Cleveland ish with the weather and stuff like that in the summer.

00:43:44.18
Mike
hmm.

00:43:46.09
Bill
Um, and part of it was just fucking brutal, but I'm like, yeah, I got, I kind of got to do what I got to do, you know? Um, but yeah, just, uh, it is nice not having to do that.

00:43:51.30
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:43:54.46
Mike
and since this instance

00:43:54.75
Bill
Um, I mean, I drove, I took ah took a drive up to just an hour north of here to one of the sand dudes last weekend. And I'm going down to this place in Illinois tomorrow. It's a couple hours away from here. But again, I keep getting these like these pop-up ads, not pop-up ads, but these ads and shit like that.

00:44:10.60
Bill
It's called um Starved Rock State Park. Ever heard of it?

00:44:14.86
Mike
Nope.

00:44:15.58
Bill
OK, it's in someplace, Illinois, a couple hours, so couple hours away from here.

00:44:18.71
Mike
Yeah. Okay. Yeah. All right.

00:44:20.62
Bill
But it looks looks really cool, you know, and I'm like, Jesus Christ, I got a cool place like this in fucking Illinois.

00:44:25.46
Mike
yeah

00:44:25.62
Bill
It's right along apparently the Illinois River, some trails like little um apparently it's trails in these almost like these river gorges, apparently ah formed by glaciers.

00:44:36.91
Bill
You know, so which I mean, they have those through Ohio and through like Kelly's Island shit like that has all that.

00:44:36.92
Mike
okay yeah right

00:44:42.79
Bill
I remember seeing that shit over there when we were kids, you know.

00:44:44.94
Mike
here

00:44:46.76
Bill
um But I don't know. I'm like, yeah, fuck it. I'll take a run, take a run over there and, you know, kind of see what's what. But um last weekend, I mean, it was it was hot, but I'm like, fuck it. I'm just I need to get out and do something, you know.

00:44:56.25
Mike
Right.

00:44:57.25
Bill
But it was this this sand dune. um and And I swear to God, i two things. i'm I'm not going to hike in the sand anymore. um It's, I mean, walking along a beach is one thing.

00:45:07.72
Mike
ahha

00:45:07.83
Bill
But um I swear to fucking God, and this was, I'm not kidding. It's like, if you walked up Kathy's stairs at that same, you know, you figure stairs aren't that big of a deal. But that that angle...

00:45:17.58
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

00:45:18.86
Bill
Um, straight up and probably from her house to the neighbor's house across the street.

00:45:20.36
Mike
Yeah.

00:45:24.42
Bill
It was, it's a big fucking sand dune, this whole sand dune thing.

00:45:27.33
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

00:45:28.75
Bill
Um, halfway up, I'm like, why, why am I doing this?

00:45:31.99
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:45:32.94
Bill
And I've never done that on one of these trails before, but it's not just the the incline, but I mean, you're trudging through the sand.

00:45:33.05
Mike
Yeah. Mm-hmm.

00:45:35.71
Mike
ahha

00:45:39.08
Mike
yeah yeah

00:45:39.89
Bill
um And I mean, every time you step, it feels like you're slipping down. It's like for every two steps, you feel like you're taking maybe half a step, you know, was fucking terrible. i was white, but got to top of, oh my God, just fucking terrible.

00:45:52.73
Bill
Plus it was 90 degrees, but, uh, you know, again, I chose to be out there, not, not out there working, but, um, I don't know.

00:45:54.11
Mike
Yeah.

00:45:57.69
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:45:59.05
Bill
I, I get it. It's, uh, yeah, it's, I, I try not to complain about the heat cause I hate the fucking winter though. So I try, I try not to,

00:46:05.07
Mike
Yeah. Oh, right.

00:46:08.92
Mike
Not me, man.

00:46:09.26
Bill
but,

00:46:09.52
Mike
I like the winter, so, you know, fuck this heat.

00:46:13.44
Bill
I just, I can't, I can't, I can't fucking do winter anymore. I don't, uh, no desire, no desire to be any part of it.

00:46:18.66
Mike
All right.

00:46:20.02
Bill
So quick question is just kind of a non-sobriety note. Um, have you, have you seen, um anything about David Lee Roth being out there again?

00:46:23.38
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:46:29.51
Mike
Diamond Dave.

00:46:30.61
Bill
yeah

00:46:31.23
Mike
Yeah.

00:46:32.58
Bill
you Have you watched any like video clips or anything like that?

00:46:35.33
Mike
I've seen a couple. Yeah.

00:46:37.89
Bill
So do you know, i guess, my two questions for you, how old he is and how much he's worth? Do you know either one of those?

00:46:44.69
Mike
I mean, he's pushing 70. I know that.

00:46:48.01
Bill
Yep, 68. You're right.

00:46:48.66
Mike
Yep.

00:46:49.73
Bill
And then just guess.

00:46:49.88
Mike
And how much he's worth?

00:46:52.18
Bill
Yeah. 60. 60.

00:46:52.81
Mike
i don't know.

00:46:53.13
Bill
but

00:46:54.06
Mike
10 mil. Yeah.

00:46:55.70
Bill
sixty Okay.

00:46:57.04
Mike
Okay. Yeah.

00:46:57.83
Bill
Now there's, there's a reason for that question because when I, when I saw what, there's two things I noticed about him was um it seems like somebody slapped a smile on his face. That's number one.

00:47:08.95
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:47:09.35
Bill
Cause he never, he doesn't not smile. And it's just, I mean, it doesn't stop.

00:47:12.11
Mike
Right.

00:47:13.99
Bill
It's like, he looks like the Joker, you know, they just always got a smile on his face.

00:47:15.80
Mike
Uh-huh. Mm-hmm. ahha

00:47:18.23
Bill
um You know, and again, he's 68 years old. I'm not body shaming him, but he's up there singing and his fucking arms are flapping and whatever.

00:47:24.24
Mike
is it

00:47:24.41
Bill
And he's, he's like, and that part I'm not i'm not criticizing him for. He's 68 years old. I mean, that's how he should look. um But I mean, he's just like, kind of like skinny, like no ass on him anymore. and He's just up there in his leather pants and whatever.

00:47:36.97
Bill
And I just thought, out of curiosity, I'm like, how fucking old is this dude? How much money does he have? And why is he out there doing this?

00:47:43.22
Mike
Uh-huh. Right.

00:47:45.68
Bill
And that's when I looked, that's when I looked it up.

00:47:45.87
Mike
kiss

00:47:47.48
Bill
i was just like, wow. Okay. Did you have an answer for that? Why is he out there doing it?

00:47:50.43
Mike
but Because that's what he does. He's fucking Diamond Dave.

00:47:52.55
Bill
Yeah, that's,

00:47:53.49
Mike
He's got a guy named Entertain.

00:47:56.64
Bill
I know, but I just thought, like, Dave, sit down. Fucking relax. You get $60 million fucking dollars.

00:48:04.07
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:48:04.26
Bill
Or just sit up there in a goddamn recliner. People still come see you. I don't know. It just ah yeah it it's just blew my mind. I mean, his voice is gone, which, again, that happens.

00:48:12.28
Mike
Right. Yeah.

00:48:13.23
Bill
um You know, in seriously, i'm not I'm not trying to, you know, people talk about body shaving. I'm not even body shaving him, age shaving him, anything like that. I just, I want the man to take his $60 million and fucking relax.

00:48:23.16
Mike
He is.

00:48:25.12
Bill
That's what I want him to do. I want what's best for time and time.

00:48:28.71
Mike
yeah

00:48:30.30
Bill
But maybe that's it. Maybe that's what he's out there doing is is the that he's living as his best time in Dave.

00:48:32.59
Mike
yeah

00:48:35.83
Mike
he is

00:48:37.31
Bill
His best time in Dave life. But um yeah, it's just, I don't know. some of these Some of these people out there are still doing their thing. And I hey give all the credit in the world, but I don't know.

00:48:45.44
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:48:45.50
Bill
There's just got to be a point when he's got to sit back and be like, enjoy your fucking millions.

00:48:50.87
Mike
Right.

