SoberNotMature - Episode 223 (Rabid Raccoons With Whipped Cream)

00:00:27.64
Bill
All right, everyone. Welcome once again to another episode of Sober, Not Mature. I did what i didn't want to fuck that up, but that was fucking perfect.

00:00:35.00
Mike
Hi there. he

00:00:40.02
Bill
Fucking perfect. And everyone, you'll you'll know what we're talking about because we just did a new recording.

00:00:41.21
Mike
Right.

00:00:44.38
Bill
I'll explain it. and Well, we can explain it in a minute, but you'll hear...

00:00:47.10
Mike
Hi there, I'm your government lackey.

00:00:49.62
Bill
You'll hear this little intro literally right before this episode started. It'll be there going forward. But yeah, Mike just did it. And it was ah it was it was it was smooth. What did you say?

00:00:58.65
Mike
One take Jake, motherfuckers.

00:00:59.10
Bill
Duck poop? You say duck goose poop, duck poop, whatever it is.

00:01:01.14
Mike
a What? Yeah, smoother than goose shit

00:01:05.72
Bill
Oh, God. Yeah, it was it was good. So, oh, nice. i'm I'm not saying that I'm overly impressed. I'm just very, ah very impressed with, and I shouldn't be.

00:01:11.89
Mike
shit. Should get out more, right?

00:01:13.90
Bill
You're a...

00:01:14.97
Mike
Right, would.

00:01:15.37
Bill
You're you're ah you' professional, so okay, cool.

00:01:17.85
Mike
ah

00:01:18.01
Bill
But yeah, we can explain that in a couple of minutes. But I do want to start off this episode with a sober, not mature tidbit. That would help if we had Echo at that point, wouldn't it?

00:01:25.37
Mike
ah right it would

00:01:28.70
Bill
Sober, not mature tidbit. Okay. So this is, this is from a TV show that I'm watching.

00:01:32.14
Mike
Tidbit, tidbit, tidbit.

00:01:35.98
Bill
It doesn't matter what it is, but here's the tidbit. Also, here it is. Also grab some whipped cream so I can lick it off your balls. Hello everyone. And welcome to another episode.

00:01:45.42
Mike
there. me

00:01:47.64
Bill
Yeah. It's from a TV show. I was listening. I am fucking laughed out loud at that. I'm like, I'm writing that down. That's going to be a tidbit. I need to share that with Mike and our friends. So yeah.

00:01:55.93
Mike
all right well thanks that's a hell of way to start hmm sure

00:01:56.12
Bill
So that's that. But dumb hey i I thought so. You know, one way or the other, it'll get it'll grab people right away. You know, just, you know, again, whipped cream and balls. So...

00:02:08.12
Bill
And i got to we got other stuff outside of whipped cream and balls, but I got a whole bunch of shit. I got a bunch of bunch of stuff on here. But, oh, can I do one more thing real quick before we get into things?

00:02:19.41
Mike
um jesus he you whatever man you want me to just step away for a few minutes

00:02:20.89
Bill
i No, and actually you can you can explain why behind it because we haven't done this in a while. but Um, we're asking, we're going to ask people to get on Apple and Spotify and leave us a review, either five stars.

00:02:31.58
Mike
m

00:02:35.74
Mike
Yes.

00:02:36.42
Bill
You don't have to leave us a review. If you don't want to just get five stars in Mike. See, here we go, Mike. Why would that be that we would want that?

00:02:41.46
Mike
Yes. um

00:02:46.26
Bill
yeah

00:02:46.90
Mike
It helps get us out there, I suppose. Right.

00:02:50.14
Bill
Yeah, yeah, it does. And, you know, the the short story on that is I some article popped up and it was talking about, you know, because i do all this fucking research on all these things. So I get fed all these fucking articles.

00:02:58.33
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:02:59.66
Bill
It was about growth and stuff like that. It was talking about the reviews, which, you know, i mean, we bring it up every once in a while to figure out what whatever the big deal is and whatever. But. um I mean, basically, we've got everything.

00:03:10.30
Bill
We've got ah a strong audience. We don't have a huge audience, which everyone knows. But, you know, it's basically it seems like the same people are strong. and They're loyal. I mean, clearly, we got a lot of lot of votes, you know, for what the Internet tells us for the when we're doing the whole podcast, best nomination thing.

00:03:24.31
Bill
You know, so i mean we've got people that care about what we're doing, but we don't have a lot of reviews. You know, so even though we rank well, oh, that's what it was.

00:03:28.74
Mike
Right.

00:03:31.23
Bill
I got I got emails about our rankings from two different sources recently, you know, that we're we're starting to rank in certain areas, not really high, like what.

00:03:33.88
Mike
see

00:03:40.12
Mike
I'm quite rank.

00:03:41.37
Bill
But like in one, once like the Cayman Islands, we, we hit like three different categories and the Cayman Islands there, there, I know, I know they're, they're big categories, but it's fucking Cayman Islands. And it was one other one.

00:03:52.16
Bill
Again, these companies, yeah, well, they're, they're companies trying to, I recognize the names cause they've approached us before.

00:03:52.50
Mike
That sounds fishy.

00:03:59.12
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:03:59.34
Bill
They're trying to, trying to have us pay them so they can, you know, help us grow or whatever.

00:04:01.25
Mike
Sure. Mm-hmm.

00:04:03.46
Bill
But that's, that's where it came about the reuse review. So If you listen to us, even if we had you know half the people that listen to us, I mean i think we've got 300 people that are subscribed on, um I think, just Spotify you know that are subscribed to our podcast.

00:04:17.34
Bill
so Even if half of those, even if a quarter of those, so 75 people, you know, got on there and did a review or a five star thing or whatever, it helps.

00:04:17.75
Mike
Right.

00:04:25.23
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:04:25.85
Bill
It does help. It helps rank what we're doing.

00:04:26.95
Mike
Right.

00:04:28.50
Bill
And, you know, I don't know. It's just if everyone, the whole point of if people enjoy what we're doing, we enjoy what we're doing. But, you know, if everyone enjoys what we're doing or even a little bit, just get on there.

00:04:35.15
Mike
Sure.

00:04:39.24
Bill
All you got to do is hit five stars and be on your way. it It helps more than you'd ever know. And um sooner or later, yes, it'll help us not just grow, maybe get advertisers and all that stuff. And we're never going to charge our listeners for anything.

00:04:50.98
Bill
But the point is, is that, you know, hey, someday maybe we can grow in different directions. So these these things matter.

00:04:55.13
Mike
Sure.

00:04:56.27
Bill
And it takes literally two minutes, if that, to hop on there and do a review.

00:05:00.12
Mike
Maybe we can buy some whipped cream.

00:05:00.83
Bill
So. like so yeah Yes, I'm just going to say, yes, yes.

00:05:07.51
Mike
Yes. Uh-huh.

00:05:09.50
Bill
Grab some whipped cream as a gift. That's a promotional item. Now, you know, somebody if somebody gives us and says, hey talk about my whipped cream on your podcast. Now we're covered since you did your little promo thing.

00:05:17.27
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:05:19.30
Bill
So.

00:05:19.70
Mike
Right.

00:05:20.98
Bill
All right. So, so that's it. I did my tidbit. I did my, we did our begging for the reviews buts on a series. Don't really get on there. And if you listen to us, get on there and leave us a fucking review or five stars or whatever.

00:05:31.17
Bill
Thank you.

00:05:31.58
Mike
Yeah.

00:05:31.73
Bill
Thank you.

00:05:32.54
Mike
Yes, please and thank you.

00:05:33.94
Bill
Yes. Sorry, please. And thank you, Jesus.

00:05:35.58
Mike
a

00:05:36.98
Bill
Like you get some goddamn manners. Maybe somebody will leave us a review, right? Stop talking about people licking whipped cream off my balls.

00:05:44.38
Mike
m

00:05:45.24
Bill
him All right. Speaking of that, do you have a reading?

00:05:49.14
Mike
why

00:05:49.91
Bill
Do you have a reading?

00:05:50.42
Mike
Wow, nice smooth segue.

00:05:50.75
Bill
reading

00:05:54.16
Bill
Okay.

00:05:54.91
Mike
Yeah, I have a reading.

00:05:57.24
Bill
Does that have anything to do with whipped cream or balls or goose shit wouldn't that be great if had something about some inference?

00:05:59.58
Mike
ah No, you know, I don't believe it does. it I don't know. Hey, by the way. Mm-hmm.

00:06:08.02
Bill
Yeah.

00:06:10.84
Mike
No, I think it's just churning butter.

00:06:13.34
Bill
Yeah.

00:06:13.55
Mike
No, I don't know.

00:06:13.66
Bill
Okay. That'll work too. That'll work too.

00:06:15.13
Mike
I do not know. For a short week, this week seemed really fucking long.

00:06:19.93
Bill
Yeah. You know what? I, I agree. Cause it was the, so obviously the end of the month and you know, our business gets busy and blah, blah, blah.

00:06:25.30
Mike
Right.

00:06:25.77
Bill
And, uh, it did it. It really, by the time it was Wednesday, I'm like, fuck man, it's, it's, it's only Wednesday day number two.

00:06:31.29
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:06:33.64
Bill
And it was, God, it's only Wednesday. Jesus.

00:06:36.22
Mike
All

00:06:37.46
Bill
But anyhow, okay. I will, I will shush. Now going to, going pause, not pause.

00:06:40.47
Mike
right.

00:06:40.66
Bill
I'm going to Jesus Christ mute.

00:06:41.28
Mike
Well, yeah. but All right.

00:06:45.24
Bill
yeah

00:06:45.90
Mike
So, oh yes, a reading. Nothing jumped out at me this week. I was sitting here trying to find something, and I'm, like, actually starting to get a little frustrated because I couldn't find anything that was halfway decent, and it was pissing me off, and I'm going, well, all right.

00:07:03.16
Mike
So I i started going back. And this is from Touchstones. This is February 23rd. And apparently at the but at that point, it was about 10 minutes before we were going to open the microphones.

00:07:17.54
Mike
And I was like, yeah, that'll do. It's better than the rest of the crap I've been reading. So here we go.

00:07:21.94
Bill
ah And and that's my yeah that's my grandson's birthday.

00:07:27.45
Mike
nice. All right.

00:07:28.22
Bill
Yeah. So happy birthday to Theo.

00:07:28.57
Mike
Well, thanks. Yes. All right, Theo. ah So, yes, February 23rd. man who studieth revenge keeps his own wounds green.

00:07:41.54
Mike
Francis Bacon. I believe he wrote some stuff. um Where do we direct our energy? Are we spending time and thought on how we have been wronged?

00:07:53.72
Mike
On the unfairness of life, those who consume their resources in this way have few left for growth and development. Their wounds stay open for years and they block the healing.

00:08:08.76
Mike
what will what What will we need to set aside our resentments and hateful attitudes? Perhaps we have been passively waiting for the other guy to make amends. That only puts our enemies in charge of us.

00:08:23.96
Mike
It would be better if we could say, i am going to move on. The change that is needed for me to heal will come from within me. i will not put my happiness in another's hands.

00:08:38.33
Mike
More than revenge, we want a life worth living for ourselves and the ones we love. We can give our energies to that. The touchstones, thought of the day, tidbit of the day, thing of the day.

00:08:55.90
Mike
ah Lift me from my desire for revenge. Replace it with the fullness of a healed life.

00:09:03.93
Bill
Oh, a healed life.

00:09:05.70
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:09:07.10
Bill
So um what was that again? Lift the revenge and healed life, right? That's basically what it was.

00:09:10.26
Mike
Yeah, lift my desire for revenge.

00:09:13.91
Bill
I see that that's an important word. Words matter is what I've i've i've been told.

00:09:16.73
Mike
They do. Uh-huh.

00:09:18.99
Bill
So, um well, let's let's start there. I mean, that's ah obviously, ah I think, a strong statement. What do you what do you think about that?

00:09:26.65
Mike
um Yeah, you know, um the whole reading, right? You know, wasting our energy on on, you know, what I really liked was the putting the control of our lives in our enemy's hands.

00:09:38.30
Bill
Right. Right.

00:09:38.46
Mike
um Yeah, that's ah that doesn't sound like fun. um Clearly, you know, in the past, yeah, you know I want to do exact revenge. I want to get even. I want to, you know, you hurt me. I'm going to see to it that you hurt too. And thankfully, because of this program, um I don't live that way today. um Yeah, replace it with fullness of a healed life, you know, move on, like the reading said.

00:10:04.82
Mike
um You know, yes, just because we get sober doesn't mean that we're not going to get our little feelings hurt occasionally.

00:10:11.61
Bill
but

00:10:12.44
Mike
um It doesn't mean that, you know, people are hurt going to still be dicks. um It's going to happen.

00:10:17.04
Bill
Right.

00:10:19.96
Mike
um But it's, it's it's again, it's the only control we have is our reactions to anything, right?

00:10:26.23
Bill
Right.

00:10:26.28
Mike
So... How we going to react to these people being dicks to us? And, you know, do we want to do we want to let them rent space in our heads and and, you know, sit there and go, oh, going to get back at them. going to make them pay as the old oh nobody outside of Cleveland knows this, but Tim Misney, our bald, eyebrowed,

00:10:47.51
Mike
Big lawyer. He's got billboards everywhere. um Right.

00:10:53.17
Bill
Right.

00:10:53.90
Mike
He makes them pay. um Well, that's his job. Makes good living making them pay. um I'm pretty sure I'm not going to make anything off making someone else pay.

00:11:04.43
Bill
Right.

00:11:04.86
Mike
Yeah. So, you know, um yeah, replace it with the fullness of of a healed life. You know, yes, I got hurt. OK, I'm going to move on. I'm going to I'm going to heal myself. I'm going to take a second look around. um You know, again, living in the moment is is a wonderful cure for all this stuff. OK, they hurt me.

00:11:26.90
Mike
Are they hurting me now? No, they're not. Okay, then I'm going to, you know, am I being hurt right now? No. So, yeah, you know and if I am being hurt right now, why am I allowing someone to hurt me right now?

00:11:39.67
Bill
Right. Right.

00:11:40.60
Mike
Yeah.

00:11:42.68
Bill
Yeah. And the, I mean, the desire for revenge. Wow. That's a, um that, that in and of itself is a strong fucking statement.

00:11:50.26
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:11:50.97
Bill
um Because i mean, that, that's the thing, you know, I mean, it's, it's a, I think it's part of human nature in a lot of, in a lot of ways, even for, you know, let's say quote unquote normal people, you know, that are either are wronged or feel that they've been wronged.

00:11:59.22
Mike
sure if a Right.

00:12:06.03
Bill
I think it could be worse when you feel that you've been wronged.

00:12:08.39
Mike
Right.

00:12:09.30
Bill
You know, versus if you've really been been wrong. But one way or the other, I mean, the, you know, to to get back at somebody, you're going to get yours, you know, it it reminded me the whole, um you know, the the whole karma thing, you know, when when somebody is fucked with, they're like, you know, they'll say to somebody, you karma is going to get you, you know, and that's what they're doing.

00:12:16.18
Mike
ze

00:12:20.95
Mike
yes

00:12:26.10
Mike
right

00:12:27.70
Bill
they're They're desiring revenge on that person.

00:12:29.40
Mike
Yeah.

00:12:30.10
Bill
Whereas I always looked at karma. Well, I'm not always, I think more than likely I'm going to say yes, since I got sober, I look at karma is, is the different way figuring that, okay, this person is, is a dick and sidestep on that for a minute.

00:12:43.67
Bill
I think that people are, um, it's, I want, I want to say people are bigger dicks, but I think we realize how much of a dick somebody is now versus, versus when we were drunk because before we were like, ah, fuck him.

