SoberNotMature - Episode 185 (Danger Moose & The Cheese In The Morning)

 

00:01.29
Bill
All right, everyone. Welcome once again.

00:05.33
Mike
Hi there. Hmm.

00:09.04
Bill
Take two. This is sober, not mature. God damn it. Jesus fucking Christ.

00:12.37
Mike
hi there

00:14.58
Bill
and Just ah laughing at the situation. So we we the guests we were supposed to have on tonight. We still may Kate might pop in here in ah in a few minutes, but. the The short story is we we were messing around for the last, I don't know, 20, 25 minutes. And I understand she's getting frustrated.

00:29.40
Bill
I get it. You know, it's the, it's not working, whatever. So finally we're like, like, Hey, we're just going to start recording. And um she's going to try to pop in. But I told her, I'm like, if we can't hear you, we're just going to fucking kick you out.

00:39.98
Bill
So she's like, that's fair.

00:40.05
Mike
Right.

00:41.58
Bill
Yeah.

00:43.04
Mike
homesome

00:43.14
Bill
But anyhow, so one one way or the other, one way or or the fucking other, we' we'll end up having K-dye. We'll figure it out. but You know, I mean, we're i werere between the three of us, I think semi-intent.

00:53.77
Bill
There's a little bit of intelligence somewhere in between combined.

00:54.11
Mike
Right. Well, I mean, you know, what right.

00:57.71
Bill
Yeah.

00:59.03
Mike
Flyer into Indiana.

01:01.54
Bill
Right.

01:02.51
Mike
Hehehehe.

01:04.48
Bill
Hey, hey, but Mr. Vitella. I'm going to put your wife up here for a couple of days.

01:08.81
Mike
Right.

01:11.32
Bill
so

01:11.98
Mike
Right.

01:12.05
Bill
No, and i I actually know, I know who her husband is.

01:13.03
Mike
Okay.

01:14.45
Bill
I mean, I've never actually met him.

01:15.39
Mike
Gotcha.

01:15.85
Bill
He's been on, he's been on the meetings and stuff like that with the Silver Curator, but um I don't, I don't, I don't really know him really well.

01:16.10
Mike
Right. okay gotcha

01:22.30
Bill
I don't think that would, that would fly one way or the other. You know what? Short of of bringing her in and and putting her up here at in Indiana or sending her out to Cleveland, don't know.

01:30.47
Mike
right

01:30.99
Bill
ah We're going figure it out. We're going to figure it out. So, um but yeah, the reason I was laughing on the way in, because I'm just like, i told Mike, he's like, ah I got to grab my book now. And he's doing this. And I'm like, I'll just, I'm just going to start up and start rambling and explain what's happening.

01:42.89
Bill
And I just, I don't know why I just started laughing. So anyhow, in case anyone didn't figure it out, this is sober, not mature.

01:45.54
Mike
instance

01:50.93
Bill
Yeah.

01:51.29
Mike
Right. I hope they figured it out. They clicked on the fucking shit.

01:55.89
Bill
I know, but yeah, you've had to click it on something and being like, Oh, what the, what the fuck is this goddamn mess? But first of all, first of all, and I, and I apologize. I should have just introduced this right off the bat, but I had to, I had to explain the whole thing with Kate.

02:10.74
Bill
I think we had to talk about that, but, um, ladies and gentlemen, I hate to, to let everyone know.

02:11.17
Mike
listen' sure

02:17.35
Bill
I've got to just drop this bomb on you. Mike will no longer be on the podcast. Okay. Um, hey Hang on. I'm introducing my new sidekick and podcast partner.

02:29.20
Bill
Ladies and gentlemen, Danger Moose.

02:31.57
Mike
Either.

02:31.99
Mike
Right. I appreciate that.

02:35.83
Bill
i ah wrote that down and I'm like, I'm not going to use this until next week.

02:38.27
Mike
Yep.

02:39.08
Bill
So I did have my, I was going to intro with that.

02:39.59
Mike
right

02:41.37
Bill
I had this in my head. I'm like, I'm going to introduce this motherfucker as Danger Moose and say that, yeah, you're done.

02:45.10
Mike
i appreciate that

02:46.46
Bill
You're done with the podcast and whatever and Danger Moose. Now, here's the thing that I thought about.

02:50.38
Mike
who

02:51.00
Bill
So, yeah and I'll leave this up to you.

02:53.17
Mike
ye

02:53.43
Bill
So we let's treat this like like it would be a wacky morning show, okay? So Danger Moose and...

02:58.24
Mike
It's not.

03:01.39
Bill
it's It's at night. It's a wacky nighttime show.

03:03.01
Mike
Ah, we're doing our morning shoe in the evening.

03:03.92
Bill
we're We're like our morning shoe.

03:07.89
Mike
Yes.

03:12.22
Bill
Okay, so Danger Mouse and Thee. So if we were a wacky morning shoe.

03:14.86
Mike
Danger mouse.

03:16.73
Bill
ah Jesus fucking Christ. What time is it? What day is it?

03:20.25
Mike
hu Well, I've got an excuse. I'm fucking sick. I've been sick for three days.

03:25.49
Bill
i know, I know.

03:25.96
Mike
That's all I'm going to say about that.

03:27.90
Bill
you You've got, you'd be ill in is what it is.

03:30.45
Mike
Yeah, I'd be ill and...

03:32.40
Bill
yeah he He's down with the sickness.

03:35.11
Mike
I got a license to ill.

03:37.93
Bill
Okay, so Danger Moose and the, what am I going to be then? what

03:41.27
Mike
ten hair

03:41.48
Bill
yeah ah let you I'll let you name me.

03:43.86
Mike
And the cheese head.

03:45.30
Bill
No, but it's got to be Danger Moose and the, b but doesn't it have to be a one word thing as a wacky morning show? Like Danger Moose and the thing or the cheese.

03:50.55
Mike
Mmm. Uh-huh.

03:52.50
Bill
i Could I just be the cheese?

03:54.01
Mike
You could be the cheese or the head.

03:55.46
Bill
Oh, it so it sounds better.

03:57.25
Mike
ha, ha, ha.

03:58.78
Bill
It sounds cheesier. hey

04:00.97
Mike
hey

04:01.11
Bill
So it's Danger Moose and the Cheese. Does that sound right?

04:03.88
Mike
That's perfect. Welcome to the morning zoo.

04:08.03
Bill
Ladies and gentlemen, it's time for Danger Moose and the Cheese.

04:12.48
Mike
Yeah, exactly. worse so Where's our horn at? Our clown horn. There, it works. Ah. Ah. Ah. Ah

04:20.94
Bill
Danger moose. The moose out front should have told you. Fucking podcast is closed. God damn it.

04:28.47
Mike
sure

04:31.11
Bill
Jesus Christ. So anyhow. um But yeah. So who knows? Kate might pop in. If she pops in, fuck it. We'll stop. Whatever we'll do.

04:37.02
Mike
Will we?

04:37.28
Bill
We'll talk to her. I think maybe if if we can hear her. If we can hear her.

04:42.32
Mike
Right.

04:43.39
Bill
Fair enough.

04:44.44
Mike
Oh, yeah.

04:45.79
Bill
Okay, so so anywho, um we know I got Danger Moose out of the way. I don't know.

04:51.85
Mike
Mm-hmm.

04:52.54
Bill
We got the Kate thing out of the way. I laughed my ass off. ah You're sick. Yeah, there's the weather up here, down here. Mike's under the weather. We got all that shit. um Yeah, so you have you now have grabbed one, meaning a book.

05:00.49
Mike
Mm-hmm.

05:04.80
Bill
So...

05:04.98
Mike
Ah, yes.

05:05.12
Bill
um shall Shall we?

05:06.93
Mike
ah Did i

05:08.11
Bill
Shall we, Mike? Shall we just jump?

05:09.18
Mike
Grab something.

05:09.51
Bill
where we're We're five minutes and 12 seconds into this fucking mess that we call a podcast.

05:14.56
Mike
yeah for for for

05:16.60
Bill
Let's

05:17.14
Mike
i don't know, man. They told us to show up and everything would work out. I don't know, man. This might be the first time in 15 years they fucking lied to us. Yeah.

05:26.99
Bill
You lying motherfucker.

05:28.23
Mike
yeah

05:28.83
Bill
You know what? This is the things, this is one of the, this is how resentments build right now.

05:33.61
Mike
Right.

05:34.44
Bill
We, we've had, we've had 15 years, how many hours and how many days and how many minutes of really good times and all it took. Why'd you guys start drinking again? Because they fucking lied to us.

05:42.19
Mike
yeah Right.

05:44.25
Bill
We showed up and we showed up in this podcast. didn't work.

05:46.77
Mike
It fucking fell apart.

05:49.68
Bill
Our world fell apart. Yeah.

05:51.69
Mike
oh

05:51.92
Bill
So, so fuck you and all your good thoughts out there, people.

05:55.30
Mike
Right.

05:55.74
Bill
You, you people.

05:57.97
Mike
Right.

05:58.18
Bill
Okay. Okay. Settle down. It's okay.

06:00.05
Mike
yeah

06:01.42
Bill
It's okay.

06:01.58
Mike
Right, so let's erase our horrible thoughts out of it and let's get to a reading.

06:01.58
Bill
shit

06:05.35
Bill
Wait, if you want, do you want some soothing music?