00:48:51.64
Bill
So, okay, let's ah let's pull another. what What do you say we get back to a little bit of sobriety here, Mike?

00:48:56.14
Mike
All right, let's do it.

00:48:56.29
Bill
stop Stop fucking around. Stop fucking around with this diamond tape shit.

00:48:59.99
Mike
Mm.

00:49:01.02
Bill
Okay, ah God grant me. Just random. i don't know where this is from. God grant me is the only thing I know. ah The reading was talking about... Having an attitude of gratitude. ha. We've talked about that before.

00:49:10.82
Mike
Aha.

00:49:11.96
Bill
um when you came in, uh, this time, when you got sober this time, um, how long do you think it was until you had, and I put in here fairly, i qualified it, a fairly positive outlook and attitude.

00:49:26.31
Bill
and I put all the time, but I'm even going to say most of the time.

00:49:29.94
Mike
Right. ah

00:49:32.79
Bill
I'm trying to call. I'm trying to give you a little bit a little bit of wiggle room here.

00:49:34.42
Mike
Yeah, I know. I appreciate that.

00:49:35.42
Bill
Yeah.

00:49:36.22
Mike
um No, um you know what? it was It was something I had to work on, something I still have to work on. um

00:49:46.09
Bill
Right.

00:49:47.63
Mike
Yeah, you know, I mean, there were definitely, um I've been more grateful than I probably am right now. know.

00:49:59.09
Mike
you know all Yeah, ah you know, I started, you know, I probably worked harder at being grateful um earlier on, you know, because I had to.

00:50:09.52
Bill
Right.

00:50:11.19
Mike
um i still have to. um I'm probably not as grateful as I've been in the past in sobriety. Yeah.

00:50:18.91
Bill
right

00:50:19.52
Mike
and Yeah. Um, I think some of that, um, comes with just, you know, being more comfortable being sober that I probably don't have to be quite as grateful, um, just for the survival portion of sobriety.

00:50:38.65
Bill
right

00:50:38.88
Mike
Um, you know, not being, you know, miserable in sobriety, um, cause I'm pretty comfortable being sober now.

00:50:45.53
Bill
right

00:50:45.65
Mike
Um, but yeah, you know, I, I, you know And I think part of it comes just getting older, and it's like you know curmudgeon-y, and I'm not quite as grateful as I used to be.

00:51:00.62
Mike
of Yeah, but I'm still plenty grateful.

00:51:00.74
Bill
Right.

00:51:04.72
Mike
um you know And again, part of my routine is part of my routine is you know, stopping at some point during the day, usually at the end of the day and, you know, finding those things to be grateful for um is still part of my routine. And yeah, it has to be, you know, because again, grateful drunks don't drink.

00:51:23.92
Mike
Grateful junkies don't use.

00:51:23.98
Bill
right

00:51:25.88
Mike
all And I don't want to drink and I don't want to use, so I better be fucking grateful.

00:51:32.02
Bill
God damn it.

00:51:33.21
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:51:34.73
Bill
You know, and well, i i've been I've been open, you know, I hear about that. And we've talked about it several times that um I, and this is not, you know, by any stretch, it's not a joke.

00:51:38.91
Mike
Yeah.

00:51:46.35
Bill
I forget to be grateful and I forget I should be grateful um to to your exact point.

00:51:46.94
Mike
Mm. Mm-hmm. Sure.

00:51:52.07
Bill
I know there's there's not a there's not a doubt in my mind that i i'm less I'm less cognizant of my gratitude or that I, you know, that I should be

00:51:59.74
Mike
Yes.

00:52:02.14
Bill
I don't focus on the fact that I should be grateful these days as much as I used to.

00:52:02.18
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:52:06.00
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:52:06.34
Bill
um Until something like, I don't know, something kind of blows my mind, which is maybe that's the maybe that's the best part. you know, I was trying to think of, you know, I'll get these flashes of it's usually something with my with my kids or being there for somebody or um it's not, it has it never has anything to do with, um oh, I got a new car, I got a new job or got a big commission check.

00:52:17.45
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

00:52:25.69
Mike
Right.

00:52:27.58
Bill
Those are all, oh, God is good. yeah I am hashtag blessed.

00:52:32.31
Mike
I'm blessed.

00:52:36.31
Mike
Yup.

00:52:38.25
Bill
Yeah. Fuck you and your hashtags, but um no, it's, it's never.

00:52:40.79
Mike
Yup.

00:52:42.88
Bill
And I, I'm so happy. i guess I'm grateful to say that it's, it has never has anything to do with money or material things, but yeah,

00:52:45.82
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:52:49.35
Mike
Right.

00:52:50.26
Bill
it's It's getting a phone call from my kids. It's being there for somebody, um being able to be of service, you know, to somebody else.

00:52:55.80
Mike
Right.

00:52:57.18
Bill
um And maybe maybe it is. I mean, maybe since I started traveling, um you know, standing on top of a fucking mountain and looking there and enjoying that that serenity and that peace that we talk about.

00:53:04.84
Mike
Mm

00:53:08.64
Mike
hmm.

00:53:08.95
Bill
um I didn't know I needed to walk on top of a fucking mountain to get it every once in a while. But when I'm there, I'm like, God damn it, man.

00:53:12.76
Mike
Yeah.

00:53:15.09
Bill
Because then I realized that I wouldn't be here. Well, first of wouldn't be ah alive.

00:53:18.93
Mike
Right.

00:53:20.65
Bill
why I don't why laugh every time i say that.

00:53:22.05
Mike
Sure as hell we're going to make it to a top of a mountain anywhere.

00:53:22.41
Bill
Because it's...

00:53:26.88
Bill
Without beer.

00:53:28.25
Mike
Right.

00:53:30.00
Bill
yeah but Remind me of it.

00:53:30.66
Mike
little tough to be on top of a mountain when you're laying in the gutter. Mm-hmm.

00:53:34.01
Bill
yeah Remind me about that. take it Take a beer to a park, too. I got something other thing that kind blew my mind. um but um But yeah, i mean, it's maybe those moments where I'm like, you know, i I have the I'm grateful that I have the opportunity to do this.

00:53:47.91
Bill
And like I just booked a two weeks in in Tennessee. I found this other this other place that just again, randomly down in in Tennessee, um it's called Falls Creek, Fall Creek Falls State Park.

00:53:54.16
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:54:00.57
Bill
again, all these fucking gorges and cliffs and, you know, fucking waterfalls and shit. I'm like, where did these goddamn things come from? I'm like, I gotta go. Um, but same, same deal when I was, I was about to book it and I'm like, God, you know, um, same thing going back to these problems that we talk about.

00:54:09.49
Mike
Right.

00:54:16.27
Bill
Um, you know, I, I've mentioned it, you know, that things little slow at work. The money's not where it needs to be and blah, blah, blah.

00:54:19.45
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:54:21.41
Bill
Then just told, told Kathy the other day, cause she wants to get her floors done. And she's like, you know, just decide, you got figure out when, ah whenever you're, you're taking a trip, I'll get it done then.

00:54:30.51
Mike
Right.

00:54:30.70
Bill
So I'm like, well, let me know. Cause I got a plan. She's like, Oh, just whatever. So I'm like, okay. You know, I, I would, I just came up randomly. Um, but I told her, I'm like, I don't know if I want to do it with the money being tight.

00:54:41.25
Bill
And then this morning I told her, i'm like, ah, fuck it. Last night and I booked it. I'm like, you know, again, you know, money's tight and, And I said, I'm not broke or anything like that, but I'm like, like I get two choices.

00:54:48.77
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:54:50.44
Bill
You know I can, I can have money be tight here, or I could be in, you know, in fucking Tennessee and be able to go on a hiking trail and have money be tight.

00:54:55.84
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

00:54:58.66
Bill
Cause all I did in it just, um there's one thing that got paid off. So it's replacing himself plus a couple of dollars monthly for what I got to pay on it. um And it's just gas money to get there. And i'm like, fuck it. You know, it's not a YOLO thing. I'm not a YOLO guy.

00:55:12.30
Mike
Yeah.

00:55:12.81
Bill
You know, but I'm just, I'm just of that opinion that, okay, so what am I going to do? Am I going to sit here and wallow?

