SoberNotMature - Episode 218 (Lane K. - Unraveling Our Helixes)

00:00:01.91
Bill
All right, everyone. Welcome once again to another episode of Sober, Not Mature. And yes, we almost didn't have a guest tonight.

00:00:10.26
Mike
yeah

00:00:12.10
Bill
We're just going to start right out fucking with you, Lane, because Lane had a little bit a delay, right?

00:00:14.74
Mike
Right.

00:00:16.30
Bill
Is that what we're going to call it, Lane?

00:00:18.33
Mike
Sure.

00:00:18.58
Bill
Delay?

00:00:18.73
Mike
We'll call it that.

00:00:19.45
Lane Kennedy
Delay.

00:00:19.47
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:00:19.48
Bill
just It was just a delay.

00:00:20.09
Lane Kennedy
That's that's perfect.

00:00:22.02
Bill
it was It was outside of her control, I'm sure, because we know better. She didn't do it on purpose. But we do have our friend Lane Kennedy.

00:00:26.27
Lane Kennedy
No.

00:00:26.38
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:00:28.02
Bill
um She's from the Sober Curator. Also wrote a book. You do some some cool stuff with wellness, which we'll get into. we get into all that stuff. But you've also been sober for an ungodly amount of time, which we'll also get into.

00:00:39.58
Bill
But two things I want i want to start off with real quick.

00:00:39.81
Lane Kennedy
Okay.

00:00:42.12
Bill
And and Mike, one's a story I want her to tell real quick is i think you'll appreciate this.

00:00:45.66
Mike
All right.

00:00:46.40
Bill
But I got one question, first question for you, Lane. You've been you've done some podcasts before, correct?

00:00:51.21
Lane Kennedy
Correct.

00:00:52.02
Bill
Have you ever done a podcast where the where the folks have been nominated for Best Podcasts?

00:00:58.62
Lane Kennedy
I have not. But you have.

00:01:00.54
Bill
Yes, you're welcome. You're welcome. So, cause now you are now you're on, now you're on a podcast cause we've been nominated for best poska podcast.

00:01:02.87
Lane Kennedy
Yes.

00:01:06.55
Lane Kennedy
Which is so cool.

00:01:06.90
Bill
I can't, I can't even fucking podcast.

00:01:07.35
Mike
Yes. Right.

00:01:09.95
Bill
Yeah.

00:01:10.87
Mike
See, yeah it's this kind of quality entertainment that these people pay for.

00:01:11.13
Bill
Yeah.

00:01:13.08
Lane Kennedy
This is it right here.

00:01:13.78
Bill
Yeah.

00:01:14.36
Lane Kennedy
So good.

00:01:14.45
Bill
See, well, here here's just everyone that listens. Yeah, this is the this is the quality, especially if you're a new listener. um Our guests don't show up on time. I can't say podcast. we We just talk, fuck, about whatever shit we want to.

00:01:22.49
Mike
he

00:01:25.33
Bill
Mike and I spend 15 minutes talking about his fucked up day and my hurt shoulder.

00:01:25.46
Mike
Right.

00:01:29.17
Bill
My shoulder hurts.

00:01:29.66
Mike
yeah

00:01:30.09
Bill
So if I can get through this episode without wincing and going, oh, fuck.

00:01:30.91
Mike
Is

00:01:33.77
Bill
If you hear that, that means my shoulder hurt. It's my it's my mouse hand.

00:01:39.26
Mike
is that a euphemism?

00:01:39.51
Bill
so so my yeah yeah you know what i didn't say my monkey hand so i answered okay but next next question or actually story i'm gonna have you i'm gonna start off before we get into everything lane i want you to tell a little story and you're gonna remember this okay so um there was a um a commercial a parody commercial on saturday night live about not now Hey, God.

00:01:44.76
Mike
Ah.

00:01:47.97
Mike
Yeah.

00:01:54.31
Lane Kennedy
Okay.

00:01:59.46
Lane Kennedy
Oh God, no, no, no.

00:02:02.88
Bill
About non-alcoholic beer. Do you remember the commercial?

00:02:05.37
Lane Kennedy
Yes. Oh, God, yes.

00:02:05.98
Bill
Okay. So whatever it was, it was like non-alcoholic, alcoholic, blah, blah, blah. Basically, Mike, if you didn't see it, um okay, so

00:02:12.69
Mike
I did not. I haven't watched Saturday Night Live in fucking 25 years. Mm-hmm.

00:02:16.73
Bill
I didn't either, but Elise posted the shit out of it because it made her mad. She didn't like the fact that they were kind of making fun of the the N.A.

00:02:21.46
Mike
he

00:02:24.62
Bill
drink and, you know, the sober you know movement and all this different stuff, because it turned out being kind of like ah like ah the the guy was actually it was it was alcoholic, non-alcoholic.

00:02:27.10
Mike
All right. Hmm.

00:02:32.94
Bill
Am I getting this right, Lane?

00:02:33.94
Lane Kennedy
Yes, yes, yes.

00:02:34.38
Bill
So it was not alcoholic beer, but it was he did like an opposite thing. So it really had like twice the alcohol or some stupid shit.

00:02:40.02
Lane Kennedy
It was so funny.

00:02:41.11
Bill
So Elise got up in fucking arms about it and they they did a podcast. She did this whole episode. And I'm like, I'm like i'm not joining in on this, but Lane, you joined in on it, right?

00:02:49.50
Lane Kennedy
Yes, I did.

00:02:50.39
Bill
So I was just kind of curious because I didn't know what the deal was. So I started watching it and Elise is going through the whole thing and I didn't see it right away. But Lane, you were giggling the entire fucking time. And Elise, she got, she got, she got so, Elise got so fucking mad.

00:03:01.02
Lane Kennedy
because it was funny.

00:03:05.67
Bill
She's like, why are you laughing?

00:03:07.45
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:03:07.85
Bill
then, then Lane's, Lane's trying to tell the story and trying to go back and forth.

00:03:08.54
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:03:11.67
Bill
You couldn't stop laughing. Am I correct?

00:03:13.88
Lane Kennedy
Correct. Because it was funny. Saturday Night Live, that that they're funny.

00:03:15.54
Mike
Right.

00:03:17.84
Lane Kennedy
They're um skits to make you laugh.

00:03:18.69
Mike
Hmm. That's supposedly right.

00:03:22.04
Lane Kennedy
Right?

00:03:22.19
Mike
That's that's what I've read. That's the intention of the thing.

00:03:23.48
Lane Kennedy
And she took offense to it.

00:03:25.47
Mike
Hmm.

00:03:25.97
Lane Kennedy
She's sensitive, but we know that about, that's why we love her.

00:03:27.45
Mike
Yes. Right.

00:03:28.63
Bill
right

00:03:28.98
Mike
She forgot rule 62. Hmm. Hmm.

00:03:31.00
Bill
yeah

00:03:31.49
Lane Kennedy
Exactly.

00:03:31.70
Bill
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. On that, oh, yeah, she really did Because she was, she was literally, she was up in fucking arms.

00:03:34.27
Mike
Hmm

00:03:36.22
Bill
i I'm watching this shit, and I'm laughing my ass off because I was laughing at you, Lane, because, and then Elise getting mad.

00:03:36.70
Lane Kennedy
Yes. Yes.

00:03:42.34
Bill
It was just so fucking funny because, and then towards the end, she's like, oh, I guess it is kind of funny. It was a little bit funny.

00:03:47.61
Lane Kennedy
She kind of, she came around.

00:03:48.78
Bill
Yeah, she kind of came around, but kind of came around a little bit.

00:03:50.55
Lane Kennedy
She came around. It took some time though. But I think, i don't know, being sober a long time, there's so many things that have changed over the years. It's just kind of like, whatever.

00:04:00.16
Bill
Right.

00:04:00.23
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:04:01.34
Lane Kennedy
Like, whatever.

00:04:01.75
Mike
Right.

00:04:04.41
Bill
Well, yeah, you are.

00:04:04.43
Lane Kennedy
Am I recording? Is this, am I on?

00:04:05.72
Mike
Yes, this is it.

00:04:05.90
Bill
Yeah, we're we're recording.

00:04:06.38
Lane Kennedy
Okay.

00:04:06.64
Mike
This is the fucking podcast.

00:04:06.82
Bill
We're recording.

00:04:07.68
Mike
This is all it is.

00:04:09.30
Lane Kennedy
Are we going?

00:04:10.23
Bill
Yeah, so this is yeah this is this is what we do, and we keep all this shit in.

00:04:10.31
Mike
ha, ha, ha,

00:04:13.63
Bill
So this is what this is what our this is what gets us nominated. So even if it if it sounds fucking terrible, I don't know why people voted for it.

00:04:16.57
Mike
Yeah, this is it.

00:04:16.63
Lane Kennedy
Okay, great.

00:04:20.62
Bill
but

00:04:20.62
Mike
Hmm.

00:04:21.27
Lane Kennedy
No, it's good. It's good.

00:04:22.23
Bill
So um the thing of it is, though, and then do you know do a brief introduction, Oaks.

00:04:22.52
Mike
Hmm.

00:04:26.03
Bill
You just mentioned, obviously, it's a great lead-in, being sober a long time. So just briefly, you know who you are, where you're from, how long you've been sober. Just a brief intro, and then we'll get into into things, okay?

00:04:36.38
Lane Kennedy
Brief intro, I mean, yeah, Lane Kennedy, sober 12-31-96, class of 96, getting right in on the end there.

00:04:38.39
Bill
Just who you are.

00:04:47.89
Lane Kennedy
I live in San Francisco, you know, feel like I've lived three lives. I work predominantly in the wellness space, like you mentioned, I work in DNA and nervous system regulation.

00:05:05.45
Lane Kennedy
i'm um I have a 16-year-old son, which is crazy, and two Irish wolfhounds that keep me busy.

00:05:08.75
Mike
Nice.

00:05:08.76
Bill
ah

00:05:09.21
Mike
That's, yeah. Mm-hmm.

00:05:12.41
Mike
nice

00:05:13.46
Lane Kennedy
ah Yeah.

00:05:13.72
Bill
Nice.

00:05:15.45
Lane Kennedy
Is that a good, quick intro?

00:05:16.69
Mike
that's yeah

00:05:17.17
Bill
that's That's perfect. Yeah. And you know, the the thing of it is, and I was thinking about it going into this. So um Wednesday, between last Wednesday, the 22nd, last Saturday, the 18th, those are mine and Mike's anniversaries.

00:05:28.27
Bill
Both of us hit 16 years each. Okay. So, yeah.

00:05:30.74
Lane Kennedy
okay

00:05:31.61
Bill
So think about this, Mike, this is this kind of, let's put things into perspective here. We've got three years on her combined.

00:05:37.18
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, exactly.

00:05:38.43
Mike
Aha.

00:05:38.97
Bill
Yeah, we got, we got three years.

00:05:39.54
Lane Kennedy
ah Yeah.

00:05:41.37
Bill
Let me repeat that. Everyone. We've got three years on Lane combined. Yeah.

00:05:46.84
Lane Kennedy
Oh, that's pretty good.

00:05:47.10
Bill
But it's, I know, and i I was looking at that kids again, I was looking at some of the stuff and posted this week. I'm like, Jesus Christ. I mean, granted 16 years, you know we're happy and proud and all those sorts of things. We take our sobriety very seriously, even though we, you know, fuck around like crazy on here.

00:06:01.17
Bill
But um it's, it's a lot of time, but you know, it's funny. My, yeah my dad had 29 years. I mean, he was, he was an a a guy and ended up, ah he passed away at actually 29 years, but was in, you know, he got sober in 1981, you know?

00:06:14.91
Lane Kennedy
Wow.

00:06:15.64
Bill
Yeah. And then we've Mike and I, I mean, Mike is still in Cleveland. I got sober out there. We've met. Well, do you think Ray was the one that had the most Mike at 55, whatever that we've known?

00:06:24.92
Mike
Yeah, something like that. I mean, anybody that knew Sister Ignatia probably got everybody beat.

00:06:30.58
Bill
Yeah, you know you know who Sister Ignatia is, right?

00:06:30.71
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. Yes, of course.

00:06:32.66
Bill
Yeah.

00:06:32.79
Mike
Yes.

00:06:32.90
Lane Kennedy
Yes.

00:06:33.10
Bill
Yeah.

00:06:33.18
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:06:33.66
Bill
we We knew a guy that knew him. We also knew another guy. We heard heard his lead, and he turned down Bill Wilson as a sponsor years ago, too, which was fucking hilarious.

00:06:40.47
Lane Kennedy
Oh my God.

00:06:41.02
Mike
Right.

00:06:42.58
Lane Kennedy
That's crazy.

00:06:43.83
Bill
Can you imagine all said and done after the after the fact? The guy wrote hell he wrote the fucking big book and the steps and all this shit, and he's like, yeah, he was a good sponsor for me.

00:06:52.82
Lane Kennedy
He was my sponsor.

00:06:54.32
Mike
He wasn't a good fit.

00:06:54.49
Bill
Yeah, yeah wasn't it wasn't a good fit for me. I didn't think he could help keep me sober.

00:06:58.17
Lane Kennedy
Oh man.

00:06:59.39
Bill
But, okay, so, I mean, obviously we've got we've got a lot to talk about. and You wrote the book. What's the the name of the book you get? I know it, but tell it for everyone so they know.

00:07:06.26
Lane Kennedy
ah Yeah. Sobriety for dummies.

00:07:08.50
Bill
Yeah.

00:07:08.63
Mike
Nice. Mm-hmm.

00:07:09.24
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, it's a Wiley book. ah You know, there's so many of those dummy books.

00:07:13.89
Bill
right.

00:07:14.39
Lane Kennedy
And, you know, they reached out and said, hey, you want to write this book? And I was like, are you this is a joke, right? Like I literally thought that it was like a, you know, shenanigans.

00:07:19.81
Mike
Wait.

00:07:20.76
Bill
ah ah Right.

00:07:24.75
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:07:26.07
Lane Kennedy
But no, it was a real deal.

00:07:27.01
Mike
Yeah.

00:07:27.37
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:07:27.67
Mike
Nice.

00:07:28.41
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:07:28.44
Bill
Yeah, it was you and you and ta tomorrow that wrote it, right?

00:07:30.07
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, me and Tamar, my writing partner, she did all the kind of, God, without Tamar, that book would not have come together.

00:07:36.60
Bill
ah

00:07:36.69
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:07:37.18
Lane Kennedy
Because I'm not good at organizing at all.

00:07:39.23
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:07:39.24
Bill
Right.

00:07:39.54
Lane Kennedy
like so So I would write, like who get it down on the you know paper, and she would like put things together and keep it organized. and It was a lot.

00:07:48.70
Bill
Well, and you know, the the thing that isn't, she's, she's insane in the best way possible when it comes to that. And just being on the the meetings and everything like that, when, when the, the sober curator podcast launched and her talk about doing all these different things.

00:07:53.98
Lane Kennedy
Yes. Yes.

00:08:00.70
Bill
And I just used to always make a joke. I'm like, I'm like, we do nothing like this. All I do is cut the episode in half. of we We don't do any work. I mean, it still it takes me an hour and 15 minutes, maybe an hour and a half, depending on the internet connection, to put an episode together.

00:08:14.99
Bill
But, I mean, I know these some of these people do all this all this editing. and there once you Once you get into it, I can only imagine that because i'm a I'm a relatively particular person, you know, and I'm sure if I did edit, i could you imagine me trying to edit one of our episodes, Mike?

00:08:18.90
Lane Kennedy
No.

00:08:29.75
Bill
I think it...

00:08:32.26
Mike
We'll have a new episode in about eight months.

00:08:34.71
Bill
Oh, yeah. I mean, it it would have been, i don't even know, i don't even know how I would have done it, let alone had the patience to do it.

00:08:41.30
Mike
you

00:08:41.31
Bill
And then I would have tried to get this whole perfectionism shit when I got into it. It was funny, though. Were you on the meeting a couple, not this month, but last month, when Tamar mentioned that we got we got nominated?

00:08:51.87
Bill
And then she's like, she's like oh, yeah. She goes, or are you and she was talking about all the different stuff and whatever and helping out and doing podcasts. And they obviously are helping other people do podcasts. Yeah. She goes, up she goes, or you could just do what Mike and Bill do and just be sober, not mature and just do nothing else and get nominated.

00:09:06.84
Lane Kennedy
Just do nothing.

00:09:06.89
Mike
Right.

00:09:07.36
Lane Kennedy
think

00:09:09.30
Bill
And I said, you know what? I said, I don't know if that were you're trying to be nice or whatever it is, but I'm like, that's exactly what we do or don't do.

00:09:13.85
Mike
Exactly.

00:09:15.40
Bill
However you want to put it, that that's that's exactly what we do.

00:09:18.57
Lane Kennedy
I think that's a good thing. i think, you know, analog, I'm all about analog.

00:09:20.05
Bill
Oh, it's so much more fun.

00:09:22.62
Lane Kennedy
Like let's go old school.

00:09:23.03
Mike
Right.

00:09:24.10
Lane Kennedy
Like all the bells and whistles, it's too much.

00:09:24.18
Mike
is is

00:09:24.43
Bill
Right.

00:09:26.78
Mike
exactly

00:09:26.97
Lane Kennedy
And granted, Tamar, I love her and I love everything that she does because she is so meticulous.

00:09:27.00
Bill
Right.

00:09:32.25
Lane Kennedy
And again, in regards to just doing the book, I needed her to be meticulous because we were working with an editor and and a whole team of people.

00:09:35.32
Mike
right

00:09:39.70
Mike
right

00:09:39.86
Lane Kennedy
And I am not keeping track of those emails. No, I'm the creative.

00:09:42.49
Bill
Right.

00:09:43.79
Lane Kennedy
I'm the writer. Like I'm...

00:09:44.60
Mike
Right.

00:09:45.91
Bill
ah

00:09:45.94
Lane Kennedy
get that

00:09:47.48
Bill
Well, mike Mike refers to himself.

00:09:48.31
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:09:49.44
Bill
You refer to yourself as a talent, right, Mike?