00:12:55.90
Mike
Right.

00:12:56.66
Bill
You know, or we forgot about them the next day because we were fucking blacked out, you know. um

00:13:01.02
Mike
Right.

00:13:02.17
Bill
But, you know, so so if somebody is a dick to me, you know, and and they hurt my feelings or whatever it is, you know, same thing.

00:13:08.42
Mike
Right.

00:13:09.56
Bill
You know, I go on because I've got hopefully got a, you know, this this life behind me and it's healed and I'm going to go on and, you know, ah why should I allow it? All those things that you said. And then one way or the other, if that person is doing bad, they're going to get bad.

00:13:22.54
Bill
Now, I don't necessarily wish that on them, but I know what's going to happen, you know.

00:13:24.86
Mike
is is

00:13:26.46
Bill
and that's not my that's not my problem. That's not my worry.

00:13:29.59
Mike
right

00:13:29.90
Bill
um I have nothing to do with that. Again, I only have control. I wrote that down. Only have control over how I react to it.

00:13:36.89
Mike
Right.

00:13:37.12
Bill
And the same thing. you know I could sit back and be like, yeah, dude, going get yours, man. So fuck you. you know um But I don't even have to say that because I know better.

00:13:41.73
Mike
Right.

00:13:44.76
Bill
But I also know the other part of it that we are taught that the good part of karma is that you know the do good, get good. you know And if we...

00:13:52.44
Mike
Right.

00:13:53.32
Bill
If I... By me walking away and not having that desire for the revenge, controlling how I react, and hopefully working on the fact and leaning on the fact that my life has been healed, you know, to an extent, then I'm doing something good for myself and maybe even for the other person by me not reacting or or retaliating.

00:14:04.69
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:14:12.02
Mike
Right.

00:14:13.82
Bill
And then hopefully good shit's going to happen to me down the road. One way or the other, if if more bad shit happens, it's not going to be because I did good. i know that for a fact, right?

00:14:20.21
Mike
Right.

00:14:21.43
Bill
Yeah. So, um yeah, and I wrote down the same thing, happiness and in others in other people's hands.

00:14:25.50
Mike
Yeah.

00:14:28.54
Mike
Right.

00:14:29.42
Bill
And I'm like, fuck that, you know. Literally, fuck that. Just fuck that.

00:14:34.90
Mike
Exactly. Well, yeah I mean, you said, you know, you kind of pointed out, you know we notice it more now than we did when we were drinking. And I think ah A big part of that is, you know, someone else being a dick, bad behavior, or whatever, how you want to put it.

00:14:48.50
Mike
um I think a big part of that is, you know, now we have these standards that we live by that we hold ourselves up to.

00:14:48.79
Bill
Right.

00:14:53.75
Bill
Right.

00:14:55.03
Mike
And when we see this bad behavior, we, we you know, we clearly recognize it from our past. And and yes, it it stands out more because we know that's not a way to live.

00:15:06.73
Mike
And I mean, i think um it's not really talked about in the reading but i mean one of our early tools in sobriety i remember you know because clearly we come into sobriety and and we we have problems with people you know most of them um are our fault which we get to in the fourth step and figure all that shit out

00:15:23.80
Bill
ah

00:15:27.34
Bill
Right.

00:15:30.04
Mike
But, you know, early on, we've got these conflicts with other people, again, mostly our fault, but sometimes not. And um I mean, one of the big things they told us a lot was, you know, pray for that person, which we we all fucking hated that, you know, you know, you know, ex-wives and whatever and, you know, whatever,

00:15:43.47
Bill
Right.

00:15:45.72
Bill
Oh God. Yeah. Yep. Yeah.

00:15:51.77
Mike
whatever, whatever, whatever, parents and blah, blah, blah, you know, all these perceived wrongs that were done to us that, of course, they're all bubbling to the surface because we've been stomping that shit down. And yeah, one of the earliest exercises I remember is got a problem with somebody, pray for them. You know, hope hope that they, that they,

00:16:11.35
Mike
have a better life, you know, um, you know, we're going to stop directly hurting them. That helps. But, you know, I clearly, there's other things going on too. If they're that miserable, it's not just us.

00:16:24.04
Mike
We're not that fucking powerful. Um, so yeah, you know, wish them well, um, is, you know, and fuck. Okay. And, you know, but you do that over and over and over again you start to actually go, yeah, fuck.

00:16:38.81
Mike
I hope they're okay, man. You know, I hope they're not miserable.

00:16:40.58
Bill
Right.

00:16:43.12
Mike
I'm not going to be involved with them anymore, but I hope they're not fucking miserable because I don't want that for anybody, including myself.

00:16:49.84
Bill
Right. Right. Yeah. And that ah in that. And I know that I've talked about this specific thing on here probably a handful of times, but now that you brought it up, I think it's worth repeating because it it had to do with, like you just said, ex-wives.

00:16:57.29
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:17:02.26
Bill
It was it was my it was my son's mom, you know, which, again, my my perception, which we've talked about a lot, is that, you know, she fucked up everything in my life, you know, which was untrue, clearly.

00:17:02.24
Mike
Yeah. Mm hmm. Right.

00:17:08.38
Mike
Right.

00:17:11.96
Mike
Of course.

00:17:14.14
Bill
you know, but, um, all these different things. And I remembered that we had a room full of, you know, whatever it was, 30 of us, you know, brand new fucking people in a group and whoever was leading the group, don't remember who it was, you know, they're going through this thing, you know, think about the person you got a problem with.

00:17:19.41
Mike
hmm. Mm

00:17:23.69
Mike
hmm.

00:17:26.54
Bill
Think about how much, you know, it bothers you. Think about how much they hurt you. And they're, they're literally, they're, they're turning up the heat and they're, they're setting us all in this, this frothy fucking boil, you know?

00:17:32.96
Mike
Mm hmm. Yeah. Yeah, right.

00:17:37.49
Bill
And I mean, you could feel it in the room that everyone's just like, Oh Jesus fucking Christ.

00:17:39.26
Mike
yeah right

00:17:42.01
Bill
And then, the motherfucker at the front of the room says and now you got to pray for him and you're like what the fuck what the and know i used to i i remember i remember i'd be like you know when i did my prayers whatever they were and how they they built over the years now but i remember going

00:17:47.05
Mike
Mm-hmm. Yep. Yep.

00:17:58.27
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:18:01.64
Bill
OK, I pray for Dawn, you know, and that'd be like I pray. It turned into, OK, you know, clearly i I pray for Dawn. I would say it you know that way.

00:18:09.14
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:18:09.39
Bill
And then, you know, then it was like, well, pray for my that was my son's mom. And, you know, then it was I hope that, you know, because I do and listen at and blah, blah, blah.

00:18:13.18
Mike
Right.

00:18:17.15
Bill
And it grew.

00:18:17.53
Mike
if three

00:18:17.71
Bill
And now to the point where both of my ex-wives, I mean, both of them are in my prayers every night.

00:18:22.36
Mike
Right.

00:18:22.61
Bill
And I pray for their health and their happiness, that they that they stay healthy and safe, you know, and I mean it.

00:18:24.84
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right. And you truly fucking mean it now, right?

00:18:29.50
Bill
Yeah, and i and i fucking and I fucking mean it. And you know what? And the thing of it is, and okay, flip back to what you said, that when we were told to pray for somebody is because usually, and you alluded to that or said it exactly, that there's usually something wrong with them.

00:18:36.54
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:18:42.40
Bill
you know There's something that's troubling them.

00:18:42.61
Mike
Right.

00:18:44.68
Bill
And there was nothing wrong with, well, okay, I'm sorry.

00:18:45.03
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:18:47.36
Bill
No, there was something wrong with Dawn and there was something troubling her.

00:18:49.01
Mike
Yep. Uh-huh. Mm-hmm. Right. Mm-hmm. Right.

00:18:50.60
Bill
And it was fucking me.

00:18:52.18
Mike
ah

00:18:53.21
Bill
You know, and it was the fact that I blew up her life and mine and everything, our, our life, you know, so that was her, that was her problem.

00:18:57.59
Mike
right. Mm-hmm.

00:19:01.14
Bill
So, so I'm like, i think about it now, like, fuck, I was praying for somebody.

00:19:02.05
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:19:07.03
Bill
i was praying for me, technically, you know, praying that, that I got better.

00:19:08.66
Mike
yeah right

00:19:10.11
Bill
So it would help her, you know, which is, is that he kind of it's really fucked up, but I mean, it's, that's what it was.

00:19:13.33
Mike
this is

00:19:16.28
Mike
yeah right

00:19:16.39
Bill
um Oh man, that's a, that's crazy.

00:19:19.54
Mike
And I mean, and that's part of the exercise of doing that, you know.

00:19:22.97
Bill
Right.

00:19:23.35
Mike
Yeah, because clearly, you know, the first time you do it, you don't go, oh, shit, it's me. no you just do the first time you do it. You don't even fucking mean it.

00:19:32.38
Bill
Right. Yeah.

00:19:33.03
Mike
But again, you know, like the the whole act as if and, you know, whatever. yes You keep doing something over and over again positively. eventually it starts to change you and it starts to make you, you know, you start to actually realize what the fuck's really going on in the world, not your twisted perception of it.

00:19:52.96
Bill
Yeah, right.

00:19:53.05
Mike
um Yeah. So, yeah you know, so again, that, that, This reading kind of brought all that up to me. It was like, yes, I don't want revenge. I don't want i don't want bad to anybody.

00:20:04.35
Mike
you know um The worst I have for anyone anymore in my life is, well, I hope they don't come around me anymore.

00:20:12.23
Bill
Right.

00:20:12.31
Mike
But... You know, yeah.

00:20:14.33
Bill
yeah right

00:20:15.35
Mike
You know, because, hey, guess what? I'm pretty kind of all right today. um You know, I'm not fucking great and I'm not perfect and I'm not all that, but I'm kind of okay to be around today.

00:20:19.29
Bill
right

00:20:25.99
Mike
I know that about myself today because I've put the fucking work in. And, um yeah, you know, if I've really got a problem with you, the worst I can say is I don't want you to be around me.

00:20:37.39
Mike
My fucking wonderfulness. That was sarcastic.

00:20:40.01
Bill
Right. Well, well, and but here' here's the thing.

00:20:41.86
Mike
Yeah.

00:20:44.02
Bill
And as a side note, and I just wrote it down, I don't want to forget. um i was listening to a podcast this week that talked about therapy. It just pops up into my head when you when you were just talking about that.

00:20:51.70
Mike
Yeah.

00:20:53.46
Bill
But um so exactly what you said.

00:20:53.79
Mike
Yeah.

00:20:55.84
Bill
What did you say? Your awesomeness?

00:20:57.40
Mike
My wonderfulness, but yes.

00:20:57.66
Bill
Did you just wonderfulness? Same thing.

00:20:59.60
Mike
Yes.

00:21:00.06
Bill
Same wonderfulness.

00:21:00.08
Mike
Yeah. I was being an asshole, but yes.

00:21:01.26
Bill
Awesome. But but here' here's the thing. Okay, you're you're joking being sarcastic, but it is true because there there is a certain point of view now that's wonderful and extremely wonderful you know compared to where where you were 17 years ago.

00:21:06.78
Mike
is Yeah.

00:21:10.59
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

00:21:14.01
Mike
Oh, God. Yeah. Right.

00:21:15.66
Bill
you know So even though, I mean, I know you don't mean that egotistically, but yes, I think that as an individual for who you are, what you do, and what you used to be, you're pretty fucking wonderful.

00:21:19.83
Mike
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Yeah, I'm all right.

00:21:25.78
Bill
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

00:21:28.83
Mike
I'm kind of okay to hang out with today.

00:21:30.87
Bill
right And, up you know, and, and, you know, we talk about it so much, even that I was talking about that individual, a you know, a month or so ago that, you know, was obviously treating somebody in my life, you know, not so great.

00:21:38.60
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:21:40.89
Mike
Right.

00:21:41.98
Bill
um I don't, I don't want, I don't want anything bad to happen to that person.

00:21:42.20
Mike
Yeah.

00:21:44.72
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:21:45.06
Bill
I want them to, I want them to just see, you know, and I want them to open up their eyes.

00:21:48.41
Mike
Yeah, sure.

00:21:50.57
Bill
And I mean, all I can do is I just, I can hope and, you know, I suppose pray that um I, that they get better, you know, whatever, whatever the case is, whatever they're dealing with.

00:21:56.96
Mike
Mm-hmm. And that's kind of it. you know Right.

00:22:00.50
Bill
Yeah. Yeah.

00:22:01.14
Mike
if you're if you're If you're happy and you know it, clap your fucking hands. No.

00:22:04.89
Bill
and

00:22:04.98
Mike
But if you're but if you're happy and you know it you're not going to act that way. You're not going to treat other people that way because you know better.

00:22:12.18
Bill
Right.

00:22:12.34
Mike
You're happy. You don't have to treat other people that way.

00:22:15.76
Bill
Right.

00:22:16.22
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

00:22:16.68
Bill
Yeah. Yeah. And it just, uh, boy, it takes, you talk about burning calories and everything like that too. And, um, you know, this, I wrote down little things about, you know, where our energy is directed, um, um, how we have been wronged, blocking the healing, setting aside resentments.

00:22:28.16
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:22:32.86
Mike
Yeah.

00:22:34.11
Bill
Wait, Oh, the waiting for the apology. Oh, that's, that's fucking rich.

00:22:36.86
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:22:38.33
Bill
Yeah.

00:22:38.87
Mike
Right.

00:22:40.15
Bill
Yeah. Waiting for the fucking apology. Yeah. It's never going to fucking happen, you know, and the same thing as we're always told, you know, sitting there and, and harboring a resentment against somebody is, you know, one of two things, either holding a, holding a hot rock and hoping they get burned or drinking poison and hoping that they fall over, you know?

00:22:45.37
Mike
Right.

00:22:51.17
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:22:55.15
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:22:58.04
Mike
Right.

00:22:59.08
Bill
It's not going to happen, you know, and sitting there, you know, waiting for somebody or like when we did, you know, our, you know, our amends, you know, to people, the key there, the key to that amends step that I, you know, one of the reasons is you don't understand that right away.

00:23:00.70
Mike
No.

00:23:06.84
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:23:13.14
Bill
You know, you want everything to be better. You want to say sorry and get a sorry back when you first get sober.

00:23:17.36
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:23:17.88
Bill
But it doesn't always work that way. You got to walk up, you know, your hat and your fucking hand and say that this is what I did.

00:23:19.38
Mike
Right.

00:23:23.16
Bill
And then regardless how that person reacts, hopefully they don't, you know, shut the door in your face.

00:23:23.96
Mike
Right.

00:23:27.68
Bill
Hopefully they don't call you a fucker, you know, and tell you to go away.

00:23:29.08
Mike
there

00:23:30.24
Bill
But if they, if it, if it happens, it happens. And 100% best case scenario, maybe they, they say that they had a part in it, but that's not what you're there for.

00:23:32.63
Mike
Right.

00:23:39.16
Mike
is it

00:23:39.95
Bill
You know, right, right.

00:23:39.99
Mike
No, no. You dare to get rid of your shit. Yeah. Make things right.

00:23:43.97
Bill
Drop.

00:23:44.69
Mike
I fucked up. I'm making things right now. You know, whatever. It's yeah. My side of the street's clean and I'm going to move on. I'm going go live on my side of the street because I get nowhere else to go.

00:23:53.21
Bill
here

00:23:56.89
Bill
Right. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. But, but yeah, the, I mean, the, like I wrote down block the healing, you know, and I mean, we don't, we don't talk a lot about, you know, healing and feelings and all that stuff, but I mean, it's, it happened, you know, I mean, we, we did, we healed.