06:07.80
Mike
don't... Hang

06:10.26
Bill
There we go. Okay. Settle down, everyone.

06:11.92
Mike
on. and I'm muting myself.

06:16.27
Bill
You're probably hacking over there.

06:21.33
Mike
ah

06:21.49
Bill
i i need to get I need to get more sound effects in here. or ear ear

06:25.94
Mike
Yeah, you do. Right. We need a fucking... I need a soundboard, man.

06:30.61
Bill
Right. Well, here's here's the here's the typical thing.

06:35.02
Mike
if

06:38.12
Mike
See, I want toys.

06:38.60
Bill
Very fitting.

06:39.93
Mike
I want toys. God damn it.

06:44.97
Bill
Yeah, but no what like you you'd spend like $1,000 the soundboard and it wouldn't fucking work.

06:49.12
Mike
yeah and It wouldn't work. Yeah, I know.

06:53.49
Bill
And you're your foot isn't... What'd you pay for it You pay $50 for that setup that you have there, right? I think.

06:58.00
Mike
Yeah, pretty much, man. I mean, you know, not with the Chromebook and probably.

06:59.34
Bill
I...

07:01.56
Mike
Well, yeah, because I've got good headphones and. My microphone's crap, and I've got a boom stand, and yeah, so yeah, probably 50 bucks total for all the stuff I plug into the Chromebook.

07:12.61
Bill
Yeah, so not a...

07:12.82
Mike
Uh-oh, uh-oh, uh-oh, Jesus.

07:13.70
Bill
Uh-oh. Hang on. Hang on, everybody. we We have a guest showing up, maybe. Wait a second.

07:19.49
Mike
Maybe.

07:19.64
Bill
Ready? I need a drum roll. No, that's... It doesn't work.

07:26.42
Mike
God.

07:26.91
Bill
it's it's a dramatic It's a dramatic piano.

07:29.48
Mike
Yeah, right, traumatic entrance.

07:33.34
Bill
Here comes a guest. Can we hear you, Kate?

07:36.57
Kate Vitela
hear me? fuck

07:37.51
Mike
Ha

07:38.51
Bill
No. Nope, you're the same as you were.

07:40.82
Kate Vitela
I have an idea this they can't hear me okay I have an idea they can't see

07:42.97
Bill
Yeah, you sound you sound muffled again. We were just were basically saying that one of these days we'll we'll get things together with you, but apparently today's today's not the day.

07:50.12
Kate Vitela
well

07:51.07
Bill
so

07:54.00
Mike
ha ha ha ha.

07:55.91
Bill
I don't know of
00:00:01.49
Bill
All right, so um yeah that was fucking seamless.

00:00:02.42
Mike
Wow. That's right.

00:00:05.55
Bill
So the last time that happened was was it was a famous person.

00:00:06.61
Mike
too powerful

00:00:09.00
Bill
um ah Tom Farley did that to us. He unplugged his his microphone while we were recording and shut down the podcast. And then Kate inadvertently just did that when she what she came back in.

00:00:19.41
Bill
Not a big deal. We got everything all squared away. We got a double recording going on. We're like fucking big time now because you know what?

00:00:24.85
Mike
wow

00:00:26.29
Bill
rolling with the fucking punches.

00:00:28.62
Mike
that's right

00:00:28.59
Bill
What were we, were we bitching about things not working out? Well, that was twice, twice in one day.

00:00:31.90
Mike
ah

00:00:33.24
Bill
That's a bad sign. Two resentments, two fucking resentments.

00:00:34.39
Mike
Yeah. Ooh.

00:00:38.52
Bill
Okay. So, uh, you know, fuck, fuck all that noise. Let's get back to something that that we can count on Mike, whatever, whatever is in your hand.

00:00:48.94
Bill
That's a loaded question.

00:00:49.35
Mike
ah It is Ah, yes. Right. So a reading. i believe that's what you're talking about, right?

00:00:55.28
Bill
Yes, it was. that that's your

00:00:57.84
Mike
I have two hands.

00:01:00.74
Bill
Drop your penis. Pick up your book. let's I don't know, unless you got a reading written.

00:01:04.52
Mike
Again, i have two hands.

00:01:05.08
Bill
written Okay, well, ah do what i do whatever you want with the other hand.

00:01:06.93
Mike
I could do...

00:01:08.73
Bill
It doesn't matter to me.

00:01:09.33
Mike
Right. All right. Cool.

00:01:11.81
Bill
yeah

00:01:12.07
Mike
It's going to be that kind of show.

00:01:12.51
Bill
All right. Hey,

00:01:14.32
Mike
We told you it was a wacky morning zoo.

00:01:16.76
Bill
hey, hey, hey.

00:01:17.93
Mike
yeah Waka, waka, waka.

00:01:23.06
Mike
Oh, good Lord. All right. This was today's because you know what? I wasn't planning on reading and blah, blah, blah. I read it this morning. And I, you know what? As I read it this morning, I went, hey, if shit goes sideways, I'll read this one today.

00:01:37.09
Bill
Right, yeah it's just in case, right?

00:01:39.88
Mike
Right. Yeah. Plan for the future. um Yeah. Don't count on it, but plan on it. All right. So September 5th. Let's see here.

00:01:50.90
Mike
ah Courage is resistance to fear. Mastery of fear, not absence of fear. Some guy named Mark Twain. I think he wrote a couple of things.

00:02:01.70
Mike
ah Which of the 12 steps teaches us how to handle our fear? The steps that scare us the most.

00:02:09.92
Bill
Thank you.

00:02:10.86
Mike
For many of us, that would be step 3, step 5, and step 9. These steps ask us to move from one place in our life to a new place.

00:02:22.62
Mike
Step 3 asks us to let go of the life we are leading and to step into a new life. We have faith that it is okay to do so because we have come to believe in a higher power that will restore us to balance and sanity.

00:02:38.81
Mike
Step 5 asks us to move from a secret life to a life of openness. We have to leave our hiding place, take off our masks, and let someone else see who we really are.

00:02:53.42
Mike
In step nine, we take responsibility for our past actions. We face the people we have hurt and we do what we can to repair the damage we have caused.

00:03:04.94
Mike
Each of these steps teaches us courage. Prayer for the day. Higher power, give me courage to move into the new life you have made open to me.

00:03:17.26
Mike
All I need to do is take the steps to get there. Today's action, pesky, pesky actions. Today I will think about my courage in recovery.

00:03:31.44
Mike
That's it.

00:03:32.60
Bill
That's it.

00:03:33.56
Mike
That's it. That's all we got to do.

00:03:37.94
Bill
yeah For a minute there, literally, I'm i'm looking at the recording. ill like Oh, what the fuck happened now? I just lost Mike.

00:03:42.06
Mike
Right.

00:03:42.58
Bill
Well,

00:03:43.22
Mike
Nope, nope. It's one goddamn sentence.

00:03:45.74
Bill
know, it's funny, though, is because I was kind of messing with my mute button because when I when I mute. So real quick.

00:03:53.26
Bill
So I just muted, and I know you couldn't hear me, but I think I'm still recording. So I think somehow with this whole mess, I can mute on my headset. So I'm wondering, like, as I cleared my throat and shit like that, once I put the recording together, if that's going to be on the record, i don't fucking know.

00:04:08.00
Mike
i I don't know.

00:04:10.88
Bill
So anyhow, what was that action line again since I since i freaked out and thought I lost you?

00:04:13.18
Mike
ter

00:04:14.99
Bill
Yeah.

00:04:17.26
Mike
Today I'll think about my courage in my recovery. Hmm.

00:04:22.20
Bill
All right. Think about my courage. So, um, and I wrote down that, you know, obviously the, as it was going through the the steps and and things like that, the things that scared us and all that sort of thing, I did write down the line that said teaches us courage, but i do you consider that?

00:04:32.16
Mike
o

00:04:37.64
Bill
Or, I mean, do you even think about that? I mean, know, so it says to think about our courage and recovery.

00:04:41.68
Mike
Right.

00:04:41.68
Bill
Is that, is that a regular everyday thing for you to sit down and be like, Ooh, I'm courageous. Okay.

00:04:47.99
Mike
No, not and certainly not a regular everyday thing.

00:04:48.69
Bill
Okay.

00:04:51.08
Mike
Absolutely not. um But, you know, since we've got this lovely sentence here that tells us to think about our courage.

00:05:02.28
Mike
um Yeah, you know, I mean, fuck yeah. You know, I was scared to goddamn death coming in. um You know, i've talked about it plenty of of times before, you know, the higher power thing scared the shit out of me because I knew it was a component to this and um You know, kind of a kind of a significant component, of you know, power greater than yourself, something bigger than you, blah, blah, blah.

00:05:18.64
Bill
right

00:05:22.40
Mike
um You know, clearly overthinking it because I didn't know what the hell else to do. Um, revert back to old behaviors. Uh, you know, when you're, you know, three, four weeks sober, it's all you got is your old behaviors.

00:05:35.70
Mike
Um, yeah. So, you know, yeah, of course I was, you know, scared to fucking death of a bunch of shit, you know, and, and clearly we've talked about, you know, how, you know, how we get to have fun, how we get to,

00:05:46.21
Mike
and know There's lots and lots of fears. all And you know yes, like as the reading says, you know we work these steps and we walk through it. And yeah, you know it it does. it it leads us. ah It teaches us courage. it it teaches us that you know ah these fears that we have are, first of all, way fucking overblown.