00:09:51.45
Mike
Yeah, exactly.

00:09:51.77
Lane Kennedy
but yeah

00:09:52.61
Mike
that's That's all I am.

00:09:53.46
Bill
here

00:09:53.81
Mike
Right.

00:09:53.94
Lane Kennedy
Well, with that voice, I mean, come on.

00:09:54.13
Mike
I mean, yeah yeah Bill does all this. Yeah, right. Bill does all the the technical stuff and whatever. Yeah. You know, I crack a microphone and do this for an hour and a half a week and then walk away.

00:10:03.64
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:10:04.31
Mike
do.

00:10:04.78
Bill
he's I mean, he's he's got to pick out a reading. And the the thing of it is, is that this, this the the thing that we do here doesn't work without the two of us.

00:10:07.83
Mike
i do

00:10:12.45
Bill
I mean, we've had, there was there's been two so instances where Mike had emergencies where um he did not, was was unable to show up for an episode.

00:10:12.79
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:10:12.80
Mike
Right.

00:10:19.57
Bill
But thankfully we had a We had a guest. If we didn't have a guest, I wouldn't have recorded by myself.

00:10:22.24
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:10:24.69
Bill
I would have waited either the next day or we would have worked around it so the two of us could do it.

00:10:24.98
Mike
Right.

00:10:25.92
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:10:28.22
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:10:29.10
Bill
There's no what no fucking way either one of us are getting on here and trying to talk.

00:10:31.99
Mike
Now.

00:10:32.54
Bill
My my internet went down at one time and he's sitting there trying to fill fill space on his own.

00:10:36.40
Lane Kennedy
Oh, my God.

00:10:37.90
Bill
It was fucking hilarious.

00:10:39.73
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:10:40.88
Bill
Because, you know, well, you know, and the thing of it is, he doesn't seem uncomfortable when he would we're talking like this.

00:10:41.00
Lane Kennedy
It's hard.

00:10:46.02
Bill
But as soon as he knows that he's the only one there, he was just like, well, um let me take a drink. He did. He did that. He's like, let me take a drink of something. Let me get a cold beverage.

00:10:57.34
Bill
He's just going through the stuff. I was down. What was it? to Like eight minutes. And then finally I called in. I called in on my phone and I'm like, should that we almost edited that? And he's like, no, fuck it. Keep that in there. Keep everything in there.

00:11:06.55
Mike
Right. okay

00:11:07.51
Bill
so So we did.

00:11:08.31
Mike
yeah Yeah, I put them on speaker and held it up to my microphone. We did the show that way for a minute.

00:11:11.16
Lane Kennedy
No. Okay.

00:11:12.95
Bill
Yeah.

00:11:13.39
Mike
Yeah.

00:11:13.47
Bill
Until, until my, until my internet came back.

00:11:15.77
Mike
it

00:11:17.30
Bill
All right. Okay. You know what? Lane, stop it.

00:11:20.16
Lane Kennedy
What?

00:11:20.50
Bill
Let's get serious for a minute.

00:11:20.70
Lane Kennedy
What?

00:11:21.42
Bill
We got, we have a guest. You're the guest.

00:11:23.45
Mike
Stop side drinking, Gus.

00:11:23.64
Lane Kennedy
No, but i think there's something I think there's something really great.

00:11:23.93
Bill
We're.

00:11:26.68
Lane Kennedy
Just but hold me.

00:11:27.42
Bill
her Okay.

00:11:27.80
Lane Kennedy
Hold for one second. Because it's hard to have a podcast. it's it is And when you have chemistry with somebody, then it's easy, right?

00:11:35.86
Bill
Right. Oh yeah.

00:11:36.85
Mike
Yeah.

00:11:37.06
Bill
Yeah. Yeah.

00:11:37.50
Lane Kennedy
So the fact that you guys are nominated, that you guys have been doing this for a while, it's like brilliant because it takes... little effort. I mean, there's still effort, right? You still have to put in the time.

00:11:47.57
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:11:47.64
Bill
right

00:11:48.64
Lane Kennedy
So I applaud you for doing it for a while now because it's easy to give up and it's easy to just be like, ah not going to do it anymore. You know, like just like everybody else, right?

00:11:56.82
Mike
Right. Like everybody else.

00:11:59.32
Bill
yeah you know you know why we didn't you know why we didn't stop spite literally yeah yeah

00:12:02.81
Lane Kennedy
Tell me why, why?

00:12:04.63
Mike
Yeah. Spite. It's a huge part of our program.

00:12:05.85
Lane Kennedy
yeah

00:12:06.95
Mike
Yeah.

00:12:07.10
Lane Kennedy
Oh, I see i love It's so good.

00:12:07.51
Mike
Yeah, yeah exactly. You know, tell me I can't stay sober.

00:12:10.29
Lane Kennedy
Uh-huh.

00:12:11.43
Mike
Fuck you.

00:12:12.40
Lane Kennedy
Uh-huh.

00:12:12.64
Mike
Mm

00:12:13.14
Lane Kennedy
Uh-huh.

00:12:13.50
Bill
And we we literally we we brought it up when we hit our ah we hit our form four year mark at the end of February. And we brought it up again.

00:12:18.28
Mike
hmm.

00:12:18.62
Bill
I looked up the emails from the guy, whatever. Some fucking jag off um sent us this email and was trying to help us build our audience and blah, blah, blah. And I go in and basically saying, you know, we can get I can find you guests and blah, blah, blah.

00:12:25.82
Lane Kennedy
Oh God.

00:12:30.04
Bill
And this and that in his his tagline, his hook, supposedly his hook is that 90 percent of all podcasts fail in the first year. And we're like, really?

00:12:41.56
Bill
So and that's as I listen, I'm watching this YouTube video.

00:12:41.69
Lane Kennedy
No.

00:12:41.69
Mike
a

00:12:44.12
Bill
And as soon as he said that, I'm like, oh, really? I'm like, fuck you. We do. So I get on again on the episode.

00:12:47.26
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:12:48.68
Bill
We're like, we're like four months into it it at this point. You know, at the time we started, we got that.

00:12:51.42
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:12:53.37
Bill
And I told Mike, I'm like, we I don't care what we do. We can we can limp to the finish line, but we need to get we we're getting a fucking year.

00:12:58.14
Mike
Yeah.

00:13:00.36
Bill
and He's like, well, hell yeah, we're getting a Yeah.

00:13:02.23
Mike
Yeah. Right.

00:13:03.03
Bill
So that's the that's one of the reasons. And then on top of that, everyone takes breaks. Everyone does hiatuses and vacations and whatever we've had.

00:13:08.73
Mike
hu

00:13:08.97
Lane Kennedy
right

00:13:10.03
Bill
We've had two instances. Again, Mike had two emergencies, but we still put out episodes that week. We had one. um What was that back in beginning of December? um the podcast just wouldn't process and it wasn't on our end it was our software so what i what i did was i just i i put up clips from old episodes that week but we let everyone know we're like you know we're going release two episodes on saturday new episode and the one from this week so you're going to get both but we can't where it's stuck i couldn't i couldn't even it didn't even like free itself up until like fucking wednesday or something like that you know So, but that's the only, the only two times we don't take breaks.

00:13:22.46
Mike
right

00:13:44.64
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:13:47.33
Bill
Mike's been in Mexico. Our mom died.

00:13:48.58
Mike
Yep.

00:13:49.77
Bill
um I don't know if you know, i had I had a fucking heart attack back in October.

00:13:51.24
Mike
Yeah.

00:13:53.55
Bill
Yeah.

00:13:53.82
Lane Kennedy
Oh my God.

00:13:53.90
Mike
Yeah.

00:13:54.89
Bill
And it's, so it was, it was mild.

00:13:55.13
Lane Kennedy
Life happens.

00:13:56.18
Mike
Yeah.

00:13:57.27
Bill
It was mild.

00:13:58.00
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:13:59.67
Bill
It just, you know, okay.

00:13:59.76
Lane Kennedy
How do you have a mild heart attack? Are you kidding me?

00:14:01.37
Mike
yeah

00:14:02.24
Bill
So real quick, and I don't want to take up, who we had a whole episode about it.

00:14:03.26
Mike
fantastic

00:14:05.44
Bill
Go back and look at, you know, who Fred Sanford is?

00:14:05.82
Lane Kennedy
Okay.

00:14:08.66
Lane Kennedy
um No, I can't say yes to that.

00:14:10.05
Bill
Sam. Okay. Somebody is, nobody's listened to the episode. Sit, look up Sanford and son, look up Fred Sanford.

00:14:15.36
Lane Kennedy
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:14:15.46
Bill
And then, yeah.

00:14:16.18
Lane Kennedy
Okay, now I know.

00:14:16.59
Mike
Yeah.

00:14:16.92
Bill
Yeah.

00:14:16.98
Lane Kennedy
Okay.

00:14:17.08
Bill
So scroll back. And if you find, if you see the picture of Fred Sanford, that's a heart attack episode. Cause of course he was always saying it was the big one. He was coming, you know? So Mike, Mike does the pictures for the episodes.

00:14:24.50
Lane Kennedy
Got it.

00:14:26.99
Bill
Yeah.

00:14:27.29
Mike
Yeah.

00:14:27.77
Bill
um But the the a mild heart attack is when you're when you've got severe blockage, but your your arteries don't shut down. If they shut down, you die. okay That's a major heart attack.

00:14:35.91
Lane Kennedy
Wow.

00:14:37.51
Bill
So it was the the one that they called the Widowmaker. That was the main one. That was the the right, I think, whatever it was.

00:14:41.05
Lane Kennedy
Yep.

00:14:43.69
Bill
so that one was 90 blocked um the other one was 80 and the thing of it is i i eat well i exercise i still it ish but still eating well whatever it was all hereditary and it was my fault for not for not keeping on top of it so um you know because i've had we've had three the males on on my side of the family don't live long they die in their 60s and i'm 57 You know, so, and I was stupid not to do that, but that's, that's what a mild heart attack is.

00:14:45.78
Lane Kennedy
Jesus.

00:15:10.81
Lane Kennedy
Okay.

00:15:14.42
Bill
I didn't know that either, but if it, yeah, if it, if it, if it shuts down, I would have been dead, you know?

00:15:16.23
Lane Kennedy
God.

00:15:20.26
Bill
So had I waited any longer and, you know, ignored the symptoms that, you know, that were, you know, fuck crazy ah for me at that last day, but yeah, had it.

00:15:22.05
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:15:28.13
Bill
Yeah. So what we

00:15:29.37
Lane Kennedy
So if you were one of my clients, i would have had i would have not you would have been taking care of your shit for sure because I could see that in the DNA 100,000%. Yeah. Okay. Sure. Great.

00:15:39.42
Bill
Okay, so we're we're gonna we we're definitely going to get into that because that's interesting. Absolutely interesting. But first of all, so in let's enough of my heart attack, enough of whatever the fuck it is we're we've been talking about for 15 minutes.

00:15:49.66
Bill
But um we want to hear your story, but we have a little bit different way of telling stories.

00:15:54.17
Lane Kennedy
okay

00:15:54.86
Bill
And Mike's going to fill you in, okay? So go ahead, Mike.

00:15:57.21
Lane Kennedy
great

00:15:58.04
Mike
Right. So ah basically, we know how to get fucked up. We know how to fuck up our lives and fuck up the lives of everyone around us. We know how to do that. I know how to get loaded.

00:16:07.38
Bill
but

00:16:07.39
Mike
can sit here for 14 hours and tell you how to get loaded in all kinds of different ways.

00:16:10.58
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:16:11.84
Mike
used to get loaded in your neighborhood. um So we don't we we hate drunkologs is basically it.

00:16:14.81
Bill
and

00:16:18.08
Mike
um We want to know your story, a little qualification, all that good stuff. But again, drunkologs suck. Tell us. We're more interested in the solution.

00:16:28.40
Mike
That's what we want to hear about. So Lane, take it away.

00:16:32.44
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, thanks, Mike. i I'm not into drunk-alongs either. I mean, i got sober in the 90s, right?

00:16:37.11
Bill
Good.

00:16:38.81
Lane Kennedy
I drank in the 90s.

00:16:38.84
Mike
Right.

00:16:40.17
Lane Kennedy
So think about that for a moment, you know, like that was a good time.

00:16:42.62
Bill
Right.

00:16:44.37
Lane Kennedy
ah

00:16:44.38
Bill
Did you drink Zima?

00:16:45.98
Lane Kennedy
God, no.

00:16:46.90
Mike
Good girl.

00:16:47.64
Bill
I was, i was going to fucking shame you if you did so good.

00:16:51.51
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:16:51.86
Bill
That's good. Okay, good.

00:16:52.25
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. Zima. But I mean, the nineties were like, that was, it was glamorous. All the high fashion models were happening. All the music was so good. And I lived in Hollywood.

00:17:04.97
Lane Kennedy
I was a part of it all. So it was normalized is what I'm trying to say. Like my friends, everybody around me was doing what I was doing.

00:17:09.22
Bill
right

00:17:12.12
Lane Kennedy
So ah I didn't plan on getting sober. Like that was not my, like, oh yeah, that's my path. i'm going to clean myself up. No, that wasn't it at all. um My girlfriend at the time, who was a musician and kind of famous, I guess.

00:17:31.14
Lane Kennedy
And she, she like stopped drinking. I was like, what are you doing? Like, what, what, you know, like, why what do you mean?

00:17:38.04
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:17:38.14
Bill
yeah

00:17:40.22
Lane Kennedy
And I just, you know, put put down the drink. Like I literally, my last glass, you know, was like a half of white wine. And mind you, I don't like my white wine.

00:17:52.79
Lane Kennedy
ah And i think that's why I never looked back. It was just kind of this weird... opportunity It was a window that I just kind of jumped through. And from that day to this, I still have not picked up a drink or, you know, had any kind of desire to drink.

00:18:07.10
Lane Kennedy
I just, it's been removed from me, which is not typical, not ordinary. That's just my story.

00:18:12.13
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:18:13.16
Bill
Right.

00:18:13.88
Lane Kennedy
ah But i I really jumped into recovery with both feet. you know She was always on the road and I had a lot of time on my hand. I was in the fashion industry at that time. So you know being in Hollywood with celebrities, and it it was a lot.

00:18:32.50
Lane Kennedy
And so for me, jumping into program of recovery was like what made sense because I needed support.

00:18:43.70
Lane Kennedy
I lived in the Hollywood Hills and I was isolated and alone and there happened to be a like rock and roll meeting like 100 feet from my house.

00:18:53.72
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:18:56.55
Lane Kennedy
you know It was like, what is this? And and I would end up in there um on Saturday mornings you know and everybody's getting you know coffee and tea and we're reading a little little ah magazine and ah You know, we've got big time musicians in there and I'm like, yeah, this these are my people, you know, like I fit in immediately. So I didn't have any of that, like what's happening, what's going on. This is not making sense to me.

00:19:25.08
Lane Kennedy
ah And, you know, I was told to just be quiet and, ah you know, we don't want anything that you have to say and and just follow the directions.

00:19:29.53
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:19:33.67
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right? Mm-hmm.

00:19:35.80
Lane Kennedy
And I didn't know how to follow directions. at all I could barely clean out my cat box.

00:19:40.44
Mike
right

00:19:42.35
Lane Kennedy
So, you know, um i just I just showed up and, you know, people were so, like I look back at that time and people were so kind to me and my world had gotten so small, you know, like I had a drug dealer, i had a girlfriend and then she had a bunch of fans, right?

00:19:42.81
Mike
just

00:20:01.98
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:20:02.04
Lane Kennedy
So it was like, and I had a housekeeper. So it was like, when people welcomed me and then like wanted to say hi and here's a cup of coffee, I was like, oh, okay, great.

00:20:14.30
Lane Kennedy
And then when they said keep coming back, I was like, yeah, okay, I'm definitely coming back here.

00:20:17.09
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:20:19.90
Lane Kennedy
You know, so ah it's been, again, you know, like... 29 years is a long time of of doing this kind of life.

00:20:27.24
Bill
Right.

00:20:29.98
Lane Kennedy
it it is ah It's a lifetime. And it's never I've never done it perfectly. I've been really, really messy. You know, the first five years, was I was all over the place.

00:20:40.87
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:20:40.90
Lane Kennedy
um And, you know, 9-11 hit. And when 9-11 hit, I like packed my bags and moved over to Bangkok because I was like, I can't i can't take it. And when I landed in Bangkok...

00:20:53.78
Lane Kennedy
yeah You know, this is how this, I don't know.

00:21:01.88
Lane Kennedy
the universe has been so generous and so open for me. I found a place ah that was like 50, again, 50 yards from a meeting place, you know, my house where I started to live.

00:21:13.86
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:21:15.07
Lane Kennedy
You know, there was ah there was a telephone booth and a place for rent, ah a big watt, which is a temple and the meeting house.

00:21:27.99
Lane Kennedy
And so i was like, okay, I guess this is where I'm going to live.

00:21:33.37
Bill
yeah

00:21:33.59
Lane Kennedy
You know, it's just like, that's kind of my life has been a series of these events of just showing up at the right time at the right place and being open-minded.

00:21:45.49
Lane Kennedy
It's

00:21:46.45
Mike
Yeah.

00:21:46.77
Bill
Right.

00:21:47.96
Mike
Yeah, that's it.

00:21:48.22
Bill
Yeah. And I mean, yeah, Micah, you spent you spent a little bit of time in Hollywood, didn't you?

00:21:52.28
Mike
Oh, yeah.

00:21:52.51
Bill
Yeah.

00:21:52.92
Mike
Yeah. Late 80s. Yes.

00:21:55.96
Bill
yeah

00:21:56.23
Lane Kennedy
messy. It's messy.

00:21:58.78
Mike
Oh, get her her her it was very messy. Spent some time in San Francisco, too. That was pretty goddamn messy.

00:22:04.86
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:22:05.24
Mike
Mm hmm. Yeah.

00:22:05.94
Mike
Yeah.

00:22:07.70
Lane Kennedy
The 80s in San Francisco were so messy. Oh, God.

00:22:10.71
Mike
okay yeah It was, but it like you said, it was a lot of fun.