00:24:03.26
Mike
Yeah.

00:24:06.14
Mike
Right.

00:24:10.74
Mike
Sure. Mm-hmm.

00:24:12.71
Bill
you know i mean Over the years, inadvertently, we would have had to try not to you know ah to heal over the years.

00:24:18.78
Mike
Yeah.

00:24:20.35
Bill
i mean No, we didn't sit down and you know in in a therapist's office and heal that way, but um we we healed through the rooms and through the work, and we continued to become better person persons and heal that way.

00:24:24.60
Mike
Mm-mm.

00:24:28.02
Mike
Yeah.

00:24:31.48
Mike
Yep.

00:24:32.04
Bill
you know so in Seriously,

00:24:32.54
Mike
Yeah.

00:24:35.10
Bill
i I would bet if if tomorrow, um and I don't don't even know how far it would place me back. I don't even want to find out ever. you know But if I started harboring resentments and holding things against people just out of the blue as of tomorrow, 16 years and a few months sober or a couple of months sober, you know how long would it take me?

00:24:47.38
Mike
Right. Right.

00:24:54.97
Bill
Um, how far back would I, would I slide?

00:24:57.43
Mike
Right.

00:24:58.35
Bill
Cause that's the term, right? How far back would I slip and slide to the point where either, um, I've got, you know, now years to get better again, you know, or to even get to get even again, you know, or worst case scenario, I know what's going to happen.

00:24:59.38
Mike
is

00:25:06.17
Mike
right

00:25:11.32
Bill
That's why I don't do it is that, you know, resentments are, they're, they're the easiest way to to get us to start drinking again and fuck everything up, you know?

00:25:11.32
Mike
right is is

00:25:18.14
Mike
Yeah, I read somewhere they're the number one offender.

00:25:21.98
Bill
Right. Yeah. And now here's the other thing, kind of, again, a side note, and I don't know if I wrote this down, but I thought about it the other day. So the, the term, and this kind of goes along with these resentments things that made me think of this, you know, not really because of the reading, but sort of, but the, the phrase is expectations are resentments waiting to happen.

00:25:35.90
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:25:41.05
Bill
So do you agree with that?

00:25:41.53
Mike
Right.

00:25:43.33
Bill
Like 100% that I do agree the statement completely.

00:25:47.99
Mike
Yeah. but Yeah. You know, I do. Yes. I mean, um

00:25:55.80
Mike
maybe 80%, 85%. Right. Right. I mean, yes, you know, I do expect some things from some people. um But those expectations are based in fact today, you know, um

00:26:04.09
Bill
Right. Okay.

00:26:09.99
Bill
Right.

00:26:11.13
Mike
I don't have expectations of things that I just create my own fucking head anymore, anymore. um Right. Which clearly I used to do constantly. um The expectations I have in my life today are because someone or something or whatever has proven it to be. a certain way.

00:26:31.80
Mike
And so, yes, I expect that to continue. um But, you know, yeah. But again, it comes down to controlling other people. And um I'm not another person. I can't control anything other than myself.

00:26:47.13
Mike
So, um yeah, you know, but yes, expecting unrealistic things, expecting someone to behave in a certain way that I want um is is yeah, that's it. It's brewing trouble.

00:27:01.64
Bill
Right. Well, and yeah, just, I just looked, I did, i had it written down from, from this week. I couldn't remember if I wrote it down, but, um, and I was just, I was thinking about that because, you know, to, to your point, when you said, yeah, and you're like 80%, 80, 85. Yeah.

00:27:14.74
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

00:27:15.83
Bill
It reminded me of, of I think, oh yeah, Bill Murray, when he said, you know, chance of departure when he's walking out of the Groundhog Day, he's 80%, 75%, 80%.

00:27:23.07
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:27:25.88
Bill
He's chance of departure. But, um you know, so think about the same thing that that we do, because, I mean, we were talking about that to begin with. we We have certain expectations about how, you know, maybe we're going to act or how people are going to act or or that sort of thing.

00:27:38.97
Mike
e

00:27:40.23
Bill
A certain expectation of how the general public maybe could could react or act or whatever. But I think to your point, that's the, I think the biggest distinction of what is, what you said is trying to expect that.

00:27:47.90
Mike
isn

00:27:54.59
Bill
Okay. I'm going to end up sitting down with this person, whatever the case is. And this person is going to be this way.

00:27:58.36
Mike
Right.

00:28:01.10
Bill
And in 100%, this is going to go this exact way. That's ridiculous. You know, be right.

00:28:04.89
Mike
Right. Well, I mean, it's yeah you said could. Right. You know. Right. And that's the way it is for us today as opposed to should.

00:28:13.56
Bill
Right.

00:28:14.04
Mike
Yeah, they could act this way, but they should act this way. That's where we get fucked up. You know, yeah, you know anyone can act in a decent way.

00:28:20.60
Bill
Right.

00:28:24.40
Mike
um ah Should they? Well, they probably should, but that's not, again, that's not up to us. That's up to them. And we we can't fucking control that.

00:28:32.13
Bill
Right.

00:28:33.87
Mike
So, yeah, that's where the expectations could get you. Yes, you should act this way. No, you could act this way. I hope you act that way, but

00:28:41.09
Bill
Right.

00:28:43.54
Mike
I don't, yeah I'm not making you act that way. I can't.

00:28:47.45
Bill
Yeah, that's kind of funny. That wasn't even a conscious decision for me to say could versus should, but i i'm I'm happy that I did because that that means why that's that's what I meant.

00:28:51.83
Mike
Right. Yes.

00:28:57.05
Bill
I mean, i want I wanted to say that.

00:28:57.27
Mike
Yes. Right.

00:28:58.89
Bill
I didn't necessarily mean to, but I i meant to, but I didn't mean to.

00:28:59.16
Mike
okay Right.

00:29:03.09
Bill
But um so, I mean, I've got expectations for the way that and so do you, I'm guessing that, you know, how that goes back to we we can control how we react so we can have our own expectations about how we should approach things and how we should react to blah, blah, blah.

00:29:08.34
Mike
you

00:29:12.02
Mike
Right.

00:29:15.64
Mike
Yes.

00:29:17.00
Bill
And be disappointed if I if I fly off the handle or something like that, or I act out of character, then that's a blown expectation of myself.

00:29:17.29
Mike
hmm.

00:29:20.65
Mike
Right.

00:29:23.72
Bill
I'm not going Well, they maybe I will resent myself and I got to work through that, you know.

00:29:26.56
Mike
hmm. Mm hmm. Right.

00:29:29.05
Bill
But, um, yeah, it was just, it was weird. And I, I don't know why I never really dug into that statement or it popped into my head again, whether it was a reading or whatever the case is, it just came into my head this week.

00:29:37.24
Mike
right

00:29:38.78
Bill
And, um, it just seemed like the way it was, it's just, I, I didn't necessarily see it as an all or nothing. So I'm, I'm glad, I'm glad we had that chance to talk about that. Cause especially when you, you wavered over that 80, 85% was, it was perfect.

00:29:48.67
Mike
Yeah. Well, yeah.

00:29:52.36
Bill
was fucking perfect.

00:29:52.66
Mike
Yeah.

00:29:53.38
Bill
Yeah.

00:29:53.78
Mike
Right. Well, because I thought about it and I was like, yeah, I do. No, not 100%. All right. Because theyre just yeah there is there's nothing that's 100%. There's nothing that's black and white.

00:30:05.30
Mike
you know it's It's all shades of gray. and And as soon as you realize that, you're a hell of a lot better off.

00:30:07.90
Bill
Right.

00:30:12.41
Bill
Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's ah it's a lot better way to i be able to deal with people and live life and and all those sorts of things.

00:30:18.44
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:30:19.77
Bill
And,

00:30:19.84
Mike
Trudge this road to happy destiny.

00:30:21.46
Bill
Yeah. And you know what? it's It's a good, I am so happy. And, you know, i mean, it' it seems kind of ridiculous to say that i'm i say this, but I mean, i'm I'm happy that, you know, that we've grown to the point to to understand those things.

00:30:34.45
Mike
hmm.

00:30:35.14
Bill
But I mean, it's been again, it's been a lot of time and a lot of work and a lot of years.

00:30:37.14
Mike
Sure.

00:30:38.18
Bill
um I don't necessarily consider, like we talk about, I mean, over the last whatever handful years or whatever the case is, Whenever whatever the work you know that we do got got more routine rather than than work, it it doesn't feel like we're working that hard at this.

00:30:38.30
Mike
Absolutely.

00:30:48.26
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:30:52.48
Bill
I mean, I work harder, I think, well, I know I do.

00:30:52.86
Mike
Right.

00:30:55.67
Bill
I work harder at life than I do at sober life. you know I mean, my sober life, and those are two different things because I can i have i have the you know the the control over how I react to my sober life and build my sober life and do my sober work.

00:31:02.65
Mike
Right.

00:31:09.87
Bill
I don't have you know really much... and control over life except for how I react to it.

00:31:12.82
Mike
Right. Uh-huh.

00:31:15.74
Bill
Right.

00:31:15.93
Mike
ahha

00:31:16.66
Bill
You know, but, um, yeah, and like I said, it may be, may be weird to say, but it's, I'm, I'm really happy to have that, have that knowledge these days. And it's, it's crazy. You know, it's like, wow, where, you know, I mean, I'm just going to say, where did it come from?

00:31:29.28
Bill
mean, I know where it came from, but really it just, it's, it's a relief.

00:31:30.39
Mike
fifty fifty

00:31:33.04
Bill
It's a, just a relief, you know?

00:31:33.24
Mike
Yeah, it is. It is. Yes, and we stay grateful for it, and then we don't have to get loaded. Imagine that.

00:31:40.63
Bill
Right. right I heard that grateful something don't what?

00:31:43.19
Mike
Yeah, yeah.

00:31:43.80
Bill
What was that?

00:31:43.91
Mike
correct Grateful trunks don't drink.

00:31:47.45
Bill
Exactly. So any anything else for the reading?

00:31:48.57
Mike
Yep.

00:31:50.09
Bill
I want to I want to dip into that podcast therapy thing that I was talking about. But um anything else from the for the reading at all?

00:31:54.13
Mike
Yeah.

00:31:56.50
Mike
I think we covered that and some more.

00:31:59.32
Bill
Okay. That and some. All right.

00:32:00.66
Mike
Yes.

00:32:01.59
Bill
So I was listening to a a podcast and I think there was two different parts of it. This this individual, he had he had a decent story, you know, and was going through a lot of different things. I think he had seven, eight, nine years sober, something like that.

00:32:19.06
Bill
um If I remember correctly, I think this was one of the people that got to start in AA and then after a certain period of time, certain number of years, three, four, five years, you know, took what basically what they wanted here.

00:32:31.01
Bill
He wanted from AA and kind of jumped into the therapy side of things rather than AA, which again, we've, we've heard the story before, it sounds like he's got a decent light, blah, blah, blah. But he was talking about the whole therapy thing and growing.

00:32:42.78
Bill
So really leaning in in all the therapy and all the work and all the digging and dredging and, you know, dredging, not dredging, dredging all this up, all this stuff.

00:32:48.22
Mike
Right Yep, yep.

00:32:51.94
Bill
And then um this two things came up.

00:32:52.06
Mike
Mm-hmm

00:32:55.35
Bill
First one was he was at a I think it was the the host that was talking about, you know, a two year old's birthday party that he had went to. And he was the only sober one there. Not that people were literally getting out of hand, but, you know, it's like everyone was drinking.

00:33:07.15
Mike
Sure.

00:33:08.59
Bill
And it was a two-year-old's birthday party.

00:33:08.61
Mike
Yeah.

00:33:10.47
Bill
He's like, he goes, the host was saying that, you know, I don't judge people do their own thing, whatever.

00:33:10.69
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:33:14.57
Bill
And then, then this guy said, he goes, he goes, well, he goes, I'm going to say this. He's like, he goes, maybe those people should look at why, why do they need to drink at a two-year-old's birthday party?

00:33:23.82
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:33:25.46
Bill
You know, and why does it, why maybe they need to look at that, you know, kind of dig into that.

00:33:25.78
Mike
this

00:33:29.98
Bill
So why, why do they need to? And I'm like, Well, let me ask you that question. ah what What do you think about that first? Let's stop there. How do you think about a statement like that? Why do they, they got to think about that.

00:33:39.90
Mike
i i think i think maybe he needs to mind in his own fucking business um maybe they want to catch a little buzz you know right at a two-year-old's birthday party um and and whatever again what's it to you yeah you know either god what's it it's none of your fucking business

00:33:41.37
Bill
right

00:33:48.38
Bill
Right.

00:33:53.30
Bill
Right.

00:33:56.32
Bill
Right.

00:34:02.14
Mike
You know, if it's your two-year-old and a bunch of people are coming in and you're sober and a bunch of people are coming in getting loaded, you know, yeah, then that's a problem. Why did you invite those people?

00:34:12.39
Mike
had knew that's what they do. um

00:34:14.18
Bill
Right.

00:34:14.97
Mike
and And if it's not, if you're, it's like a friend of yours is in whatever and people are having a few drinks, so what?

00:34:23.91
Bill
Right.

00:34:23.90
Mike
You know, apparently they can or they can't. Again, not your fucking problem.

00:34:30.55
Bill
yeah I like the way you just said that maybe they can or they can't.

00:34:34.39
Mike
Right.

00:34:35.42
Bill
and And I thought the same thing.

00:34:36.08
Mike
It's not, it's not right. You know, it's, it's, you know, no one can, I can't call anyone out an alcoholic. The only person I can call an alcoholic is me and you, cause you know, you' right.

00:34:45.01
Bill
Right. Well, I mean, yeah. I mean, I never think it twice about it.

00:34:48.57
Mike
Right.

00:34:49.05
Bill
Yeah.

00:34:49.85
Mike
But yeah, but you know seriously, yes. The only person I can call an alcoholic is me. um You know, and and again, dragging people off barstools and that doesn't work.

00:35:00.50
Mike
Right. You know, I'm here for anyone that comes to me, but you know i mean i go to I go to bars. I go to ball games. I go to whatever.

00:35:10.87
Mike
and Fuck, walk down the street, man. I mean i smell weed all the goddamn time. you know

00:35:16.98
Bill
and

00:35:18.20
Mike
i mean, so what? you know i i see empty beer cans and booze bottles on the side of the road. and you know and and So what? you know I'm not going to let it bother me. you know The only thing I know for sure is I can't.

00:35:34.71
Mike
You know, and and the rest of it is, again, out of my control. So, yeah, maybe they need to look at themselves.

00:35:40.20
Bill
Right.

00:35:42.90
Mike
Maybe you need to look at yourself and wonder why are you so concerned about other people's habits?

00:35:50.35
Bill
Right.

00:35:50.87
Mike
Yeah.

00:35:51.32
Bill
Yeah. And I thought about the same thing and that's why I stopped it. Cause I, I, I literally have my question on there asking you how you felt about that statement.

00:35:58.36
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:35:58.48
Bill
So I almost, I almost jumped on the, almost jumped the route on that before asking you, but um I was thinking the same thing. It's like, okay, so literally everything that you just said, um not only did I think about, but I agree with.

00:36:04.29
Mike
Yeah.

00:36:09.51
Bill
And I mean, that's, there's really not much more to say about that. It was just kind of like, who the fuck are you? That's the only thing I'll add to that.

00:36:14.81
Mike
m h

00:36:16.61
Bill
Who the fuck are you? Not you, Mike, but who the fuck are you?

00:36:18.17
Mike
very Right, right, right. This guy.