00:06:05.91
Mike
Um, and, um, you know, ah we just take some little actions and and move through them and and they're not as bad as we thought and then we get through them and yeah, guess it is a little courageous.

00:06:17.99
Bill
Right. Yeah. And I mean, obviously, I know we were laughing a little bit about it, but I mean, I don't I don't necessarily. Well, not even necessarily. I never directly look at at what we do as, you know, courage or courageous or the courage part of it, the courageous part of it.

00:06:30.95
Mike
hmm.

00:06:32.62
Bill
mean, you and I talk about we like you just said, we talk about fear all the time.

00:06:35.94
Mike
Right.

00:06:36.40
Bill
um fear from the in the beat from the you know day one and you know through now you know things that that scare us and everything in our lives is you know the backbone of it is is fear-based and i i do i believe that and i i happen to learn that on here it came more to light i don't think that i maybe however you want to put it it came to the forefront of my mind since you and i have been doing this for the last three and a half years

00:06:40.25
Mike
Yeah.

00:06:46.90
Mike
Mm

00:06:50.38
Mike
hmm. Sure.

00:06:59.60
Mike
Sure.

00:07:00.03
Bill
You know, so, but I mean, really it does, yeah you know, you read a lot of things, you know, online, these little motivational things that people talk about in recovery. um Oh shit, the serenity prayer, you know, the courage, you know, it talks about it right in there.

00:07:11.87
Mike
Yeah.

00:07:12.58
Bill
And I guess i that just, wow, that just popped into my head. The serenity prayer, it's right there.

00:07:18.08
Mike
Hey, hey

00:07:19.23
Bill
but

00:07:19.97
Mike
yes, the word courage is in the serenity prayer.

00:07:22.64
Bill
Yeah, but I mean, it it and it is when when it comes down to it, because knowing that even though we didn't want to, certainly didn't want to admit it to begin with, um maybe if we did admit, you know, how fearful we were afraid of things coming in, um it does. It takes courage to do all of this shit.

00:07:37.66
Mike
Right.

00:07:37.72
Bill
You know, number one, to to either walk in the door or, hello, be dragged to the front door, ah one way or the other.

00:07:43.04
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:07:43.35
Bill
I wasn't dragged, but I mean, I didn't want to be there.

00:07:45.30
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:07:46.01
Bill
um Certainly wasn't, nobody held it.

00:07:47.97
Mike
You were certainly pushed.

00:07:48.59
Bill
Yeah.

00:07:49.09
Mike
You might have been dragged, but you were pushed.

00:07:51.50
Bill
Yeah, I mean, i was i was told where I was going to go, and and i was and I was taken there.

00:07:54.06
Mike
Yeah.

00:07:55.42
Bill
So, I mean, yes. um But the thing of it is, is that I had the ability. could have left. I could have walked out at any point.

00:08:01.74
Mike
Mm-hmm. Sure.

00:08:02.74
Bill
I could have walked away. Both of us could have any time over the last, you know, 15 years.

00:08:04.77
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

00:08:06.36
Bill
But yeah.

00:08:06.63
Mike
There's no locks on the doors. Right. Mm-hmm.

00:08:09.36
Bill
yeah There's, we've got, we've got locks out, keeping people out, not keeping people in.

00:08:12.96
Mike
Yes, exactly.

00:08:15.00
Bill
um But yeah, I guess it it does. It does. It takes courage to continue to do this thing for, ah for 15 fucking years. Right.

00:08:22.03
Mike
Right. Absolutely. Well, and I mean, you know, the the opening quote from, you know, Samuel Clemens there. um Yeah. You know, courage is resistance to fear, mastery of fear, not absence of it.

00:08:34.19
Bill
Right.

00:08:34.86
Mike
Yeah. You know, it's there. It's, it's always going to be there. It's, it's dealing with it, you know? again, you know, pushing through it and, and, you know, thankfully doing this work and pushing through those fears over and over and over again.

00:08:49.85
Mike
um we've learned that, you know, if they're not, they're not as big as we think they are. You know, there's it's not, we're, there's not as much to be as to be afraid of as, as we thought there was going to be, you know, yes, there's things to be afraid of. And yeah, we're fucking, we've been fear-based most of our lives. So, um,

00:09:07.73
Mike
That's why we got loaded. I'm scared. You know, we'd never admit it, but yeah, you know, that was a big part of why we got loaded. Just, we were fucking scared and we wanted to ah leave that fear ah the easy way, the easier, softer way.

00:09:20.12
Bill
Right.

00:09:23.02
Mike
Yeah. You know, of course it stopped working a long time ago, but of created more fears and okay not really a solution to that problem.

00:09:30.45
Bill
Right.

00:09:33.22
Mike
Imagine that, but yeah,

00:09:37.16
Bill
I was literally just going to say, ah imagine that. So, yeah, it sounds like we came from, it feels like we we ended ended up coming from, or spent some time in the same place when we were young in this thing, right? Imagine that.

00:09:47.90
Mike
exactly oh

00:09:48.83
Bill
Thank you, Marty. Thank you very much, Marty. So, you know, it's funny is, is I... um Because not obviously thinking same deal. we We weren't going to do a reading tonight. I wrote this down this morning. I made a note of it um for next week was, you know, for the God grant me reading the steps that scare us the most and blah, blah, blah.

00:10:03.35
Mike
yeah yeah

00:10:04.81
Bill
And then from the reading, and I was going to actually pop into that reading because I had a couple of questions about it. So I'm glad that you that you talked in or obviously brought this up. But yeah, when you started reading and I'm like, like, wait a second, why does that?

00:10:15.14
Bill
I mean, it sounds familiar because I just read it.

00:10:16.32
Mike
okay Right.

00:10:17.47
Bill
But then i I flipped this off. I'm like, God, getian that's right. I wrote this down. So um the the side question I had to all of this is, do you ah were you scared by ah steps? Because it's talking specifically about steps three, five, and nine.

00:10:31.21
Bill
um and I mean... Maybe we should, for anyone out there who's not a 12-step person, I mean, we could at least explain briefly what these steps mean. and I mean, step three is just basically handing our shit over to somebody else, you know, our will and our lives over to the care of us of a higher power, as we like to put it.

00:10:43.37
Mike
Right.

00:10:46.55
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:10:47.35
Bill
um Step five is taking all of this shit that we wrote down and sitting down with a short Italian priest.

00:10:54.23
Mike
Right.

00:10:55.08
Bill
Yeah. In our case, the same priest. But I mean, yeah, and unloading all of your all of your garbage to to get rid of it.

00:10:57.80
Mike
Yep.

00:11:01.89
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:11:01.92
Bill
And then, I mean, yeah, step nine is, you know, going out there and actually making amends to people. So, um I mean, all of them can be daunting steps.

00:11:06.67
Mike
Yeah.

00:11:09.48
Bill
But do you, were you afraid of any of those?

00:11:12.98
Mike
I mean, well, clearly three because, you know, yeah, um I didn't know what I was going to do about that little situation, um you know, being the lovely atheist that I am.

00:11:16.82
Bill
Right. Right.

00:11:23.48
Mike
You know, where am I going to find this fucking power greater myself? Oh, yeah, they're goddamn everywhere. Everything's more fucking powerful than me.

00:11:30.67
Bill
ah

00:11:31.91
Mike
Oh, yeah, that's right. dumb ass um you know but at the time no you know again other people's concept of god or whatever the fuck you want to call it um yeah you know scared me yeah clearly because again i knew it was a component of this fucking thing and i was gonna have to do something with that somehow um thankfully i i figured it out and you know i

00:11:34.34
Bill
right

00:11:50.18
Bill
right

00:11:57.98
Mike
fought those fears, walked through those fears, mastery of that fear, and went to another person and and said, I don't know what the fuck I'm doing, man. I'm scared. i don't know if I'm going to do this. I can't work this. ah Shut up, kid.

00:12:12.33
Mike
42-year-old kid. forty two year old kid um

00:12:17.77
Bill
Get away from me, kid. You bother me.

00:12:19.69
Mike
Right. no, no, that's a thing. No, no, kid. Yeah, you bother me, but don't go away from me. Here, let me help you.

00:12:26.23
Bill
Right.

00:12:26.41
Mike
um Let me help you with your dumbass fear. um

00:12:32.59
Bill
yeah

00:12:33.38
Mike
you know, so yeah, again, you know, it's all about, yeah, you know, that was early on. That was one of the first big ones that I walked through and, you know, and clearly looking back on it hindsight and I went, Oh yeah, I guess it wasn't that big of a deal.

00:12:48.12
Bill
Right.

00:12:48.36
Mike
Again, you know, the shit that I work up in my head on my own um is yeah, never right. You know, I built shit up to be bigger than it actually is. And,

00:12:59.46
Mike
ah yeah I don't have to do that anymore, thankfully.

00:13:04.71
Bill
Yeah. And you know that, well, you and I came in, I mean, ah atheist, agnostic. I mean, that we're ah not, we're not the same, but you know, it's this, it's, it's at least the outside circumstance of not, both of us had that, had that fear of not knowing how we were going to deal with the God thing.