00:22:12.58
Lane Kennedy
Deadly is what it was.

00:22:17.06
Mike
Yeah.

00:22:17.18
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:22:17.58
Mike
You know, yeah. I was playing rock and roll and all that good stuff. And yeah, you know, playing the Mab and on Broadway and all that shit.

00:22:23.57
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:22:23.66
Mike
And fun, fun.

00:22:26.55
Lane Kennedy
I think about now, it's so different now for the kids, right?

00:22:29.78
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:22:29.94
Lane Kennedy
and the the I sound so old. Like this the the younger generation, it's like is there's there's no comparison.

00:22:37.54
Mike
Right.

00:22:37.55
Bill
Right.

00:22:38.46
Lane Kennedy
so i just It kind of bums me out. Right.

00:22:40.92
Mike
Yeah, I know.

00:22:41.55
Bill
Right.

00:22:43.28
Mike
And there were no cameras anywhere unless we wanted them to, and you had to go get the film developed.

00:22:43.45
Bill
ah

00:22:47.86
Lane Kennedy
Right.

00:22:49.10
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:22:49.53
Bill
right

00:22:49.56
Lane Kennedy
Right. I have film oh of me mid swing, you know, like hitting somebody.

00:22:56.94
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:22:57.62
Lane Kennedy
And I, it it's like, this, this was kind of my come to moment of like, what just happened? You know, that like, yeah, it's frightening.

00:23:06.26
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:23:07.59
Bill
Well, and that's the thing, too. I mean, I didn't get i mean, Facebook was around and MySpace was around before I got sober, but I didn't get on Facebook until like I was what, eight or nine months, nine months sober.

00:23:18.07
Bill
So, yeah, February of whatever year, February of 2011 is when i got on on Facebook. So, I mean, yeah, this is kind of nice because, you know, I hear so many people that have been sober for a bit and then they're like, yeah, all these all these things pop up, these memories pop up and they're like, oh, that's what I was fucking drunk or that's what I was with that that fucking loser whatever, you know, whether it's a man or a woman, whatever the deal is, you know, and I have not.

00:23:41.29
Bill
None of that's documented, you know, for me. And i mean, with the the things that come up now, thankfully, that even the people, because there's been a lot of death, I mean, since I've been sober, family members, and obviously we know friends and all those sort of things, countless number of people, I can't even imagine.

00:23:44.52
Lane Kennedy
Right.

00:23:44.54
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:23:52.04
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:23:57.72
Bill
Well, I mean, you've been sober twice as long, over twice as long as us or twice as long as us, you know, so the number of people that you know, or that you know on the outskirts, that friends of friends that have died, You know, so, I mean, yeah, I get that.

00:24:06.83
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:24:09.21
Bill
You know, I get family members like, yeah yeah, yeah, gosh, they're not around anymore. Or a good buddy of ours we were talking about, Mike and I were talking about when I was just out there last weekend, you know, around our anniversary time, our our buddy Pat had it passed away a couple years ago.

00:24:17.63
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:24:21.39
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:24:21.68
Bill
Has it been two years, three years now, Mike?

00:24:23.03
Mike
Yeah, couple years.

00:24:24.50
Bill
Yeah, somewhere in that in that range. And, you know, I mean, he had always, you know, he was he had a few years on us, two, three years on us. And, you know, he'd always compliment us. he was a good He was a good role model, a good mentor and all that sort of stuff.

00:24:35.02
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:24:35.50
Bill
And, you know, so you see these comments on Facebook and it's just kind of like a deep breath moment.

00:24:35.62
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:24:39.35
Bill
Just like, ah you know, like a sigh, you know.

00:24:40.31
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:24:41.75
Bill
But I don't have to look back and I don't have to deal with regrets in my Facebook memories. And any other, you know, I mean, thankfully, the regrets that I had, you know, we had a we've got a program, you know, that deals with that.

00:24:48.01
Lane Kennedy
Oh God.

00:24:48.54
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:24:53.82
Bill
And, you know, you still get yeah you could easily get yourself kind of drawn into those things again, looking back at whatever. But, you know, Mike, can I talk about that all the time on here?

00:25:02.91
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:25:03.00
Bill
You call it dangerous, right, Mike?

00:25:04.82
Mike
Yeah. Oh, absolutely.

00:25:05.67
Bill
Yeah.

00:25:06.22
Mike
Yeah. Well, it's, you know, living in the past, man, dwelling on it. I believe I read somewhere.

00:25:09.29
Bill
Right.

00:25:10.94
Mike
We're not supposed to do that.

00:25:12.25
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, no. It's not good to do that. Mm-hmm.

00:25:15.26
Mike
No, it is not right.

00:25:15.42
Bill
Right.

00:25:16.58
Mike
Live in the now, man. Live in the now.

00:25:21.69
Bill
So you, I mean, you just kind of, as you, as you've just put it lane, I mean, you've, you felt like there was just kind of these moments where you just did, we're in the right place at the right time. But I mean, do you also think, and and I mean, we talk about the same thing that when you're, when you're doing the right things and hanging out with the right people and walking the right path, it's amazing.

00:25:38.42
Bill
You know, when a lot of these things end up in your path, these positive things, right? I mean, do you agree?

00:25:42.42
Lane Kennedy
Yes, a thousand percent.

00:25:42.85
Bill
Right.

00:25:44.54
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:25:45.21
Lane Kennedy
Everything, everything good in my life is exactly because of that.

00:25:48.15
Bill
Right.

00:25:48.20
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:25:50.94
Lane Kennedy
Because I'm connected to the principles of a program that I believe in.

00:25:53.85
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:25:55.67
Bill
Right.

00:25:56.25
Lane Kennedy
Because it's, it's saved my life.

00:25:58.26
Mike
Absolutely. Right.

00:25:59.29
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:25:59.37
Mike
and And like you said, you know, we're open and and we we make ourselves available. and And hey, imagine that good things come in and we're doing and we're doing good things.

00:26:06.23
Bill
yeah

00:26:06.58
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:26:07.81
Mike
Right. We're we're doing the next right thing and and all that.

00:26:08.18
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:26:10.93
Mike
And right. We're not we're not negatively impacting the universe anymore much. And so, right. You got to qualify it. um And right. You know, and so we're doing good things. We're putting this positive stuff out. And hey, guess when it comes back to us.

00:26:26.16
Bill
Right.

00:26:27.00
Lane Kennedy
But there are times, I don't know, i think there's like dips in sobriety or like i think of them, well, I can look at them at now as decades.

00:26:32.76
Mike
Oh, sure. Mm-hmm.

00:26:33.40
Bill
Oh God. Yeah. Yeah.

00:26:37.08
Lane Kennedy
You know, the first the first first decade was, you know, like learning how to live, right?

00:26:38.54
Bill
Right.

00:26:39.56
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:26:40.15
Bill
okay

00:26:42.78
Bill
right

00:26:43.23
Lane Kennedy
And then the second decade was like, okay, I'm now living. And then this third decade is is kind of like, oh, I have to deal with what I didn't deal with before. Like it's a different playground.

00:26:57.08
Mike
Right.

00:26:57.26
Lane Kennedy
It's completely unrecognizable because now I'm looking at um you know restitution or retribution around things that I did while I was not drinking.

00:26:57.57
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:27:06.68
Lane Kennedy
Hello?

00:27:06.78
Mike
oh

00:27:07.06
Bill
Oh, sure. Yeah. Right.

00:27:08.63
Lane Kennedy
that ah That can be some fucked up stuff right there.

00:27:11.00
Mike
Yeah, i I can imagine.

00:27:11.10
Bill
Right.

00:27:13.84
Lane Kennedy
that's like That's like next level like Zen mastery like Jedi stuff that you have to wrap your head around. And I think this is where people start to go out and drink again because life gets real.

00:27:20.37
Mike
Sure.

00:27:23.91
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:27:28.12
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:27:28.89
Bill
So in those circumstances, you think if you if you're dealing with, and I'm not asking for obviously examples, it's none of our none of our business, but so if you're dealing with something like that, that you had to like wreckage of your of your present or, you know, that necessarily, yeah, wreck it.

00:27:41.30
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. So the sober life. Yeah. Wreckage of the sober life.

00:27:44.18
Bill
So do you think those things happened because you got you got lazy, you forgot about it, it popped up, what you didn't know, or or how do those things happen, do you think?

00:27:53.27
Mike
Or it's just the fact that you continue to grow and you start realizing, oh, shit, I've been, you know, hanging on to this old stuff and i'm and I'm still acting, you know, in ways that I shouldn't be acting.

00:28:01.59
Bill
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah

00:28:05.87
Mike
You're learning more. And as you're growing, you're learning that, oh, damn, this thing I thought was okay kind of isn't.

00:28:07.16
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:28:12.38
Lane Kennedy
her

00:28:12.73
Bill
yeah.

00:28:13.46
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, I think it's a little bit of both.

00:28:15.06
Mike
Okay. Okay.

00:28:15.26
Bill
Okay.

00:28:15.86
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, I think there's been... like the longer we live, like just age wise, right? we We start to realize, oh, I don't like the way that I'm acting.

00:28:26.49
Lane Kennedy
You know, I'm 40 years old and I'm like doing this.

00:28:26.64
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:28:26.69
Bill
Right.

00:28:29.21
Lane Kennedy
That's not cool. Or I'm, you know, 50 years old. Like whatever age it is, right? It's the same thing I think in recovery where it's like, oh, I'm now 15 years sober and I'm still doing this, like this weird dating thing or I'm being a stalker or, ah you know, like

00:28:44.77
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:28:44.89
Bill
yeah

00:28:48.99
Mike
Yeah.

00:28:49.26
Lane Kennedy
i'm I'm binging on on food. like You know what I mean?

00:28:51.79
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:28:52.38
Lane Kennedy
Like addiction is going to pop up however it's going to pop up.

00:28:54.30
Mike
Sure. Mm-hmm.

00:28:55.65
Bill
Right.

00:28:56.34
Lane Kennedy
And so I'm either going to take care of it or I'm just going to say, nah, I'll deal with it later. Or I don't even, you know, like think about it.

00:29:04.47
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:29:04.92
Lane Kennedy
And it piles up.

00:29:06.81
Mike
Right.

00:29:08.06
Bill
Well, you know, yeah and you mentioned something that we've talked about it and I came to a realization ah probably, I don't know, six, seven, eight years ago, somewhere in that range. It certainly wasn't, you know, in the last couple of years, but it certainly wasn't to begin with.

00:29:21.59
Bill
When, before I got sober, I had, I had two modes when it came to relationships. I was either, you know, kind of like, okay, this person's cool. They're a friend or I i love you. And why are you, you know, don't, don't ever leave me type of thing, you know?

00:29:33.20
Bill
Yeah. I mean, I, I was, I, I fell and I fell.

00:29:34.00
Mike
Ha ha ha ha ha.

00:29:36.44
Lane Kennedy
Wow.

00:29:37.40
Bill
no I seriously, I was, and I i never realized that until after I got sober, you know, so was really easy. I didn't have a lot of long-term relationships with the ones that I did, you know, why like my, my marriages, especially, you know, and again, I was drinking, my head wasn't right and all those sorts of things. Um, I didn't know how to deal with that, you know, with that rejection, you know? And then, and it was, I don't know, probably, you know, seven, eight years ago, whatever it was, have no idea how I came across it or probably read something or heard something, whatever it was.

00:30:04.41
Bill
But I realized that, um, and I talked about plenty on here. I can, I can, and I do, I love on different levels, you know, so I learned that I can love people without being in love.

00:30:12.21
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:30:14.56
Bill
I can love somebody without, you know, again, going, I don't have to be a 10. I can be, can be a seven or eight with somebody, or I could be a four or five, You know, I can I love Mike differently than I would love my kids.

00:30:23.47
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:30:26.20
Bill
You know, there's different levels. There's family members. There's intimate love. You know, but I can I can love somebody of the opposite sex or somebody in an intimate side of things. But I don't necessarily want to be with them forever. And I, you know, I i haven't fallen in love with them.

00:30:40.82
Bill
And, you know, part of that's been for me, it's been fucking amazing. You know, it's not always amazing for the people you're in relationships with, you know, because I told people they're like this, this one in particular, it was a bad, she was fucking nuts.

00:30:48.92
Mike
as as

00:30:55.70
Bill
But man, she, I'm sorry, I'm going to be rude here for a minute because, you know, it's you lane and we're, we're just talking here.

00:30:59.86
Lane Kennedy
Okay. Yeah, let's go.

00:31:00.98
Bill
She fucked like a beast. Okay. And I mean, unbelievable.

00:31:04.85
Mike
So Blackie Lawless, like two people got that joke, but all right, go ahead.

00:31:07.03
Lane Kennedy
Oh my God.

00:31:09.72
Bill
She, um, and literally, um, we, we both knew we were bad for each other, but, um, we met, we met literally, she was, she had just gotten sober, been four or five months sober and she was looking for friends.

00:31:20.18
Bill
We met on a dating app.

00:31:21.05
Lane Kennedy
Friends.

00:31:21.88
Bill
We honest to God, to begin with, it was a year before we had sex.

00:31:21.96
Mike
Mm. Mm. Mm.

00:31:25.28
Bill
We were just friends because she was looking for a sober friends.

00:31:26.30
Lane Kennedy
Oh my God.

00:31:27.84
Bill
She wanted, it was really important for her to stay sober and she didn't want to fuck it up. I'm like, it's fine. I'm cool. But then when we did start having sex, it was just fucking wild. But then then she'd go nuts on me.

00:31:35.48
Lane Kennedy
Game on. Yeah.

00:31:37.54
Bill
And, you know, I just to begin with, she was cool. But I'm like, I don't know. It's just whatever wasn't there. You know, she wasn't like my lifelong type of whatever.

00:31:43.71
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:31:45.62
Bill
So almost by clockwork every two, three months. And Mike knows all this shit because every two, three months, I'm like, she's she fucking fucking nuts on me again. So, you know, she's going away. And then we get back together just just for the sex.

00:31:57.22
Bill
And then we hang out a little bit. The one time she's like, cause I'm like, I can't, I can't hang out with you anymore. I'm like, I'm i'm done. Cause you go fucking nuts on me.

00:32:03.55
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:32:04.70
Bill
It's like, I like clockwork. And then it was like a week or two later, she sends me a text message.

00:32:08.29
Lane Kennedy
Uh-huh.

00:32:09.90
Bill
I'm fucking working too. And she's getting ice two, three texts. I gotta call me. listenss ah goodbye I'm like, Jesus Christ, I'm fucking working. She's like, I've got a solution. I'm like, okay. She goes, let's just get together and fuck every once in a while.

00:32:22.58
Bill
We're fine. I'm like, are you sure you could deal with that?

00:32:26.09
Lane Kennedy
Uh-huh.

00:32:26.47
Bill
I'm like, I can. i kid you. She's like, oh, absolutely. It was so fucking weird. it was We did it twice. And I'm like, this is just too fucking weird, you know. um But you get people that are like, you know why don't you want to be with me forever?

00:32:39.26
Bill
I'm like, I don't know, you know. And that's the honest to God answer. I don't know why I don't have that full feeling, but I'm not going to settle anymore. I'm not going to settle for For a half a friendship, I'm not going to settle for half a relationship.

00:32:51.03
Bill
If I, if God forbid, if I had a family member that was fucking me over, I'm not dealing with you. If I've got an individual that's causing me pain and stress, I don't want to be around you. Mike and I talk about that endlessly.

00:33:01.50
Bill
Right, Mike? I mean, you know, and, you know, he's like, he goes, I don't know.

00:33:02.00
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:33:02.46
Mike
yeah

00:33:04.46
Bill
What is it? Burn calories. Right, Mike?

00:33:06.14
Mike
Yep. I have a very limited amount these days. I'm getting fucking old. I don't have the time or the energy for any of it.

00:33:14.62
Bill
here Yeah, but it's, ah I don't know, it's it's nice to have that flexibility, but, you know, every once in a while we've talked about this too, I'd i'd love to just hand somebody, a you know, a fucking big book and say, just read the first 164, you'll understand where I'm coming from, then let's get together and let's figure out how we can coexist.

00:33:32.50
Bill
You know, if we could do that, would that be great, right?

00:33:32.84
Lane Kennedy
man. Are you married to a ah sober person?

00:33:38.90
Bill
Am I? I'm not married. I'm not married.

00:33:39.90
Lane Kennedy
You're not married? Are you, Mike?

00:33:40.67
Bill
Nope.

00:33:40.94
Lane Kennedy
Are you married?

00:33:41.35
Mike
No.

00:33:41.88
Lane Kennedy
No?

00:33:41.93
Mike
No, no.

00:33:42.20
Lane Kennedy
Okay.

00:33:42.91
Mike
Yeah. Uh-huh.

00:33:43.54
Lane Kennedy
So I'm married to a non-sober. sober person and the

00:33:47.80
Bill
Okay.

00:33:52.02
Lane Kennedy
like I get you i get exactly what you're talking about right like as you were talking about this I was thinking about when I was five years sober there was somebody who I was we were

00:33:55.22
Bill
hey

00:34:02.49
Lane Kennedy
exactly this kind of story that you just shared, right?

00:34:04.50
Mike
ahha

00:34:05.37
Lane Kennedy
And I turned out to be a stalker. I mean, I would go and stalk him. And I told my mentor at the time, I said, you know, I have this problem. And she's like, what are you doing? I said, I'm, you know, at his house at two o'clock in the morning stalking him.

00:34:19.00
Lane Kennedy
And she said, you know, you're going to have to stop doing this and you're probably going to have to, you know, make amends for this.

00:34:22.57
Mike
Right.

00:34:24.90
Lane Kennedy
And I was like, oh God, no. But I share this because you get exactly what I'm talking about, right?

00:34:31.48
Bill
Oh, yeah, yeah yeah

00:34:31.52
Mike
Right.

00:34:33.14
Lane Kennedy
If I tell this to anybody like that is not an alcoholic, they they look at me like I'm crazy.

00:34:36.80
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:34:37.22
Bill
yeah. Right.

00:34:39.48
Mike
Right.