00:36:20.02
Bill
Yeah, it's it to to question anyone about anything, you know?

00:36:22.42
Mike
Anyone? Yes.

00:36:24.18
Bill
It's staying your fucking lane, you know?

00:36:24.15
Mike
Yes. Exactly. i i got enough to handle questioning myself about everything.

00:36:27.22
Bill
but

00:36:30.94
Mike
i don't I'm not going to start questioning other.

00:36:31.22
Bill
ah

00:36:33.90
Mike
Again, comes back to should, could, um you know, to control resentments against all this. Fuck, man. Right.

00:36:42.45
Bill
Right.

00:36:43.03
Mike
The only thing I can control is me. and i start worrying about other people.

00:36:46.73
Bill
Right.

00:36:50.00
Mike
i'm upscrewed.

00:36:52.12
Bill
Yeah, well, it comes down to, I think you could add that to everything in the reading, even though you're not having a resentment.

00:36:55.90
Mike
Yeah.

00:36:57.16
Bill
But think about, I mean, like like you just said, you know, the the work in the, yeah, it is, I guess, yeah.

00:36:57.21
Mike
Right. Well, and it's kind of a resentment. you know Somewhere in there, there's a resentment that they're fucking getting loaded and you're not. And it's bothering you.

00:37:07.37
Mike
Why?

00:37:08.10
Bill
That's a good that's a good point. Yeah, i I didn't, as soon as I said that, I'm like, how you know, yeah, hey yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:37:09.40
Mike
Yeah.

00:37:12.47
Mike
You know, I mean, no, I don't like being around sloppy drunks anymore.

00:37:14.44
Bill
Right.

00:37:19.29
Mike
Probably never did. um You know, but, you know, it clearly affects me a little more today than it did 17 years ago.

00:37:21.69
Bill
Right.

00:37:27.69
Mike
um Totally out of control, sloppy. It's like, oh, my God, I don't want to be around it. And it's not because of anything other than it's annoying, you know. And and I do have to take that half a second and go, hey, asshole, remember that was you.

00:37:43.22
Mike
um You want to act like that again? you know, but other than that, um I don't fucking care.

00:37:46.99
Bill
Right.

00:37:51.86
Mike
You know, and as far as people, you know, getting a little loaded and a little buzzed and, you know, clearly you can tell, we can tell, everyone can tell about us, we can tell about them.

00:37:52.24
Bill
Right.

00:38:01.78
Mike
You know, yes, you're getting a little lit up.

00:38:02.74
Bill
Right.

00:38:04.38
Mike
Okay. It doesn't, it doesn't offend me.

00:38:06.74
Bill
ah

00:38:07.73
Mike
It doesn't, you know, I'm certainly not going to start going, ooh, I think maybe they have a problem. You know, no, I don't know.

00:38:13.46
Bill
right

00:38:14.85
Mike
Maybe they do.

00:38:14.94
Bill
right

00:38:15.61
Mike
Maybe they don't. Again, what's it to me? You know, the only the only time that could ever concern me is if they walk up to me and go, hey, man, I think I got a fucking problem.

00:38:28.81
Mike
OK, then I can do something about it. I can tell them what I did. That's all I can do.

00:38:36.21
Bill
You know, and and I just thought about it, too. I mean, i and i I know I mentioned this on here before. Everything that I didn't seek out, um i I didn't in the majority of my with the exception at the end when I was just drinking all the times I needed to.

00:38:49.59
Bill
I didn't necessarily seek out like I need to be here and I need to drink, you know, or when we when we have a party for the kids, because we did that with Derek and my stepson, Alec and all every every time when we had, you know, birthday party for the kids, even going back to when Kimmy was little and, you know, she's pushing 40 now.

00:38:49.93
Mike
Right Yeah Sure Right

00:39:05.66
Bill
you know And you know being that many years ago, 35 years ago, let's say, um when we had a birthday party for her, we had alcohol there.

00:39:05.66
Mike
listen

00:39:09.39
Mike
Right Sure Right

00:39:16.34
Bill
I mean, it just it was it it it was just, it was. you know You're going to have some food, you're going have cake, and you're going to have some beer or wine or wine whatever the case is.

00:39:19.96
Mike
Yeah, right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, right.

00:39:25.72
Bill
And it was in the funny part, yeah.

00:39:26.71
Mike
She pops.

00:39:28.95
Bill
And, you know, i and I think about, you know, those birthday parties that we had with all those people. And I think back, I can't remember everyone that used to come in when, you know, when the boys were little, like my daughter and I would have the parties, but, you know, probably had 30, 40 people through the house throughout the day, you know, between family members and friends and in that sort of thing.

00:39:37.50
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:39:41.56
Mike
Sure.

00:39:44.71
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:39:45.22
Bill
And unless I'm mistaken, there's only one person out of that group that is now that has admitted that they they have an alcohol problem.

00:39:52.47
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:39:53.49
Bill
And that's fucking me, you know.

00:39:53.75
Mike
Right. Right.

00:39:55.37
Bill
um So, um I mean, just sheer numbers.

00:39:55.39
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:39:59.22
Bill
I mean, I don't know. Are there other people in that group that might have an issue with alcohol?

00:40:03.56
Mike
Sure.

00:40:03.70
Bill
I don't fucking know. But I think that at some point out of those people, maybe I would have heard something.

00:40:04.89
Mike
Right.

00:40:11.04
Mike
Hmm.

00:40:11.19
Bill
you know, at some point, maybe not, you know, but, but the only one, only one I know for sure that has a problem with booze and needed to walk away from it is this guy, this guy right here.

00:40:12.63
Mike
Yeah, maybe not. Uh-huh. Uh-huh.

00:40:20.85
Mike
Yep. Who's got two thumbs and a severe drinking problem?

00:40:28.24
Bill
He's got two thumbs. That is a raging or was a raging alcoholic, this guy, but, um,

00:40:32.18
Mike
Right. Right. I just, you know, and I just had a conversation with somebody the other day and used that phrase and um and I had to correct myself and go, well, I'm still an alcoholic. I just don't rage anymore.

00:40:45.69
Bill
Yeah, and that that is the thing. yeah I used to be, I'm still an alcoholic, but I used to be a raging alcoholic.

00:40:49.69
Mike
yeah Mm-hmm.

00:40:51.13
Bill
So now now I got two things.

00:40:51.14
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:40:52.37
Bill
I just had another side note. So remind me, and let me write it down. So alcoholic and then ah podcast podcast host.

00:40:57.02
Mike
Okay. Uh-huh.

00:40:59.58
Bill
I just saw this yesterday or today. um Okay.

00:41:02.76
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:41:03.25
Bill
But let me talk about the therapy thing. So the, this, and I think this was two different people.

00:41:05.14
Mike
you go

00:41:07.41
Bill
So the two-year-old thing, that was one person, because I see in my notes here, I see she, so that might've been a female on that one.

00:41:12.57
Mike
aha

00:41:14.17
Bill
And then this guy that was the one I was talking about to begin with that I thought this was his too. He was talking about, you know, therapy and whatever and blah, blah, blah. um So, but he did kind of the same thing, you know, kind of the same concept was, you know, he goes, when people come home from work and he goes, those people that, you know, grab a drink right away, because they either, they had, you know, why are you grabbing that drink?

00:41:22.76
Mike
Right.

00:41:34.68
Bill
That's what his question was. So why is that person grabbing that drink? So did they have a bad day? It's just habit, whatever the case is. Did they try and these? He's going through all these different things. Did they try going to the gym? Did they try going for a walk?

00:41:45.80
Bill
Did they try meditating? It's right. Whatever. And I'm like, in my head, I'm like, what the fuck are you talking about, guy? You know what?

00:41:51.13
Mike
right

00:41:52.24
Bill
Dude, you know, these are normal people. Now, if they walk home and they say, I need a drink or man, I could use a drink or whatever.

00:41:55.75
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:42:00.12
Mike
Right.

00:42:00.89
Bill
fine. You know, they can come home and they can sit down and have a goddamn drink.

00:42:01.75
Mike
Well. monthh

00:42:04.80
Bill
And maybe like you just said, maybe they do or don't have a problem. But, but the thing of it is for who, who is this guy?

00:42:07.90
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:42:10.80
Bill
Who are you and I to sit there from the outside and go, well, uh, why did that, did that individual question their overall behavior before they took that drink? Who gives a fuck?

00:42:20.73
Mike
Right. yeah Yeah.

00:42:21.78
Bill
You know,

00:42:22.09
Mike
I mean, that's, again, one of the gifts of this program for me was stop worrying about other people. You know, yeah only, again, comes back to the only person I can control is me.

00:42:35.34
Mike
I, you know, if I'm looking at somebody else, I'm looking at someone else's behavior. I'm looking, I'm paying attention to them. What am I ignoring in myself? What don't I want to look at at myself?

00:42:45.28
Bill
Right.

00:42:47.67
Mike
You know, and, and that's the thing I do, you know, I, I have to look at my reactions and my routines and my, you know, thankfully most of them are good now. Um, but you know, yeah, I mean, fuck, I don't give a fucking flying rat rat's ass.

00:43:03.69
Mike
What? what someone else does. You know, if if their behavior is affecting me in some negative way or positive way or whatever, yes, I kind of pay attention to that.

00:43:13.85
Mike
But again, so what? You know, I mean, we've talked about my neighbors, right? You know, they party and I mean, the dude drinks every fucking day.

00:43:20.05
Bill
Mm-hmm.

00:43:22.33
Mike
I know he does. Um, okay. He also gets up and goes to work every day. He manages his house and, you know, whatever, you know, maybe he's a heavy drinker.

00:43:32.84
Mike
Maybe he's an alcoholic. Maybe it's none of my fucking business.

00:43:37.05
Bill
Right. if Yeah. Yeah. And it just, that it kind of cracked me up. Cause I'm like, you know, that I, I never would have thought about that. This guy saying these things, he's, he's speaking from, you know, an eight or nine year old sober individual that now has these tools in his life for himself.

00:43:47.78
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:43:51.13
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:43:53.72
Bill
But you can't, you can't put that, that book cover on this person over here.

00:43:54.93
Mike
Right.

00:43:58.12
Bill
That's number one. Like the main point is it' none of our fucking business. But it's but it's also not fair.

00:44:01.79
Mike
Right.

00:44:03.58
Bill
It's not fair to sit there and try to try to pass some sort of judgment on somebody to to your exact point that you know nothing about, you know?

00:44:04.96
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:44:11.10
Mike
Right.

00:44:11.66
Bill
So we can take a look at this in any way, shape, or form. Okay, why does a person wear those type of clothes? Why do they drive that type of car? Why do they eat that way?

00:44:18.70
Mike
Right.

00:44:19.62
Bill
um whatever Whatever the case is, I mean, it it doesn't matter.

00:44:21.76
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:44:23.75
Bill
Yeah. You know, but here's what what the other guy was talking about.

00:44:24.09
Mike
Yeah.

00:44:27.32
Bill
lot of fucking therapy talking. They're kind of in and out.

00:44:29.18
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:44:30.02
Bill
Sounded like he had a kind of decent program, ah far different than what we do just because it's so therapy heavy. You know, but it sounded like he, again, whatever reason he walked away from Alcoholics Anonymous, he didn't bad mouth it or anything like that, but just jumped into therapy and did that thing.

00:44:36.55
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:44:43.13
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:44:45.38
Bill
But sounded like he took the the the foundation and the basics of Alcoholics anonymous Anonymous with him. And I'm like, again, same thing we talk about.

00:44:51.54
Mike
Sure.

00:44:53.22
Bill
Whatever. Do whatever you're going to

00:44:54.42
Mike
Yeah.

00:44:55.03
Bill
You know, but he was talking so much about this, this digging in and he actually, yeah you know, kind of saying that, you know, it would help helpful for him could be helpful for other people and blah, blah, blah. And it reminded me of it when you said that, you know, I'm a pretty happy guy these days, you know.

00:45:08.44
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:45:09.88
Bill
And um the same thing we talk about, and i I thought about it again when I was listening to that, and I'm like, okay, so everyone, including myself, including you, you've got shit going on out in your life.

00:45:21.68
Bill
I know that for a fact. I've got shit going on in my life. I think you know that for a fact.

00:45:24.57
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:45:26.24
Bill
Everyone's got shit going on in their life, you know?

00:45:27.16
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:45:28.24
Bill
Is my life perfect? Fuck no. Do I get, you know, um you know, this again, these, whether it's expectations or the, these ideas that, you know, why am I sitting here?

00:45:30.49
Mike
Nope.

00:45:37.73
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:45:38.71
Bill
Why can't I go do this? Why, whatever the case is.

00:45:40.31
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:45:41.23
Bill
But then, but then I forget that I forget to be grateful.

00:45:41.29
Mike
Right.

00:45:44.81
Bill
And then i one of the reasons that, and I've said it before, I post so many goddamn pictures on Instagram of, of all the trails I go to.

00:45:45.24
Mike
Yeah.

00:45:52.21
Bill
And even when I go to the same trail every week,

00:45:52.93
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:45:54.68
Bill
You know, um or every other week, whatever it is, I still post pictures from it because when these things come up as memories and now the I just got over the the memories of two years ago when I was in Texas, when I was in Branson.

00:45:56.97
Mike
Right.

00:46:06.24
Bill
And last year at this time, I was in the Buffalo National Forest and um all those different things.

00:46:06.29
Mike
Yeah.

00:46:11.04
Bill
And I sit there and I look at these pictures again. I'm like, Jesus Christ, that's it right there, you know.

00:46:15.77
Mike
Yeah.

00:46:16.34
Bill
Now, the first year I traveled a lot, the second year, not so much. And and since, well, October, obviously, when I had my whole health thing, October, November or December area, I haven't traveled a lot.

00:46:23.83
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:46:26.80
Bill
Money is the one thing. If it were weren't for the money, I'd still be traveling, but it's all going to come around.

00:46:29.91
Mike
Sure.

00:46:31.52
Bill
So this year I'm going to travel the least out of the last, obviously three, but you know what?

00:46:35.50
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:46:37.11
Bill
I never fucking traveled at all, ever before.

00:46:40.50
Mike
Right.

00:46:41.62
Bill
Ever.

00:46:42.48
Mike
Yeah.

00:46:42.68
Bill
And in the meantime, I'm out like I've got I've got two places I'm going to go, you know, this weekend. One's close to here. This trail I've just I just found and, you know, it's 20 minutes away. This other one, like an hour away in Michigan, I'm going to go to this two trails within like 30 minutes of each other that are supposed to be fucking like, you know, I mean, laid back and not a lot of people and just spoke.

00:47:01.12
Mike
Yeah.

00:47:01.75
Bill
fucking spectacular, you know?

00:47:02.90
Mike
Nice.

00:47:03.35
Bill
So I can do that. I can drive within an hour, 45 minutes, hour and a half, maybe.

00:47:06.71
Mike
okay

00:47:07.19
Bill
And I can do all these things. It's just 20, 20 bucks in gas, you know?

00:47:09.03
Mike
Right. Yeah, right.

00:47:11.67
Bill
Um, but my point is, is that, you know, I can, do all these different things I can look at, but then I look at, okay. So everyone's talking, everyone talks about this, this therapy and this and that fine. Do what you got to do.

00:47:22.60
Bill
But I, I'm not, I'm not afraid of it, but we've talked about it before.

00:47:22.96
Mike
Yeah.

00:47:27.67
Bill
Like you just said, I'm pretty happy guy over there.

00:47:29.27
Mike
Yeah.

00:47:29.43
Bill
Kind of wonder, wonderful these days, you know, the wonderfulness or awesomeness, whatever the fuck you said, which I, which I agree with.