00:55:17.94
Mike
Right.

00:55:18.98
Bill
You know, which there's nothing wrong. I'm, I'm having the time of my life wherever I, wherever I can be. But, um, you know, I told Kathy, I'm like, if I get to go be someplace beautiful, i'm like, I don't mean it's not beautiful here.

00:55:24.30
Mike
sir

00:55:29.96
Mike
Right.

00:55:31.52
Bill
You suck, Kathy. yeah Fuck you, Indiana.

00:55:36.29
Mike
right

00:55:37.67
Bill
Although quick side note, fuck the gas prices around here though.

00:55:39.60
Mike
Yeah.

00:55:41.68
Bill
Oh, I just got, uh, when I ran up to get my pizza, I stopped and got gas.

00:55:41.68
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:55:46.51
Bill
I just paid $4 and 17 cents for fucking premium.

00:55:49.31
Mike
Oof.

00:55:50.41
Bill
Yeah.

00:55:50.60
Mike
Oof.

00:55:51.19
Bill
And, um, I mean, it's ah when I'm traveling around, I've, I've gotten it down to like, I don't know, three and a quarter. And this is for 93 octane and all this stuff that I just, it's like a fucking dollar more gallon, you know, at some places here.

00:55:58.19
Mike
Yeah, right. Yeah.

00:56:01.55
Bill
And I'm like, I'm like, fuck you.

00:56:01.88
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:56:03.08
Bill
That was a fuck you to Indiana.

00:56:04.88
Mike
Yep.

00:56:06.04
Bill
But, um, yeah, I don't know the, the gratitude part. I don't know when it pops up, but to your exact point, yes. Old guests curmudgeon.

00:56:12.26
Mike
yeah mm-hmm right

00:56:14.35
Bill
Um, just, yeah, just kind of like, you know, worn out by worn out by life every once in a while, just because of our age and all that stuff.

00:56:17.13
Mike
ah yeah this is

00:56:21.01
Bill
But, um, But yeah, it is. It's, uh, it's kind of funny that, um, I, I do, I, I forget, I forget to be grateful and, you know, the positive attitude, I, I talked about that too. You know, I, I feel like I'm always trying to, I'm in a constant state of trying to pull myself up and I don't mean that in a bad way, but that is, I, we re we figured that out on here about me that, you know, I'm, I'm always, I'm living down here and I got, always got to pull myself up, you know?

00:56:37.16
Mike
the

00:56:40.69
Mike
right

00:56:43.01
Mike
Yeah, right. Yeah, you know, and I mean, you're you know, similar to me, I, you know, lived my entire life looking at the negative and it's, you know, and sometimes it's looking around, it's a little tough to find positive, of but it's there, you know, you just gotta, gotta scratch that surface a little bit because God knows the surface is grimy and dingy and

00:57:00.47
Bill
Right.

00:57:07.54
Mike
fuck that but ah yeah you know there's some there's some decency out there you just gotta to look for it and it' sometimes sometimes the effort is a little much but yeah you know it's worth it when yeah when you do find something decent occasionally

00:57:21.40
Bill
Right. Yeah, I agree. Oh, the, uh, so I was thinking of, I didn't want to forget about the, uh, alcohol and parks. So the, um, the park that I went to, it was, um, Warren dunes state park, um, in whatever town, again, north of here, which you've probably driven by might even driven by there before.

00:57:35.59
Mike
hmm

00:57:40.58
Mike
Probably.

00:57:40.75
Bill
But um so when when I got there, i remember what time I got there, probably 1030-ish. A little bit of a wait to get in. of Whatever it was, it's like fucking $11 to drive into this goddamn park. All it is is sand dunes. When I was in when i was in ah um Amarillo, I went into that...

00:57:56.49
Bill
where were you at that Paulo Alto or Apollo Duro?

00:57:57.38
Mike
Yeah, right. Yeah, the canyon. Mm-hmm.

00:58:00.01
Bill
That was $8. And I'm like, i don't spend $8 there again, grateful, grateful. I could do this. yeah

00:58:06.16
Mike
Right.

00:58:07.12
Bill
But, um, as I'm, as I'm going in and even looking, you know, for all the different things, I mean, all over the place, you know, no alcohol in the park, no alcohol here, no alcoholic beverages.

00:58:13.74
Mike
Right.

00:58:14.97
Bill
And I'm like, really? You know, I mean, there's picnic areas or whatever. I'm like, really? Because all I could sit there and think about and I mean, when I pulled out, there was this line all out onto the road and people come in.

00:58:25.36
Bill
And so i'm like, seriously, all these hundreds and hundreds, maybe thousands of people, nobody's drinking. Come on. Really?

00:58:31.67
Mike
Right. Yeah. Well, we know they are.

00:58:33.60
Bill
know. Yeah. was going to, know what I would have done.

00:58:36.20
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:58:36.49
Bill
Um,

00:58:37.05
Mike
They're drinking. They're using drugs. Yes, yes.

00:58:39.04
Bill
yeah Right. But it's just that I thought about that. I'm like, like, really, that's not even allowed in the park. And then um I never really paid attention to it before. But as I was searching some of these other places, um I noticed these other things that, you know, you're reading because I was reading something about this place.

00:58:47.31
Mike
jo

00:58:53.33
Bill
I'm going ah whether it's this weekend or Kentucky or the other place that I that I booked. um Same thing in their rules. I think these most of these places, you know, you're you can't bring you're not supposed to have any alcoholic beverages in these.

00:59:05.11
Mike
Right.

00:59:06.09
Bill
I'm like it again.

00:59:07.71
Mike
Yeah.

00:59:08.30
Bill
I'm glad that I don't.

00:59:08.40
Mike
Well, you're not supposed to drink and drive either.

00:59:11.64
Bill
Right.

00:59:12.23
Mike
Right.

00:59:13.12
Bill
Right. yeah That's, that's it. You know what? Nevermind. You just, you just proved, you just, you just proved the point.

00:59:17.55
Mike
uh-huh

00:59:20.59
Bill
Forget everything I just said.

00:59:22.06
Mike
right

00:59:22.13
Bill
Okay. Back, back to this one. um From keep it simple. If we're not excited about being sober, we need to check on ourselves. Okay. This has happened to be like two below what we were just talking about.

00:59:31.02
Mike
right yes

00:59:33.68
Bill
Do you feel, um,

00:59:38.70
Bill
ah Just as I'm looking at something, everything we just talked about, I know the answer to this, but I can say it anyhow. Mike, do you feel excited about being sober every day?

00:59:44.26
Mike
yes

00:59:47.41
Mike
ah

00:59:50.77
Mike
oh I'm not excited about anything every day.

00:59:54.37
Bill
i know. I mean, it's...

00:59:54.82
Mike
um No, I mean, you know what? But again, part of the routine, you know, but find something to be grateful for.

01:00:00.96
Bill
Right.

01:00:03.03
Mike
Yes. I don't know if excitement is the right word. oh Yes. But I do notice um and I'm thankful for I'm glad, you know, um I don't know about excited, but certainly glad.

01:00:15.04
Bill
right

01:00:18.49
Mike
Because, yeah, I don't want to not be sober today. So, yeah, no.

01:00:22.91
Bill
Right.

01:00:24.52
Mike
Excited? but i don't know.

01:00:26.89
Bill
Settle down.

01:00:27.23
Mike
Yeah, again, it's not a hell of a lot I'm excited about anymore.

01:00:27.46
Bill
Come on now. yeah

01:00:32.76
Mike
Right.

01:00:33.76
Bill
I know. And it's just that what when I started reading that, and so I started laughing. I'm like, this is we just fucking talked about this. You know, we got to remember to be grateful and we're going to be fucking excited. Wake up every morning.

01:00:43.73
Mike
Exactly.

01:00:44.56
Bill
Hello. Hello, world.

01:00:45.80
Mike
um I'm excited that there's oxygen in this room right now. I'm excited that there's gravity and I'm not floating away.

01:00:55.62
Bill
right Right.

01:00:56.46
Mike
Right.