00:34:39.73
Bill
Yeah.

00:34:39.86
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:34:40.09
Lane Kennedy
right Like it's like different language. Like we have, i don't know, a language that we get.

00:34:45.53
Mike
yeah who we hope Yeah, we understand each other. Yeah, we're we're wired in a different way than, we well, you know, we call them normies.

00:34:48.50
Lane Kennedy
Yes.

00:34:48.76
Bill
Right.

00:34:49.75
Lane Kennedy
Yes. yes

00:34:53.26
Mike
Right, yeah.

00:34:53.43
Lane Kennedy
Yes. Yeah. yeah It's...

00:34:55.50
Mike
And clearly, you know, the the principles and the and all of that would help them and make them better people, but they don't need it like we do.

00:35:04.47
Bill
Right.

00:35:04.50
Lane Kennedy
Right? Yeah. I definitely need the principles.

00:35:08.28
Mike
Yes, exactly.

00:35:08.73
Bill
Oh, yeah.

00:35:09.49
Mike
Yeah.

00:35:10.36
Bill
there was a There was a meeting that we were at. So but Mike and i yeah we got sober in Cleveland, and we were at this sober living facility called the Keating Center. And we, again, talk about it a lot, but we were probably, i don't know, maybe 60 days, probably 45 to 60 days sober.

00:35:24.92
Bill
And there's this this meeting at the at the sober living facility.

00:35:24.93
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:35:28.64
Bill
There's a guy up at the at the podium telling his story, and I think he was probably five or six years sober. He had some time, but not like extreme time. But he's telling this story. and He's like, hey, he goes, I got loaded or I was fucked up at whatever.

00:35:39.80
Bill
He goes, I drove. And then, you know, I i missed a corner and then I ended up in, you know, with my car in somebody's living room. And then he then he goes on with his story and then he stops and he goes, he goes, going to back up for a minute.

00:35:45.90
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. Yeah.

00:35:50.70
Bill
He goes, everyone heard me, right? You know, he goes, raise your hand if you heard me here or something like that. You know, that I ended up in somebody's living room. We're like, yeah yeah, we heard you. And he goes, he goes, these rooms are the only place where I could tell that story.

00:35:57.93
Mike
Yeah.

00:36:01.30
Bill
And nobody blinks an eye. They're like, well, of course, of course you drank, you got fucking loaded.

00:36:02.87
Mike
Right. Yeah, right.

00:36:04.02
Lane Kennedy
yeah

00:36:05.62
Bill
You ran off the road and we're in somebody's living room. well Why wouldn't you be, you know?

00:36:08.69
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, it makes sense.

00:36:08.71
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:36:10.17
Bill
Yeah, it does.

00:36:10.17
Mike
Yes. Mm-hmm.

00:36:10.87
Lane Kennedy
ah

00:36:11.29
Bill
I mean, but like you said, you can't, you can't walk into, you know, a school board meeting and, you know, and tell that story or a PTA meeting and be like, oh yeah, you, was so fucked up. Me and this chick, you know, I wrote, drove right into somebody's fucking living room.

00:36:20.92
Mike
he

00:36:21.40
Lane Kennedy
No.

00:36:24.80
Bill
It was a hoot. And they're just, they'd be looking at you like, who the fuck are you?

00:36:28.54
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, no, it's not going to go over well.

00:36:28.73
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:36:30.68
Bill
No, they'd be, they'd be fucking horrified. So, so this, this kind of started lane with you talking about having to, you know, obviously make, make amends in, in sobriety.

00:36:33.03
Lane Kennedy
Yes.

00:36:33.14
Mike
Exactly.

00:36:39.92
Bill
So were you talking simply about the, the stalking and were you like holding a boom box in the rain, anything like that?

00:36:45.22
Lane Kennedy
Oh, God.

00:36:45.66
Bill
ah

00:36:46.87
Lane Kennedy
I mean, it it you know, when you meet somebody that you physically, sexually, you know, our it it is a chemical thing.

00:36:51.77
Bill
Right.

00:36:54.31
Mike
Chemically. Yes, exactly.

00:36:56.92
Lane Kennedy
Exactly.

00:36:57.05
Bill
Right.

00:36:57.36
Lane Kennedy
Thank you, Mike.

00:36:58.01
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:36:58.24
Lane Kennedy
Not everybody has that, right? Not everybody.

00:36:59.86
Mike
Right.

00:37:00.28
Bill
Right.

00:37:00.64
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. it's like animalistic. It's like beast mode comes out.

00:37:04.95
Mike
Mm

00:37:05.32
Bill
Right?

00:37:05.40
Lane Kennedy
Right. So I had that with this drummer and he, and it was like, i i didn't even know how to handle myself.

00:37:10.42
Bill
a

00:37:15.09
Lane Kennedy
I was like, what is happening to me? So I didn't, I didn't show up with a boom box that I did not, but I did show up several times and just like,

00:37:17.72
Bill
yeah

00:37:23.99
Lane Kennedy
Like, i it's embarrassing.

00:37:25.66
Bill
yeah

00:37:25.72
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:37:26.18
Lane Kennedy
Like, what? Yeah. And then, and then you know he he and he kept you know, he said, fine, he was like, Lane, we we can't do this anymore. Like, it's not good for me.

00:37:34.36
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:37:35.74
Lane Kennedy
It's not. And he said that, you know, here he is. He was like 10 years sober. And at the time, I think I was like, I was under five. So, you know, he had the the wherewithal.

00:37:41.42
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:37:41.54
Bill
Right.

00:37:44.14
Lane Kennedy
He had the smarts, the wits. And he's like, we have to stop. Like, this is not good.

00:37:47.90
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:37:48.90
Lane Kennedy
And and i here I am like, no, I just want more, right? Like,

00:37:53.02
Mike
yeah

00:37:53.52
Bill
Right.

00:37:54.42
Lane Kennedy
But then I showed up at this place and here he was with this date. And I was like, ah, okay. And he's trying to be normal and kind and, you know, introducing me to her.

00:38:06.92
Lane Kennedy
And I'm thinking to my God, I'm just like, oh my God, what the fuck is happening right now?

00:38:07.42
Bill
yeah

00:38:11.76
Lane Kennedy
You know, like out of my mind, crazy

00:38:12.00
Mike
Right,

00:38:14.85
Bill
Yeah.

00:38:15.38
Lane Kennedy
And I show up again his house that night. And he just, he opened up the window and he shook his head at me. And I was like, okay, that's it.

00:38:24.09
Mike
yeah. Yep. Mm-hmm.

00:38:28.57
Lane Kennedy
I'm done.

00:38:28.79
Mike
right yeah

00:38:29.59
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, yeah. But that's what it took. I mean, that that it that's that was the humility.

00:38:32.38
Mike
h

00:38:34.62
Lane Kennedy
That's where it took me. I'm like, oh, okay, I have to stop this. God, it's just crazy.

00:38:41.33
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:38:41.37
Bill
I mean, I had a I had a and I was like five or six years sober. and It was a individual that I shouldn't been involved in to begin with. But again, felt really hard. You know, that's what i'm saying. Even early in sobriety, I'm, you know, five, six years sober.

00:38:52.33
Bill
i felt really fucking hard for this person. And I mean, she was a normie, but kind of, you know, thinking she wanted to get sober, blah, blah, blah. Never doesn't really matter.

00:38:59.43
Lane Kennedy
Mm.

00:39:00.19
Bill
But, you know, she's the one that told me she's like, you know, you she's like, you're going to stop acting this way type of thing, you know. And I said, you know, basically when I ended up apologizing to her and I said, I said, I've got no excuse.

00:39:06.38
Lane Kennedy
Mm.

00:39:12.39
Bill
I'm like, I've never dealt with this before. I've never not that you did it. But I said, I got I got my feelings hurt. You know, I got my heart broken, which is my own goddamn fault. You know, so not you. it was me. But I'm like, I had never dealt with that up to that point.

00:39:25.14
Bill
And I said, I told her, I said, unfortunately, I said, you just got to experience what it's like to deal with me as an active alcoholic without the booze, you know, and that was scary as fuck because I didn't have to drink to be that guy.

00:39:32.79
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:39:36.25
Lane Kennedy
Yep.

00:39:36.99
Bill
And we talk about that all the time.

00:39:37.43
Lane Kennedy
Yep.

00:39:37.51
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:39:38.39
Bill
You know, it doesn't I didn't do anything super like horribly extreme, but it was my you know, it was words and it was emotions and it was all the sort of things that didn't need to happen.

00:39:38.73
Lane Kennedy
Yep.

00:39:48.99
Bill
And, um you know, i because I just I didn't know how to handle myself.

00:39:49.14
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:39:52.46
Bill
yet and for anyone out there listening yeah i said five or six years sober and lane just said the same goddamn thing she's out there in somebody's front yard in five years sober and so maybe you think about them my you know by my other one i'm like yeah well yeah i was there too i get it i get it

00:39:53.82
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:40:02.81
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:40:03.86
Mike
this is

00:40:08.90
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:40:09.11
Mike
Yep. Mm-hmm. And yeah, right. My five, my five years sober story. I moved a girl from San Francisco into my house and, you know, a lot, ignored every fucking red flag that she threw at me and, you know, right.

00:40:22.79
Lane Kennedy
Uh-huh.

00:40:25.62
Mike
You know, and she she brought drugs into my house and, you know, oh yeah.

00:40:27.93
Lane Kennedy
Oh, my God. No. no

00:40:29.10
Mike
Oh yeah. Mm-hmm. yeah Thankfully, um you know I was um so fucking sober that she couldn't stand to be around me anymore, and she went back to California, thank God. um Right.

00:40:40.62
Bill
Right.

00:40:41.11
Mike
But yes, so apparently all around five, six years sober, we make really stupid moves in the romance department.

00:40:47.60
Bill
Yeah,

00:40:50.58
Bill
yeah well.

00:40:50.78
Lane Kennedy
And I think it's because we we're, you know, starting to like, oh yeah, I know how to do this. Like, i I'm like, good, I can do this.

00:40:55.31
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:40:55.35
Bill
ah

00:40:55.86
Mike
Yep, yeah exactly.

00:40:58.20
Lane Kennedy
But, and in that's what keeps happening.

00:40:58.39
Mike
Right, yeah.

00:41:02.54
Lane Kennedy
Like we get this time under our belt, you know, this like life experience, like I can handle it.

00:41:03.13
Bill
Right.

00:41:03.16
Mike
Yes.

00:41:07.26
Mike
Yeah.

00:41:08.76
Lane Kennedy
But in reality, I'm not handling things well. I mean, i I'm still super messy.

00:41:15.99
Mike
yes

00:41:16.34
Bill
Right.

00:41:17.05
Lane Kennedy
like And I used to really give myself a hard time about that.

00:41:17.36
Bill
Right.

00:41:20.17
Lane Kennedy
And now I'm just like, whatever.

00:41:20.34
Mike
m

00:41:22.13
Lane Kennedy
Like, I can't.

00:41:22.20
Mike
yeah

00:41:22.79
Bill
Right.

00:41:24.73
Lane Kennedy
Like, I cannot. Yeah.

00:41:26.46
Mike
Yeah, well, yeah, there comes a point where it's just acceptance, you know, I mean, you know, yes, you know, ah step six and seven.

00:41:30.26
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:41:33.78
Mike
Absolutely. You know, we want to get rid of the shit and we're willing to get rid of the shit. But some of it, we just have to accept it. You know, we just have to mitigate it the best we can, because that's who we fucking are and we can't beat ourselves up over it.

00:41:46.07
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:41:47.63
Mike
And we can't, you know, we have to, again, you know, minimize the damage that we do um and and, you know, don't infirm inflict ourselves on other people the way we used to but um yeah there's some shit that just it's gonna stay fucked up for our entire lives and it sucks and we just have to make sure that we keep an eye on it so it doesn't get out of control like it used to be

00:42:12.11
Bill
Right.

00:42:12.76
Lane Kennedy
And I think there's that part, i mean you guys are talking about meetings and Alcoholics Anonymous, so I'm going to say that it's fair to talk about the big book here.

00:42:19.90
Mike
sure yeah yeah oh yeah

00:42:19.99
Bill
Oh, yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.

00:42:20.74
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:42:21.11
Bill
you could you

00:42:21.46
Lane Kennedy
um Because i i was I was reading...

00:42:22.17
Bill
You can talk about what talk about whatever you want.

00:42:24.95
Lane Kennedy
Recently, I was just reading about the bedevilments and in my book, I had dated, you know, like 2006, right? And it talks about like not having a job or like whatever they are.

00:42:37.76
Lane Kennedy
And and I was like, oh, here I am again, right?

00:42:40.30
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:42:40.33
Lane Kennedy
Like 29 years later, it's like life just keeps occurring and those pages still apply.

00:42:43.00
Mike
Yeah.

00:42:46.82
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:42:51.29
Bill
Right?

00:42:51.42
Lane Kennedy
Like they still apply.

00:42:55.70
Bill
hey

00:42:55.94
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:42:56.01
Mike
God damn it.

00:42:57.24
Bill
Right. Well, you know, the the funny thing is, too, and that I and I again, I mentioned that on here all the time that I've i've also gotten to the to the point in my sobriety and probably me What do you think, Mike, at least for the last you know handful of years where I go to I go to Mike, I go to Mike for all sobriety shit.

00:43:13.47
Bill
You know, there's everything that's that's kind of fucking me up where I know that only he would understand. I go to him you know because I know he's going to shoot me straight. Number one, he's going to know where I'm coming from. It's fucked up.

00:43:22.23
Mike
Right.

00:43:22.66
Bill
It may sound. He's going where I'm coming from.

00:43:24.51
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:43:24.67
Bill
Um, and then, you know, like life stuff too, I'll go to our sister. And then, you know, when it's things that I want, that I want to do in general, that um, that I'm, I still, I don't necessarily, not that I don't trust myself, but I don't trust myself.

00:43:31.98
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:43:36.54
Bill
I want to make sure still that this plan I've got in my head, because this head of mine could still, I know for a fucking fact that this head can still develop some weird and whacked ideas and,

00:43:36.94
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:43:48.73
Bill
I need to get it either out on paper. I need to speak it. I need to get it out on here. We'll talk about things on here. Or if it's things that, you know, we don't want to air out to everyone. I'll just I sit down and talk to. I run shit by my kids.

00:43:59.80
Bill
You know, I'm like, this is what I want to do. Is it is it crazy or does this even make any sense? You know, because I don't I don't.

00:44:05.02
Lane Kennedy
Right.

00:44:07.00
Bill
Well, two things. I don't want to do something to, you know, again, that's, that's reckless. But I also, I don't want, I really don't want people to be looking back on what the fuck is he doing?

00:44:19.61
Bill
You know, I don't want to act like, like an active alcoholic anymore.

00:44:19.90
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:44:23.21
Bill
I want to act like a responsible human being.

00:44:23.60
Lane Kennedy
No.

00:44:24.89
Bill
And I know that it doesn't matter how many years I have. I'm not a responsible human being all the time, you know, and I know I'm not, you know, so I need to make sure that I'm, that I'm still being that guy, you know?

00:44:30.26
Mike
Exactly.

00:44:30.82
Lane Kennedy
Right. Right.

00:44:39.06
Bill
But yeah, when it comes to, I mean, we we came through the AA program. We've had plenty of people on here that have done all these other things that are out there. and We don't give a shit. Mike, tell her what you what you always say about what people do with their lives.

00:44:50.01
Mike
I don't give a shit how you got sober as long as you're staying sober and it's making you a better person and you're being a better human being to the people around you.

00:44:50.81
Bill
Yeah, yeah.

00:44:53.50
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:44:58.93
Mike
I don't care how you got there.

00:45:01.06
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:45:01.24
Bill
yeah

00:45:01.59
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:45:01.94
Lane Kennedy
I kind of feel that same way.

00:45:02.15
Mike
You know, yeah.

00:45:02.90
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:45:03.43
Mike
You know, I mean, the 12 steps is what I use personally.

00:45:06.72
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:45:06.95
Mike
um You know, and everybody who's listened to more than a couple episodes of this thing knows I'm an atheist and I work the 12 steps. You know, I found a way to do that.

00:45:15.00
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:45:16.71
Mike
um

00:45:17.22
Bill
Right.

00:45:17.50
Mike
You know, I have powers that are greater than myself that I lean on. um And they're not metaphysical and they're not supernatural. I find physical and natural just fine. I don't need to make them super and meta.

00:45:29.78
Lane Kennedy
yeah

00:45:32.28
Bill
Yeah. And it's, I'll tell you when, when we first, um and I mean, shit, even when, when we first got sober, so obviously like when you got sober lane, I mean, there weren't a lot of these, you know, options out there, you know, that there are now.

00:45:43.19
Lane Kennedy
No, no.

00:45:43.46
Bill
And um neither one of us knew anything about this. I had never, until I got on Instagram, whatever it was, four years ago now,

00:45:46.63
Mike
Hmm. Hmm.

00:45:51.48
Bill
I had never heard a gray area drinking. I'd never heard a sober curious.

00:45:53.35
Lane Kennedy
Uh-huh.

00:45:54.68
Bill
I only thing I knew about AF.

00:45:55.00
Lane Kennedy
Right.

00:45:56.48
Bill
I thought it standard for as fuck. I didn't know was alcohol free. I knew, i knew nothing about this.

00:45:59.86
Lane Kennedy
Yep.

00:46:01.48
Bill
I knew about smart recovery.

00:46:01.70
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:46:02.89
Bill
Cause I had a friend of mine in Wisconsin that did smart recovery meetings.

00:46:05.36
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:46:05.72
Bill
I didn't know about any of this other shit. This recovery, what recovery Dharma is one recovery elevators, there' another thing, all these fucking communities out there, um which is fine, you know?

00:46:10.26
Lane Kennedy
Yep.

00:46:15.41
Bill
And there's a, there, there's an individual that we talk about all the time, but we've never named this person, but, You know, this individual, you know, kind of kind of rips on Alcoholics Anonymous and is trying to change names and labels.

00:46:27.78
Bill
And I'm like, I'm a fucking alcoholic.