00:47:31.10
Mike
Yeah. Right. he

00:47:36.07
Bill
So now let's put you in front of a therapist and let's, let's rip you open and let's figure out what else is wrong.

00:47:38.52
Mike
this is Right. Yes. Let's see what mommy did to me when I was four fucking years old. Yeah. No, thank you.

00:47:45.82
Bill
but Well, yeah, but you're, but you're, you're in good shape right now, but let's, let's completely, let's tear you apart again.

00:47:49.24
Mike
yeah let's that's Yeah, exactly. i didn't do enough of that for fucking decades.

00:47:52.12
Bill
and then,

00:47:54.65
Bill
Yeah, let's let's do that and then let's try to put you back together and see what we end up with in another five fucking years.

00:47:57.59
Mike
this is

00:48:00.45
Bill
Okay?

00:48:00.47
Mike
Yeah, great. i god I don't have time for that shit, man.

00:48:01.98
Bill
Yeah. ah the way The way you just said that, oh, great.

00:48:11.03
Mike
Great. Yeah.

00:48:12.18
Bill
Yeah.

00:48:12.75
Mike
No, no no thank you. No.

00:48:14.82
Bill
I'm like, I don't, I don't want to fucking do that. Cause here's the thing.

00:48:17.05
Mike
No.

00:48:17.70
Bill
I, I'm not dumb. You know, I mean, I, I'm not, I'm not ignorant.

00:48:18.84
Mike
Right.

00:48:20.47
Bill
I know for a fucking fact, I know the upbringing I had, it wasn't terrible.

00:48:20.89
Mike
Right.

00:48:24.47
Bill
Um, I think you had a far rougher childhood than I did based on what you shared with me, you know, and whatever, whatever you want to talk about it, you, you dealt with some things that I didn't, that maybe I dealt with some things.

00:48:24.59
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:48:27.63
Mike
Yeah. Right.

00:48:33.49
Mike
Sure. Yeah.

00:48:34.23
Bill
doesn't, it doesn't matter.

00:48:35.22
Mike
Right.

00:48:35.52
Bill
Okay. But. I don't, I have no, I know for a fact that, yeah, maybe there's some things that I could, in big fucking air quotes, heal from, okay, that every once in a while these things wouldn't pop into my head.

00:48:44.98
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:48:48.49
Bill
But when these things pop into my head about whatever the case is or whoever they are, I don't sit there and fucking dwell on it. It's like when when a shot of alcohol comes into my head, literally the thought, and I'm like, hmm, it shoots out the other side.

00:48:58.17
Mike
yeah yeah mm-hmm yep

00:49:01.38
Bill
you know As long as I don't daydream about it, I don't daydream about whatever fucking trauma if there was in my life because it's not fucking worth it.

00:49:07.11
Mike
mm-hmm right right yep mm-hmm exactly

00:49:10.14
Bill
Is it happening to me now? no And I'm just like this. I know. But I mean, again, this guy wants to fucking dig it because he's like, he's like, oh, next I'm going to start digging into this. And I'm like, Jesus Christ.

00:49:23.42
Bill
When do you have time to just fucking enjoy your life? You know?

00:49:25.05
Mike
yeah right back to the reading man you know let that shit fucking heal over and just enjoy your life yes you know things happened okay are yeah are they happening now no okay then fucking enjoy it sit there go back and again it's it's you know i mean we learned to smash our egos and humble ourselves realize we're not that fucking important and so therefore

00:49:31.78
Bill
Right.

00:49:38.87
Bill
Right.

00:49:50.26
Mike
By an extension of that, the bad things, quote-unquote, there's my air quotes, bad things that happened to us in the past aren't that fucking important because we're not that fucking important.

00:49:55.85
Bill
Right.

00:50:02.19
Mike
It's okay, man you know just Life is good right now. Enjoy it. Live well-heeled life.

00:50:11.04
Bill
Right. Yeah. I, wait, I read that someplace.

00:50:13.56
Mike
Yes, I know.

00:50:13.74
Bill
Where'd I read that?

00:50:14.32
Mike
i just i just read it myself.

00:50:16.34
Bill
Yeah.

00:50:16.31
Mike
Okay.

00:50:17.78
Bill
and And I'm not trying to judge the guy. Hey, do all your therapy all you want. It just seems like, it seems like a lot, a lot of work for, I mean, I don't, I don't understand it, but it doesn't mean that, Hey, if it's working for the guy, if he wants to spend the same thing, like we've talked about, if people want to spend their lives in, you know, in church basements, I, both of us see it as kind of a waste, you know, get, get healed and do what you got to do and and make sure that you're doing all the things to keep yourself sober.

00:50:20.48
Mike
Yeah.

00:50:27.30
Mike
hmm.

00:50:32.53
Mike
Yep.

00:50:35.25
Mike
Mm hmm. Yeah.

00:50:39.69
Bill
But, you know, after a certain point, you don't need to hide in the rooms all the time.

00:50:43.45
Mike
Right.

00:50:43.81
Bill
That's our opinion. It's not necessarily everyone's opinion, but, um, man, I got, I got some shit I want to get done, you know, and the majority of it is not going to happen at goddamn church basement.

00:50:45.48
Mike
Mm hmm. Right.

00:50:49.30
Mike
Yeah.

00:50:54.55
Mike
No, it is not.

00:50:54.74
Bill
So, all right. So on that note, what do you think, my friend?

00:50:59.67
Mike
Yeah.

00:51:00.36
Bill
Shall we, uh, shall we take a break?

00:51:02.23
Mike
I think we shall. well We'll be back and talk about more stuff that we don't know what we're going to talk about after these words from our sponsors.

00:51:18.16
Bill
All right, everyone. Welcome back. You really made me laugh with that when We're going to come back and talk about more stuff that we don't know what we're going talk about

00:51:22.52
Mike
Yeah, I know.

00:51:25.50
Mike
Right.

00:51:25.78
Bill
ah So real quick on the other podcast.

00:51:30.14
Mike
Yes.

00:51:30.39
Bill
Jesus fucking Christ.

00:51:30.48
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:51:33.58
Mike
Yep.

00:51:33.88
Bill
Apparently didn't have a long enough break. The other podcast host and the word alcoholic.

00:51:36.92
Mike
yes

00:51:38.41
Bill
Okay.

00:51:38.65
Mike
v

00:51:39.29
Bill
So I came across this in a, in one, in a video clip and I've got a side note on a video clip to all these things. That's rabbit holes, rabbit holes today.

00:51:45.85
Mike
ye

00:51:46.33
Bill
um Oh, we got mentioned on the sober friends podcast again.

00:51:50.89
Mike
Oh, cool.

00:51:51.19
Bill
They, they went off on a tangent. They're like, Hey, they're just for sober, not mature again.

00:51:55.15
Mike
Nice. Mm-hmm.

00:51:56.70
Bill
It fucking cracks me up every time. So again, Matt and Steve, 100% love you guys. You guys are fucking wonderful. I listen to you every week. And yeah, when you mention this, it just I just know that I'm laughing every time every time you mention us.

00:52:08.13
Bill
so um

00:52:08.54
Mike
nice

00:52:09.80
Bill
But it's the guy, and I'm going to mention him because I think he's handling this in a good way. And he was also on the Sober Curator.

00:52:17.08
Mike
who

00:52:19.93
Bill
He does some good shit. He focuses towards healing. And I think he... He might be a a sober coach also, but his podcast is geared towards men and, you know, helping men heal and that sort of thing through recovery.

00:52:29.80
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:52:32.64
Bill
um His name is Shane. and It's a sober guy podcast. OK, I found him on Instagram really, really early. It's one of the people i so I followed right away because, again, the word sober, like I was telling Erica, you know, people with the word sober and I found him right away.

00:52:41.99
Mike
Okay. Right. Mm-hmm.

00:52:47.20
Bill
Um, I haven't really, I've listened to a little bit of his podcast to begin with decent guy, decent story.

00:52:47.32
Mike
Right.

00:52:52.56
Bill
I think he lives in California, um, tattooed up and whatever kind of seems like a cool guy, family man, married kids, the whole bit, um, number of years sober.

00:52:59.42
Mike
Right.

00:53:01.25
Bill
I don't know how much, but, um, seems like he's got a good head on his shoulders that I respect what I've listened to him, uh, I respect what I've listened to when I've listened to him.

00:53:09.15
Mike
Right.

00:53:10.01
Bill
Okay.

00:53:10.10
Mike
you think

00:53:10.65
Bill
So coming across this clip and I said, I see it's something about alcoholic anymore or not any, whatever it was that I stopped on it.

00:53:17.88
Mike
a

00:53:18.42
Bill
And I just read, I didn't, I think it was while I was, that well, whatever it was, I didn't listen to the whole thing, but basically read the description. He's like, how this may upset some people, but, but his point was, is he's not going to refer to himself. He doesn't feel that the word alcoholic fits him anymore.

00:53:34.43
Bill
OK, he's just not going to call himself an alcoholic anymore based on what he said.

00:53:34.42
Mike
and Okay.

00:53:37.79
Mike
Okay.

00:53:39.41
Bill
And based on I'd listen the whole thing. It's just that whatever it is, you know, that that word isn't isn't something he fully identifies anymore because he said he feels like he's leaning on the worst area of his life.

00:53:51.73
Bill
And he's grown beyond that at this point. So that for him pulls him back into something that he used to be. Not anymore. He doesn't deny. he goes, don't get me wrong. He goes, I know I can. He goes, i'm I'm not saying that I could drink or this and that.

00:54:03.38
Bill
He goes, that's not the point.

00:54:03.70
Mike
Sure.

00:54:04.62
Bill
I'm still where I'm at.

00:54:04.70
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:54:05.42
Bill
He goes, I just don't, I'm not gonna refer to myself as that word anymore. And I'm like, okay, you know, and I'm like, um ah we know a lot of people that say alcohol free or whatever, or recovering or blah, blah, blah.

00:54:08.41
Mike
Okay. Yeah.

00:54:13.54
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

00:54:15.42
Bill
You know, so yeah, which I don't, I don't like.

00:54:15.49
Mike
Or recovered. Right. Which, you know, I know. I know. But yeah, I mean, you know, yeah, that's, you know, yeah, it's, it's, it's words. And again, if that's what you want to do, if that's how you want to identify, cool, man, whatever.

00:54:29.14
Mike
I'm a recovered alcoholic. Okay, cool. All right.

00:54:32.22
Bill
Right.

00:54:32.82
Mike
Yeah, that's fine.

00:54:33.59
Bill
Yeah. The, the only reason I don't like the word is it scares me. It may, it would make me nervous if I refer to myself as that, which is the reason I, if anyone else wants to be that way, that's fine.

00:54:36.54
Mike
Right. Right.

00:54:41.78
Bill
You know um you know, but it just, I thought the, cause I thought about the reason I stopped that.

00:54:41.98
Mike
Right.

00:54:46.86
Bill
I'm like, I'm not, not you, Shane. Come on, man.

00:54:48.98
Mike
Right.

00:54:49.10
Bill
Cause I, know, I've known of this guy for like four fucking years, you know?

00:54:49.52
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

00:54:52.44
Bill
And i don't know him, but I mean, you get a little bit invested from the begin with or whatever, but he wasn't saying it that way.

00:54:54.84
Mike
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sure.

00:54:57.92
Bill
It wasn't like the other individual saying the word isn't, you know, he wasn't saying everyone it just, this is me.

00:54:59.68
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:55:02.30
Mike
Right. Yeah. Yeah.

00:55:03.40
Bill
I'm just not going to call myself this anymore.

00:55:04.02
Mike
He's talking about himself. Right. Which is, yeah, that's yeah if you're going to do that sort of thing.

00:55:05.62
Bill
Yeah. Right.

00:55:10.20
Mike
Yes, exactly. Again, back to the only person I can control is myself. And if that's his decision and that's how he feels, cool. Yeah.

00:55:18.68
Bill
Right.

00:55:18.98
Mike
You know, rev that works for you. Great. You know, yeah. Don't work for me.

00:55:23.74
Bill
Right.

00:55:24.26
Mike
I'm a recovering alcoholic. you know i Yeah, right.

00:55:27.06
Bill
Yeah. And you, yep.

00:55:28.65
Mike
yeah I still have work to do. I know I do. um and and And I need to do that. And I know for you too, because we realize that it's process and it never ends.

00:55:41.78
Mike
And we have to remind ourselves of that, you know that we we still have work to do and and and we still need to do certain things. Otherwise, you know, um I'm going to pick up a drink if I don't do certain things.

00:55:55.10
Bill
Right.

00:55:55.58
Mike
Yeah. Period. That's me. You know, um again, the only person I can speak about is myself. And if I don't do stuff, I'm going to drink again because I'm an alcoholic.

00:56:08.14
Mike
And that's what alcoholics do is drink. I'm also a drug addict. And if I don't do these certain things, I will use drugs again.

00:56:17.10
Bill
Right.

00:56:17.82
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

00:56:18.20
Bill
Yeah. And I mean, in my prayers, I mean, I identify myself or I always tell myself that I, you know, um I say clean and sober. You know, i use the I use the same thing because I know the people, people who have used drugs, you know, use those two terms.

00:56:26.60
Mike
Yeah. Right.

00:56:31.18
Bill
I mean, I understand that sober is sober, but I recognize the fact that even though I I've never done drugs, if I start, it's going to be a problem.

00:56:33.40
Mike
Right.

00:56:36.98
Mike
Right. Yeah.

00:56:38.78
Bill
You know, as I'm not of the I'm ah I'm not of the belief that I'm like, oh, well, You know, and i don't I don't need to try it out.

00:56:38.81
Mike
right

00:56:43.51
Mike
right

00:56:45.62
Bill
You know, I mean, I know people who were heavy in the drugs said, well, I could probably drink it.

00:56:46.20
Mike
yeah

00:56:48.98
Bill
I'd be fine. And they aren't, you know, or vice versa, you know.

00:56:49.50
Mike
Sure. Right. I mean, yeah, I mean, that's, you know, in my humble opinion, very real humble. um You know, the one thing i liked about N.A.

00:57:00.03
Mike
was, you know, in their preamble, they say alcohol is a drug, you know. So, you know, that's that's I like that about N.A.

00:57:05.11
Bill
Right.

00:57:08.10
Mike
is, yes, you know, they they focus on drugs and they're blah, blah, blah, blah. But in their preamble, they say alcohol is a drug. then Everybody says period. um Yeah, you know, right, exactly. ah yeah We've talked about it ad nauseum on here. You know, the substance doesn't fucking matter. It's the fact that it's a substance. It's a mood and mind altering, whatever the fuck it is. We can't do it.

00:57:35.82
Bill
Yeah. If I do, and i' that's, you know, exactly. I'm convinced that if I, there's anything, I mean, you know, glue, you know I could, I could stiff glue or I can stiff paint or, ah you know, anything I can huff, you know, I, anything like that is good sooner or later.

00:57:39.07
Mike
Yeah. Sure. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Carbona.

00:57:49.88
Bill
It's going to, it's going it's going to be bad, you know?

00:57:52.06
Mike
Yes. Mm-hmm.

00:57:52.89
Bill
Um, but so, you know, was just, it was interesting cause I was like, okay, you know, so he's not, he's not denouncing the word for everyone. He's just saying this, this word is not my deal anymore, you know, but I'm, I'm still, yeah, I'm still the same person.

00:57:59.35
Mike
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Doesn't apply to him.

00:58:04.23
Bill
I'm just wearing a different jacket now.

00:58:04.63
Mike
Right.

00:58:05.55
Bill
You know, I'm still doing all the same goddamn things, you know, and he repeated that a couple of times that is in his short video, you know, about, no, I, I know it goes, I'm not changing my mindset.