00:13:16.86
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:13:18.94
Bill
um And I know both of us have ah ah a little bit of a different mindset about what we believe and how we believe.

00:13:22.75
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:13:23.62
Bill
But, um you know, I mean, thankfully again, going sarcastically said before, but we went, you know, we're at the same place going through the same thing, listening to the same people, you know, so we have the same idea to deal with our thing.

00:13:32.14
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:13:34.94
Mike
Right.

00:13:34.94
Bill
Um, and our things are kind of similar anyhow, in my opinion.

00:13:37.99
Mike
Yeah.

00:13:38.14
Bill
I mean, really they are no.

00:13:39.61
Mike
Again, we're not unique. Mm-hmm.

00:13:42.66
Bill
right Right. yeah So, I mean, i don't know that the third step, the only thing, like I've said before, is I just, I heard all these people doing these big, crazy fucking things. You know, this, this production was step three. And, um, I don't know, along the way up until I realized that it didn't fucking matter.

00:13:57.20
Mike
Yeah.

00:13:57.21
Bill
I was feeling almost like I was robbed of an experience with step three and I never had the bright lights and I never had all these goddamn things.

00:14:00.09
Mike
for Sure.

00:14:02.97
Bill
And I'm like, like I want this shit. going to go through all this fucking garbage, man.

00:14:05.87
Mike
Sure.

00:14:07.19
Bill
Give me, give me a pink cloud. Give me a fucking bright light. Give me a process. Give something, God damn it.

00:14:13.77
Mike
right.

00:14:13.86
Bill
so Oh, all I get is 15.

00:14:15.20
Mike
little static electricity.

00:14:15.52
Bill
Right.

00:14:16.61
Mike
Right,

00:14:16.63
Bill
right All I get is 15 years and my life is a million times better than it was.

00:14:21.15
Mike
of course. Yeah.

00:14:21.97
Bill
Yeah, that's not enough.

00:14:22.27
Mike
Yep. right of course

00:14:23.86
Bill
didn did you hear Did you hear the beginning of the podcast? It went to shit. It went to shit.

00:14:27.68
Mike
yeah yep

00:14:29.60
Bill
We proved you wrong, motherfuckers. No, just kidding.

00:14:31.85
Mike
Yeah.

00:14:32.64
Bill
But um the, you know, so step step five, i don't I don't remember being afraid of that. um Just anxious because, you know, that was, we were so fucking selfish.

00:14:40.20
Mike
Yeah.

00:14:41.66
Bill
I think we just wanted to get up there and lead. So we knew was like a means to the end.

00:14:44.07
Mike
Sure.

00:14:46.63
Bill
um Step nine, I think, you know, had that It had a dauntingness to it again, too, you know, but I was nervous. And I guess, yeah, if if nothing else, it wasn't, you know, I wasn't panicked.

00:14:58.08
Bill
I had, if nothing else, a nervous fear about doing it because you just you just don't know.

00:15:01.13
Mike
sure

00:15:02.56
Bill
I think I had a good idea ah what people.

00:15:02.98
Mike
Well, yeah. Lack of control.

00:15:07.44
Bill
Wait, that I think is our problem now.

00:15:10.37
Mike
Yes. Mm-hmm.

00:15:11.36
Bill
yeah But, you know, I think I had a pretty good idea, you know, how how people were going to respond. But then again, you just never know.

00:15:16.96
Mike
Yeah. Right.

00:15:18.65
Bill
um But yeah, I mean, that it is, it's a, they all can be daunting, but I don't know. I think the biggest one probably, you know, come to think of it, you, as you said, you know, I mean, as it ended to be step three was the big one, but we were able to kind of handle that fear more so in the beginning before we really had to to face that step. Right.

00:15:36.17
Mike
So you're saying that steps are in order for a reason?

00:15:39.70
Bill
You know what? Hang on one second. Note to self. um What'd you say again? Steps or what?

00:15:45.73
Mike
They're in order for a reason?

00:15:47.86
Bill
Four.

00:15:48.08
Mike
mean, you can't do one and then 12 and then five and then, let's say, eight and then go back and do six and then, oh, okay, I'll get to four when I get to it.

00:15:58.72
Mike
But I'm already working 11.

00:15:58.91
Bill
Right.

00:15:59.64
Mike
Yeah.

00:16:00.82
Bill
but it So just to be clear, they should be done one through 12 in that order.

00:16:06.61
Mike
Yeah, I believe so.

00:16:08.14
Bill
Okay. Okay, cool. I just learn learn something new every day.

00:16:10.52
Mike
It's my understanding.

00:16:12.10
Bill
learn Learn something new every day. I get got it. I got it. But yes, that is what I was saying. That's exactly what I'm saying. But um yeah, i don't know. I mean, it's just, it's it's funny that I'm glad...

00:16:23.95
Bill
This may sound weird, but maybe and maybe not. I'm really happy that I know how to hot be fearful these days. And I recognize the fact that I'm, number one, I know how to be vulnerable and I know how to be fearful.

00:16:31.39
Mike
Yeah.

00:16:36.23
Bill
um It doesn't make me less than.

00:16:36.47
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:16:37.71
Bill
It doesn't make me weak. It doesn't make me anything.

00:16:39.29
Mike
No.

00:16:39.75
Bill
I think it makes me stronger having that us stronger, having that vulnerability, right?

00:16:41.38
Mike
Yeah, absolutely.

00:16:44.66
Mike
Right. I mean, that's kind of the whole point of the thing is fear is going to be there. You know, it's always going to be there.

00:16:48.71
Bill
Right. Right.

00:16:49.86
Mike
it's It's about the courage. It's about what we do with it. You know, we walk through it. We we manage the fear. And that is where the courage comes from. Absolutely.

00:16:59.89
Bill
Right.

00:17:02.21
Bill
Right. Well, that's ah that's a damn, that's a damn good reading. That is a, that's a, that's a good one.

00:17:05.28
Mike
Yeah.

00:17:06.93
Bill
That's a humdinger. I like that one.

00:17:08.09
Mike
ah

00:17:11.13
Mike
Hum that dinger.

00:17:14.50
Bill
so You do with your other hand. I'm home that.

00:17:16.59
Mike
Hey.

00:17:17.64
Bill
Hello. Hum that dinger. See, now this what's going to suck. going to have sit here and fucking I'm sit and fucking math. I'm going have to oh, big of deal. I've eight minutes to wherever we're at whenever we want to take a break.

00:17:28.22
Bill
Not that we're there yet. Settle down, people. We just did a fucking reading.

00:17:30.17
Mike
Right.

00:17:31.86
Bill
We got more wacky stuff to talk about.

00:17:34.54
Mike
Moral be revealed.

00:17:35.92
Bill
yeah You know, it's funny. ah I apologize. Let me step back. Anything else with that reading? Anything else that jumped out at you? and his i was I was jumping the route on you there. Okay.

00:17:44.91
Mike
No, no, not at all. I think we covered it pretty well. You know, the fear is always going to be there. It's all about what we do with it and the courage that we have to work through it.

00:17:55.29
Bill
Right. Okay, cool. Speaking of jumping the route, there's a couple of football teams playing this weekend. I didn't think we'd have a chance to talk about that too, but so, and not that ah Mike doesn't care about football.

00:18:01.81
Mike
yeah. Hmm.

00:18:06.41
Bill
I do.

00:18:06.94
Mike
Nope.

00:18:07.59
Bill
um I care less about it than I did probably even a handful of years ago. And you know, quite honestly, what I did last year um and the year before I, year before I missed a number of games just because I was out traveling and

00:18:12.08
Mike
ah herh

00:18:19.74
Mike
Right.

00:18:19.95
Bill
um Same thing last year. I was not going to just sit around if I ended up catching a game or something like that. And I'd usually, if I could, i'd you know, throw it up on my phone and listen to it.

00:18:25.39
Mike
There.

00:18:29.08
Bill
Sometimes coming back from a hiking trail, it would be, you know, basically on the TV, quote unquote, but it was going through my car so I could just listen to it, you know.

00:18:31.24
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:18:36.74
Mike
Yeah.

00:18:37.22
Bill
um You know, but I mean, now it's a it's a late game. It's the Lions in the Packers. So anyone who's been around for a minute knows that Mike is a Detroit guy. I'm a Green Bay guy.

00:18:45.84
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:18:46.33
Bill
If nothing else, it's two times a year that that they play at a minimum, sometimes three. I think they played three times last year.

00:18:51.48
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:18:52.83
Bill
Um, but yeah, i mean, it's not like, like we have this huge rivalry, but I don't know. It's a, it gives us a little bit of something more. So me probably at less. Well, when the lions beat the Packers all three times last year, I think.

00:19:03.66
Mike
Yeah.

00:19:04.54
Bill
So that that gave you the chance to be like, even though you don't care about football, you're like, yeah, but if the Packers win, you don't give a fuck. So, so yeah, it's not as much fun for me one way or the other, but, uh,

00:19:11.39
Mike
Yeah, exactly. Yeah.

00:19:15.82
Mike
Well, mean, you know, it's it's a little bit, right. You know, well, since the Lions haven't completely sucked for the past couple of years, it's been a little bit better.

00:19:22.65
Bill
Yeah.

00:19:23.96
Mike
i

00:19:23.95
Bill
On the contrary. On the contrary.