00:46:28.15
Lane Kennedy
What?

00:46:29.86
Bill
You know, so is Mike.

00:46:30.89
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:46:31.06
Bill
I can call him an alcoholic.

00:46:31.57
Mike
Yep.

00:46:32.42
Bill
He can call me one. That's how we identify when when people are out there saying that, you know, the al the word alcoholic and this individual, there's a group of people, but this individual is trying to lead this cause, you know, about getting rid of the word alcoholic, that it's outdated, it's old, it doesn't mean anything.

00:46:35.19
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:46:44.62
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:46:46.84
Lane Kennedy
Oh my God.

00:46:47.06
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:46:47.54
Bill
Well, fuck you.

00:46:47.77
Lane Kennedy
No.

00:46:48.66
Bill
OK, it means something to me, you know,

00:46:48.79
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah.

00:46:51.48
Bill
And I used the the first example I used, I said, if I went to the doctor and the doctor's like, you you have this thing, okay, and there's no cure for it and it's going to start fucking with you, we're going to to give you this this medicine and probably kind of do an x-ray thing is you're going to your hair and you're going to throw up all the time, but we're not going to put a label on it, but we're going to treat you.

00:47:11.45
Bill
And you're going what do I have?

00:47:13.05
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:47:13.72
Bill
You know? So cancer is a fucking ugly word. You know, it's an ugly circumstance.

00:47:16.34
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, yeah.

00:47:17.96
Bill
It's an ugly situation. But I mean, is the word outdated? Of course not. It's the same goddamn thing. So that that's the only thing that and I try. And this is where I kind of I i get a little bit lit up about what I think about these things every once in a while, because I'm like, neither one of us, we've been so goddamn open.

00:47:34.16
Bill
Do whatever the fuck you want to do, but don't fuck with our shit, you know?

00:47:36.60
Lane Kennedy
who

00:47:36.81
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:47:37.61
Bill
Don't change our book. You want to go make a new book, make a new book, you know, just like they did with new fucking Coke, you know, leave, leave Coke is, it is go, go do your goddamn new Coke.

00:47:40.33
Mike
Right.

00:47:46.30
Bill
I don't give a shit. Go do new big book over there. If you want to do new big book, do it, but leave ours alone.

00:47:50.23
Lane Kennedy
Oh my God.

00:47:51.14
Bill
Leave it the fuck alone.

00:47:53.17
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:47:54.17
Lane Kennedy
that Okay. ah You just said so much, both of you. so okay i there's so So many places where I want to go with this conversation. First of

00:48:02.74
Bill
Okay, real real quick though. you know Maybe this is a good place. We've said a lot of things.

00:48:05.66
Mike
m

00:48:07.58
Bill
is this What do you think, Mike? It's time for a quick break.

00:48:10.26
Mike
Absolutely. We're going to we're gonna go listen to a couple of words from our sponsors, and we're going to come back and hear where Lane wants to take us, right after these words.

00:48:11.49
Lane Kennedy
Okay. Okay, let's take it.

00:48:27.80
Bill
All right, everyone. Welcome back. So that wasn't so smooth lane. And I'm sorry about that, but, but you know what?

00:48:33.21
Mike
Hehehehe.

00:48:34.60
Lane Kennedy
Okay.

00:48:36.14
Bill
Usually we try to find a comfortable place, but I'm like, I'm like, no, it would use like, there's so many things and so many ways to go. I'm like, this could go on for a minute. Cause we've been in these great conversations here for these last, whatever it's 45 minutes. So I'm like, that's a great place to just interrupt the shit out of you.

00:48:49.10
Bill
And then now we could just go, go and run free. So lane, where are you going take us?

00:48:53.53
Lane Kennedy
Okay, first off, this whole idea around somebody changing alcoholic, that's infuriating to me.

00:48:59.95
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:49:01.75
Lane Kennedy
Like, okay, that that's all I'm going to say about that.

00:49:01.85
Bill
okay

00:49:04.20
Lane Kennedy
I don't...

00:49:04.75
Mike
Right.

00:49:05.91
Lane Kennedy
You do you, right? Like whatever, you do you and leave the rest of us alone.

00:49:07.30
Bill
Right.

00:49:07.37
Mike
Yep. hmm.

00:49:10.67
Lane Kennedy
The next thing is that, you know, I am one of these authors that wrote a ah book about sobriety.

00:49:16.11
Mike
hmm. Right.

00:49:16.98
Lane Kennedy
And when when Wiley approached Tamar and i I was like, what? what Who am Like, this isn't real. like And I only share that because now there are so many different programs and books and, you know, about sobriety.

00:49:26.28
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:49:33.02
Lane Kennedy
how to get sober. And the only reason why I said yes to this is that my dear friend said, Lane, you're going to say yes to this because if you don't, someone else is, and they're not going to have the sobriety that you have.

00:49:48.72
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:49:51.40
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:49:51.54
Bill
yeah Good point. Yep.

00:49:52.50
Lane Kennedy
And I was like, oh, okay, that's right. And she said, it's really hard to get a book publishing deal. So say yes to this.

00:50:02.98
Lane Kennedy
yeah

00:50:03.26
Bill
Right.

00:50:03.42
Mike
Yeah.

00:50:03.74
Bill
Mm-hmm.

00:50:04.26
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:50:04.70
Lane Kennedy
so But I say that with like, there are so many ways to find recovery and stay sober now, right?

00:50:12.25
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:50:13.78
Lane Kennedy
And like what Mike was just saying, it's like, just stay sober. And what the Sober Curator is all about, like just stay sober, like just stay. And I think that's one of the threads about Alcoholics Anonymous. Like we have statistics that if you stay around Alcoholics Anonymous, you're going to probably stay sober.

00:50:33.05
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:50:33.08
Lane Kennedy
Like we have that kind of longevity and those kinds of facts.

00:50:33.19
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:50:33.31
Bill
Right. Right.

00:50:33.45
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:50:36.60
Lane Kennedy
I don't know about the alcohol-free area. I don't know about the gray drinkers. I don't know about their statistics, but I do know the statistics around AA and that is profound.

00:50:46.68
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. so Bill Wilson and Dr. Bob were legendary, right? Like time, they've been highlighted as, you know, that century, a part of this great ah find, you know, ideology. So I don't know if somebody is trying to erase that or say change alcoholic, think

00:51:12.53
Lane Kennedy
there's going to be problems. I think there there will be a lot of people that kind of step forward and say, no, you can't do that. Like it's not going happen.

00:51:19.06
Mike
right

00:51:19.77
Bill
Well, and here and here's a quick side note on that. i'm just going interrupt to give this side note on. this is it's so It's so hard for me sometimes not to – we have not mentioned the person.

00:51:23.42
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:51:27.57
Bill
We're not going to. it's not It's not fair. I mean, if we ever have the individual, and maybe we will. We'll have the person on here and we can debate it. Maybe we'll figure out that you know this person's got some decent ideas and we can find a common ground. I don't i don't think so.

00:51:40.02
Mike
mm-hmm yeah

00:51:40.05
Bill
Okay, but I would be – if Mike would be willing to, I would be willing to have that person –

00:51:42.46
Mike
m yeah yeah open-minded and willing right absolutely

00:51:46.20
Bill
Yeah, to have that person on here to have a conversation.

00:51:46.42
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:51:48.20
Bill
But until that happens, um you know, the part of it, and Mike made a good point when I was telling the story at one time about what I read on Instagram. He said this individual basically will be the type of person that throws ah ah a firecracker or a small bomb in the middle of a room and then act surprised when it blows up, you know.

00:52:05.62
Lane Kennedy
Oh, God. Yeah, yeah.

00:52:06.34
Bill
So, and that's, that was how these conversations were going. So I was reading these things word for word from Instagram and he's like, God damn it.

00:52:10.82
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:52:12.87
Bill
That's what it is like. And that's what it is. It's like a shit store. But the individual also kind of has this other thing, you know, kind of like, um, I don't know, like let's say maybe you're, you're, you're wellness stuff and I'm not accusing your wellness stuff of doing it.

00:52:25.42
Bill
But if you had this radical idea where you're like, well, fuck these wellness people, I'm doing it this way and everyone else is wrong and I'm going to try to change everything, you know?

00:52:34.16
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:52:34.34
Bill
And then, so your program, so you're promoting, you know, your program by kind of bashing or trying to change the mindset of other, of other things, you know, so that, that's the, ah that's the other thing.

00:52:42.10
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, no.

00:52:44.35
Bill
But um yeah, it's just, I, I don't, I don't understand because this person has a, an extremely wide audience and doing, I'm sure, decent things for a lot of people.

00:52:51.92
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:52:54.13
Bill
I still, to this day, I don't understand why, like you said it to begin with lane, you do you and let us do us, you know?

00:53:01.11
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. There is a whole movement though of people who, you know, AA has a stigma.

00:53:09.21
Bill
Right.

00:53:09.27
Lane Kennedy
Like it just is.

00:53:09.37
Bill
and that's fine.

00:53:11.10
Lane Kennedy
And so there is a younger, you know, crowd that just, they don't want anything to do with it.

00:53:15.27
Mike
Right. Sure. Yeah, absolutely.

00:53:17.66
Lane Kennedy
So

00:53:17.70
Bill
Right.

00:53:18.62
Mike
Right. yeah and and And as an atheist, I understand that. you know I've got to sit there and listen to the goddamn Lord's Prayer every fucking week.

00:53:21.98
Lane Kennedy
yeah. Yeah.

00:53:25.10
Lane Kennedy
Oh, that drives me crazy.

00:53:25.50
Mike
you know

00:53:26.44
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:53:26.52
Mike
you know And it's fine.

00:53:26.96
Lane Kennedy
No, I get you.

00:53:28.68
Mike
you know Again, you know and i mean, I don't... I have to let them do that because you know it helps them and it's cool. And and you know I do another thing in my head that's mine and I do it while they do that.

00:53:38.36
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. Yeah.

00:53:40.30
Mike
And you know after all these years, I've got it timed out where I finish mine right when they finish theirs. um You know, and it's cool.

00:53:45.37
Lane Kennedy
Right.

00:53:47.98
Mike
You know, it's fine. um yeah And I'm not going to start screaming about, you can't do this in in my meeting anymore.

00:53:52.70
Lane Kennedy
Right.

00:53:54.85
Mike
You know, why?

00:53:56.66
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, no.

00:53:56.69
Mike
It's, you know, it's it's it's it's fine.

00:53:56.92
Bill
Right.

00:53:59.93
Lane Kennedy
it It is fine.

00:54:00.01
Mike
It's fine.

00:54:01.05
Lane Kennedy
it is fine that we all find our way.

00:54:01.50
Mike
Yes.

00:54:03.53
Lane Kennedy
And one of the things that was so important when you know we were writing Sobriety for Dummies is that because my background is in mindfulness and Buddhism and health and wellness, right like I really took that as the forefront of like there are so many paths to recovery.

00:54:04.08
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:54:09.75
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Right.

00:54:22.36
Lane Kennedy
And right In sobriety for dummies, I even talk about like psychedelics and ketamine and MDMA.

00:54:30.87
Mike
Yeah.

00:54:31.45
Lane Kennedy
I just want people to know that there are options.

00:54:34.25
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:54:37.07
Mike
Great.

00:54:37.08
Lane Kennedy
I would rather have somebody have like oh an option than die.

00:54:37.08
Bill
Right.

00:54:40.28
Mike
Yeah, oh, absolutely. You know, and I mean, no Jesus, Bill Wilson did acid, kids.

00:54:41.40
Lane Kennedy
Right?

00:54:44.57
Lane Kennedy
Exactly.

00:54:45.43
Mike
Yeah.

00:54:46.20
Bill
and

00:54:46.55
Mike
In the 60s.

00:54:46.62
Lane Kennedy
like I'm pro-Bill doing his tripping.

00:54:48.89
Mike
Yeah, right. You know, whatever. Exactly.

00:54:50.59
Lane Kennedy
LSD was his magic.

00:54:51.11
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:54:52.06
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:54:54.01
Mike
Yeah, yeah. It kept them doing whatever. i mean, I don't know the details of it, but I certainly know it happened and I understand why it happened, you know.

00:55:04.10
Lane Kennedy
It kept him on the planet, right?

00:55:05.53
Mike
Yeah, right. Right.

00:55:06.34
Lane Kennedy
Like that is like people get so up in arms around these stories and it's like, well, do you want the person dead?

00:55:10.40
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:55:12.98
Mike
Yeah.

00:55:13.08
Lane Kennedy
like

00:55:13.28
Bill
Right.

00:55:14.73
Lane Kennedy
Like, I don't know. i I don't know.

00:55:17.39
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:55:17.62
Bill
Well, and in Dr. Dr. Bob was doing drugs. He was taking sedatives every day. Right.

00:55:21.29
Lane Kennedy
Right, right.

00:55:21.46
Mike
Right. Well, yeah.

00:55:21.85
Bill
You know.

00:55:22.34
Mike
No, but I'm talking Bill Wilson did it when he was sober. He did it in the 60s.

00:55:25.43
Lane Kennedy
But he yeah, Bill did it when he was in he was sober.

00:55:26.97
Bill
Oh, OK, I got you.

00:55:27.10
Mike
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:55:27.79
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, yeah.

00:55:27.85
Bill
Yeah. Right.

00:55:28.38
Mike
well

00:55:28.41
Bill
Right. Right.

00:55:28.95
Lane Kennedy
For his depression.

00:55:29.02
Mike
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah, you know, and yeah, well, dave Bill Wilson was doing sedatives too when he was drinking. um You know, that's why just that's a whole other conversation.

00:55:36.70
Lane Kennedy
Yeah,

00:55:39.79
Mike
The old timers are can't talk about drugs in the meeting. Shut the fuck up.

00:55:43.54
Lane Kennedy
yeah no.

00:55:43.63
Mike
They talk about drugs in the big book.

00:55:44.28
Bill
hey Right, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:55:46.53
Mike
Mm

00:55:47.35
Lane Kennedy
And I don't think that people have to be so... I mean, alcoholism is deadly, right? It is a killer disease and it is it is coming for you.

00:55:51.32
Mike
hmm.

00:55:51.93
Bill
Right.

00:55:52.60
Mike
Right. Yep.

00:55:54.67
Lane Kennedy
like

00:55:55.16
Mike
hmm.

00:55:55.48
Lane Kennedy
And I'm just going to go back to the DNA for a second because if you are genetically, pre you know, have these genes, alcoholism is going to get you.

00:55:57.82
Mike
Yep.

00:56:03.27
Mike
Yeah.

00:56:05.64
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:56:05.82
Lane Kennedy
So what is the path that you're going to find to recovery? Absolutely.

00:56:09.22
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:56:09.56
Lane Kennedy
you know What is going to be your solution? Because sooner or later, it's going to get you.

00:56:12.22
Mike
Right.

00:56:14.99
Lane Kennedy
And if it doesn't get you through and out you know through vodka or a pipe or a needle in your arm, it's going to get you through food.

00:56:15.58
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:56:19.19
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yep.

00:56:24.21
Lane Kennedy
It's going to get you through sugar.

00:56:24.37
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:56:25.97
Lane Kennedy
It's going to get you through sex.

00:56:26.25
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:56:27.61
Lane Kennedy
It's going to get you.

00:56:27.77
Mike
Yep. Right.

00:56:30.01
Lane Kennedy
So exactly.

00:56:30.24
Mike
Gambling, whatever. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, something. Some compulsion is going to take over because that's what compulsive people.

00:56:35.51
Lane Kennedy
Exactly. Yeah.

00:56:37.69
Mike
Yes. Yes. Absolutely. Right. You know, and and and that's, yeah, it's a beautiful thing working this. I mean, right now i have no compulsions anymore.

00:56:48.22
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:56:49.05
Mike
You know, it's beautiful. I mean, I still smoke and I still smoke way too fucking much, but you know, but I enjoy smoking.

00:56:50.55
Lane Kennedy
Well, that's the 12 steps.

00:56:55.97
Mike
So that's a whole and nother thing.

00:56:57.38
Mike
Yeah.

00:56:58.30
Lane Kennedy
h But that's the beauty of the 12 steps, right?

00:56:59.66
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:57:00.69
Lane Kennedy
Those principles, and even though you're agnostic or atheist, what did you say you are?

00:57:01.88
Mike
Yes.

00:57:05.62
Mike
Oh, I'm an atheist. Yeah, there's nothing.

00:57:06.77
Lane Kennedy
You're an atheist, right?

00:57:07.00
Bill
yeah

00:57:07.41
Lane Kennedy
So so there's nothing there. so But the the principles behind those 12 steps are so solid, they have transformed your life.

00:57:11.06
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm. Yes. Yes, absolutely.

00:57:16.86
Lane Kennedy
right And for somebody who is struggling and really up against smoking or sex or gambling, right those same 12 steps, those principles, you can come out on the other side and start living your life.

00:57:17.58
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:57:27.14
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:57:31.26
Mike
Yep.

00:57:34.41
Lane Kennedy
That's a freaking miracle.

00:57:34.49
Bill
Yeah. here And I mean, I'm and i'm at best agnostic. you know So Mike, yeah, Mike Atheist, and I'm um at best agnostic. And we had a we had a priest down here two summers ago.

00:57:44.98
Bill
Father Bill, what was he, 78 years old, I think?

00:57:46.61
Mike
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

00:57:48.25
Bill
And, you know, been sober for fucking ever.

00:57:48.41
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:57:50.37
Bill
And this guy was, it was just great.

00:57:50.71
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:57:51.97
Bill
We had a great conversation with him.

00:57:52.25
Mike
Yep. Yeah.

00:57:53.41
Bill
And we, you know, I paused a little bit. So I'm like, are we sure? He's like, ah Mike, Mike, that Mike's like, oh, fuck it. Let's have mine. Let's see what happens.

00:58:00.73
Mike
yeah

00:58:00.74
Bill
What's what's the worst thing? I'm like, OK, you know, I'm like, I don't I'm not worried about us. I'm worried about somebody else getting weird, you know, if feeling weird with because we're not God people.

00:58:08.24
Mike
Right.