01:00:57.54
Bill
Yeah. And again, I, yeah of of course, I mean, ah the, the, in, in my, in my heart, yes, every, every day, I mean, I'm, I'm happy, I'm grateful. um All those things about being, you know, I'm being sober is, is the thing, you know, the most important thing in my life today, you know, today and every day, God damn it.

01:01:06.41
Mike
Yep.

01:01:11.19
Mike
Yes. Today. Today.

01:01:17.33
Mike
Yes.

01:01:17.45
Bill
And I, and I know that, but um yeah, I can't remember the last time I woke up and like, God damn, I'm so excited. I'm sober. Yay. yaay

01:01:27.59
Mike
And I just can't hide I'm about to lose control.

01:01:27.65
Bill
yeah Yeah. yeah this

01:01:34.91
Mike
think I like it.

01:01:35.90
Bill
yeah Oh yeah. Okay. So, um, yeah, that, that was a good laugh.

01:01:39.98
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:01:40.56
Bill
That got a good one.

01:01:41.38
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:01:42.11
Bill
Um, oh, you know, do you have your, have your big book there?

01:01:47.67
Mike
ah In the house?

01:01:48.45
Bill
Or, yeah, or, well, and you know what? i The only reason I just came across this one, I've had this on here for a while.

01:01:54.73
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:01:54.80
Bill
um I don't know why I wrote it down, but it's been a while ago. I wanted to read through the promises again because um Keep It Simple said, the reading said, today I'll read over the promises of the program.

01:01:59.27
Mike
Yeah.

01:02:03.92
Bill
And I wrote that down. And I know we did it one time, but I don't know. i just, I like the promises. I just didn't know if you had a book in front of you or within arm's reach or anything like that that had the promises in it.

01:02:12.88
Mike
Well, you know what?

01:02:12.92
Bill
If not,

01:02:13.87
Mike
I have a phone right next to me and... What the hell is that?

01:02:19.72
Bill
Just, I mean, you know, kind of since we're, I mean, again, I found this randomly just kind of glancing over here, but since we're reading about all this and talking about this, this gratitude and excitedness shit, I think the promises would be, that would be kind of appropriate.

01:02:29.34
Mike
Right. I've got them.

01:02:32.93
Bill
Cool.

01:02:33.71
Mike
Yeah. All right. So you want me to read the promises? God damn this...

01:02:37.18
Bill
I would love for you to read the promises.

01:02:38.98
Mike
Are you excited for me to read the promises?

01:02:42.56
Bill
I'm excited. Ladies and gentlemen, my friend Mike's going to read the promises from Alcoholics Anonymous.

01:02:52.48
Mike
Wow. The fount's pretty small on this one. Let's see here. The 12 Promises of Alcoholics Anonymous. One, if we are paid painstaking about this phase of our development, we'll be amazed before we are halfway through.

01:03:06.89
Bill
Woohoo!

01:03:07.53
Mike
We are going to know a new freedom and a new happiness. We will not regret the past nor wish to shut the door on it. We will comprehend the word serenity and we will know peace.

01:03:20.96
Mike
No matter how far down the scale we have gone, we will see how our experiences can benefit others. That feeling of uselessness and self-pity will disappear.

01:03:33.24
Mike
We will lose interest in selfish things and gain interest in our fellows. Self-seeking will slip away. Our whole attitude and outlook on life will change.

01:03:46.32
Mike
Fear of people and ah economic insecurity will leave us. We will intuitively know how to handle situations which used to baffle us. We will suddenly realize as God is doing for us what we could not do for ourselves.

01:04:04.10
Mike
are theseta Are these extravagant promises?

01:04:04.35
Bill
Nice.

01:04:07.55
Bill
We think not.

01:04:07.58
Mike
We think not.

01:04:11.39
Bill
They are being fulfilled among us every day, sometimes quickly, sometimes slowly.

01:04:13.34
Mike
Yes.

01:04:15.98
Bill
Right.

01:04:16.80
Mike
Right.

01:04:17.67
Bill
See, look at that. I remember. remember some things. So, um and you know, it's just kind of funny. And I seriously, I have no idea when I wrote It's been a while ago since I wrote that down. But um I mean, I i love the the promises. I always loved going to you know go into a meeting or love going to meetings when they read them.

01:04:34.60
Mike
Uh

01:04:34.79
Bill
um So I think they're important. You know, I probably didn't pay same thing. Maybe I guess the other way around. i didn't pay much attention to those as much attention to those, you know, when I was newer.

01:04:43.30
Mike
huh. Right.

01:04:45.60
Bill
um But I remember I don't remember where I was, like whether it was Ohio or Wisconsin or whatever. So remember the time frame um that it clicked to or that the the words clicked to me. But, um you know, the, like, what is it, third or fourth one where it says, you know, we will know, ah comprehend the word serenity and know peace.

01:05:04.23
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:05:04.82
Bill
I remember sitting in a meeting when that was read and just this, again, this calm came over me when that line was read.

01:05:10.90
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:05:11.99
Bill
And I'm like, that was fucking cool.

01:05:15.76
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:05:17.41
Bill
You know, because it it just, after hearing that for, and I was, I think I was in Wisconsin, so probably three, four years, you know, of hearing it.

01:05:23.38
Mike
Sure.

01:05:24.76
Bill
Um, that I just, I actually, it was, it was almost like a, um, again, like this physical reaction I got to it. It wasn't a fucking white light or any bullshit like that. It just, you know what i mean?

01:05:34.25
Mike
Right.

01:05:35.42
Bill
It was just a calming effect, you know?

01:05:35.88
Mike
Yeah. Mm-hmm.

01:05:37.73
Bill
Um, and mean, I think that's the point to those promises, right? You know, they're,

01:05:41.77
Mike
Sure. Yeah, well, you just, you know, you whatever, three, four years sober, hear that, newcomers, you went, oh, shit. i I know peace.

01:05:50.43
Bill
Right.

01:05:51.95
Mike
I comprehend the serenity of which they speak.

01:05:58.36
Bill
yeah hit um

01:05:58.46
Mike
I know what the fuck they talking about.

01:06:00.91
Bill
And umm like seriously, i'm I'm pretty sure it was, I'm pretty sure it was when I was in a meeting in in Madison. So yeah, probably three, four years sober at that timeframe, which, yeah, that's, I guess that's a, that's a great point to make.

01:06:07.45
Mike
Yeah. Yeah. Well.

01:06:13.87
Bill
It didn't, it didn't happen at six months.

01:06:15.37
Mike
Right.

01:06:15.83
Bill
with It did not. And I was, I was, you know I had my, my head was, you know, completely out of my ass at that point. I was doing the right things. I didn't have all my shit together.

01:06:26.42
Bill
I still don't clearly, but,

01:06:26.80
Mike
Right. Sure. Right.

01:06:29.20
Bill
Um, you know, but I mean, I had a ah good solid foundation by the time I left Cleveland, um, and going to meetings and, you know, again, living a decent life and all that sort of things.

01:06:33.32
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:06:37.78
Mike
Right.

01:06:38.06
Bill
But, but yeah, like, I guess to your point, yeah, it took, you know, it was three, four years sober until that, until that feeling fucking came over me, which is, don't know.

01:06:42.53
Mike
Yeah.

01:06:46.82
Bill
It's cool. You know, why did it take so long?

01:06:47.63
Mike
Yeah. ah Oh, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, took it took as long as it needed to take.

01:06:54.00
Bill
yeah

01:06:56.98
Bill
hey I know. And the thing of it is I was already in a good fucking mood. So it just, it was just a little bit of a, you know, cherry on top of the icing is all that, not all that it was, but, uh, you know, adding to it at that point and it was just, it was fucking wonderful.

01:07:01.76
Mike
Yeah.

01:07:04.63
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:07:08.78
Mike
Right, yeah. I mean, well, yeah, you were peaceful and serene, and you just it made you actually look at it, and you went, oh, shit, I actually am peaceful and serene. Wow.

01:07:18.89
Bill
Right.

01:07:19.64
Mike
Yeah.

01:07:20.15
Bill
Yeah. Yeah. It's like, uh, Hey, I can, I can actually relate to that now. Hey, how you doing?