00:19:26.07
Mike
Right. Yeah. They've been all right. You know, and they weren't that great last year, but year before they were pretty good. um

00:19:31.96
Bill
Right.

00:19:32.99
Mike
NFC championship, I believe. ah Anyway. Yeah. Yeah.

00:19:37.45
Bill
Yeah.

00:19:37.50
Mike
Yeah.

00:19:38.18
Bill
Yeah. But I mean, yeah and and like, I mean, their coach, I mean, Dan Campbell, he's a, that dude's a, he's a fucking madman in the best way possible, you know?

00:19:42.12
Mike
yeah yeah they Absolutely. Yeah. I like him, but you know, right.

00:19:47.42
Bill
Oh, I do too. I enjoy it. when When he first came in, i mean, I think everyone around the league was like, who is this fucking nutbag, man? This guy, what what is this guy fucking doing?

00:19:54.75
Mike
Right.

00:19:56.96
Bill
But I mean, you know, clearly what has this guy done, you know, over the last handful of years?

00:20:00.33
Mike
Yeah.

00:20:00.79
Bill
I think this might be his fifth season, maybe.

00:20:03.38
Mike
Well, he was like, he was a defensive lineman, right?

00:20:06.70
Bill
I believe so.

00:20:06.88
Mike
If I were, ah yeah, I think so. Right. So, I mean, he was, you know, whatever, a defensive fucking lineman and, and, you know, right.

00:20:12.33
Bill
Right.

00:20:14.24
Mike
And he was, he was on that team that lost every fucking game. You know, if they went, oh, in 16 or oh, in 17 or whatever the fuck it was that year. He was playing.

00:20:24.27
Bill
Oh, that was the, yeah, that the Saints, right?

00:20:25.39
Mike
Yeah.

00:20:26.53
Bill
Yeah, because they called them they call them the Aints.

00:20:28.43
Mike
No, no, I'm the lions.

00:20:30.01
Bill
Oh, the Lions. Oh, the and he was with the Lions.

00:20:32.25
Mike
Yeah.

00:20:32.41
Bill
Why do I keep forgetting that?

00:20:32.74
Mike
Yeah.

00:20:33.49
Bill
Okay, I got you. I got you.

00:20:34.51
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:20:34.65
Bill
Okay, yep.

00:20:35.43
Mike
So, I mean, you know, right. You know, and of course, there's a great picture of him looking out there. It's on the Internet. You know, he's standing with his wife who's this cute blonde and he's got a pack of Marlboro lights stuck in his waistband. you know, there's just, yeah, he's he's cool.

00:20:51.29
Mike
So, yeah, and he went in there and he said, look, guys, you know, I'm a goddamn defensive linebacker and we're goingnna go out there we're going to play fucking football.

00:20:53.81
Bill
Right.

00:20:59.74
Mike
which doesn't happen anymore.

00:20:59.81
Bill
right

00:21:01.63
Mike
You know, I mean, it's part of the reason I don't watch football like I used to, because I mean, they watered the game down so fucking much. It's like, whatever, you know, but he's, you know, within, within the watering down of the game, he does what he can to make it, to make it actually football again. So, yeah.

00:21:18.97
Bill
Right. Well, in the the morning show, I listened to the one of the guys called in. I mean, Matt LaFleur, I mean, he's a decent coach for the Packers and has done really well.

00:21:25.82
Mike
Hmm.

00:21:26.29
Bill
And he's been the you know the winningest coach of the of the entire franchise and all that sort of stuff. And seems like a hell of a nice guy and all those sort of things. But um one of the morning show guys, I think up until last year, maybe they were just talking about him switching his mindset this year.

00:21:40.85
Bill
He called him a yoga instructor. you know, for the last, he's, LeFleur's been there for six years or five years, six, seven years, something like that.

00:21:42.82
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:21:48.13
Mike
Okay.

00:21:48.32
Bill
But he said, he goes, he goes, every time I look at it, he goes, I just think, you know, the way he is in his mindset, it's more of the, um the baseball, the money ball thing in baseball, the statistical angles is what they do.

00:21:56.06
Mike
Right.

00:21:58.74
Bill
Well, shit, even when you watch a game now, when it comes to fourth down or this and that or punt versus whatever it is, they always throw up, you know, the stat of what, you know, what the, what the stats tell you that you should do.

00:22:09.13
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:22:09.20
Bill
um Everything is statistically or statistical based now, um you know, kind of your point and then get all the, all the fucking rules. You don't know what it catches anymore. You can't tackle anyone.

00:22:17.89
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:22:19.34
Bill
You can't even look at the quarterback wrong or you're going to get,

00:22:19.38
Mike
Yeah. He made a football move. What, he showed up at the stadium? Right. Uh-huh.

00:22:26.45
Bill
yeah what does the football do? Lay a football on the ground. It didn't move.

00:22:29.85
Mike
hey

00:22:30.00
Bill
the guys what's a fucking football move yeah but and i agree with you i agree with you wholeheartedly but same thing this year i mean uh you know kind of just finish what i was saying before with the um i i i will watch the games when i have the ability to do it what i did towards you know the end of the season last year i spent whatever it was 100 bucks for the last three four games you know on youtube so i could watch it wherever um

00:22:43.84
Mike
ah

00:22:53.02
Bill
And then, you know, the playoffs are on every fucking thing, so I don't worry.

00:22:55.45
Mike
Playoffs.

00:22:56.94
Bill
Yes. Jesus Christ.

00:22:58.31
Mike
Oh, yeah. Nice. Right.

00:23:00.19
Bill
Yes. You should see the, take a look at the line on your recording where you just did that.

00:23:03.38
Mike
oh Yeah. ah nice

00:23:05.00
Bill
yeah's like That fucking, that fucking spiked. Holy shit. yeah

00:23:07.73
Mike
a

00:23:08.50
Bill
um But yeah, I mean, I'm just, I'm not going to, I would rather, if I get the chance of, you know, walking around in the woods or, you know, watching a football game, I'm going to go, I'm going to walk in the fucking woods and look at, look at mountains, you know?

00:23:17.32
Mike
right yeah

00:23:20.13
Bill
But, no, I mean, it's just, I don't know. I think it's going to be a good game, and it's a showcase game because it's division and all that stuff and blah, blah, blah. But don't know.

00:23:28.62
Mike
Sure.

00:23:29.09
Bill
don't know. It'll be, I'm going watch. I mean, I'm going to be around. I got nothing going on this weekend. So at 325.

00:23:35.50
Mike
And you said it's a late game on Sunday?

00:23:35.79
Bill
Yeah, so, yeah, 425. You'll be at, you'll be heading to your meeting.

00:23:39.52
Mike
oh Yeah, I will. And it's ah high it's our anniversary, too. So I have to be there early.

00:23:44.47
Bill
Oh, is it?

00:23:45.24
Mike
And yeah.

00:23:46.69
Bill
Yeah.

00:23:46.75
Mike
So I'll probably... Oh, I'll have it on my phone. But yeah.

00:23:51.02
Bill
Well, tell tell everyone, because know you a lot lot of people show up with the anniversary thing.

00:23:51.67
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:23:54.87
Bill
If you see anyone that you know that I would care about saying hello to, then tell them, hey, Bill says hi.

00:24:01.45
Mike
I shall do that.

00:24:02.95
Bill
Cheese. Danger Boos and the cheese. Tell them that the cheese said hi.

00:24:08.63
Mike
I shall.

00:24:10.26
Bill
But that goddamn anniversary thing again. When was that?

00:24:12.75
Mike
Yeah.

00:24:13.16
Bill
Was that two years ago that I was up? No, I haven't been out to the anniversary one. and

00:24:17.72
Mike
The actual, yeah, the actual anniversary.

00:24:17.76
Bill
I can't remember.

00:24:19.68
Mike
No, I made you lead last year in the month, the anniversary month because I was cheering, but.

00:24:24.93
Bill
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.

00:24:26.41
Mike
Yeah. um Now, God, our anniversary? Yeah, it's been two or three years.

00:24:32.19
Bill
Yeah, I was going to say might have even been longer than that, but um I was thinking, yeah, I was forgot about that.

00:24:34.13
Mike
Yeah.

00:24:37.27
Bill
You made me lead. You made me lead.

00:24:38.83
Mike
Yeah, I did.

00:24:39.91
Bill
u You asked me, and I said yes. i mean, yeah it's like, well, Bill didn't want to lead, but I but i made him.

00:24:42.12
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:24:47.59
Mike
That's right.

00:24:49.28
Bill
No, that was fun. I mean, I see you i don't say no, but it's just one of those things. so What are you doing at the end of September? Because that's what it was. It was the last was it like it was the last weekend of September.

00:24:57.62
Mike
Yeah, was the last one. Yeah.

00:24:59.50
Bill
yeah cause i don't know where

00:24:59.76
Mike
Yeah, because I got stuck with five last year.

00:25:02.90
Bill
Oh, yeah, yeah. Because then I think I went, yeah, that's when I was, I headed it headed out someplace because then I think I was going down to Arkansas because then I went up to West Virginia last year. I don't know, whatever the fuck it was.

00:25:12.93
Bill
I i was running around last year, which I think I'm i'm i'm cooling my my financial heels here for at least um maybe a month.

00:25:17.74
Mike
Ah.