00:58:09.26
Bill
But it's never happened.

00:58:09.62
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, yeah.

00:58:10.50
Bill
We had another guy on a couple of months ago that um clearly religious and i had a great conversation with him.

00:58:14.10
Mike
hu

00:58:15.31
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, yeah.

00:58:16.13
Bill
We've had a lot of other people that, you know, truly walk the path of God and all those things.

00:58:20.34
Mike
h

00:58:21.31
Bill
And they bring it up and we, every once in a while I get, I get a little cringed, you know, but I don't mind it, you know, because it is, it's what, it's what keeps them.

00:58:21.49
Lane Kennedy
Right.

00:58:25.40
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. yeah

00:58:30.19
Bill
We've had, we've watched priests lead in meetings and stuff like that and all this different stuff. But the the thing of it is, is that, you know, the, um the same thing is that, and I mentioned it in last week's episode too, and I'll say it again, my, my sponsor that I had in, in Wisconsin.

00:58:34.65
Lane Kennedy
yeah

00:58:45.04
Bill
And he was this dude from, he was the dude, I swear to God, Mike can attest to this. He looked like Snoop Dogg. Okay.

00:58:51.03
Mike
Yeah.

00:58:51.78
Bill
And I swear to God, looked 100% like Snoop Dogg.

00:58:51.86
Lane Kennedy
That's

00:58:53.84
Bill
He'd be like, God damn, is that Snoop? That was my sponsor in in Milwaukee.

00:58:56.47
Lane Kennedy
awesome.

00:58:57.30
Bill
He was fucking great. And he had probably, if not, probably had more time than you do, Lane. I think he was the early 90s when he got sober. Really nice guy, laid back and all that sort of stuff.

00:59:08.29
Bill
But he used to always say, he goes, he goes the same dog that bit me, bit you too.

00:59:13.08
Lane Kennedy
Yes.

00:59:13.27
Bill
And that was his explanation.

00:59:13.85
Lane Kennedy
Yes.

00:59:14.68
Bill
It didn't matter. You know, he didn't matter.

00:59:15.96
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

00:59:16.44
Bill
He was the only black guy in, you know, in Mequon, Wisconsin, going to this meeting. um I never even noticed it, you know, but he'd bring it up every once in a while.

00:59:20.66
Lane Kennedy
Wow. Mm-hmm.

00:59:23.48
Bill
was like, he's like, the reason I come around here and I'm the only black dude is because he goes, you guys are cool.

00:59:24.15
Mike
Right.

00:59:27.24
Bill
He goes, I enjoy it. And then he'd be like, but You know, but it's the the whole point is like you just said, the principles and all that sort of thing.

00:59:28.64
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

00:59:38.69
Bill
There's the we were able to both of us came into this thing. And I think even though, again, Mike Atheist, me agnostic, both of us didn't really know how we were going to deal with the God part of the program until we realized that there doesn't really have to be a God part of the program.

00:59:55.18
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:59:55.23
Bill
You know, I mean, we read the 24 hour book every day in certain days yesterday or the day before, Mike, there was so many, so fucking many.

01:00:00.49
Mike
Yeah. Yes, there were.

01:00:03.13
Bill
and And Mike just told me he used to substitute the word good.

01:00:03.51
Mike
Yeah.

01:00:05.97
Bill
So every time I see God, I say good.

01:00:08.14
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:00:08.57
Bill
It works, you know.

01:00:09.27
Lane Kennedy
her

01:00:09.51
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:00:09.78
Bill
um But, you know, so um we figured out right away and we were told um you don't have to. First of all, you don't have to figure out what your higher power is right away. you Just got to figure out a power a power greater than yourself and just know it's not you.

01:00:22.16
Mike
Right.

01:00:23.11
Bill
So that's the number one thing we heard. And then we realized that we were told. through this whole thing. You know, it's the, it's the spiritual side of things. Even people that have gone back, that we know that have gone back to church after they got sober, their priests will tell them the same thing.

01:00:37.72
Bill
Do your, do your AA stuff over there and come here to do your God stuff. Separate them. They're not the same.

01:00:43.29
Lane Kennedy
Yep.

01:00:43.67
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:00:43.88
Bill
You could use, you know, God for your higher power. That's fine. Blah, blah, blah. You know, but they're, they're different things that we've had. We've heard priests say that, you know,

01:00:51.76
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:00:52.41
Bill
So it's just in and here's the other thing, like you mentioned, statistics lane, you know, and in the wide range where of Alcoholics Anonymous, worst case scenario, if nothing else, you know, to to kind of ah solidify the whole God thing.

01:01:05.37
Bill
It works fucking everywhere, everywhere in the world, you know, and, you know, somebody on the other side of the the world in this small community, you know, with one AA meeting within 50 fucking miles.

01:01:07.77
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. yeah

01:01:16.63
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:01:17.24
Bill
They're not looking at most of the time, probably not looking at the sort of God that you'd find, ah you know, down the street from where you live here, you know, so that in and of itself says how, how wide of a range.

01:01:24.36
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:01:27.91
Bill
And I understand the stigma and the people have their thing with it. I don't give a fuck. Let them do whatever they want to do.

01:01:32.02
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:01:33.03
Bill
I would never attraction rather than promotion. Right.

01:01:36.10
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:01:36.62
Bill
You know, so I don't care. Somebody doesn't want to do AA. That's fine. I don't understand, you know, some of these other programs. I don't know that I'd be able to, I could, I could be friends with and try to give somebody guidance, but I don't know that I could throw the word sponsor on somebody if they didn't do an AA thing, just because I don't know that they would get the right stuff for me. If that makes sense.

01:01:56.12
Lane Kennedy
It totally makes sense. Have you had many conversations with the alcohol-free community or people from that world?

01:01:57.34
Bill
Right.

01:02:01.53
Bill
um Have we had, we've probably had a couple of people on here that are more of the,

01:02:04.20
Mike
I think couple out of here, but that's, yeah, I mean, that's about the extent of it for for me anyway.

01:02:09.30
Bill
Yeah, just ah just people on here, and I can't even you know think.

01:02:09.62
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:02:12.18
Bill
there's We've had people on here that have been just you know like ah ah not really labeling the exact thing that they do type of thing. They just they're you know they don't drink, and they're they do whatever, and they didn't really name whatever.

01:02:18.74
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:02:22.30
Bill
They haven't used the 12-step program, blah, blah, blah, but not deep discussions with actually you know just saying, okay, you're with the alcohol-free community.

01:02:27.45
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:02:30.31
Bill
Talk to me and let you know tell me what you got over there type of thing.

01:02:30.55
Lane Kennedy
who

01:02:32.83
Bill
Sure.

01:02:33.18
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. It's a different, it's a different mentality.

01:02:36.57
Mike
Okay.

01:02:36.91
Bill
Sure.

01:02:37.03
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. Yeah. it

01:02:39.83
Bill
hey

01:02:40.18
Lane Kennedy
It's different.

01:02:40.28
Mike
Yeah. Right.

01:02:41.26
Lane Kennedy
That's, that's all I need to say.

01:02:41.26
Mike
Yeah. But, but, right.

01:02:42.59
Lane Kennedy
It's different.

01:02:43.16
Mike
But again, if it's working for them, it's keeping them sober and it's making them better people, which is really the whole point of any of this, you know, right.

01:02:45.05
Lane Kennedy
It's, it's working for them. I don't care. That's, that's exactly right.

01:02:51.53
Bill
Right.

01:02:52.38
Mike
You know, making you less harmful to the people around you. who That's the most I can hope for.

01:02:56.74
Lane Kennedy
Right. ah you know

01:03:00.19
Bill
Right.

01:03:00.79
Lane Kennedy
But I think there's something really great about participants in AA. There is a...

01:03:07.29
Mike
Yeah.

01:03:08.12
Lane Kennedy
a friendliness, a jovialness. There's a um a lightness. you know I go back to that story that you said, Bill, earlier about the you know the car landing in the and living room.

01:03:17.66
Bill
Right.

01:03:18.44
Lane Kennedy
it's like right like The things that we laugh about, I'm not quite sure about the other communities being as lighthearted as we are, at least when I've stepped into them and

01:03:18.79
Mike
Yeah.

01:03:21.39
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:03:27.58
Mike
Right.

01:03:28.28
Bill
Right.

01:03:30.45
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:03:31.58
Lane Kennedy
gone to conferences or been in meetings with them, it's there's a little bit more seriousness, I think.

01:03:35.34
Mike
Right.

01:03:38.49
Mike
m

01:03:39.03
Lane Kennedy
And I don't i don't know i i don't know if that's good or bad or whatever it is.

01:03:42.98
Mike
Right.

01:03:43.26
Lane Kennedy
It doesn't matter what it is, but there is members that are from Alcoholics Anonymous, we do have this levity, i just this which is really beautiful.

01:03:51.98
Mike
Yes. Yes. It is. Yeah. Well, I mean, you know, right. I, you know, I didn't get sober to be, you know, to be miserable, to sit in a church basement seven days a week to, yeah.

01:04:03.00
Bill
ah

01:04:06.43
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:04:07.10
Mike
And just, you know, bemoan life.

01:04:09.75
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:04:10.02
Mike
That's no, I, you know, I want, I want happy, joyous and free. God damn it.

01:04:13.82
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:04:14.42
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:04:14.49
Lane Kennedy
I want it all.

01:04:14.87
Bill
Yeah. Yeah. yeah Yeah. we Well, we wanted we wanted it all. We wanted all it all. And we wanted more when we were drinking. why Why the fuck should it change now?

01:04:23.64
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:04:23.66
Bill
You know, it shouldn't.

01:04:24.38
Mike
Yeah, exactly.

01:04:24.40
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:04:24.62
Bill
You know, just, you know.

01:04:25.52
Mike
Back to the back to the the core of us, the things that we are. Yeah, it's the same.

01:04:29.26
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:04:29.37
Bill
Right. Right.

01:04:30.00
Mike
Yeah, you know, and yes, I still want more. I still, know you know, but now I want more of good things, not things that are trying to fucking poison me.

01:04:32.58
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:04:36.33
Bill
Right.

01:04:36.76
Lane Kennedy
Right. Right.

01:04:38.90
Mike
Yes.

01:04:39.80
Bill
And, you know, the in the thing that is that and you mentioned the poison thing, and I was thinking about what you said too, Lane, and I i read, um I don't read a lot on Instagram, but I see some of these posts and I'll see a lot of things where I think it is probably, and I guess I haven't really paid attention, but it just kind of clicked. it My guess is that these articles that I'm going to mention in this mindset that I'm going to mention is probably coming from more the alcohol-free community, probably some of the AA community.

01:05:03.11
Bill
But um when people are talking about the, you know, carcinogens and the poison and really focusing on all that, you know, and every people who are really against like big alcohol and against alcohol and people shouldn't drink.

01:05:13.59
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:05:15.11
Bill
And, you know, more the almost like the holier than now up on a, you know, at a rooftop going alcohol kills, which, okay, sure. You know, I mean, I get it under the right circumstance, but, you know, Mike says it all the time.

01:05:23.03
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:05:26.76
Bill
You know, the dude can have a couple of pops at night and he gets up and, you know, goes to work and takes care of his kids. So what, what the fuck, man? You know, I mean, they say, whoever they is, that, you know, no amount of alcohol is is good for you.

01:05:32.63
Lane Kennedy
right

01:05:38.24
Bill
But then, you know, who's the dude? The the dude recently we were talking about, Mike, that said, Mimet, Dr.

01:05:43.99
Mike
Oh, yeah.

01:05:44.76
Bill
Oz. Yeah.

01:05:45.24
Mike
Yeah.

01:05:46.04
Bill
but Apparently, Dr. Oz is just saying, just don't drink at breakfast now. Yeah.

01:05:49.41
Lane Kennedy
Oh my God. Seriously?

01:05:50.49
Bill
Yeah. Yeah. I saw that recently and I but i brought it up and, you know, and Mike's, Mike's, cause he's saying that, you know, people get s nothing wrong with having a couple of drinks kind of as a social lubricant and, you know, thinking that it's probably not a good stance to take from somebody at that level.

01:05:51.77
Lane Kennedy
ah

01:05:51.91
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:05:52.47
Lane Kennedy
Jesus.

01:05:59.37
Lane Kennedy
Oh my God.

01:06:02.61
Bill
But then again, Mike made a good point. you know, if you're getting your, you know, getting all your, all your news and your, you know, your direction from, you know, some fucking politician or from the TV in general, you probably got more problems.

01:06:14.23
Lane Kennedy
Right?

01:06:14.42
Mike
um

01:06:14.95
Lane Kennedy
A lot more problems.

01:06:15.10
Bill
Yeah.

01:06:15.51
Mike
Right. And, and I mean, you know, the big book does talk about, look, we're not supposed to be anti-alcohol. You got to remember those guys, those guys were drunk in the prohibition.

01:06:21.34
Bill
Right. Right.

01:06:24.11
Mike
Shit was illegal when they were at their worst, you know?

01:06:25.47
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. Yeah.

01:06:27.59
Mike
Yeah. Right. You know, and well, you know, I've said it on here so many times, you know, legalize fucking everything, regulate it, tax it, you know, so yeah people are going to, people want to get out of themselves, right?

01:06:34.89
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:06:42.38
Mike
you know, normal people and us as well.

01:06:42.55
Lane Kennedy
Yep.

01:06:45.38
Mike
And it's, you know, it's never going to go away. So let's, let's stop, you know, the poison on the streets. You know, I mean, i i have a tattoo covering it now, but for a very long time, I had a mark on my arm because somebody cut my tar with shoe polish.

01:06:53.81
Bill
Right.

01:06:54.70
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:07:04.57
Mike
Yeah, you know, I put it in myself and I had this lovely little mark on my arm to remember it by for my entire life. It has tattoo over it now. ah Right.

01:07:14.41
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:07:15.67
Mike
So, you know, yes, legalize it all. Prohibition doesn't work. It's yes, I'm done with that now. yeah Right.

01:07:23.38
Bill
Well, and yeah, I mean, the whole, the whole fentanyl thing, you know, I mean, you know, people are, I mean, everything, um, I don't know if everything, but I know a lot of things it's like the, you know, the people are out on the street now grabbing, you know, or trying to pick up anything.

01:07:25.94
Mike
Right.

01:07:34.78
Bill
That's where all the, I mean, not all, but there's a lot of deaths out there that come from all this shit is, you know, fucking laced with fentanyl, you know?

01:07:40.86
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, it's not okay.

01:07:40.95
Mike
Right.

01:07:41.06
Bill
And no, it's not, it's not even close to being okay.

01:07:42.58
Mike
Yeah. what that I mean, you know, I i had conversations with newcomers in the rooms and, you know, you can't even get real heroin anymore, which I feel, so i talk about feeling sorry for the kids.

01:07:44.22
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:07:44.63
Bill
Right.

01:07:51.41
Lane Kennedy
No.

01:07:54.46
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:07:55.02
Mike
know.

01:07:56.92
Bill
what's What's happened in this world where where a kid can't even get some real heroin?

01:07:58.71
Mike
i know That's right.

01:08:01.38
Lane Kennedy
my God.

01:08:02.78
Bill
ah

01:08:02.92
Mike
Hmm.

01:08:04.31
Bill
But no, I mean, I just, I couldn't even i couldn't even imagine, you know, um and and I mean, i i think there would be... And Mike's talked about that. We've ever had like a deep conversation about it.

01:08:15.63
Bill
I don't disagree. I just don't know enough about it to really throw my hat in the ring. But I understand the concept, you know, because the whole point is, is that when when something is, you know, you think back to when when we were children, you know, um as soon as you were told that you couldn't do something or you had to do something, it was a fucking problem, you know.

01:08:32.62
Bill
Um, I always use the one that, you know, we had this, we lived in Pittsburgh. We had this yard and it was a small yard with a bunch of trees around it going to this big, beautiful, like ravine in the back. And we'd rake up leaves and jump into leaves.

01:08:43.86
Bill
And mom would come home and be like, well, you know, you got to rake all those up and get them out of the yard. And like at that point, well, that's so fucking good anymore. I don't want to rake leaves, you know, or as soon as you're told you can't do something, well, you, you can't, uh, you can't eat that.

01:08:54.87
Bill
You can't go there. You can't smoke that. You can't drink that. Well, why? You know, and, you know, you watch all the other people around, you go, well, we can do it, you know, in whatever the case is, um you know, so if it is, and Micah, the one, only one part you left out this time, Mike, you usually say that, you know, take all the revenue from the taxation and use it for treatment, you know?

01:09:14.36
Mike
Mm-hmm. Oh, yeah, right.

01:09:15.86
Lane Kennedy
Right, right.

01:09:15.99
Bill
Yeah. And I mean, he says that all the time, you know, so I mean, what, what a great idea. Now I I'm guessing what would happen if it were legalized, there'd be, there might be a dip, you know, some people going crazy with it right away, you know, but I mean, if again, and we, we just laughed about it, but so think about it this way.

01:09:26.76
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:09:30.76
Mike
Well.

01:09:32.12
Bill
If you're getting clean heroin, okay. It's not good for you.

01:09:34.95
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:09:35.21
Bill
I think we're all, all of the opinions that care was not good for you.

01:09:37.11
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, not good.

01:09:38.33
Bill
You know, but you get clean heroin versus something laced in fentanyl, you know, where, you know, if you if you're doing that, at least you got a chance of possibly living where you can get some treatment.

01:09:41.18
Lane Kennedy
Oh, God. Mm-hmm.

01:09:46.45
Bill
You do this shit laced with fentanyl, whatever the else of fucking shit is in there. And your chances of death go up by, you know, whatever percentage, you know.

01:09:50.25
Lane Kennedy
You're dead.

01:09:53.21
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:09:53.31
Mike
Right.

01:09:54.04
Bill
Again, I don't know how it would work. I'm not i'm not that smart, but you know I can see the concept behind it. And i don't I don't think it's a terrible concept. But I think as soon as the government figures out a way that they can they could justify it, and they well, they know like they can make money off of it.

01:10:00.85
Mike
here

01:10:05.29
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:10:07.31
Bill
They're making fucking billions off of off a weed.