00:58:05.98
Mike
Sure. Uh-huh. Good. Uh-huh.

00:58:14.71
Bill
I don't think I could do this. I'm still this guy. It just, I don't, you know, just the, the word.

00:58:16.98
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:58:18.51
Bill
And I was like, i'm like, okay, you know, and, um,

00:58:19.06
Mike
Yeah. Yeah, and and I get that. you know i and And you know what? I would love to be in that place. I'm not.

00:58:26.41
Bill
Right.

00:58:28.66
Bill
Well, and in the same thing, the same thing we we had talked about just a little bit ago, you know, the word, you know, we we were raging alcoholics and now we're not, you know, we're now we're just alcoholics.

00:58:35.32
Mike
z Right. Right.

00:58:37.72
Bill
um And, you know, now we're recovering alcoholics, not raging or, you know, active versus not active.

00:58:40.22
Mike
nice Sure.

00:58:42.68
Bill
You know, however you want to put it. I mean, I need for me and I know you, too. I need that distinction.

00:58:46.78
Mike
who

00:58:48.00
Bill
I need to you know, this this is who I am.

00:58:48.69
Mike
Yep.

00:58:50.36
Bill
And if somebody, if somebody called me an addict, I would, I'd accept it.

00:58:50.52
Mike
Yeah.

00:58:54.35
Bill
You know, if they're like, for whatever reason, is as, as of tomorrow, you know, the word alcoholic didn't exist anymore.

00:58:54.62
Mike
Sure.

00:58:59.83
Bill
I'm like, well, what where can I use? I, I'll go with addict.

00:59:01.91
Mike
Yeah.

00:59:02.44
Bill
I mean, I get it.

00:59:02.71
Mike
Sure.

00:59:03.16
Bill
It's the same goddamn concept.

00:59:04.34
Mike
Sure.

00:59:05.14
Bill
You know, um, I'm addicted to, or was addicted to, or will still will be or blah, blah, blah. I'm, I'm in this case. I'm just in a matter of, you know, I'm, I'm working, I'm going up the down escalator right now today.

00:59:15.34
Bill
And I'm okay at the moment, at the moment.

00:59:16.36
Mike
Yep. Mm-hmm.

00:59:19.93
Bill
But, yeah, I mean, I was, again, it's it's Sober Guy Podcast. His name's Shane. He seems like a good shit. He's all over Instagram. And, you know, I mean, again, he seems like a good deal or a good dude.

00:59:27.34
Mike
Yeah.

00:59:29.49
Bill
So, yeah, I don't know. All in all, just an interesting, interesting guy.

00:59:33.40
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:59:33.60
Bill
So that kind of ah kind of came through. So a couple of different things with other podcasts. So they had – ah and This was god it probably three four years ago.

00:59:44.62
Bill
i'm I'm digging back in some of the old Joe Rogan podcasts. so They had to Dave Chappelle on there, which I i i love Dave Chappelle.

00:59:48.23
Mike
Uh huh.

00:59:52.32
Bill
He had a great conversation with him and just talking back and forth.

00:59:52.52
Mike
Right.

00:59:54.96
Bill
but This is the funny part, which I thought you would you would appreciate. so So Dave's like, he he was talking about when he met, somehow Lenny Kravitz came up and he said when he first met Lenny Kravitz.

00:59:58.40
Mike
Mm-hmm Okay

01:00:05.24
Bill
And he goes, yeah, he goes, he told Joey, he goes, yeah, he goes, Sherman Hemsley is the one that introduced me to him. And if anyone who doesn't know who that is, if you know the if you're old enough to know the show, The Jeffersons, that's George.

01:00:09.91
Mike
o

01:00:14.74
Mike
Sure, right Now it's his mom right?

01:00:15.51
Bill
you know And the the the black chick that's married to the white guy on there, that's Lenny Kravitz's mom. Yeah. So that's how, that's how the whole thing, that's how he knew Lenny and blah, blah, blah.

01:00:25.02
Mike
Uh-huh

01:00:26.64
Bill
So, um, and then, so Dave's telling this quick story. They said, they, he goes, yeah, I got to meet Lenny, you know, cool dude, whatever, and blah, blah, blah. And he goes, then I smoked a joint with George Jefferson.

01:00:37.11
Mike
yo

01:00:38.01
Bill
And I'm like, that's, I just, I just started laughing out loud. like, I got to tell Mike about this.

01:00:43.42
Mike
oh well i mean he's no um he was a big acid head and i mean he was really into like psychedelic rock music and oh yeah sherman hemsley was a trip you dig oh yeah yeah yeah yeah he was he was like big into psychedelics and And and um there was like a bunch of bands that he was like involved with.

01:00:53.98
Bill
Was he really? I had no idea.

01:01:03.43
Mike
And yeah, this really trippy rock shit, progressive psychedelic rock stuff. And oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's got... Go down that rabbit hole sometime. He was a trippy fucking dude.

01:01:15.64
Bill
i had I had no idea. i just I just thought it was funny as fuck because, you know, he's just explaining to the whole story.

01:01:17.25
Mike
Yep.

01:01:20.36
Bill
And then, course, she just ends up with, yeah, so I smoked a joint with George Jefferson.

01:01:20.91
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:01:25.90
Mike
Yep. Mm-hmm.

01:01:26.87
Bill
Which, again, i thought I thought was pretty hilarious. So... um All right. So this is this is kind of a, and this actually might've been in the 24-hour book today. If not today, it was yesterday. um The 24-hour book, and for everyone out there, we've talked about this a lot.

01:01:42.62
Bill
There's there's certain times it's the it's the book that both of us have read the longest. We've read it since literally since day one of the Keating Center when each one of us came into the Keating Center.

01:01:47.16
Mike
Right.

01:01:49.82
Mike
Yep. okay

01:01:51.86
Bill
And it's the first one that we both read every morning, blah, blah, blah. The backbone of our of our readings.

01:01:55.48
Mike
Yep.

01:01:57.51
Bill
But there's a lot of God.

01:01:57.56
Mike
Sure. Mm hmm.

01:01:59.99
Bill
And lately there's been a lot of God in it. So whether it was today or yesterday, I can't remember, but it was talking about the, I have, just so you know, Mike, I have a point to the end of this.

01:02:11.25
Bill
So I'm just kind of going to go through the whole, the whole sentence, but then i have a point.

01:02:11.74
Mike
Okay, sure.

01:02:15.94
Bill
It's talking about the presence of God, feeling that presence, but not being able to see it, setting aside the whole God thing.

01:02:21.08
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:02:22.77
Bill
So this is my question. So setting aside the the concept of God in general, maybe looking at a higher power, a power greater than herself type of thing.

01:02:30.56
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:02:31.19
Bill
um there was a sentence that said, I cannot see him because I was not made with the ability to see him. Again, God thing.

01:02:38.71
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:02:39.62
Bill
um Else there would be no room for faith. So my question is, again, setting aside the God god part, do you think the fact that we can't see these powers that are in our life, um is that where faith comes from?

01:02:43.00
Mike
Right.

01:02:54.07
Bill
Do you think that's the natural order of things? and that's Maybe this is a weird thought, but it just came into my head.

01:02:58.64
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right. um

01:03:01.72
Bill
but

01:03:04.70
Bill
yeah

01:03:05.34
Mike
Right. Well, i mean, that's, you know, one of those little loopholes. There's lots and lots of them.

01:03:08.82
Bill
Right.

01:03:10.02
Mike
um Yes, you can't see God because then you wouldn't have faith and but blah, blah, blah, blah.

01:03:18.58
Mike
Yeah, kind of. I mean, you know... Yes, faith is is kind of an irrational belief in something other than whatever. um Yeah, it is kind of irrational um at ah at its core, you know, faith itself.

01:03:36.12
Mike
um You know, I... I believe, I hope that this thing is going to be true. i don't know for sure. um That's kind of the basis of what faith is, right? So, yeah, you know, um ah you know i I want to be sober. i think I could be sober, but I'm not 100% sure.

01:04:00.79
Mike
But I have a little faith that if I do these things that these people people are telling me to do, maybe I can do it. Um, we don't know for sure. Right. So that's, you know, early on faith.

01:04:13.43
Mike
Um, Yeah, you know, ah kind of hopes and wishes and dreams and not 100% concrete, you know, this is going to happen. I hope it does. I have faith that if I did if i do the right thing, um it it might come to be.

01:04:33.53
Mike
um Yeah, you know, I mean, yes, we have faith in our lives. Okay, this atheist has faith in his life.

01:04:40.70
Bill
hey

01:04:40.77
Mike
I have faith in things that... that um I don't 100% believe um or have 100% evidence of or whatever.

01:04:52.70
Mike
um Yeah, you know, um again, the pertaining to the God thing, that's one of the loopholes that they give them. um You know, yes, this thing exists, but you can't see it.

01:05:00.33
Bill
Right.

01:05:03.38
Mike
That's, they you know. Yeah. um i but I'm not going to get into that discussion. um But anymore.

01:05:13.98
Bill
Right.

01:05:14.07
Mike
um Yeah. 17 years ago, would have sat your ass down and told you exactly how it was. I don't know how it is. um i know what I believe and what I don't believe.

01:05:25.02
Bill
Right.

01:05:25.14
Mike
um But yes, you know, yes, faith is just, it's hopes and dreams. And, you know, um again, there's not 100% physical evidence that that's the way it is. But yeah you hope it'd be nice if it was that way. so yeah, I have faith that it is that way, even though I don't know for sure.

01:05:45.09
Bill
Right.

01:05:45.30
Mike
That's all.

01:05:46.42
Bill
Well, and and that's why I had to read the whole thing as a concept because, you know, neither one of us believe in the, in the true, you know, the, the mainstream God, you know, in air quote type of thing, God.

01:05:50.05
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

01:05:55.58
Mike
Right. Right. Right. the The old man in the robe, sitting in the big chair, wait with the stick pointing, sending lightning bolts across the universe.

01:05:59.44
Bill
Yeah.

01:06:06.03
Mike
Right.

01:06:06.87
Bill
right And i i love I love the fact that you call it a loophole. That makes it makes it so much more fun.

01:06:11.74
Mike
Yeah.

01:06:13.39
Bill
But it is. It's like, ah oh, hey, well, why can't I see it? Oh, that would take away the surprise. That would take away all that and' take away the magic of it.

01:06:19.58
Mike
Right.

01:06:22.14
Bill
But but wouldn't it but would it be easier if I was able to, you know, can't we just, no no no, no, no, You have to look over here.

01:06:22.17
Mike
the The mystery.

01:06:25.88
Mike
Yeah, right, yeah. learn or No, no, no, no, no.

01:06:32.06
Bill
Do not look behind the curtain.

01:06:32.60
Mike
Right, that's right.

01:06:33.26
Bill
You can't look back there.

01:06:34.68
Mike
Don't look at my right hand, look at my left hand.

01:06:37.50
Bill
Okay. But again, it wasn't my point to make fun of the the God-fearing individuals.

01:06:42.52
Mike
i know,

01:06:42.66
Bill
Do what you got to do, man. Do what you got to do with your what you God thing.

01:06:43.80
Mike
right.

01:06:45.14
Bill
We're fine with it. um But then I thought about that.

01:06:46.10
Mike
Yep.

01:06:48.34
Bill
I'm like, okay, so even in our our case, because I know we've talked about that, we have faith, you know?

01:06:50.56
Mike
Uh-huh. h Yeah, right.

01:06:53.26
Bill
so is... Is it that the fact that, you know, if what would be the point of faith if we if everything was laid out in front of us, you know, so that was kind that was kind of my my thought.

01:07:00.28
Mike
and Exactly. Mm-hmm.

01:07:02.70
Bill
And and you answer that question. So i'm I'm glad I'm glad that that made sense that I took that jumbled mess of God stuff.

01:07:07.95
Mike
Yep.

01:07:09.22
Bill
And and we you know we kind of pushed it all around and figured out that, yeah, it is. It's part of the part of our magic is having having that little bit of faith.

01:07:17.18
Mike
Sure.

01:07:18.11
Bill
Because in my opinion, I mean, I'm not saying that um ah i'm not saying that it's 100% that I have to have faith, but my gosh, it makes my life a little bit more...

01:07:29.14
Mike
ah Exactly.

01:07:30.30
Bill
helpful. It's helpful to me. It gives me more meaning.

01:07:32.22
Mike
man

01:07:33.02
Bill
um It's nice to be able to be like, okay, I've got, I've got it.

01:07:33.27
Mike
um

01:07:36.74
Bill
I you gotta believe it's fucking something, you know?

01:07:38.62
Mike
Right.

01:07:39.14
Bill
And you know, that, like you said, I don't know how it's going work out, but I, I'm do, I'm doing all the good things that do good, get good, you know, trying to help and be good people and picking up paper towels.

01:07:42.17
Mike
Yeah.

01:07:44.73
Mike
Yeah. Right. Tomorrow's got to be a little bit better than today.

01:07:47.46
Bill
and

01:07:49.94
Mike
a Yeah.

01:07:50.20
Bill
Yeah. You know, or, or I've got to be a little better tomorrow than I was today, you know, worst case scenario.

01:07:53.44
Mike
Right. Exactly.

01:07:55.40
Bill
So yeah.

01:07:55.58
Mike
Yeah. Mm-hmm. Exactly. you know And it might be fucking worse tomorrow. But you know then maybe the day after that.

01:08:01.82
Bill
Yeah.

01:08:03.16
Mike
yeah Faith. you know A little hope. A little you know expectation. without a yes Without the resentment.

01:08:10.01
Bill
Right. Yeah. And you know, the same thing as we've said before, man, if you're, if you're going through hell, just keep on fucking walking, man. You gotta, it's gotta come through that at some point, you know?

01:08:16.42
Mike
Yep.

01:08:19.61
Bill
Okay. So, um, I don't remember, I know how you feel about one member of this particular band, but I don't remember if we've talked about the other one.

01:08:25.05
Mike
All right.

01:08:26.41
Bill
Okay. So I know how you feel about Vince Neil. I know all that.

01:08:29.90
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:08:30.89
Bill
And you can, you you want to lay out your opinion on him now to get it out of the way?

01:08:31.10
Mike
Yeah.

01:08:33.93
Bill
Because you're dying.

01:08:34.31
Mike
He's a fucking murderer.

01:08:35.58
Bill
There we go. Okay.

01:08:36.75
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:08:36.90
Bill
So, so I was just, i was just waiting. I wanted to get the Vince Neil thing out of the way and set him aside.

01:08:40.63
Mike
Right. Yeah.

01:08:41.78
Bill
um

01:08:41.85
Mike
is

01:08:42.71
Bill
Did you ever, I guess.

01:08:43.89
Mike
You have a forklift to set him aside. He's a big boy.

01:08:49.34
Bill
yeah Yeah. it is. I ran across that side note. you know the the thing the The fact that they used his 80s picture as a before and after of the pandemic when the pandemic first started you know before quarantine and it after and he was just this this thin and dude in a leather suit without a shirt on and he's just fat motherfucker in this stretched out t-shirt with his gun hanging out the bottom.

01:09:01.68
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:09:04.31
Mike
Yep. Yep.

01:09:10.77
Mike
Yep. Yes, he did.

01:09:14.73
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:09:15.11
Bill
Yeah.

01:09:16.39
Mike
Right. Right.

01:09:16.76
Bill
But yeah, he he let himself go. don No doubt.

01:09:18.58
Mike
yes he did

01:09:18.76
Bill
I 100% agree with that. Okay. And the the murder part is that it's there's facts involved with that.

01:09:24.12
Mike
ah ha

01:09:24.20
Bill
So again, we're going to accept all of that. Okay.