00:25:19.66
Bill
I just got to let let some shit settle.

00:25:21.02
Mike
Gotcha. Yeah. Mm-hmm. I'm with you.

00:25:23.80
Bill
Yeah, works works fucking slow and in whatever the deal is. And it it is what it is. And I'm just like, eh, fuck it.

00:25:30.12
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:25:30.15
Bill
I got to be here.

00:25:31.26
Mike
Yep.

00:25:32.59
Bill
Fucking Indiana.

00:25:33.99
Mike
Right.

00:25:34.10
Bill
No, but but I mean, that this weekend I got nothing to do, but next weekend I'll be up in Wisconsin um for a baby shower for my stepson and in his girlfriend. They're having a baby.

00:25:42.81
Mike
Cool.

00:25:43.46
Bill
um And then the weekend after that, I don't think I'm doing anything, but the weekend after that, I'm going up for... um lunch. I'm having lunch. I know for a fact with Kimmy on that Saturday, late birthday lunch.

00:25:53.78
Mike
Nice. Uh-huh.

00:25:54.95
Bill
And then um Sunday, I don't know if I might Derek and Katie are camping. So I might be up there the entire weekend, have lunch with them. But you know, like it's like I told them, we were trying to figure it out.

00:26:05.14
Bill
I think when we were in, in Ohio and I'm like, I, you guys know me. I'm like, I don't give a flying fuck about my birthday.

00:26:10.13
Mike
Right.

00:26:10.29
Bill
Only thing I just, I'd love to get together with you guys have, have lunch or dinner or whatever.

00:26:10.91
Mike
Yep. Yep.

00:26:13.41
Mike
right

00:26:14.93
Bill
But I mean, yeah, it's around my birthday, but Hey, it is what it is. So,

00:26:18.57
Mike
listen

00:26:20.08
Bill
All right, so random question. Do you know, and if you don't know this, I'm going to be fucking shocked. Remember I said, you know, some things that you do know and don't know.

00:26:26.54
Mike
yeah yeah

00:26:27.72
Bill
Okay, Dr. Frankenstein. Okay, you know who that is, right?

00:26:30.37
Mike
Yes. Yeah, Victor. Yeah.

00:26:33.98
Bill
Fucking idiot. yeah It's unbelievable. So again, they, I don't know what they were talking about with on the morning show. And the, one of the guys is like, do you know, Dr. Frankenstein's first name?

00:26:45.59
Bill
And the other guy said something like Leroy or something some fuck, you know, just something fucking stupid.

00:26:47.83
Mike
but yeah

00:26:51.57
Bill
And then he's like, no, it's Victor. I'm like, Victor. I'm like, I know Mike knows this, but I don't care. I'm fucking writing it down anyhow. Because if you, again, if you wouldn't have known that I would have been fucking shocked.

00:26:59.21
Mike
he

00:27:02.83
Mike
Well, yeah, I'd have to turn in my fucking card. ah i don't know what card it is, but I'd have to turn it in. Yeah, absolutely.

00:27:09.69
Bill
yeah

00:27:10.47
Mike
i mean, I've got images of Frankenstein, the creature, the monster, all over my house.

00:27:14.32
Bill
Right.

00:27:15.49
Mike
Yeah, yeah, Victor. Yeah. Read the book. Yeah, yeah,

00:27:18.58
Bill
I just I if I and I when I was younger, I read i read Dracula books. I read Franklin. I read all these books when I was a kid. You know, um I'm sure at some point that name had to have crossed through this through these brain cells.

00:27:32.67
Mike
All

00:27:33.53
Bill
I'm guessing the Victor brain cell got drank away.

00:27:37.01
Mike
yeah

00:27:36.98
Bill
It's it's had to have got drank, drowned out in some booze at some point, because when they said that, I'm like nothing.

00:27:41.76
Mike
all right.

00:27:44.70
Bill
I mean, no, no, like, oh, yeah, that's that sounds familiar.

00:27:45.88
Mike
Hmm. Right.

00:27:49.27
Bill
Not even not even not a whiff think whiff of a memory in there.

00:27:49.53
Mike
Yeah.

00:27:53.40
Mike
Okay. Okay.

00:27:53.84
Bill
But um I mean, like your fucking spider. when you When you told me that, ah okay, tell the story of your spider again and tell tell where that comes from. For people who don't know this, it it it made me laugh, but it just it's it's so fucking wonderful.

00:28:06.78
Mike
Well, ah yeah yeah, right.

00:28:07.10
Bill
your Your tarantula.

00:28:09.45
Mike
do I have another spider. I'm sure there's plenty in the house, but...

00:28:13.29
Bill
I know, but I said i said spider, but technically it's ah it's a tarantula.

00:28:13.77
Mike
um

00:28:16.69
Bill
So I was just making it clear.

00:28:17.03
Mike
Right. which ah Right. So I have pet tarantula that was, um, that I abandoned in the sober house we were living in.

00:28:22.85
Bill
Abandon.

00:28:27.24
Mike
Yeah. One of the idiots up in the attic. Um, yeah. You know, decided he brought the tarantula in cause he was, you know, getting his shit together and he was responsible and yeah, he went and took his will back and off he went and left the spider behind. So I got a, I got a free spider. Hey, cool.

00:28:45.18
Mike
Um,

00:28:45.55
Bill
so Well, real, real quick. And the funniest part about that is just, it was left, I think it was left upstairs.

00:28:51.93
Mike
Yeah.

00:28:52.09
Bill
And then somebody just literally brought it down and like either put it by our door or said, give this to Mike. I mean, no, I don't think anyone even asked you if you wanted it.

00:28:57.79
Mike
he

00:29:00.00
Bill
They just gave it to you because why the fuck wouldn't they, you know?

00:29:00.55
Mike
Right. z

00:29:03.55
Bill
But yeah, yeah it wasn't like somebody said, Hey, would you want it?

00:29:03.62
Mike
Right.

00:29:07.08
Bill
You're like, yeah, let me think about it for a minute. It's just, it was abandoned over here.

00:29:08.87
Mike
Yeah.

00:29:10.55
Bill
And then you ended up with the baby.

00:29:10.97
Mike
Yeah.

00:29:12.16
Bill
Yeah.

00:29:12.61
Mike
Yes, I did. It's left on my doorstep. It's left in the rushes.

00:29:17.02
Bill
yeah exactly

00:29:19.02
Mike
it was baby Moses. should have named her Moses. Anyway, right, but I didn't. I named her Dwight um after Dwight Frye, who is the actor who played Renfield in the original Universal Dracula, 1931. I wouldn't know Victor, please.

00:29:37.25
Bill
I know

00:29:37.70
Mike
Yeah. Anyway, yes, and and he played Renfield in the original Dracula, and Renfield was famous for eating flies and bugs and spiders and whatever.

00:29:49.63
Mike
So, yes, I named my spider Renfield. Well, i yeah after Renfield, Dwight Frye, which, side note, ah has a wonderful song off Alice Cooper's third album, The Ballad of Dwight Frye, which scared the hell out of me when I was six years old.

00:29:56.15
Bill
Right.

00:30:06.89
Mike
So there you go.

00:30:09.19
Bill
yeah It's just when i remember when you because this this just as a again, ah ah flashback, a side thing. This is when Mike and I were were living in a very, very small bedroom together at the at the three quarter house, um which I don't I mean, I'm not I'm not afraid of.

00:30:20.19
Mike
Yep.

00:30:24.52
Bill
I'm not a sound like I'm going to have a spider as a pet, but I'm not afraid of them or any. It never bothered me having.

00:30:30.42
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:30:30.55
Bill
this tarantula in our room never, ever, ever didn't freak me out.

00:30:33.21
Mike
Right.

00:30:34.05
Bill
But, um, but yeah, I mean, so we we, we, it was, it was yours, but we had, we had a roommate.

00:30:38.16
Mike
if you

00:30:40.12
Bill
It was Dwight.

00:30:40.40
Mike
Yes.

00:30:41.29
Bill
But then when when you told me the name, I'm like, and then I think I, I don't know if I asked you or you just volunteered it. I probably asked you because, because I don't think that you, you're not the kind of guy to walk around, by the way, my spider's name is Dwight.

00:30:48.29
Mike
Yeah, you asked me.

00:30:54.43
Mike
he

00:30:54.98
Bill
You remember the 1931 original Dracula?

00:30:57.77
Mike
Right.

00:30:58.67
Bill
um And then I was just like, that's fucking ingenious. It's crazy in in a really good way.

00:31:04.19
Mike
Yeah.

00:31:04.20
Bill
But I'm like, that's perfect. That's fucking perfect.

00:31:06.13
Mike
Yeah.

00:31:07.34
Bill
But yeah, I mean, I knew you'd know who Victor was. That's why I said, if you didn't know, I wouldn't even, I don't even think I'd know what to say if you didn't know

00:31:13.98
Mike
I wouldn't know what to say either. Again, I'd turn in my card.

00:31:15.78
Bill
yeah

00:31:17.24
Mike
i you know, I might have to jump out a window or something. Yeah.

00:31:20.11
Bill
yeah You're only one story up, though, so that's not going to do any good.

00:31:24.66
Mike
Yeah.

00:31:25.40
Bill
That's not going to do any good.

00:31:25.55
Mike
right. Well, I don't know. I could go up to the attic and jump out a window. It's three stories up.