01:10:07.51
Mike
Right. They already are.

01:10:09.59
Bill
Yeah, they're making billions off of fucking weed.

01:10:10.33
Mike
Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha.

01:10:11.67
Bill
They're making billions off of the pharmaceutical companies.

01:10:14.30
Lane Kennedy
Well, I mean, look at they're going into MDMA, right?

01:10:14.75
Bill
Right. Right.

01:10:16.78
Lane Kennedy
Ketamine, the psychedelics now.

01:10:16.92
Mike
Right.

01:10:18.66
Lane Kennedy
Like I'm all for it.

01:10:19.26
Mike
Right.

01:10:20.14
Lane Kennedy
Like let's go. Because those medicines can actually help people.

01:10:24.83
Mike
Sure.

01:10:24.98
Lane Kennedy
So let's open it up.

01:10:25.39
Bill
Right.

01:10:26.91
Mike
Yeah.

01:10:26.92
Lane Kennedy
It's like, come on. Yeah.

01:10:28.41
Mike
Yeah, I know. Stop demonizing. and Actually use the things for what they are. And and it clearly, you know, they hey, there is a reason why this stuff's around.

01:10:33.62
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:10:38.37
Mike
I mean, you know, um I've done pharmaceutical cocaine.

01:10:38.85
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. God. Mm-hmm.

01:10:42.17
Mike
um It's really fucking good.

01:10:42.93
Lane Kennedy
but

01:10:47.30
Mike
didn't use it right, but, um you know, but right.

01:10:49.75
Bill
ah

01:10:50.34
Mike
Yeah.

01:10:51.35
Bill
Well, who's to say if you used it right? i It sounds like it.

01:10:53.14
Mike
yeah wow

01:10:55.06
Lane Kennedy
god

01:10:57.27
Mike
Right. But I mean, you know, all this stuff in the pain management and all that. And yeah Jesus Christ, man, you know, stop demonizing the substances and let's get to the solution. Because as again, I read somewhere that alcohol was just a symptom, which means heroin is just a symptom, which means crack is just a symptom, which means whatever is just a symptom.

01:11:11.90
Lane Kennedy
Yep. Right.

01:11:17.42
Mike
We need to cure the symptom, not the fucking substance.

01:11:22.20
Bill
Right. And I just, ah and i got I got one. I never did a drug in my life before I got sober, but I got i got one on Mike now.

01:11:26.87
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:11:28.24
Bill
I've done fentanyl. Okay. So when I had my, I had two stents put in after the the whole heart thing.

01:11:29.93
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:11:34.68
Bill
And the the second one, they might've done it on the first one too, but I know for sure. They gave me morphine and then fentanyl for, you know, again, but again, it was used in a prescribed manner.

01:11:41.72
Lane Kennedy
Wow.

01:11:45.60
Bill
And to begin with, I'm like, i'm like I don't know if I want to fuck with the fentanyl, but then you know what?

01:11:46.07
Lane Kennedy
Uh

01:11:49.56
Bill
Seriously, part of me, I'm like, fuck it. First of all, um they know better than me. You know, that's number one.

01:11:54.57
Lane Kennedy
huh. Yeah. Yeah.

01:11:55.38
Bill
um They know, I mean, I told everyone that would listen four times that i'm that I'm an alcoholic, how long I've been sober and I don't want to fuck with things and whatever the case is.

01:12:02.96
Lane Kennedy
Mm hmm.

01:12:03.58
Bill
So everyone knew from the, from the doctors to the nurses to everyone fucking knew what my deal was.

01:12:03.70
Lane Kennedy
Mm hmm.

01:12:08.26
Bill
But, you know, like, you know, like Mike was talking about, I mean, they they got to get you to a state where they could do this procedure. So you're not, you know, feeling pain and, you know, flopping all over the goddamn place.

01:12:13.61
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:12:13.69
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:12:17.00
Bill
So, you know, I got to, I got to take, you know, fentanyl in a controlled area.

01:12:17.66
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:12:22.14
Bill
And I swear to God, Lane would, when they were doing it like, okay, it's now it's time for the don't care medicine.

01:12:22.41
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:12:22.42
Lane Kennedy
God.

01:12:28.06
Bill
Here it comes. And, You know, they gave me Versa to begin with that I've i've had before when I've had I had one other the procedure years ago. So that's the first one to kind of just easy in and then they did whatever else. But I sat there and I'm like, I'll never probably never be able to do this again, you know, or at least maybe I won't.

01:12:43.04
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:12:44.02
Mike
if he

01:12:44.82
Bill
So I really tried to just focus and enjoy the high.

01:12:48.11
Lane Kennedy
Oh my God.

01:12:48.89
Bill
And it happened to God, it happened to goddamn quick before I do it. I'm just like, I think I'm fucking high. I'm like, I think, I think I'm, I think I'm looped up.

01:12:53.37
Lane Kennedy
Oh my God.

01:12:56.17
Bill
I think he's done. and I think um i I bypassed him. I'm like, that's okay. This is fine. You know, but I missed it. i didn't miss it, but you know what I mean?

01:13:03.80
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. Yeah.

01:13:04.41
Bill
It was just, it was just fucking weird. I'm like, I need to be able to, I need to remember this moment.

01:13:09.62
Lane Kennedy
Need to remember it.

01:13:09.89
Bill
Yeah.

01:13:10.62
Lane Kennedy
Right. Right.

01:13:11.22
Bill
Well, there was, who was, uh, Mark Marin talked about it, didn't he? Who was talking about with the colonoscopies? Was that Marin that was talking about?

01:13:16.76
Mike
Yeah, that was from Aaron. Yeah.

01:13:18.10
Bill
Yeah. I get a freebie. That's what, uh, I told the nurses that I'm like, yeah, buddy of mine calls this a, I said, yeah, hit me up with that fentanyl, man. I said, a buddy of mine calls me, it calls this a freebie anyhow. And I said, I'm like, do you know Mark Marin is?

01:13:29.04
Bill
And she didn't for whatever reason. I'm like, he does the same thing. You go in for a procedure and you get it prescribed. It's a freebie, you know? So I said, fucking hit me up, man.

01:13:34.51
Lane Kennedy
Oh my God. Oh,

01:13:36.54
Bill
It's fine. I'm good.

01:13:37.43
Mike
see

01:13:38.02
Bill
Yeah.

01:13:38.65
Lane Kennedy
that scares me.

01:13:40.09
Bill
Yeah, you know what, but the thing of it is is that, um you know it just again, it was under a controlled environment and in all that stuff.

01:13:44.31
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. Yeah.

01:13:45.69
Bill
And I'd never taken with any of that stuff. I never took any pain medication. I actually have have taken less things after coming out of there because I was taking over-the-counter stuff for allergy medications, cold medications, ibuprofen, because I'm you know just soreness and whatever because getting fucking old.

01:13:49.64
Lane Kennedy
Right,

01:13:59.38
Lane Kennedy
right.

01:13:59.98
Bill
you know but um you know So I've taken less things since that time frame.

01:14:00.25
Lane Kennedy
right

01:14:03.86
Bill
So I haven't taken more. I've taken less of stuff. Um, but we don't want to, I don't want to get too far away from, cause I know you've, you've been dipped into a little bit about the book. You've dipped into a little bit about your wellness stuff.

01:14:14.13
Bill
Um, tell us about your wellness thing and anything else you want to talk about the book. I, we, I, this has been a great conversation. Don't get me wrong, but I don't want to, we don't, we want you to be able to whore out your stuff too, while you're on here and not just talk about fun stuff like fentanyl.

01:14:26.65
Lane Kennedy
Hey, for me, it's all about you know recovery, right? So this is a great conversation.

01:14:28.85
Bill
Right. Yeah, I know. I know.

01:14:30.53
Lane Kennedy
Just like, whatever, game on.

01:14:32.54
Bill
ah

01:14:33.47
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. yeah Yeah, the book, I mean, the book is out there, right?

01:14:36.15
Mike
Yeah, so the book.

01:14:37.56
Bill
Yeah, so the book and then your your DNA stuff and your wellness stuff.

01:14:43.00
Mike
he

01:14:43.29
Lane Kennedy
It's Sobriety for Dummies. Anybody can pick it up. There's a podcast that goes along with it. you can so you can go through and listen to Tamara and I kind of go through each chapter, which is really fun.

01:14:52.82
Mike
Cool.

01:14:53.27
Lane Kennedy
ah But more importantly, I think, You know, a year ago, i mean, you know this, Bill, I landed in the ER, right?

01:15:03.38
Bill
i I got wind of something. I didn't know exactly what was what, but I caught kind of the the gist that there was something that went on.

01:15:06.97
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:15:10.07
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, so like a year ago, I think this is what I want to bring up, is that a year ago I landed in the ah ER and it took me by surprise. i basically broke my nervous system. And I share that because I'm okay.

01:15:25.94
Lane Kennedy
I think sober people, we've got our, we've got our shit together. Let's just say that out loud. Right? Like we've got it going on. So I, um, I work in the wellness space.

01:15:37.67
Lane Kennedy
I'm a mindfulness teacher. I'm a meditation teacher. I'm doing my program, but I landed in the ah ER. I broke my nervous system and i go into this dark, dark place of, I should have known better.

01:15:52.25
Lane Kennedy
right And this this is what I want.

01:15:52.51
Bill
Right.

01:15:54.87
Lane Kennedy
like This is addiction at 28 years sober of the shoulda, coulda, woulda.

01:15:57.04
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:16:01.84
Lane Kennedy
And it is so deadly. So I've spent the last year of my life kind of rehabilitating myself, recuperating and understanding the nervous system to a whole new level, which has been incredibly useful for the client work that I do. And so now you know I look at people's DNA.

01:16:22.84
Lane Kennedy
and can really make protocols around stress because let's face it, everybody is stressed in the world that we live in today.

01:16:32.19
Bill
Right.

01:16:34.01
Lane Kennedy
um I work with the first responders and sometimes they have three phones. Sometimes they're sitting at a desk with three monitors. I work with... teachers i work with the district attorney's office. i work like I work with all different types of people and stress is unilateral. it's it's It's affecting everybody.

01:16:52.88
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:16:53.37
Lane Kennedy
And so understanding somebody's DNA, i can look at their DNA and kind of like make a prescription, so to speak, on how to eat, how to move, how to live.

01:17:06.52
Lane Kennedy
Because your DNA going to express itself and stress is the number one killer. And it may, you know, the doctor's not going to say stress is the the problem. They're going say, oh, you just had a heart attack.

01:17:19.35
Bill
Right.

01:17:19.89
Lane Kennedy
right? They're going to say, oh, you have a cholesterol problem. They're going to oh, you have diabetes. But underneath like stress, your nervous system is what's happening here. that That's a trigger.

01:17:31.60
Lane Kennedy
And underneath that is understanding your DNA. So what, you know, I look at people and I'm like, okay, these are the little corrections that we can make for you. So your system is not so stressed.

01:17:43.58
Lane Kennedy
So your DNA doesn't express itself. So we can change ah your breast cancer diagnosis, right? there's so There's so many ways that I work with clients around this. Did I just say too much?

01:17:56.66
Mike
No, I don't think so.

01:17:56.71
Bill
No, no, no, no, not at all.

01:17:57.66
Lane Kennedy
ah

01:17:58.04
Bill
Not all.

01:17:59.64
Mike
i i'm I'm waiting to hear more.

01:17:59.67
Bill
No. yeah

01:18:01.44
Mike
I don't think you said enough.

01:18:01.91
Bill
Yeah. Yeah. We are, we're actually listening. We're listening intently.

01:18:05.83
Lane Kennedy
Okay, I love that. ah And a lot of times, you know, what will happen is that somebody will come in into me and they'll say, you know, I have this brain fog right now and, you know, I'm starting to forget things and I'm overwhelmed and, you know, I can look at their DNA and i'll there's a couple of genes that are associated with, um you know, Alzheimer's, dementia.

01:18:30.12
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:18:30.26
Lane Kennedy
And, you know, these are these can be really scary genes.

01:18:30.26
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:18:34.79
Bill
Right.

01:18:35.19
Lane Kennedy
You know, and people don't want to know this information, but this is the information that can change the last, you know, the last quarter of your life.

01:18:45.89
Bill
Right.

01:18:46.42
Lane Kennedy
right So as somebody who is in recovery, it's like wouldn't you want to know that information? Wouldn't you want to understand like how your genes are going to express themselves in the last quarter?

01:18:58.71
Lane Kennedy
I don't know. I think it just makes a lot of sense.

01:19:00.38
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:19:00.73
Bill
right Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:19:02.68
Lane Kennedy
like What are the things that you can do today um that's going to allow you to sleep better, is going to allow you to not have anxiety when you walk into a meeting, right?

01:19:14.23
Lane Kennedy
Like there's so many different different scenarios where I'm supporting someone. ah One, i have a lot of athletes and a lot of times these athletes are training.

01:19:28.22
Lane Kennedy
And they're actually overtraining.

01:19:29.97
Mike
Right.

01:19:30.46
Lane Kennedy
So then I say, you know what, here's your genes. It's like I give them permission to take the weekends off.

01:19:36.14
Bill
Right.

01:19:36.18
Lane Kennedy
Because in their mind, they're thinking, well, I'm running, I got a triathlon. I got to like, that this is the this is what I'm doing. But their genetics are, you know, they're pushing too hard.

01:19:47.16
Lane Kennedy
So therefore their ankles are blowing out or their knees are wrapped and, you know, they're taking the ice baths.

01:19:47.30
Mike
Right.

01:19:52.80
Lane Kennedy
And i'm like, no, actually, if you just take two days a week off, all of this is going to change. So it's been a pretty, um I've been doing this now for, well, my son is 16, so 16, almost 17 years.

01:20:06.87
Lane Kennedy
And it's been kind of a game changer, like honestly, understanding it.

01:20:12.03
Bill
Right.

01:20:14.49
Bill
So you were, you were doing the whole DNA thing in the nervous system thing before you had your, your incident or issue last year or no?

01:20:21.18
Lane Kennedy
Yes.

01:20:22.22
Bill
Oh, okay. Okay.

01:20:22.71
Lane Kennedy
Yes. Yes. And that's why it's, that is why I think, oh my God, like then nobody's been paying attention to the nervous system.

01:20:32.28
Bill
Right.

01:20:33.05
Lane Kennedy
Like nobody's talking about it. like But that is the one thing, you know, people will say, oh, it's the microbiome. You know, that's like a big term now, the microbiome, the microbiome.

01:20:40.87
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:20:43.91
Lane Kennedy
You got to work at the gut. But really, no, it's the nervous system. The nervous system and the immune system are the two systems in the whole body that are constantly on or talking to each other.

01:20:49.91
Mike
Yeah.

01:20:55.10
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:20:55.86
Lane Kennedy
So if you can like understand that, you can start to make some changes.

01:21:01.75
Bill
Well, you it was funny, too, is that so I when I because I'm in northwest Indiana right now and actually staying at our our sister's house. and I've been down here actually coming up on four years now.

01:21:11.93
Bill
The short story is came down here. Our mom was sick, came down to help out with all that stuff. And she had passed away in October 22 and got the estate settled, and blah, blah, blah. And then that's what I started, you know, kind of doing the traveling and whatever the case is.

01:21:23.96
Bill
But in that meantime, from the time that she passed to the time I started doing the traveling, i left the job that I was at in Milwaukee because I was working remote and then got a different job. But it was funny that, and do you remember that?

01:21:35.12
Bill
I'm sure you remember that, Mike, is that, you know, I get, I would get, because years ago I had like really bad acid reflux, had stomach surgery.

01:21:35.84
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:21:36.45
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:21:42.73
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:21:43.76
Bill
So I get heartburn every once in a while, um almost weekly, you know, or every couple of days, whatever the thing was, literally like two, three days out of, this job that I was at in Milwaukee, um my heartburn went away.

01:21:56.92
Lane Kennedy
Uh-huh,

01:21:56.98
Bill
And I was fucking, I'm like, ah I'm like, this is crazy. I'm like, clearly it was, it was the stress.

01:22:00.30
Lane Kennedy
uh-huh. Uh-huh.

01:22:02.22
Bill
Now, the funny part is, is i'm I'm starting to get it again, you know, and I started to get it over the last probably handful of months.

01:22:05.85
Mike
specific

01:22:06.47
Lane Kennedy
Uh-huh.

01:22:08.26
Bill
But I mean, I'm i'm not happy with my job situation.

01:22:08.69
Lane Kennedy
Uh-huh.

01:22:11.04
Bill
mean, granted, I had this whole heart thing. That's a little stressful. You know, so um ah money things here and there, you know, because mean, things got slow at work, blah, blah, blah.

01:22:17.14
Lane Kennedy
Yep.

01:22:19.14
Bill
So, I mean, i I think I understand where it's coming from again, you know, but I mean, I'm working on on getting myself, you know, kind of changed in that circumstance. But I've had, I never realized it, but and it was crazy to me that when that happened, when again, I quit job and my heartburn went away.

01:22:26.06
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:22:35.36
Bill
It was it fucking nuts, you know? Right?

01:22:37.50
Lane Kennedy
Yep, yep. the The correlation, right? Like stress, the current of stress that the human body is under right now is incredible.

01:22:41.78
Bill
Right.

01:22:42.01
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:22:48.76
Lane Kennedy
So, you know, like, and and we don't really think about it anyway anymore because we've normalized it.

01:22:48.79
Mike
Yep.

01:22:49.06
Bill
Right.

01:22:54.52
Bill
Right, right.

01:22:54.55
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:22:55.46
Lane Kennedy
We've normalized scrolling on Instagram. when that's actually a trauma of response, right?

01:23:01.50
Mike
Right?

01:23:01.59
Lane Kennedy
Like we're, we're just causing ourself trauma when, you know, so it's, we're in a sad situation. I don't know.

01:23:09.97
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:23:11.00
Bill
Yeah, you know, and I, and the thing it is, is that, and it's kind of funny that, like, like you said, when, when you said you should have known better, you know, obviously when you ended up in the ER and, and I should have known better with my heart situation.