01:07:25.37
Mike
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

01:07:26.47
Bill
It's not just fucking words coming out of my mouth. I ah kind of feel that a little bit. Yeah, I got that kind of got that going on.

01:07:30.36
Mike
ah

01:07:32.67
Bill
little bit swagger. little bit peace and serenity swagger.

01:07:33.86
Mike
so

01:07:37.67
Bill
But um yeah, and yeah to to your point, you know it took as long as it took. And I was obviously joking, so you would say that. But um yeah, it was ah it was a good thing. So thank you. I appreciate you fumbling through the the small font to read us the Demdar Promises.

01:07:49.82
Mike
Uh-huh. Yes, absolutely.

01:07:54.44
Bill
All right. So um this one is from God Grammy. This might be more recent. Reading was talking about letting go of good and bad things and how we are now versus before we got sober.

01:08:06.93
Bill
And I've gotten in quotes here.

01:08:06.92
Mike
Ah,

01:08:08.33
Bill
Am I the type of person who has more trouble letting go or hanging on? That was the quote at the end.

01:08:13.48
Mike
ah yes. Yes.

01:08:14.36
Bill
um So, and I think this was recent, probably in the last couple of weeks. So what do you think about that? I mean, I, am i the type of person who has more do you have more trouble letting go or hanging on or is it equal or or what do you think right

01:08:27.34
Mike
Um, um ah you know what? I probably have more trouble hanging on. Yeah. You know, I, I let it go is pretty, pretty easy for me.

01:08:38.43
Mike
Um, yeah, you know, good and bad. oh yeah, but hanging on, um, yeah, uh, you know, hanging on to good. Um, I don't hang on to bad very much anymore, but hanging on to good sometimes is a little difficult for me.

01:08:53.47
Bill
Right.

01:08:53.81
Mike
Uh, yeah, I, you know, I don't know. Again, it's, it's that, you know, uh, spending, you know, most of my life, 40 plus years, you know, looking at the negative, man. So, um, hanging on to the good stuff sometimes is, is a little difficult, but I'm getting a little better at it.

01:09:11.39
Bill
Right. Well, I think, ah and I mean, maybe, I guess that's a, that's a good way to put it. You know, as far as again, how we used to be in blah, blah, blah.

01:09:19.79
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:09:20.12
Bill
But um I wonder if it, well, i I mean, I think it does. I think it, I think it takes more work to hang on to something. Right. I mean, once you, you know, sometimes getting it, I want to say it's easy.

01:09:27.39
Mike
Oh yeah.

01:09:30.79
Bill
You know, we've worked for a number of years, you know, to, to get certain things. And ah once again, not talking about material stuff, but yeah,

01:09:37.28
Mike
Right.

01:09:39.55
Bill
realizing that, you know, just something as, as simple, but as critical as, you know, i'm staying sober every day, you know, we, we have to do the work.

01:09:45.44
Mike
Uh

01:09:46.51
Bill
We have to hang on to this thing. We have to do this, this daily work, you know, the readings and being a good boy and doing all those different things.

01:09:51.26
Mike
huh. hmm.

01:09:53.39
Bill
um But, you know, I, I guess I, I, I didn't think about this when I wrote it down because I try not to, But, you know, when weird shit or weird people or weird things that have come into my life, um it is, it's it's easier.

01:10:06.62
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:10:09.13
Bill
It's not as difficult. It used to be impossible for me um to cut something loose, you know, because I just didn't, i maybe I don't know why i didn't have the balls to do it or didn't want to deal with the confrontation.

01:10:14.30
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:10:18.66
Mike
Right.

01:10:20.30
Bill
But if, especially if it's something that threatens, well, the only reason I, the only reason If it was bad to me, would be because it'd be threatening some part of my life. And usually, you know, my, maybe that piece of serenity I was just talking about, which could you know affect my sobriety. So it's, it's easy to just be like, man, I can't, I can't be around this person.

01:10:39.60
Mike
Right.

01:10:39.76
Bill
i can't do this thing anymore. um So yeah, maybe, maybe it is. Maybe that's the reason that letting go is easier. Right.

01:10:47.55
Mike
Yeah. Yeah, definitely. think so. I don't know, man.

01:10:54.30
Bill
yeah you're funny you're like yeah if I could I just I just I just don't know

01:10:59.42
Mike
I'm running it on fumes here. Go ahead.

01:11:02.83
Bill
okay so um I know let's why don't we do a little bit let's do some light-hearted stuff I won't make you won't make you think anymore between now and the end of the episode is that fair

01:11:10.94
Mike
It sounds good to me.

01:11:13.93
Bill
yeah i I don't even know what all these fucking articles are. i just kept like copying shit into my for some of these articles that came up. And I've got i've got a number of, god damn, I've got a bunch of them.

01:11:24.68
Mike
yeah

01:11:24.74
Bill
um Okay, going give you choices here, okay? Can you least pick pick from choices?

01:11:30.22
Mike
I can pick something. go ahead.

01:11:33.44
Bill
um The humans aren't built to remember everything. We had talked about that last time. that We didn't talk about it, but that was one of the choices last time. 10 phrases people use with below average social skills. We didn't do that one yet, but that's one of the choices.

01:11:47.67
Bill
um People who speak more than they listen in conversations typically display these seven traits. That might be one since I talk a lot.

01:11:55.00
Mike
All right.

01:11:56.89
Bill
um Eight signs that you're a difficult person.

01:12:03.25
Mike
right

01:12:04.94
Bill
uh what was the other one kind of got another like a news article here that i want to read too if you find small talk exhausting you probably have these 10 deeper traits that might be a fun one let's do let's do that one first

01:12:13.97
Mike
Mm-hmm. Well, let's do... Okay, let's do that one first. and little Let's find out how difficult I am

01:12:21.64
Bill
oh okay okay so you want to do the the small talk one first all right let's pop into some small talk here give me one moment and

01:12:24.30
Mike
Yes.

01:12:30.88
Mike
Itty-bitty tiny talk.

01:12:33.91
Bill
And once again, i've I've made it a point not to read any of these because I found it's more fun.

01:12:39.52
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:12:39.69
Bill
All right.

01:12:39.72
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:12:39.93
Bill
So the title of this, if you find small talk exhausting, which I think both of us do for the most part, right?

01:12:44.89
Mike
Yes.

01:12:45.85
Bill
Okay.

01:12:45.97
Mike
and sir

01:12:47.00
Bill
um You probably have these 10 deeper traits.

01:12:51.01
Mike
all right.

01:12:51.39
Bill
number Number one, you crave authenticity. the hand The handshake, smile, and nod script feels flimsy because you are scanning every exchange for something real.

01:12:55.44
Mike
Definitely.

01:13:02.63
Bill
And then more shit, blah, blah, blah. um You read emotional subtext like a second language. Idle chatter isn't empty for you. It's noise.

01:13:13.65
Mike
small talk annoys and right

01:13:14.33
Bill
Laid out with micro expressions, tone shifts, and subtle sighs.

01:13:18.13
Mike
yeah

01:13:18.59
Bill
um You're deeply, ooh, I don't know. You're deeply empathetic.

01:13:25.10
Mike
ah small talk annoys me and

01:13:27.91
Bill
Yeah.

01:13:28.41
Mike
um

01:13:29.96
Bill
empathy is Empathy is a gift, but it means catching emotions you've never asked for, especially in crowded, chatty rooms.

01:13:29.96
Mike
alright

01:13:36.15
Mike
yeah

01:13:36.38
Bill
I know you went bowl for fresh air. oh you bowled for fresh air. Okay, i got I understand now. It's kind of the almost like a sideline to having empathy. Okay.

01:13:43.91
Mike
and Okay.

01:13:44.12
Bill
um you're

01:13:44.85
Mike
Not real empathy. Okay.

01:13:46.79
Bill
Exactly. Sideline. it that That's why it makes sense. I'm like, oh, yeah, yeah.

01:13:49.78
Mike
Yeah. Oh, yeah. There you go.

01:13:51.80
Bill
He's not really empathetic.

01:13:52.33
Mike
No, no.

01:13:52.72
Bill
It's fake shit. So, okay, okay.