00:31:30.77
Bill
Well, and I suppose it's it's how you jump. you know They say you can you can drown in a teaspoon of water, so if you just you know no don't just jump.

00:31:33.10
Mike
Yeah, exactly. Sure. i go head first into the neighbor's driveway. I'd be all right.

00:31:39.67
Bill
That's what I was just going to say. You've got to go with that big old fucking melon out.

00:31:42.98
Mike
yeah

00:31:43.00
Bill
let that let that Let that fucking watermelon hit the pavement. That'll do it.

00:31:47.01
Mike
Right.

00:31:47.18
Bill
That'll do it.

00:31:47.60
Mike
I'll just let, you know, physics and nature and gravity take its course. And yeah, the that the heaviest part of my body, just it'll, it'll line up. It'll be fine.

00:31:57.22
Bill
you should Now I'm disappointed in you.

00:31:59.69
Mike
Well, yeah.

00:32:00.67
Bill
The second heaviest part of your body. You should have said my penis is the first, but

00:32:04.58
Mike
well yeah

00:32:06.12
Bill
yeah and I'm disappointed. ah You know what? Happy that you knew Victor. I knew you would, but yeah, you you missed one there. So, okay. One, one last quick thing that I've had this written down for a couple of weeks. This is not, yeah I guess maybe this is recovery related.

00:32:19.40
Bill
Don't care. I'm going to ask any help.

00:32:20.70
Mike
yeah

00:32:21.80
Bill
Does your OCD ever bother you or do you think it gets in the way at times? Now, first of all, I didn't say, do you have OCD? Cause I know better.

00:32:30.71
Mike
um

00:32:31.56
Bill
So do i Okay. So i'm just saying, does it ever, do you, do you think it ever gets in the way or does it bother you having OCD?

00:32:39.96
Mike
I mean, yeah okay. First of all, um, OCD is a specific thing and neither one of us actually have it.

00:32:48.12
Bill
Oh, okay. Yeah.

00:32:48.62
Mike
Um,

00:32:49.24
Bill
OCD behavior.

00:32:50.50
Mike
Yeah, no. I mean, what, yeah are you padding things like over, you know, a certain amount of times or checking your stove 14 times before you leave the house and, you know, okay, well, see, there you go.

00:32:54.39
Bill
No. 12. twelve No, no, no, no.

00:33:03.25
Mike
Right. Exactly. Right. I mean, that's a specific thing. You know, you have to walk downstairs a certain way, blah, blah, blah. I mean, that's a real fucking thing. Now, do I have control issues and do I like things to be exactly how I fucking want them?

00:33:11.89
Bill
Right.

00:33:16.78
Bill
Right.

00:33:17.65
Mike
Yes.

00:33:18.52
Bill
yeah

00:33:18.98
Mike
that's more of an alcoholic thing.

00:33:20.69
Bill
Right. right

00:33:21.49
Mike
Yeah. No. and Yeah. I don't have OCD. Um, and do it, it doesn't get in the way. No, absolutely not. You know, I use um you know, again, i have certain things in a certain way, but certainly for my job, um, it's, it's helpful, you know, that I like seeing things a certain way.

00:33:38.43
Mike
I have to do things in a certain way, in a certain order, because then I make sure all the safety stuff is done, you know?

00:33:46.42
Bill
Right.

00:33:46.83
Mike
So yeah, I mean, it's helpful, you know, and as far as, you know, ah my shit needs to be where I fucking put it. Well, that's just control shit.

00:33:55.87
Bill
Right. And you know, there are, I think there are certain things that I, that I am OCD-ish about. And I, and I know what you mean. and It's just people, it's a blanket term that people use.

00:34:02.71
Mike
Yeah.

00:34:03.83
Bill
So I, I, I agree with you not only, and I understand what you mean.

00:34:04.29
Mike
Right.

00:34:07.14
Bill
um But like, like for instance, I was just trying to think of something I do certain number of times. Like when I, when I set my alarm at night on my phone, um every single night I'll check it three different times before I go to bed.

00:34:18.39
Mike
All right.

00:34:18.53
Bill
And that, that's,

00:34:18.64
Mike
Yeah, that's a little. Yeah, it's a little.

00:34:20.56
Bill
that's in that And that is every single night. And I don't know why I've done it. I've done it for years. um I'll, you know, I suppose I do certain readings in a certain order, things in an order, um so um that you know, what those sort of things.

00:34:31.54
Mike
Oh, yeah. yeah

00:34:33.24
Bill
But probably the alarm, there's probably other things that I do like that. Um, you know, but not necessarily like checking the stove 14 times.

00:34:37.04
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:34:41.55
Mike
Yeah.

00:34:41.78
Bill
Um, sometimes I'll check the coffee pot twice to make sure I hit the right button. Cause my coffee pot can, it can make the, the, the K cup or the regular thing. And if you do the wrong one, it'll spill coffee all over the floor, which I've done a couple of times.

00:34:52.82
Mike
Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

00:34:54.50
Bill
So sometimes that'll get checked a couple of times. I don't lock doors three times or anything like that. I'm not like, you know, Jack Nicholson.

00:34:59.08
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:35:00.34
Bill
It is, did you ever see as good as it gets?

00:35:02.22
Mike
Yeah.

00:35:02.85
Bill
Yeah, that's, that's a great one for you know cd behavior.

00:35:04.61
Mike
Right.

00:35:06.92
Bill
but um But yes, the the things like that, there are, and I agree with you wholeheartedly, there's certain certain things that I like in a certain way, I like in a certain order. um i mean, even i down to the like packing my car, I pack my car in the same way every single time I go.

00:35:16.61
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:35:20.67
Mike
Right.

00:35:21.97
Bill
um Because number one, I know it fits, but it's it just, if I don't, like if I don't, if I'm not taking along water with me,

00:35:23.88
Mike
Yeah.

00:35:29.11
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:35:29.48
Bill
it's It's almost like there's a there's a space in the trunk that's missing. And one of the suitcases, I'm like, hey what can I put under there so it fits better? You know, just one of the suitcases that kind of sags down.

00:35:36.58
Mike
Right.

00:35:39.18
Bill
Switching cars, because this one has a ah totally flat trunk. The other one had a little bit more of ah a rise in one area.

00:35:45.87
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:35:45.94
Bill
So I did ah learning to pack the car differently in this one. it was fucking weird.

00:35:48.84
Mike
ah

00:35:50.10
Bill
um But I don't know. But getting in my same thing, like you said, I i think the things that I do um help me out from a work standpoint and a personal standpoint and a safety standpoint ah along the way. But, you know, the funny part is, is that the second part of this question, I put, do you think that's part of us being who we are or possibly a learned behavior?

00:36:10.98
Bill
And I think it'd be probably that who we are, right?

00:36:13.92
Mike
Yeah, yeah, definitely.

00:36:14.52
Bill
The alcoholic behavior. Okay.

00:36:16.06
Mike
Right. Yeah. Yeah. and And, you know, and some of it, think some of it's learned for me too. I mean, I, you know, again, I talk a lot about wasting time and burning calories and for nothing and all that. I mean, that's, that is an important thing in my life because I wasted so much of my fucking life. I don't like wasting time and energy today.

00:36:39.13
Mike
And that's that's kind of part of it.

00:36:39.10
Bill
Right.

00:36:40.93
Mike
I mean, I want to do things as efficiently as I can. um You know, shit that I have to do that I clearly don't want to do, but I have to do them. um I want to do it as efficiently and and save as much energy as possible. And yeah, that's, you know, like packing your car and doing, yes, knowing knowing where things are at. So I'm not fucking spending a half hour looking for something that I'm looking for.

00:37:05.06
Mike
ah know where it's fucking at. You know? Yeah. it's ah So, no, i I'm glad I'm this way.

00:37:12.58
Bill
Right. Well, and it's funny, too. So the you know, I've got you've seen them. I've got the two bigger big duffel bags that I that I take with me. And it's got I mean, literally, it's it's all the clothes that I that I would ever think of wearing fit into duffel bags.

00:37:24.79
Bill
I'm not a I don't have I mean, you could never pack all your clothes.

00:37:25.36
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:37:29.10
Mike
Oh, no.

00:37:29.81
Bill
yeah

00:37:29.96
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:37:30.83
Bill
um But I there's even some I just took out some T-shirts. I had some more novelty type of T-shirts in my bag that I I've been doing this for a year and a half and I've never taken them out worn them.

00:37:40.62
Mike
Right.

00:37:40.81
Bill
So I'm like, fuck it. I took them out. I took them out of my bag. Not that I don't like the T-shirts, but but I'm like, I'm not wearing them.

00:37:44.60
Mike
Yeah.

00:37:46.23
Bill
So why carry them?

00:37:46.92
Mike
Yeah.

00:37:48.10
Bill
You know?

00:37:48.52
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:37:49.19
Bill
And I, the, the bags right now are packed a certain way. And then when it gets colder, I'll flip a couple of things around because I've got, I've got all my long sleeve shirts in the other bag.

00:37:54.37
Mike
Sure.

00:37:57.43
Bill
so I'll flip some things around. So one is not all weighted down, but I'll end up using both bags more than, than I use just one now. But when I get someplace, hopefully I have, and not all these places have, not all of them have big dressers.

00:38:04.79
Mike
Yeah.