01:23:17.53
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. Yeah.

01:23:21.24
Bill
So the, and again, from the, from the family history I had, my dad died or a great grandpa, 63, grandpa, 63, dad, 66, all of massive heart attacks.

01:23:21.37
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:23:26.61
Mike
Thank you.

01:23:31.42
Bill
And none of them really, our dad was sort of mindful of his condition, but not really, he didn't really take care of himself that much.

01:23:31.60
Lane Kennedy
Wow.

01:23:36.96
Lane Kennedy
Uh huh. Uh huh.

01:23:38.34
Bill
And I was doing the same goddamn thing. But, you know, and even our sister said after the after it happened, she's like she was blown away because she's like, this isn't supposed to happen till you're in your 60s.

01:23:40.70
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:23:48.06
Mike
a

01:23:48.22
Bill
So even so literally even she was of the, you know, ah not on purpose, but all of us were the same mindset.

01:23:51.41
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:23:54.49
Bill
This stuff i I got another six, seven years until I even got to think about this, you know.

01:23:58.20
Lane Kennedy
No, no.

01:23:58.55
Bill
But had I went in there, that's the only thing when after all said and done, you I, I, I apologize to, to my, you know, all the family members close to me. I apologize to my kids. I'm like, this was going to happen.

01:24:09.25
Bill
It's hereditary based on everything that I know, or me abusing my body, drinking, smoking, eating like shit for years, combination, whatever it is, this was going to happen one way or the other, but it didn't have to be a surprise phone call on a Saturday afternoon when I was in Missouri, by the way.

01:24:22.84
Bill
You know, so um none of that had to happen. But when I told my son and my son's 25, I said, here's the thing, you know, because we've talked about, you know, the drinking, whatever. I don't get on him.

01:24:32.07
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:24:32.40
Bill
He does his thing.

01:24:33.43
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:24:33.44
Bill
He's a good kid. He knows what I'm doing. He knows what Mike's doing.

01:24:36.11
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:24:36.19
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:24:36.20
Bill
And if he has an issue, he's going he knows where to go. That's where we leave it with him.

01:24:41.07
Lane Kennedy
Yep. Right.

01:24:41.51
Bill
Um, and he, I don't think he's got, I mean that he doesn't have a problem, but he understands us and what the deal is and the hereditary part of it. But I told him, I said, this, this is a different deal. I'm like, clearly now you got four individuals, all males and the side of the family.

01:24:55.31
Bill
And and I was almost the fourth one that died. You know, I said, so what ah I said, this is what I said.

01:24:58.65
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:25:01.11
Bill
My suggestion to you is from now on, when you go in for your physical or anytime you step foot in a doctor's office, just have them take a look at your shit, you know?

01:25:09.53
Lane Kennedy
Yep, yep.

01:25:10.17
Bill
Have them start monitoring it when you're 25 and 26. I said, maybe this could be, if they can see it going in a direction, they could do something. So you don't end up in your mid to late fifties, you know, in a fucking hospital, you know, having to get, you know, two heart stets, you know?

01:25:24.11
Mike
Yep.

01:25:24.40
Lane Kennedy
He can also, right, like this is diet and lifestyle can change that completely, right?

01:25:28.53
Bill
Right. Yeah.

01:25:30.15
Lane Kennedy
So if he just becomes aware of that, he can make those changes.

01:25:30.37
Bill
Right.

01:25:35.48
Bill
Well, and that's the thing. That's why I talked to him because he's, you know, the the thing that is in that all the people in our family around us, you know, him included and, you know, anyone that we that we know. And, um you know, we don't get up on, you know, on soapboxes or anything like that.

01:25:48.00
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:25:48.08
Bill
But people people know what we went through.

01:25:50.36
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:25:50.38
Bill
um They've heard our stories, family, friends, all those sort of things. They know what the deal is. And there' there's enough of this recovery and in their lives where if nothing else, we've we've thrown a bag full of seeds at them, if nothing else, you know.

01:25:58.51
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:26:02.89
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:26:03.26
Bill
um

01:26:03.29
Lane Kennedy
Right.

01:26:04.06
Bill
And hopefully, if anything, if anything happens, you know, then they know what to do, or at least they know where to go. And that was the same thing I wanted to bring up with him is just start getting him mindful, because at this point, I mean, I mean, granted, yeah, my dad was an alcoholic.

01:26:09.11
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:26:16.82
Bill
I think our grandpa might have had some things, but not really. I don't have enough. nothing really fact-based that I could go on. But now, I mean, literally this is the, you can't deny that there's some sort of hard things in our family.

01:26:27.54
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:26:27.89
Bill
You know, it just is what it is. You know, everyone, everyone wears the color green. So, well, you got g green on two today.

01:26:33.05
Lane Kennedy
You got green, yeah.

01:26:33.57
Bill
So, you know, it just be careful because that's what I told him. I said, it's all going to say, but I said, just, that's my suggestion, you know, so you don't have to fucking deal with this shit, you know, but no, no, was just going to say, yeah.

01:26:42.05
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

01:26:47.41
Lane Kennedy
What? No, I'm just saying because you're 57 it happened and theirs happened later, but the amount of stress that you're under now is different than what they're what they were under, right?

01:26:49.23
Bill
So

01:26:53.62
Bill
Right.

01:26:55.78
Mike
Yep. Yep.

01:26:57.71
Lane Kennedy
So that inflammation in your body is different.

01:27:00.48
Bill
Right.

01:27:02.58
Lane Kennedy
So therefore it's younger.

01:27:03.20
Bill
Yeah.

01:27:04.60
Lane Kennedy
and And for your son, it will be different, right?

01:27:04.84
Bill
Right.

01:27:07.61
Mike
a

01:27:07.75
Lane Kennedy
his ah His amount of stress, the way if he's got a phone or a screen, how old is he? Exactly. So yeah, that his spatial, you know, kind of awareness and his eye stress is already exponentially changed him.

01:27:14.39
Bill
Right.

01:27:15.13
Mike
ah

01:27:15.44
Bill
Yeah.

01:27:25.19
Mike
Yep.

01:27:25.38
Bill
Right.

01:27:25.72
Lane Kennedy
So it's going to, it's going to happen quicker for him.

01:27:26.07
Mike
Absolutely.

01:27:29.14
Lane Kennedy
Yes.

01:27:29.14
Mike
Yeah.

01:27:29.24
Bill
Well, and, it and, you know, that's the only thing that,

01:27:29.91
Mike
And living in the last days of a dying Republic doesn't help either.

01:27:33.43
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, exactly. Jesus. So grim. I'm so sorry.

01:27:37.05
Bill
Well, and that's what I that's what i asked the nurse. I'm like, I know you can't really answer this question, but I said, you know i said what do you think? I said, given an educated guess, seeing the things that you do, I said, do you think this was more hereditary?

01:27:47.95
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:27:49.79
Bill
Do you think it was lifestyle? Blah, blah, blah. And she goes, no way for any of us to know. She goes, the easiest thing I can tell you, though, is it because at that point, you know clearly I was 15 years sober, um went over my diet.

01:27:59.01
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:27:59.92
Bill
She knew I was eating right. Whenever I was started, I had you know been hiking and doing whatever and walking for last year and a half prior to that. She goes, everything you've done over the last 15 years kept you out of here. You know, you you would have been here earlier or maybe not at all, you know, had you not made those changes. So she said your lifestyle prevented you from either being here earlier or never getting here.

01:28:19.85
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, yeah,

01:28:20.22
Bill
And I'm like, this's okay, that's what what else can I ask for? You know, she gave me the, that's the answer.

01:28:24.50
Lane Kennedy
yeah. yeah

01:28:26.22
Bill
That's the answer right there.

01:28:26.36
Lane Kennedy
yeah

01:28:27.38
Bill
So, um okay, so I don't want to cut anything off here, but I'm looking it because I know what, I know timeframe we were talking about. We're looking at eight minutes until um the the top of the hour, which you were talking about.

01:28:38.47
Bill
So your choice, is there anything that you want to wrap up with, say, direct people to anything like that? Because I, you know, we want to be respectful of your time.

01:28:50.78
Lane Kennedy
yeah I mean, everything is going to be in your show notes, right?

01:28:54.17
Mike
Right.

01:28:54.46
Bill
Right, right.

01:28:54.51
Mike
Right.

01:28:54.84
Lane Kennedy
Yeah, lanekennedy.com. All of my information is over lanekennedy.com. I have a ton of videos. I have DNA stuff. I have mindfulness stuff. I have meditation stuff.

01:29:05.88
Lane Kennedy
right like I'm so clear on my purpose. like I know that not only do I need to stay sober, but I need to support people's nervous system. And there are several ways to support one's nervous system. I am not of the variety of saying that meditation is the go-to answer.

01:29:25.05
Lane Kennedy
And I'm a meditation teacher, but no, that...

01:29:26.69
Mike
Sure. Yeah. Well, yeah as we talked about, you know, there are many paths, there are many ways we can do this thing.

01:29:31.26
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. there

01:29:33.49
Mike
And hey, guess what? That counts for, you know, all kinds of stuff. Again, it all comes back to the program, right?

01:29:36.95
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:29:38.65
Mike
You know, there's all kinds of paths, but the the bottom line is we need to do something.

01:29:39.00
Lane Kennedy
It really does.

01:29:44.60
Mike
Action, right? Simple program of action.

01:29:47.78
Lane Kennedy
It's so funny how, you know,

01:29:52.66
Lane Kennedy
just... i didn't I wasn't looking for this like life, right but the life that I live is like so easy in in so in so many ways.

01:29:58.98
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:29:59.51
Bill
right

01:30:03.74
Mike
Yes.

01:30:05.17
Lane Kennedy
And I used to think, I was the variety of you've got to meditate and it's got to look a certain way.

01:30:05.50
Mike
Mm

01:30:12.83
Mike
hmm. Mm

01:30:13.50
Lane Kennedy
And I was very rigid around the 12 steps and around being in meetings and just, I don't know, a lot.

01:30:18.11
Mike
hmm.

01:30:24.25
Lane Kennedy
And when I collapsed last year and I spent this last year in bed and trying to just really kind of reevaluating life, you know, there's been a lot of me throwing my hands up in the air and saying, i don't know.

01:30:24.49
Mike
Sure.

01:30:33.20
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:30:40.38
Lane Kennedy
Like, i don't know, dude.

01:30:40.47
Bill
a

01:30:42.04
Mike
m

01:30:42.82
Lane Kennedy
Like the, the, the, you do you it's like across the board everything.

01:30:42.90
Mike
little surrender yeah

01:30:48.50
Mike
here

01:30:48.87
Bill
Right.

01:30:50.74
Lane Kennedy
you know I'm also a meditation teacher that has been teaching for 10 years or whatever it's been now, where when I first started teaching, I was again very rigid.

01:31:01.06
Lane Kennedy
like You have to sit, you have to do this.

01:31:02.34
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

01:31:02.74
Lane Kennedy
And you know I didn't know that actually sitting could put you into a trauma response. I just was like... So clueless, so clueless.

01:31:09.18
Bill
hey

01:31:11.86
Lane Kennedy
But you couldn't have told me that then, right?

01:31:14.56
Bill
Right.

01:31:14.78
Lane Kennedy
I would have been like, how dare you say that? That's not right. Like, no.

01:31:18.20
Bill
hey

01:31:19.93
Lane Kennedy
And so I just, I look at this, you know, this last year, this kind of this incident that occurred, it was it was purposeful. Like I needed this year to evaluate my life

01:31:32.52
Mike
Mm.

01:31:32.63
Bill
Right.

01:31:33.11
Lane Kennedy
to kind of come back like, oh, where am I going? What am I doing? How am I serving people?

01:31:40.66
Mike
Mm.

01:31:41.62
Lane Kennedy
And when I can stay in that kind of momentum situation,

01:31:46.48
Mike
Mm.

01:31:48.23
Lane Kennedy
It's good. Like, I'm so good.

01:31:49.30
Mike
yelp

01:31:49.40
Bill
Right.

01:31:52.50
Mike
yeah

01:31:52.73
Lane Kennedy
and And so I guess for the listener, it's like, you know, you're going to find your way in and however in whatever you do. um And I'm just so grateful that I've had, you know, the...

01:32:05.08
Lane Kennedy
the sober sobriety, the years and the experience.

01:32:06.87
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:32:09.43
Lane Kennedy
And then I just stay, right? Like i i haven't picked up another drink.

01:32:11.74
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:32:13.73
Lane Kennedy
I haven't picked up a drug to alter my mind and get checked out.

01:32:15.40
Mike
Right.

01:32:18.57
Lane Kennedy
It's it's like, this is a journey that just continues to evolve.

01:32:18.58
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:32:24.12
Mike
That's it.

01:32:24.22
Lane Kennedy
and And that is like the biggest gift because i i wasn't looking for this when I got here.

01:32:28.31
Mike
Yeah, absolutely.

01:32:28.73
Bill
Right.

01:32:30.26
Mike
Right.

01:32:30.63
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:32:30.97
Mike
Well, and and that's just it. Continue to stay open-minded and and willing because, like you said, you know, meditation, right? You were rigid about it. And then and then you realized, no, there's there's other stuff, you know?

01:32:39.77
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:32:44.89
Mike
Right. we We have this. We have the answers. We know what's going on. And then... We don't again.

01:32:51.10
Bill
hey

01:32:51.82
Mike
And that's, and that's the beautiful thing, but we have to be open to that constantly.

01:32:52.15
Lane Kennedy
Mm-hmm.

01:32:56.30
Mike
We have to keep reminding ourselves that yes, we've got a few answers and yes, we've got a way to do things and it's working and it's wonderful, but, But there might be more.

01:33:06.82
Mike
There is more.

01:33:07.30
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:33:07.82
Mike
there

01:33:07.91
Lane Kennedy
There's always more.

01:33:08.78
Mike
There's always more.

01:33:09.17
Bill
Right.

01:33:09.78
Mike
And that's what we want.

01:33:12.01
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:33:12.08
Mike
we're We're fucking alcoholics and drug addicts.

01:33:12.27
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:33:14.24
Mike
We want more.

01:33:14.55
Lane Kennedy
so success

01:33:15.40
Mike
So keep yourself open to that more.

01:33:16.57
Bill
and

01:33:18.04
Mike
Yes, this is good and this is working, but there's more. Continue to look for it. Continue to be open to it. that's And that's exactly what you've told me tonight. Yeah, you know, right.

01:33:31.29
Mike
28 years sober and 10 years of meditation. And and and then it then there it stopped. You got hit, literally. and and And you went, oh, wait, no, there's more.

01:33:43.99
Lane Kennedy
the

01:33:44.19
Mike
There's there's more.

01:33:44.34
Bill
hey

01:33:46.06
Lane Kennedy
There's more.

01:33:47.10
Bill
yeah

01:33:47.38
Lane Kennedy
Oh, God help me more.

01:33:47.54
Mike
and and and we And we want more. and So that's good.

01:33:51.51
Lane Kennedy
Yeah.

01:33:51.70
Bill
Absolutely.

01:33:52.23
Mike
We're right where we need to be.

01:33:55.77
Bill
All right. Well, we will, ah we'll, we'll wrap this up and yes, everything will be, and I didn't have your, I did not have your website in the promo on Instagram, but I'll have your Instagram and your website in the, in obviously ah the click through in the show notes and description.

01:33:59.18
Mike
Right.

01:34:08.97
Bill
So everyone, you worst case scenario, it's her fucking name.com. Okay.

01:34:13.34
Mike
yeah

01:34:13.82
Lane Kennedy
Yeah. Lane Kennedy. Yeah.

01:34:15.77
Bill
Yeah.

01:34:15.90
Mike
right

01:34:16.09
Bill
like There you go.

01:34:17.91
Lane Kennedy
So good to be with you guys. Thanks so much.

01:34:19.80
Bill
Yeah, not a problem. So, um yeah, mike Mike's got his his little way of shooting us out of here, but don't don't go away yet. Remember, don't go away until we're all done. Then we'll tell we'll tell you you can go away, okay? So stick around for a minute.

01:34:29.30
Lane Kennedy
yep

01:34:29.88
Mike
All right. Well, thank you everyone for listening to yet another episode of Sober Not Mature. Thank you, Lane, for coming on and hanging out with us. We totally appreciated it. It was very cool. And now, um as always, be kind to each other. be good to each other. go out and do something nice for somebody else this week and don't tell anybody you did it.

01:34:52.66
Mike
Now, from the bottom of my heart to the depths of my soul, from the beginning of time until the ends of the earth, always and eternally, fuck you Now it's time, kids. Oh boy, is it time. It's time for you to fuck off. Then keep fucking off. Keep fucking off till you get to a gate with a sign on it saying, you cannot fuck off past here.

01:35:17.91
Mike
Climb over that gate. Dream the impossible dream and keep fucking off forever.

01:35:25.74
Bill
that's our That's our fun little way of closing out our episodes.

01:35:28.25
Lane Kennedy
That is fucking brilliant.

01:35:29.66
Bill
Yeah. Well, thank you. Thank you. it It was pieced together over the years, but we have fun with it. It's Mike's favorite part because it means the episode's done. so Lane, it's I can't even tell you.

01:35:40.15
Bill
It's been it's been wonderful. um Thank you. Thank you very much. And I was going to tell you before, your audio has been fucking spectacular, by the way.

01:35:46.04
Mike
<unk>

01:35:46.91
Bill
anybody want Anyone who wants to come on here, sound like Lane did.

01:35:47.06
Lane Kennedy
Oh, good.

01:35:50.15
Bill
God damn it.

01:35:50.20
Mike
Yeah, God damn it.

01:35:50.83
Bill
we We're audio only. She sounded wonderful. So...

01:35:53.82
Lane Kennedy
Fantastic.

01:35:54.78
Bill
yeah All right, Mike, I love you, brother.

01:35:56.57
Mike
Love you too.

01:35:57.66
Bill
We will talk soon.

01:35:58.74
Lane Kennedy
Thanks, guys.

01:35:58.78
Mike
We shall.

01:36:00.18
Bill
Everyone else, goodbye.

01:36:02.56
Mike
Bye.