01:13:53.67
Mike
All right. Yeah. Yeah.

01:13:54.59
Bill
yeah Your inner monologue runs 24-7.

01:13:58.59
Mike
Hmm.

01:13:58.67
Bill
While someone recounts commuter traffic, you're also replaying yesterday's podcast, planning dinner, wondering whether the moon looks the same from New York tonight. ah The rich inner world makes silence productive and chatter intrusive.

01:14:13.64
Mike
Yeah.

01:14:13.89
Bill
um You're purpose-driven. Quickest changes feel pointless because they often are. ah No lesson, no story, no next step.

01:14:21.03
Mike
Right.

01:14:22.70
Bill
I like that one. I like that one a lot.

01:14:23.85
Mike
Yeah.

01:14:25.43
Bill
um You're a high sensitivity powerhouse.

01:14:31.31
Bill
ah i Highly sensitive people process sensory input more deeply, which means fluorescent lights, overlapping voices, and polite chuckles stack up fast.

01:14:41.40
Bill
I don't know if that, does that one fit? don't know. That's kind of weird.

01:14:43.61
Mike
Nah, nah, nah, nah. Doesn't fit me, anyway.

01:14:47.47
Bill
Right. um You prefer listening to performing.

01:14:53.43
Bill
Ask yourself, do you leave gatherings knowing everyone's favorite vacation spot, yet feeling no one asks what you're reading? Like you care what people, if people ask you what you're doing.

01:15:03.51
Mike
Yeah, I don't fucking care.

01:15:05.67
Bill
yeah know.

01:15:06.90
Mike
Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha.

01:15:07.35
Bill
So that, so that one doesn't count. ah We just got three more. um You love complexity and nuance. ah Binary yes or no questions. Busy week? question mark

01:15:18.21
Mike
Right.

01:15:18.56
Bill
Flatten a world you know is anything but binary. Your mind thrives on paradox, contradiction, and messy middle.

01:15:25.59
Mike
Yeah.

01:15:26.50
Bill
Okay. um You guard your energy like a scarce resource.

01:15:31.99
Mike
Like a white nail.

01:15:32.81
Bill
but Let me start over. You guard your energy like a scarce resource.

01:15:37.40
Mike
oh

01:15:37.75
Bill
Not a scarce resource. Okay.

01:15:39.95
Mike
Right.

01:15:41.33
Bill
But I would say you do. You guard your energy.

01:15:43.13
Mike
Oh, yeah, absolutely.

01:15:43.50
Bill
yeah him here You don't want to burn calories and blah, blah, blah.

01:15:44.63
Mike
Yeah. Uh-huh.

01:15:47.93
Bill
Okay. You invest in, oh, this, I think this one rings true for both of us. You invest in fewer, deeper relationships.

01:15:55.57
Mike
Oh, absolutely.

01:15:57.02
Bill
Okay, cool. So I think with the exception of, i don't know, whatever that one, one minor thing was that we didn't agree with.

01:16:03.39
Mike
Right.

01:16:03.58
Bill
So what was the other one you wanted to see how, why you're difficult?

01:16:05.85
Mike
Oh, yes. How difficult am i he

01:16:08.35
Bill
And there's a there's an article I want to read about about a turkey. um Even though it's not Thanksgiving, it came up in a news story recently.

01:16:12.44
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:16:16.03
Bill
But...

01:16:16.29
Mike
God is my witness. I thought turkeys could fly.

01:16:18.38
Bill
yeah

01:16:21.55
Bill
Um, ah okay. Eight. Ooh, not even eight signs. These are eight strong signs that you're a very difficult person.

01:16:29.03
Mike
All right.

01:16:29.26
Bill
yeah

01:16:29.63
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:16:29.95
Bill
Strong signs that you're a very difficult person.

01:16:33.01
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:16:33.83
Bill
Ooh, it's got all these fucking adjectives all over the goddamn place.

01:16:36.41
Mike
u hu

01:16:37.68
Bill
Um, who, I don't know. You're, you're often the center of drama.

01:16:42.99
Mike
um No.

01:16:44.47
Bill
No, that doesn't fit. I can't even make a joke about that because there's there's there's nothing. I can't even lie about that. um People often seem taken aback by your comments.

01:16:59.09
Mike
No, because I know better. Unless I'm here, but yeah, right.

01:17:02.03
Bill
Right. You know, in...

01:17:05.18
Mike
I try.

01:17:05.37
Bill
Well, in...

01:17:06.22
Mike
Yeah, that'd be, you know, exactly. That'd be letting my thoughts run. You know, yeah, my thoughts. They heard what the hell was going on in my head. Yes, they would be taken aback, but I know better.

01:17:15.33
Bill
Right.

01:17:17.32
Mike
Yes, go ahead.

01:17:17.46
Bill
Right. I mean, we, we, we say, well, we say things for, you know, just fun shock value, but not, um, not, not truth.

01:17:23.00
Mike
Right.

01:17:24.46
Bill
the So yeah, yeah. Okay. I wouldn't, I wouldn't pinpoint you on that or me.

01:17:28.20
Mike
right. So far, I'm 0 for 2.

01:17:28.76
Bill
Um, nope.

01:17:30.39
Mike
Yeah.

01:17:30.96
Bill
Oh, I think you got number three. You've, you've openly admitted it on here.

01:17:33.20
Mike
ah ha

01:17:35.56
Bill
You struggle with empathy.

01:17:37.98
Mike
Yes.

01:17:41.10
Bill
Uh, empathy, the ability to understand and share feelings of others is a key characteristic of emotional intelligence. i don't know about that.

01:17:46.64
Mike
mrs

01:17:47.30
Bill
I mean, it is, I guess, but, um, but did you know that being low on empathy can make you come across as difficult?

01:17:48.74
Mike
Sure.

01:17:53.87
Bill
Um, I mean, I can, I,

01:17:54.26
Mike
I don't fucking care.

01:17:57.91
Bill
well, don't you seem difficult.

01:18:00.00
Mike
That's right.

01:18:01.60
Bill
Um, okay. So number four, I think depending on the circumstance could go either way. You are resistant to change. Okay.

01:18:10.16
Mike
Yeah.

01:18:10.41
Bill
So I think depending on the circumstance, that could be a yes or a no, right?

01:18:14.99
Mike
Well, no it's ah it's a definite yes. I have resistance to change. um But ah thankfully, I know better that there are things that I have to change. Otherwise, my life is fucking miserable.

01:18:25.30
Bill
Oh yeah. Yeah. Okay.

01:18:26.69
Mike
But yes, I'm resistant to it.

01:18:27.22
Bill
You know what? That's yeah.

01:18:28.91
Mike
Yeah, always. You know, I'm a goddamn drunk, man.

01:18:30.46
Bill
Okay. Okay.

01:18:31.52
Mike
I hate change.

01:18:33.64
Bill
Yeah, I wasn't thinking about it that way. I was just, I was thinking the fact that you're open to change, but you're right. I mean, that's, and yeah that's, that's the perfect way to explain it.

01:18:38.60
Mike
Right. I'm open to it. I fucking hate it, but I'm open to it.

01:18:42.21
Bill
Right. No, and that's, that yeah, that's where I was. Again, I was, my, my brain was over there on trying to, you know, think, think positively for you. But I, when I wanted to go back to the real, the real reason. So now I get it, but I have the same goddamn way.

01:18:53.42
Mike
Yep.

01:18:55.55
Bill
have that exactly the same way.

01:18:55.97
Mike
Yep.

01:18:57.56
Bill
um This one, I don't agree with you. Don't apologize easily.

01:19:02.26
Mike
Hmm.

01:19:05.47
Bill
hey Well, we...

01:19:07.70
Mike
I mean, define easy.

01:19:10.69
Bill
Well, I mean, we we have a 10-step, you know, and mean, so I...

01:19:13.10
Mike
Yes, exactly. Yeah. And it's there because we don't naturally apologize easily. You know, what I mean, you know, other than, yeah, you know, sorry, whoo, and then don't fucking change our goddamn behavior.