01:09:26.36
Mike
right

01:09:27.32
Bill
So Nikki Sixx and the Heroin Diaries. Did you ever read that?

01:09:32.43
Mike
Yep.

01:09:33.08
Bill
Okay. Opinion?

01:09:34.97
Mike
Most of it's bullshit.

01:09:37.08
Bill
Okay. In what way?

01:09:38.23
Mike
um He em but embellished a lot of stuff.

01:09:38.35
Bill
I'm just curious. say

01:09:41.51
Mike
He wasn't nearly as yeah as bad and blah blah, blah, blah, blah.

01:09:42.07
Bill
Did he? Okay. Okay.

01:09:45.11
Mike
You know, whatever, man. He's he's a fucking hoaxer. He's a fraud and a phony.

01:09:50.55
Bill
but

01:09:51.45
Mike
it Check out his bass playing sometime. Yeah, the guy doesn't do anything he says he does, but that's just my opinion.

01:10:01.66
Bill
Okay. So in, in the reason I asked is because I couldn't remember. And I, for some reason I thought that, um, that you might've read the book. I mean, it's been like, now, now I know for a fact, cause I, I got the audio book.

01:10:09.94
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:10:12.71
Bill
So I started listening to it.

01:10:13.53
Mike
Okay. Uh-huh.

01:10:14.75
Bill
Um, cause I never did. i never, i knew of the book, but the book came out in 2007. He did a re-release 10 years later.

01:10:18.97
Mike
Yep.

01:10:20.75
Bill
So it's been almost 10 years again now, you know, since that re-release, but he did, it's a, it's like 11 hours for an audio book.

01:10:23.26
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:10:27.99
Bill
because he added this other chapter.

01:10:28.02
Mike
Yeah.

01:10:29.51
Bill
and I'm sure there's bits and pieces.

01:10:29.94
Mike
Yeah.

01:10:30.63
Bill
So I'm just into, you know, like the the actual, like first couple of chapters of the book. And I thought it was interesting.

01:10:35.54
Mike
Yeah.

01:10:36.54
Bill
You know, I'm just bits and pieces.

01:10:36.66
Mike
yeah

01:10:37.86
Bill
Now, the the thing with is, and I'm glad you said that, because I will still listen to it, but I didn't know. And you know these things. Number one, there there's two different things that, that, you know, kind of two things that that fire on your cylinders there.

01:10:52.86
Bill
He's a, you know, musician, so rock and roll dude.

01:10:52.85
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:10:55.36
Bill
I know you know a lot about those things.

01:10:55.35
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:10:56.96
Bill
And he's a fucking drug addict addict, okay? So you know a lot about those things.

01:10:59.01
Mike
Yeah. I do.

01:11:00.63
Bill
So putting those two together, and then I thought maybe you read the book and then maybe you had an opinion.

01:11:04.98
Mike
Yep.

01:11:05.35
Bill
So the fact that both of those things are true is helpful, you know?

01:11:08.47
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:11:08.63
Bill
And it doesn't mean that I won't listen to it because I think it's interesting, but knowing that some of it or a portion of it or whatever it could be embellished, I get it, you know?

01:11:11.13
Mike
Right. Yeah.

01:11:17.76
Mike
Yep.

01:11:18.08
Bill
I just think it's an interesting setup. But so all that said aside, thank you for for your opinion. I do i knew you'd have one way or the other.

01:11:24.64
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:11:26.70
Bill
OK, this one was kind of funny.

01:11:26.71
Mike
Sure.

01:11:28.53
Bill
And I have a side question on this for you. But so he's talking about, again, at one point, you know all the different types of drugs and it was on methadone and all these different things. So he's going through all these different this list of things that he's taking every morning and blah, blah, blah.

01:11:37.75
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:11:41.11
Bill
And then it just, this made me laugh. He said, he goes, oh, he opened up this one setting. He says, he goes, I'm off the, off the methadone because it didn't work, which I thought was kind of funny because he's taking all these other fucking drugs.

01:11:52.60
Bill
And he's like, oh yeah, by the way, the methadone didn't work.

01:11:52.95
Mike
Right.

01:11:55.12
Bill
That I just thought was funny because it just reminded me of, I don't know, people that are, you know, trying to get themselves.

01:11:55.23
Mike
Right.

01:12:00.29
Bill
I'm sure we've known some people that have tried that, but then abused it and whatever. I'm like, oh, it's just not working, you know?

01:12:05.41
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

01:12:06.93
Bill
So my question, though, is because he was talking about, um you know, obviously having ah delusional thoughts and hiding in closets and all the certain things when he was using. And I don't know if we ever talked about these sort of things.

01:12:16.18
Mike
Right.

01:12:18.17
Bill
So did you ever deal with you yourself, hallucinations, any sort of psychosis, anything like that through any of the using or any type of substances that you ever got involved in?

01:12:22.08
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:12:29.60
Mike
No, you know, I really didn't. Um, I've certainly saw people around me. but yeah, no, or did I?

01:12:35.89
Bill
Or did you? Or did you? ah yeah

01:12:42.62
Mike
Yeah, I fucking did. Um, but no, I mean, you know, um,

01:12:44.31
Bill
hey

01:12:50.26
Mike
when you do a lot of speed and you've been up for a week. Um, yeah, you know, but I, I was aware of it. I, like, I knew like I'd hear shit and whatever. um but I knew i was hearing shit because I had been up too long, you know?

01:13:05.02
Bill
Right. Right.

01:13:06.72
Mike
So, I mean, yeah, you know, and and shit out of the corner your eye moving and, and, you know, but I knew, i knew that it was happening because it was supposed to fucking it happen.

01:13:17.91
Mike
So it was, I never believed that anything was real. You know, I knew that I was hallucinating because i was fucking hallucinating, but it wasn't like I believed the hallucinations, which I know people did, you know, I mean, our our friend Heidi, who was on here, you know, she talked about, you know, she had cans of bug spray in her back pocket because she shit was crawling around and she was going to kill it.

01:13:40.03
Bill
Right.

01:13:41.05
Mike
And there was, there was nothing crawling around.

01:13:41.34
Bill
right

01:13:43.77
Mike
um Yeah, you know, again, I saw i saw that behavior in other people, but when I had those effects, um I realized what they were. I knew what they were, so it didn't freak me out. I just went, oh, yeah, look that. I'm hearing shit or I'm seeing shit or whatever, but I knew it wasn't real.

01:14:05.34
Bill
Yeah, but you, cause you were up for x number of days or hours or whatever the case may be.

01:14:07.42
Mike
Right. Yeah.

01:14:08.78
Bill
Okay. Okay.

01:14:09.48
Mike
Yeah.

01:14:10.23
Bill
Yeah. And I just, I didn't know if we had ever talked about that. And, uh, even through when you went through, detox, cause I remember them, they, they asked me as I was, when I was going through detox, if I, if I, you know, saw anything, cause they would come in and, you know, I vaguely remember these things here and there, cause I was out for like the first couple of days or two and a half days, ah two days, probably two and a half, whatever it was.

01:14:16.96
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:14:23.02
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:14:27.54
Mike
Right.

01:14:30.65
Bill
Um, maybe a little bit less, a little bit more, whatever. It doesn't matter. But, um,

01:14:33.89
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:14:35.13
Bill
I remember being asked about that. And I don't remember again, having any hallucinations, although I know a lot of people, and I'll say a lot. I know that certain people have that issue when they go through detox.

01:14:46.05
Bill
You no issue with that either.

01:14:46.46
Mike
Right now, now, nope.

01:14:47.63
Bill
Did you remember? Okay. Yeah. And it just, I, um, again, I I've heard, you know, plenty of people talk about it. You know, we've heard the God, how many leads, you know, heard plenty of leads and shit like that.

01:14:57.37
Mike
Right.

01:14:58.34
Bill
So I just, I didn't know if you and I had ever talked about that.

01:15:00.60
Mike
Yeah.

01:15:00.66
Bill
So

01:15:00.88
Mike
And I mean, there were, you know, there were ah several times in my life where, you know, I would, I was drinking super heavily and and I would stop, which is not good.

01:15:11.06
Mike
um But, you know, I did it a few times in my life and I mean, nah, never, never, you know, the DTs, delirium tremors.

01:15:11.42
Bill
Right.

01:15:20.67
Mike
um Yeah, no, never happened to me. You know, thankfully, here's a piece of wood. I'll knock on it.

01:15:26.74
Bill
Right. Right.

01:15:27.50
Mike
um Yeah, you know, never whatever. My brain's better than other people's. No, it's just different.

01:15:36.06
Bill
Yeah. And I can completely understand that, that whatever whatever somebody's makeup is, is that, you know, whatever combination you had or whatever you could handle versus because, I mean, there's people that in I know for this for a fact.

01:15:41.93
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:15:44.50
Mike
Right.

01:15:48.14
Bill
Some people, you know, um get paranoid when they smoke weed. Most people or a lot of people.

01:15:51.48
Mike
Right.

01:15:53.10
Bill
You know, it just chills them out, you know, so you can get literally opposite reactions from, you know, the same drug or substance.

01:15:54.92
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:16:00.06
Mike
Sure.

01:16:00.24
Bill
And I don't know, maybe one type of alcohol fucks somebody completely up and doesn't bother somebody else or blah, blah, blah.

01:16:04.54
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:16:05.88
Bill
So, I mean, I i don't know.

01:16:05.97
Mike
Right.

01:16:07.10
Bill
It just, um like I said, it would see.

01:16:07.32
Mike
Yeah.

01:16:09.30
Bill
And that's interesting, though, because I will ah'll listen to this book in a little bit different, kind of like, eh.

01:16:14.20
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:16:14.42
Bill
kind of side-eye everything, but it's, so far it's been interesting, and, you know, I mean, there was a time, there was a time frame when um I never knew much about Nikki Sixx, I mean, i I liked the band, you know, at ah at a point for a period of time, um you know, and ah again, at a certain period of time in my life, you know, as part of the life of the music that I listened to, but I don't, I really never knew much about him, I knew about him, but not really a lot about him, so, Um, again, one way or the other, it's, i was just curious about that.

01:16:15.56
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:16:25.71
Mike
Yeah.

01:16:32.15
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:16:34.49
Mike
Right.

01:16:38.96
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:16:42.21
Bill
It's one of my, one of my freebies. So I'm not certainly not out any money or anything like that.

01:16:44.76
Mike
Get what you pay for.

01:16:46.29
Bill
So mindless, yeah mindless, mindless listening. So, um, all right. So I had another one here. where the fuck did it go?

01:16:57.23
Bill
Oh, so I was listening to, this was Sober Friends, are again, you know speaking of of Matt and Steve, and they were talking about acceptance, okay, just in a general sense, probably a couple of weeks ago, talking about acceptance.

01:17:03.31
Mike
Mm

01:17:09.62
Bill
And it made me think about, you know, like the main question that they, or the main question that I had that made me think about was, What does that actually mean when somebody says that, you know, for us to have acceptance?

01:17:22.14
Bill
um What does it mean? I mean, to to you, I mean, I know we know what it means. It's like, you know, we we deal with It's one of our daily things.

01:17:27.62
Mike
Right.

01:17:29.46
Bill
But to put it in in words, what did you what does it mean? Or how does it how does it really play in with what we have to do?

01:17:36.85
Mike
Um, ah I'm going to go back to the fucking control thing. Um, you know, I, I accept the fact that I can't fucking control anything but myself.

01:17:40.28
Bill
ah

01:17:47.05
Mike
Um, which is tough, you know, it really is.

01:17:47.54
Bill
Right.

01:17:50.01
Mike
But yeah, I mean, that's, that's true acceptance, you know, and that's, that's tough for us. Alcoholic types. We want to be the director. We want to arrange the sets and the actors and the gloh blah, blah, blah bla blah, blah.

01:18:03.45
Mike
Read that shit somewhere. Um,

01:18:05.11
Bill
Right.

01:18:06.46
Mike
But true acceptance, and ah again, you know not perfect at it, trust me, not anywhere near perfect at it, but much, much better than I used to be. um Just accepting that you know things are going to happen, and people are going to act ways, and and situations are going to arise, and and yeah, and there's not a goddamn thing I can do about it.

01:18:31.73
Bill
Right.

01:18:32.12
Mike
And, and, and there's comfort in that, you know, it's, it's I don't have to, i don't have to, because there's nothing I can do.

01:18:39.91
Bill
Right.

01:18:42.44
Mike
So stop wasting my fucking time trying to.

01:18:47.06
Bill
Well, and I'm glad you went back to the to the control thing i didn't think about that either. But it just, every once in a while when I'm listening to these things, and um once again, sober friends, they'll do they'll do these basic topics.

01:18:58.87
Bill
But a lot of times i'll I'll pull something out of there, something different, or maybe it's exactly what they're talking about.

01:18:59.25
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:19:04.39
Bill
But a lot of times, once again, it's just this basic thing. It's like when we're going through a reading or you know reading the steps and something's like, Jesus Christ, that's what that meant to it.

01:19:13.24
Mike
okay

01:19:13.36
Bill
That's where that where that thing come from. Yeah.

01:19:15.93
Mike
Right.

01:19:16.24
Bill
And I just, I hear something in these, you know, the, these readings for these episodes. And I thought about that. like, well, what the fuck does it even mean? You know?

01:19:24.82
Mike
o

01:19:25.05
Bill
I mean, so people, we have to have acceptance. Great. Thank you.

01:19:28.06
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:19:28.29
Bill
So if, yeah.

01:19:28.98
Mike
Moving on. I accept that.

01:19:31.16
Bill
You know, if I had to explain that to a newcomer, what would I say?

01:19:31.99
Mike
Yeah.

01:19:34.24
Bill
i mean, I know I could figure it out, you know, how how to put it into in the layman's terms or or newly sober terms. But the the control thing is good.

01:19:39.67
Mike
Right.

01:19:41.41
Bill
And then I just thought about it as you were talking. If we don't have acceptance of all these things, I mean, then it turns back into these or could resentments, right? I mean, could that be that circle that circle back?

01:19:50.55
Mike
Sure. Oh, absolutely.

01:19:52.18
Bill
Okay, yeah.

01:19:52.47
Mike
And again, you know, ah the illusion of control, the illusion of power.

01:19:55.45
Bill
yeah

01:19:56.27
Mike
Yeah, that that there's something we can actually do about something. You know, clearly there are some things we can do things about, but it ah it comes back to pretty much just pertains to us and our reactions.

01:20:10.01
Mike
um You know, we can... we can be examples and we can influence to a degree, um, other people, but, um, but not much, not much.

01:20:25.08
Mike
And that's accepting that, you know, that I have no power. I have no power over substances. I have no power over other people. I have no power over situations, very little power over situations.

01:20:37.24
Bill
yeah right

01:20:38.87
Mike
Right. Right.

01:20:39.58
Bill
Yeah. And that that's even a tough thing too. And I know what' it doesn't feel so hard these days, but I know to begin with was, you know, again, when, when we're told to, you know, you just gotta, just gotta accept, you just gotta let things happen.

01:20:52.38
Bill
You know gotta go with the flow and things are going work out.

01:20:54.36
Mike
Right.

01:20:55.26
Bill
And, you know, the, the key was, is that, you know, that, I mean, no, we can't sit back and do nothing, but we do have to let things, we got to flow.

01:20:55.84
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:21:00.74
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:21:02.82
Bill
Like you said, you know, flowing with the, with the current, but also, you know, controlling ourselves.

01:21:03.54
Mike
Yeah.

01:21:07.18
Bill
So we're not bashing up and you know, up against rocks and the, you know, the, the bank of the, of the, whatever river we're on and that sort of thing.