01:19:27.10
Mike
Right. Um, you know, we did that a lot, but we didn't truly apologize because truly apologizing is changing your fucking behavior. So no, not easily, but, uh, we, we do it because again, we have to.

01:19:36.00
Bill
Right.

01:19:41.28
Bill
Okay. Yeah. So you're, you're looking at, you're looking at both layers and I like that because I'm looking at, you know, I'm looking at where we, what we do versus what we are.

01:19:44.88
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:19:48.52
Bill
So yeah.

01:19:48.69
Mike
Right.

01:19:49.36
Bill
And that's, yeah, that's not what you're, you're 100% correct.

01:19:51.60
Mike
Yeah.

01:19:52.08
Bill
So yes yeah.

01:19:52.25
Mike
Oh, I'm difficult.

01:19:54.91
Bill
Yeah, but no, you're june being truthful. And i'm I'm looking at more of the the glossy and the the shiny side where you're like, no, no, no, it's this.

01:19:57.40
Mike
Yes.

01:19:59.93
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:20:02.30
Bill
I'm like, fuck, okay, it is. You're right.

01:20:03.77
Mike
Yep. Uh-huh.

01:20:04.83
Bill
um But yeah, with the sorrys, it's like, well, fine, I'm fucking sorry.

01:20:10.64
Bill
I said it.

01:20:11.49
Mike
Yeah, i I said it. or I can apologize real fucking easily. not going to do anything about it, but yelp.

01:20:18.57
Bill
All right, so ah number six, you're often dismissive of others' ideas.

01:20:24.28
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:20:27.98
Mike
Yeah, often.

01:20:30.82
Bill
it You're like, yes.

01:20:31.73
Mike
You're full of shit.

01:20:34.31
Bill
You're like, yes, yes, often, yes.

01:20:34.51
Mike
Right.

01:20:37.35
Mike
Yes.

01:20:40.47
Bill
Okay, I'm just going to give that one to you then. um all right, so number seven, you're not open to feedback.

01:20:48.57
Mike
Right.

01:20:52.43
Bill
Again, I'm just...

01:20:52.82
Mike
Now, unfortunately, yes, I am fucking open to it. Again, I don't like it, but I'm open to it because I have to be.

01:21:02.89
Bill
Right. And I'm just reading these and shut my fucking mouth. No commentary to begin with. Just giving you, giving you the range to go whichever way you want. You can go whatever way, but you're like, no, I am that way. i' like, okay, fine. Fuck you then.

01:21:14.07
Bill
yeah

01:21:14.09
Mike
Yep. Yeah. know

01:21:15.50
Bill
Okay. So um I agree with that though. I mean, with myself also. um Okay. So this, I'm going to disagree with this one. Okay. um' um But butll we'll see what you think. Number eight, you struggle to maintain close relationships.

01:21:30.78
Mike
Now.

01:21:31.69
Bill
Okay.

01:21:31.99
Mike
No.

01:21:32.10
Bill
I was,

01:21:32.58
Mike
Yeah. That one, I mean, no, I don't struggle. I have two of them and three.

01:21:39.34
Bill
hey

01:21:40.99
Mike
of Yeah.

01:21:41.39
Bill
yeah

01:21:41.83
Mike
And yeah, know that but that's fine. It's plenty.

01:21:44.84
Bill
right yeah and that's and that's the thing i mean it it went back to i forget whether it was in in a reading or one of these other things we just read but uh you know the um the circle of people we have we talked about it before um i don't have the time or patience to have a large circle of you know friends friends anymore um in ah in it i take away from the fact of all the people that we run across in cleveland

01:21:54.88
Mike
Yeah. Mm hmm.

01:21:59.84
Mike
No. Right. Right.

01:22:06.55
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:22:06.71
Bill
um Even all, you know, because we've got our core people, then we've got, you know, the whole poker group that I consider all those people friends, but not people who we do so do stuff with on a on a daily basis.

01:22:12.23
Mike
Mm-hmm. Oh, absolutely. Yeah. Right.

01:22:17.37
Bill
You know, but um I still consider those to be close relationships, but just different, you know, there, you know, than that core.

01:22:20.61
Mike
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

01:22:23.64
Bill
But OK, so that was you know that was it.

01:22:25.09
Mike
Yeah.

01:22:26.52
Bill
That was the eight strong signs. OK, that was eight of them.

01:22:28.01
Mike
That's eight. All right. So, yeah, I'm fucking difficult. Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha.

01:22:33.62
Bill
I don't know. I mean, I think that, you know, in in my mind, as ah as a friend, and like we said, you know, with Father Bill, I mean we're not even friends anymore, a fucking family.

01:22:41.09
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:22:41.33
Bill
I think you're man you're manageable in my mind.

01:22:41.75
Mike
Right. Well, yeah, i that took a lot of work, though.

01:22:43.69
Bill
I mean, that's...

01:22:47.58
Bill
yeah

01:22:47.87
Mike
but

01:22:48.53
Bill
No, I mean...

01:22:48.52
Mike
I sure as fuck wasn't 15 years ago.

01:22:51.18
Bill
No, and I'm saying, to me, you're manageable to deal with. That's what I...

01:22:53.94
Mike
Yeah, right. I know.

01:22:54.89
Bill
Oh, okay.

01:22:54.98
Mike
Yeah.

01:22:55.85
Bill
Yeah.

01:22:56.15
Mike
That took a lot of goddamn work because it's not my natural state.

01:23:00.12
Bill
Right, right. I thought you meant that you were manageable. And I'm like, no, no, But you you got what I meant. Okay, good.

01:23:05.23
Mike
Yeah, I did. Yeah.

01:23:06.30
Bill
Okay. All right. So um this is an article about a, when was this? From June 16th. So yeah, 10, 11 days ago. um All right. Dateline Madison, Wisconsin.

01:23:18.15
Mike
Mm-hmm. Uh-huh.

01:23:20.97
Bill
ah An apartment occupant reportedly used tequila to marinate home cooked turkey Sunday evening, causing the oven door to blow open.

01:23:29.51
Mike
um so

01:23:32.25
Mike
it

01:23:34.97
Bill
Again, I heard this is a kicker story, you know, and then they they read it on the the morning show.

01:23:39.37
Mike
ah hair

01:23:39.62
Bill
So according the Madison Fire Department, 911 caller said they were cooking a turkey in the oven for eight minutes when the oven door blew open. Firefighters arrived at the block of blah, blah, blah.

01:23:50.60
Bill
um A thermal imaging camera was used and firefighters opened the oven, which had blue flames that came out. So this this fucking turkey is still in the oven.

01:24:00.36
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:24:00.38
Bill
So it blew the door open. It must have blown it open and blown blown it back or obviously closed up again.

01:24:05.27
Mike
Yeah.

01:24:05.91
Bill
But so the firefighters opened up blue flames coming out. The oven was removed from the apartment and the occupant obviously said the or said they have used the recipe before and had no issues.

01:24:14.29
Mike
Yeah.

01:24:14.40
Bill
um ah They used before. Firefighters presumed the accumulated vapors from the alcohol were not being vented properly from the oven and when exposed to oxygen would ignite.

01:24:23.03
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:24:25.48
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:24:25.75
Bill
Um, so Occupy had been evaluated for burns, not taking the hospital, blah, blah, blah. But, um, so what they were talking about, what I was thinking about too, I'm like, like how much fucking alcohol, um, would you have had, how much tequila would you have had to use to make your fucking oven a lot?

01:24:44.90
Mike
Right. um Well, you know, yeah.

01:24:47.35
Bill
ah lot

01:24:49.66
Mike
ah Just dump this whole handle of fucking tequila into, pour it over the turkey, and yeah. I'm sure they, you know, whatever, the pan, like figure like a roasting pan, right?

01:25:00.99
Mike
You know, figure five, six inches deep, so you got four or five inches of tequila in there.

01:25:01.04
Bill
Right? Yeah. yeah

01:25:09.49
Mike
Yeah, sure. Why not?

01:25:12.02
Bill
Yeah, I just, still you know, and I think about, um you know, i mean, there's there's bourbon everything out there now. Bourbon steaks, bourbon hamburgers, bourbon this, bourbon that. Jack Daniels has got all these recipes, you know, which they're they're marinated in alcohol.

01:25:24.52
Bill
But I'm guessing, I don't know, whatever whatever the quote-unquote proper amount is, um you know, this, and you know, I guess that now that we're talking about it is that, you know, if it were you and I, if they're like, well, it's this much tequila,

01:25:29.72
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:25:38.17
Bill
is It's good.

01:25:38.42
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:25:39.89
Bill
um

01:25:40.06
Mike
Yes.

01:25:40.54
Bill
i think we're going to put a little bit more in there, you know?

01:25:42.20
Mike
Absolutely.

01:25:43.78
Bill
But and I was just...

01:25:43.84
Mike
More is better.

01:25:47.02
Bill
yeah I was just thinking of, um well, brats, you know, and ah beer brats. I mean, that's a, you know, the the whole point of, I mean, making brats, if you do them, boil them in beer and butter and blah, blah, blah, all that stuff.

01:25:57.47
Bill
But mean, it's an open pot on the top of the stove.

01:25:57.70
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:26:00.00
Bill
So, I mean, it's not like it's, it's enclosed.

01:26:00.27
Mike
Right.

01:26:02.46
Bill
up But I think that was, that seems to be like the the key is the vapors are in there. That, that makes sense. You know, when you think about it, but I don't know just fucking cracked me up.

01:26:07.08
Mike
Yeah.

01:26:10.21
Bill
I'm like some fucking dude. I mean, first of all, I don't know. In all my years of drinking, I wasn't a huge tequila drinker um at at any point.

01:26:16.43
Mike
Yeah, me neither.

01:26:18.83
Bill
Mexico, we did. We were down there and you know shots here and there. But um i I don't know. I mean, the it doesn't even sound appealing to me. Fucking tequila turkey.

01:26:29.55
Bill
Yeah.

01:26:30.23
Mike
Mm-mm. No, it doesn't.

01:26:32.80
Bill
I mean, maybe in in in my drinking days, I mean, a whiskey burger or something like that. I mean, I do understand that what that does, it's probably the the caramelized flavor and everything like that.

01:26:37.44
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:26:41.15
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:26:42.09
Bill
I just, I understand it from the basics, you know, we standpoint of cooking something.

01:26:45.92
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:26:46.40
Bill
They're probably fucking delicious, you know, but honey, I'm going to make the tequila turkey again tonight.

01:26:48.32
Mike
Right.

01:26:53.39
Mike
ah Oh, boy.

01:26:54.82
Bill
All right, dear.

01:26:57.98
Bill
All right, man. um I even think had. Nope, i don't I don't have anything else. I don't have any like any other things or whatever, but looking at the time. See, i the last whatever that was, 15, 15, 20 minutes or whatever it was, you got to ease up a little bit, right? do You feel better?

01:27:11.17
Mike
I did. No.

01:27:14.37
Bill
are you Are you fucking happy now? Are you? Because we're done.

01:27:17.52
Mike
Uh, yeah, sure.

01:27:19.52
Bill
it Come on, now you got to be happy you're done.

01:27:20.93
Mike
ah Uh,

01:27:24.57
Bill
um right, man.

01:27:24.70
Mike
Hmm.

01:27:25.01
Bill
So anyhow, um so that you can become happy and go do what you do, it's your turn.

01:27:29.65
Mike
All right. Well, thank you everyone for listening to yet another episode of sober, not mature. It's always be kind to each other. Begin to each other. Go out there, do something nice for somebody else this week and don't tell anybody you did it.

01:27:45.69
Mike
Now, from the bottom of my heart to the depths of my soul, from the beginning of time until the ends of the earth, always and eternally, fuck you.

01:27:58.51
Mike
And now it's time, kids. Time for you to fuck off. Then keep fucking off. Keep fucking off till you get to a gate with a sign on it saying, you cannot fuck off past here. Climb over that gate.

01:28:10.89
Mike
Dream the impossible dream and keep fucking off forever.

01:28:17.62
Bill
I can't remember who we had on the one time that when you were, ah got to the end of the episode and maybe it was when we had Lisa on the last time and you were just all happy through. And I i think I said that to Lisa. She knows how happy is in that last thing.

01:28:28.81
Bill
She's like, yeah, I did notice the difference in his voice.

01:28:28.91
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:28:30.66
Bill
I'm like, yeah, it's because we're fucking done. She's like, oh, if that makes sense.

01:28:32.65
Mike
well

01:28:35.83
Mike
ahha

01:28:35.91
Bill
But, um yeah, she's going to. Did I tell you that she's they're going to post up the father's episode on the Sober Curator?

01:28:44.24
Mike
Oh, cool.

01:28:44.65
Bill
I think as of the what day is it? I think it's as of the 29th. So I think Sunday.

01:28:49.93
Mike
OK.

01:28:50.07
Bill
um She said they post a couple of articles, a couple of day or whatever. So it'll it'll go up, I think, on the 29th. But. um Yeah, I mean, it's, ah I don't know.

01:28:56.14
Mike
Cool.

01:28:57.58
Bill
du We got a couple of, oh, just real quick. um Al, our buddy Al, he's on Facebook with us. I don't know if he wants us to use his name. it It rhymes with Ritz.

01:29:07.12
Mike
All right.

01:29:08.70
Bill
Um, but he sent a message to us on, uh, uh, Instagram and said, you know, how, uh, how much he enjoyed the episode. And he's like, he goes, I know neither one of you guys are our church or religious guys, but he goes that, you know, the episode was really good. And he goes, I, he goes, it was very cool.

01:29:23.07
Bill
Um, how much respect you treated him with. And I said, well, um, I said, here's the thing. And I'm like, we, we made a point of it and we told father that is we've said no to people that we don't think are going to, are going to gel with us and we wouldn't have somebody on that we didn't think was going to, first of all, we're not going to have somebody on and fucking beat them up verbally.

01:29:34.57
Mike
Right.

01:29:41.19
Bill
You know, I mean, it's just not, it's thank God it's not our thing.

01:29:41.36
Mike
Of course.

01:29:46.56
Mike
Right.

01:29:47.47
Bill
I mean, part of it, it'd be fun for a couple of minutes if the person was a real, if the person was a real dick.

01:29:50.83
Mike
Oh, yeah.

01:29:53.33
Bill
um

01:29:53.36
Mike
Yep.

01:29:54.05
Bill
But no, I mean, we're not going to do that, but I'm like, no, I mean, we, we were open with, we were open with father about that. You know, we didn't know how this fucking thing was going to go.

01:29:57.79
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

01:30:00.28
Bill
But yeah, it just turned out we got,

01:30:01.28
Mike
And plus, he was just a real cool motherfucker. So, yeah. It was, you know, right.

01:30:04.16
Bill
Oh my God. Yeah.

01:30:05.35
Mike
Yeah. You know.

01:30:06.77
Bill
Yeah.

01:30:07.33
Mike
Yeah. He was just a very cool dude. So, yeah. You know. Yeah. It doesn't matter what his title is and where he comes from, whatever. Cool is cool. And he was cool.

01:30:18.07
Bill
yeah Yeah, 100%. Oh, and I had messaged him too and said that, you know, obviously let him know about the Sobicure and everything. And he's like, he's like, hey, he goes, he goes, if I ever make that pilgrimage out to Cleveland, he said, lunch is on me.

01:30:24.51
Mike
see

01:30:30.02
Bill
And I'm like, okay.

01:30:30.60
Mike
Yeah. Nice.

01:30:31.39
Bill
I said, give us, give us a heads up. I'll make sure I'm out there for a free fucking lunch from a priest.

01:30:33.15
Mike
l

01:30:35.48
Mike
Fuck yeah.

01:30:35.78
Bill
Why the fuck? Yeah.

01:30:39.16
Bill
All right, man. So anyhow, no, you're right. Yeah. Cool is cool. and That's a great way to put it. So, all right.

01:30:42.75
Mike
Yup.

01:30:44.09
Bill
I don't know. I think I love you, brother. I think we'll talk soon.

01:30:46.77
Mike
I love you too. We shall.

01:30:50.89
Bill
Bye.

01:30:51.67
Mike
Bye.