01:21:08.78
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

01:21:12.80
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:21:13.86
Bill
But, um, acceptance and realizing that we have no control. Those are two really hard things to swallow in the beginning. i mean, I don't think about it that much that, you know, these days, you know, mean, I know i had no control over anything, but still, but I also know that once again, i cannot sit back.

01:21:21.74
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right. Uh-huh. Mm-hmm. Right. Mm-hmm. Right.

01:21:28.39
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:21:31.34
Bill
If I do nothing, i I can't do nothing, but I have to do, you know, the things that are in my control.

01:21:35.89
Mike
right

01:21:38.35
Bill
I can't control the other people around me. I've got accept all this shit that goes on and in life and in the world and in all the other fucking garbage that goes on.

01:21:42.20
Mike
a right

01:21:45.59
Bill
But I don't i don't have to like it, but I, you know,

01:21:46.20
Mike
aha Right. Great.

01:21:49.56
Bill
hey

01:21:49.74
Mike
Nobody said you had to like it. and You sure as hell don't have to love it. But, you know, yeah. But accept it. Yeah, there it is. That sucks. Oh, well.

01:22:03.02
Bill
That's kind of funny. So, well, well there it is

01:22:05.75
Mike
There it is. Yep. Sit right there. Look at that. I'm not going to go over and play with it. I know that. I'm sure as hell not going to go taste it.

01:22:17.65
Bill
Right. Oh, you know, it's just maybe I had this written down to that.

01:22:18.40
Mike
Cool.

01:22:21.60
Bill
Well, kind of play with the thing, not taste it. But so this this past weekend, you know, this weekend that literally obviously the holiday weekend, I went up to.

01:22:23.58
Mike
Cool.

01:22:32.44
Bill
Well, I went to the normal hiking trail around here on Saturday.

01:22:34.84
Mike
who

01:22:35.32
Bill
I went up to Milwaukee and I met up with my friend Kathleen and we took a little trip around like by Lake Michigan, the hiking trail up there.

01:22:42.36
Mike
cool

01:22:43.06
Bill
And then there was another one. I found this hiking trail in Michigan that I went to on Monday. And again, like and it it was an hour or so away, hour, 15 minutes, whatever. It's nice though. But so, I mean, all these different things that I, you know, all these different trails or whatever.

01:22:56.51
Bill
So the, the one that and I don't see a lot of I see a lot of nature, but I don't, I see squirrels. I see a couple of birds here and there.

01:23:03.51
Mike
Right Ooh

01:23:04.82
Bill
I saw a turtle, you know, once and, know, That sort of thing, you know, and I mean, that was kind of, that's the one that's just right up the road by, you know, by the, uh, toll road.

01:23:13.40
Mike
huh

01:23:13.75
Bill
It was actually kind of a beautiful turtle, you know? Um, so I'm like, oh, it's fucking turtle, but I don't see a lot of other things, you know, deer, obviously I've seen deer around, but so I was at the, the trail again, the one up by the toll road this past weekend.

01:23:19.97
Mike
Sure Right

01:23:25.86
Bill
And I was just walking along and I mean, I I'm on that trail. I've been on that trail so goddamn many times. I mean, I know it like the back of my hand, so it's not that i don't pay attention to where i'm walking but i'm not really focused on like oh i gotta look at this and look at that type of thing you know but it just caught the corner of my eye it was a big fucking raccoon and uh i mean probably let's say from from where i'd say from where you're sitting right now in your bedroom to your neighbor's house okay away so it wasn't close but not really far away i mean i could clearly see it was a raccoon and it was good size one too So I'm just walking along and it catches my eye and I stopped and it's just like fucking mean mugging me.

01:23:32.38
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:23:39.08
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:23:43.42
Mike
Ah.

01:23:52.12
Mike
Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Uh-huh.

01:24:04.46
Bill
It's just looking, just standing there, you know? So I zoomed in and got a picture. It was kind of funny. It kind of looked like a bear almost when I got a picture because it was, it was far enough away, right? To really zoom in. But I'm like still kind of keeping an eye out because you know, it's fucking raccoon.

01:24:17.31
Bill
You know, you never know.

01:24:17.69
Mike
Right.

01:24:18.07
Bill
I mean, they're not like, it's not like a bear, but I mean, they're fuck you up, you know?

01:24:22.26
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:24:22.81
Bill
They mess you up a little bit if nothing else.

01:24:24.85
Mike
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:24:25.33
Bill
So,

01:24:25.73
Mike
And they can get rabies, so yep.

01:24:27.83
Bill
Exactly. You know, and I wasn't thinking of it necessarily that time until Monday. Okay. When, when I'm at the other trail.

01:24:31.91
Mike
Aha.

01:24:33.59
Bill
So, um, you know, um and I'm down to this like little, um, like ravine area, this one trail and this one, one I found in Michigan and it was, it was so beautiful. I mean, it was really, it was nice. It wasn't that crowded, um, you know, surprisingly enough.

01:24:45.59
Bill
And I started, I've been using, um, I use all trails, which is, you know, obviously maps myself out. But searching through there sometimes can be a little challenging depending on what you're looking for because there's only certain criteria that you could put in there.

01:24:51.42
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:24:58.23
Bill
You can narrow it down but only to a certain extent. So what I've been doing is I've been using, I've actually hooked in, i hooked up ChatGPT to AllTrails. So now I can tell chat GBT exactly what I want. I'm looking for this type of trail, little off the beaten path, not a lot of people, certain distance. It was a river, lake, you know, whatever. And within an hour of where I'm at right now. And then it gives me this whole list of trails. That's how I found the one in Michigan and the one I'm going to tomorrow and the next day. Very easy now. It's an easy way to find it.

01:25:28.82
Bill
So again, off the beaten path, not a lot of people, great trail I was on. And it was like a, probably four miles total, but I'm getting kind of towards the end of where, wherever I was. And um I'm walking down this trail and I come around just this little bend and it's not a big trail, but I could put my, I could put my arms out.

01:25:44.38
Bill
So it's like about the width of my wingspan type of thing is the trail.

01:25:47.09
Mike
Uh huh.

01:25:48.18
Bill
And, you know, dirt, you know, nothing, dirt, stone, whatever, nothing out of the ordinary. And I see this little animal kind of like wobbling around and kind of like shaky walking in front of me.

01:25:52.45
Mike
Alright.

01:25:56.70
Bill
i don't know, probably 10, 15 feet.

01:25:56.89
Mike
Uh huh.

01:25:58.23
Bill
And I look, I'm like, it's a fucking raccoon, you know, but little, I mean, I mean, like it looked like a, like a small cat. Okay.

01:26:04.21
Mike
Mm-hmm. right.

01:26:04.85
Bill
Not a kitten, but you know, medium size, half the size of full grown, normal size cat type of thing, you know? So I'm coming up and I'm kind of making noise. So like, I want to startle this thing. I mean, I, again, it's a still a like fucking wild animal, know, and it comes just walking it up and like, it kind of like falls into this hole right off the trail.

01:26:22.49
Bill
So I kind of walked up and I got within two, three feet and zoomed in and took a picture of it. And again, that's what I posted. And then it looked at me and I was walking around. I'm like, yeah, you know, see yeah like have a nice day type of thing.

01:26:33.38
Bill
And it's like, and like growled and like hissed at me.

01:26:35.88
Mike
Uh-huh. Uh-huh.

01:26:36.73
Bill
I'm like, I'm like, motherfucker. Yeah. And, and then I thought about I'm like, Jesus Christ, when it was walking, it was, it was walking wobbly and shaking and it was in that hole kind of shaken too.

01:26:38.49
Mike
ah

01:26:43.99
Mike
a

01:26:45.93
Bill
And then kind of like, and it started to get out a hole. I'm like, fuck you, man. So like, I'm like, hu pop you know, and then kind of, kind of walk backwards a little bit, making sure it was small, you know, but still, I mean, um,

01:26:53.18
Mike
a aha

01:26:58.74
Bill
I don't fuck with anything like that. Same thing. So I'm thinking, speaking of rabies, I'm like that thing, yeah whatever it was, rabies, distemper, whatever the thing they get.

01:27:04.42
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

01:27:06.74
Bill
I'm like, that thing was fucked up. And then I thought about it even further. I'm like, that's probably why the fucking thing was alone. You know?

01:27:12.54
Mike
Yeah.

01:27:13.33
Bill
Cause when I saw that one to begin with, when I was walking up, I was looking around. I'm like, there's, there's a baby. There's gotta be a mom around here someplace, you know?

01:27:19.28
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:27:20.36
Bill
And that's why I was trying to slowly, you know, kind of make noise and whatever as I was, as I was walking up. Um, but then, but I'm like, that's probably why this thing was alone because it's probably, you know, it's probably fucked up and they're like, well, yeah, you're just, you could be here and die.

01:27:28.28
Mike
Yeah.

01:27:32.90
Mike
Yep.

01:27:34.55
Bill
So, so yeah, it was, uh, two raccoons within, within three days. But I mean, yeah, that one, I've never seen what I, and I truly believe this fucking raccoon after I, after all said and done, I'm like, this goddamn thing is, is probably rabid.

01:27:39.14
Mike
hmm yep well yeah all right

01:27:47.27
Bill
So anyhow. But yeah, that was the that was the extent of my fun. So yeah, you know it's again, my the wild animal stuff. I still, i at a distance, let me say this to begin with, at a distance, I still want to see a bear.

01:28:01.61
Mike
right right

01:28:03.51
Bill
But at a distance, there's been there's been a couple of bears. There was a bear attack. Was it Yosemite? One of the national parks recently.

01:28:12.92
Mike
Roy.

01:28:13.78
Bill
yeah, that somebody got killed. And they, they think that this guy probably just came upon some, you know, the bear ah mom, mom with cubs and whatever.

01:28:16.44
Mike
Nice.

01:28:23.17
Bill
And you know, got, they could tell, obviously it got, it got killed. And then I saw a video just the other day on either Facebook or Instagram, was this guy and his girl, his girlfriend. And they're just standing there. And they they were taking a video of something. And this fucking bear comes hauling ass. Like this big-ass bear comes hauling ass like, I don't know, five feet off the trail from him. Just run shoots back. And they're like, meh. Then this other one comes hauling ass. And then the second one, again, it ran away. and then But then stopped and turned around. So the guy had bear spray. So he just shot like a little bit of bear spray. And it ran away. But then another one, the other one doubled back again. And I'm like, Jesus fucking Christ, man. You know, same thing.

01:29:04.38
Bill
Yosemite, Yellowstone, whatever it was, one of these fucking, you know, places like that.

01:29:07.18
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:29:07.98
Bill
But again, you know, it's just early in the year. But I mean, everything they're saying is, I mean, I do. I don't, I don't fuck around with stuff like that. I've got bear spray, but fuck, I wouldn't mind seeing one at a distance, a distance.

01:29:17.38
Mike
Yeah.

01:29:17.74
Bill
And I mean, a hundred yards and I'm up on a, on a bluff. That's where I want to see one.

01:29:21.11
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

01:29:22.39
Bill
You know, I don't want, when one comes fucking running by me, I'm going to shit myself.

01:29:24.73
Mike
Does

01:29:25.63
Bill
I think. Yeah.

01:29:28.05
Mike
Bill shit in the woods? Apparently he does.

01:29:29.69
Bill
yeah Yeah, does this Bill shit in his pants with a bear?

01:29:30.52
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:29:34.14
Bill
Because, I mean, again, I've i've got bear spray, but fuck me, man. You know, I just ah want i don't want to play with that.

01:29:38.27
Mike
It

01:29:40.18
Bill
So, all right. enough of Enough of that. I think probably it's been a long day, right? I think.

01:29:45.05
Mike
it has.

01:29:45.92
Bill
All right.

01:29:46.39
Mike
business

01:29:47.32
Bill
So what do you think? We all good?

01:29:49.27
Mike
i believe we've done another one.

01:29:51.92
Bill
we've we've We've done something. We've done some work. We've done something.

01:29:54.97
Mike
We have.

01:29:55.28
Bill
So I think it's probably acceptance that is the key.

01:29:56.02
Mike
I accept that.

01:30:00.27
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:30:01.21
Bill
All right. So your turn, my brother.

01:30:02.26
Mike
Cool. All right. Well, thank you everyone for listening to yet another episode of Sober Not Mature. As always, be kind to each other, be good to each other, go out and do something nice for somebody else this week and don't tell anybody you did it.

01:30:17.82
Mike
Now, from the bottom of my heart to the depths of my soul, from the beginning of time until the ends of the earth, always and eternally,

01:30:28.89
Mike
Fuck you. Now it's time, kids. It's time for you to fuck off. Then keep fucking off. Keep fucking off till you get to a gate with a sign on it saying, you cannot fuck off past here.

01:30:45.02
Mike
Climb over that gate. Dream the impossible dream. and Keep fucking off forever.

01:30:52.54
Bill
ah she i I forgot that I muted. I'm like, I'm le like, kind of mute.

01:30:56.44
Mike
ha ha ha ha.

01:30:56.70
Bill
I'm like, but

01:30:58.68
Mike
ah

01:30:59.77
Bill
and I was trying to look something up because I was going to remind you of stuff.

01:31:01.62
Mike
um

01:31:02.21
Bill
did just Just real quick. and there was like i can't I can't get into the article now. It doesn't really matter. But did you did you hear about this?

01:31:07.90
Mike
ah hair

01:31:09.29
Bill
This was ah probably a couple of weeks ago. But there was a a woman that was riding a shopping cart down Interstate I-95 in Florida at 3 a.m. m with ah with a sail fashioned from a shower curtain.

01:31:18.46
Mike
Of course there was.

01:31:22.49
Mike
Beautiful.

01:31:25.66
Bill
And I'm like, I'm laughing. I'm like, like what the, I'm like, Oh, okay. Well, I don't know. Depending on the circumstance, if I would add a shopping cart and a shower curtain at a certain, at a certain point, I might've tried.

01:31:33.71
Mike
Mm-hmm. And a shower curtain. Sure. and I was in Florida, and it was 3 a.m., yeah.

01:31:40.09
Bill
iy again, it's, I can't, I can't say that I can't really laugh at something, something like that. Cause I'm not, it's, it's not out of the realm of possibility that i that I could have been that person, but yeah she looked like, so

01:31:50.70
Mike
Eh, that's too much fucking work.

01:31:53.85
Bill
Yeah.

01:31:53.96
Mike
Ingenuity and shit, man. Rigging up a sale and and, you know, well, you got to find a shopping cart. and Jesus Christ. and Too much goddamn work.

01:32:04.80
Mike
I salute you, ma'am, for your ingenuity.

01:32:05.21
Bill
yeah yeah well and i and i'm guessing and i again i can't get in the article but if i remember correctly she was probably in her 20s so a lot younger than us i mean when when maybe you and i are you know would have had some you know some some gumption i guess as they would say but uh yeah these days i mean i fuck i stone cold sober with the yeah if i if i knew what i was doing i would be like

01:32:14.03
Mike
Hmm.

01:32:17.25
Mike
No, Okay. Yes. Yes.

01:32:23.03
Mike
Nah. Nah. That's way too much work.

01:32:27.86
Bill
i want build a I don't want to build a fucking... and I don't want to do it.

01:32:30.85
Mike
Nah. Nah.

01:32:32.44
Bill
i don't want to do it at all. so

01:32:34.37
Mike
Nope.

01:32:35.42
Bill
All right. Well, you know what? I love you, brother.

01:32:37.85
Mike
I love you too.

01:32:39.06
Bill
And we will talk soon.

01:32:40.38
Mike
We shall.

01:32:41.98
Bill
All right. by

01:32:43.59
Mike
Bye.