00:38:10.97
Bill
There's been a ton of places I've been in because they're more of these smaller, older homes that not a lot of closet space, you know, or, um you know, just not, not a lot of dresser space and stuff like that.

00:38:20.51
Mike
Right.

00:38:21.19
Bill
But if I can, um I'll take out, basically it's all the, you know, the clothes I wear throughou throughout the week, t-shirts, underwear, socks, jeans, shorts.

00:38:26.97
Mike
Yeah.

00:38:29.60
Bill
I put them all out there and then I don't have to go in my, my duffel bags at all from maybe, I don't know, random thing, but, um but I, I pack it that way so I can unload.

00:38:35.53
Mike
Right.

00:38:39.12
Bill
Same thing when I get back here, it doesn't take that long, done pack 10 minutes, 15, you know,

00:38:41.88
Mike
Uh-huh. Right.

00:38:43.65
Bill
And I put everything away, you know?

00:38:45.46
Mike
No.

00:38:46.29
Bill
So, yeah, but again, go back to that good point. I mean, it's, we're not, we're not clinical, you know, with the, with the OCD or anything like that.

00:38:51.30
Mike
Yes. Yep.

00:38:53.50
Bill
And I do know it's a, it is, i mean, for people that are really afflicted with it, I mean, it's a, yeah, it's a, it's a challenge, but you and I have our particular ways of doing things.

00:38:59.41
Mike
yes

00:39:02.14
Bill
And I think for the most part, um everything is done for the right or positive reasons.

00:39:02.51
Mike
ye

00:39:08.69
Bill
Yeah.

00:39:08.81
Mike
Yeah, efficient. yeah

00:39:10.60
Bill
yeah yeah

00:39:12.76
Mike
I'll justify and rationalize that shit all day long.

00:39:15.67
Bill
Right.

00:39:15.84
Mike
I'm being efficient.

00:39:15.87
Bill
Well, the,

00:39:16.64
Mike
Fuck you. I like where I stuff where I like my stuff.

00:39:19.78
Bill
Yeah, and there's and there's nothing wrong nothing wrong with that. It's just I got, yeah, everything. even Again, even when I travel, like the way the kitchen is set up, it'll take me usually a day and a half to kind of get settled on where I have things.

00:39:27.31
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:39:30.08
Mike
Yeah. Mm-hmm.

00:39:31.61
Bill
But I mean, I make sure that all my, you know, I put my groceries away and I put them up and if I got space for them. And um yeah, I don't have shit just laying all over the place unless I don't. There are certain places that I don't have a lot of covered space.

00:39:43.46
Bill
um So I have no choice. I mean, I don't use a stove, so I'll put a lot of stuff up with things on the stovetop.

00:39:48.42
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:39:48.73
Bill
Nicely organized on it, but I don't have a fucking choice, you know?

00:39:49.65
Mike
Right. Sure. Right.

00:39:52.39
Bill
So, but, um, yeah, it it is, it's just a matter of, uh, you know, again, liking things the way you do.

00:39:52.70
Mike
Yeah.

00:39:58.06
Bill
The funniest part was I just thought about it when think it might've been one of the first times that I was not even first times in the last year or so that I was out there, probably when I stayed for that, that first week out there after I started traveling.

00:40:08.76
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:40:09.69
Bill
And that, that scrubber sponge that you have behind your, behind your faucet. And I didn't notice it right away, but whatever way it is right now, either it's, it's standing up like vertically or it's laying down horizontally, whichever way you,

00:40:15.64
Mike
ah hair

00:40:20.25
Mike
Yep. Yep. No, standing up vertically. Yep.

00:40:25.47
Bill
Okay. So that's the way that you, that's the way that you liked it.

00:40:26.59
Mike
Yep.

00:40:28.06
Bill
And and what happened was, is when I turned on the faucet whatever, I knock it over accidentally the first time and I put it back. And then I think I did it again. And then I just accidentally randomly noticed that it was put back in the same way.

00:40:41.30
Bill
I'm like,

00:40:41.93
Mike
yep

00:40:42.07
Bill
Like, did I, did i do that or what? So I'm like, I wonder. So I put it on the side on purpose. And then I went back to did something like, Oh, okay. So I'm like, he does that. So going keep fucking with him. So yeah, every, every, every time I went into the kitchen, i put it on the side and then I finally fessed up to it.

00:40:50.72
Mike
Yeah, of course.

00:40:56.01
Bill
And you're like, you're like, whatever. I'm just putting it back the way that I want it. Yeah.

00:40:59.23
Mike
Yeah, right. Yeah, I mean, I'm not going freak out about it and cause problem whatever. It's right. It's my fucking problem. I understand that. I wonder where I got that from. um

00:41:09.63
Bill
yeah

00:41:10.00
Mike
Right, yeah. I'll just, okay. It's not the way I want it. I'm going to put it the way I want it, and then it's the way I want it. Fine. Right. It's nobody else's fucking problem.

00:41:17.35
Bill
Yeah, and but I think that's the that's the only thing that i've ever I've ever really fucked with you about in your house because I just i just noticed it was such a little random thing um and completely random.

00:41:18.54
Mike
It's my problem, and I'll deal with it.

00:41:25.13
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:41:28.36
Mike
Yeah.

00:41:29.99
Bill
I wasn't looking for something to fuck with you with. That's what made it more fun, so.

00:41:32.20
Mike
Right. Sure. Oof.

00:41:34.30
Bill
yeah

00:41:34.76
Mike
Mm-hmm. Eh. Eh.

00:41:35.99
Bill
All right. So um what do you say we take a break? And then I personally, I want to hear ah about Alaska and I could tell you probably a little bit about the the whole Shawnee forest that I went to, but I think Alaska is probably more interesting and but in my opinion.

00:41:48.36
Mike
yeah

00:41:48.87
Bill
But so what do you, what do you think?

00:41:50.58
Mike
All right. yeah All right. Well, we'll be back with more Danger Moose and the Cheese right after these words from our sponsor.

00:42:08.26
Bill
All right, everyone. Welcome back. God, that was ah that was a tough one not to not to laugh.

00:42:13.66
Mike
Help.

00:42:14.78
Bill
i like I like it, though. Danger Moose and the Cheese coming at you.

00:42:17.54
Mike
help

00:42:18.73
Bill
you Weekdays at 5

00:42:21.76
Mike
In the boarding.

00:42:25.64
Bill
So anywho, Alaska, but you couldve could have been where you picked up this this lovely cold of yours, but and the that's where you picked up the cold and the and the new moniker.

00:42:27.98
Mike
Yes.

00:42:31.56
Mike
Yeah. Oh, it was.

00:42:36.66
Bill
so you got two great things coming out of Alaska, danger moose and a cold.

00:42:40.38
Mike
Yes.

00:42:40.56
Bill
yeah

00:42:43.23
Mike
And spending time with Cam and his wonderful family.

00:42:46.09
Bill
Well, yeah, yeah, yeah, that that too, yeah.

00:42:46.38
Mike
so Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That too. Right. Um, yeah.

00:42:49.53
Bill
Hi, Cam. Hi, Cam.

00:42:52.73
Mike
yeah Anyway. Um, yeah, so we went up there and hung out and spent some time with them. It was great. Um, ah you know, the travel was tough.

00:43:02.67
Bill
right

00:43:04.55
Mike
Um, I mean, it wasn't going up there. wasn't all that half bad. You know, we left early in the morning and it was, uh, you know, it was, uh, what an hour, some change to Chicago. Then we spent about an hour there in the airport and then, about a little over six hours on the plane up to Anchorage.

00:43:22.88
Mike
Um, yeah. But yeah, you know, you lose four hours. So there's that, um

00:43:30.00
Bill
right

00:43:31.15
Mike
you know, so we got there and it was, i don't know, it's like two in the afternoon or something. It was six o'clock at night in our head, you know, so by the time we're, you know, a few hours later, we're just like, oh my God, we're so exhausted, you know, and they're like, it's it's six at night we're going no it's not it's it's 10 it's bedtime sun's out yeah but it was cool man yeah we went and had this really good pizza um friday night imagine that we went got pizza um

00:43:49.18
Bill
Right.

00:43:51.82
Bill
Right.

00:44:05.14
Bill
right

00:44:07.42
Mike
Killer stuff. ah Yeah. And then, we you know, we just hung out. We went to the Alaska State Fair one day. That was very cool. um It was a state fair. It was pretty much like any other state fair I've been to. Nothing.

00:44:23.56
Mike
You know, except there was like mountains all around us. So that was cool.

00:44:26.69
Bill
right

00:44:27.22
Mike
um You know, and then what the next day we went and um we like drove up the inlet, the main inlet there ah and went up to a wildlife preserve.

00:44:43.53
Bill
right

00:44:43.62
Mike
um You know, it a place where they take injured animals and stuff and keep them. So it was... You black bears, brown bears, wolves, moose, elk, reindeer. Yeah, all of it.

00:44:56.34
Mike
It was pretty cool. um

00:44:58.44
Bill
And so with with that real quick, and I didn't mean to meanan interrupt, but so is that like, um I mean, but guessing maybe there's like a fence around at some place, but they're kind of roaming around in a wide open area.

00:45:00.38
Mike
Yeah, no.

00:45:07.28
Mike
Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

00:45:09.88
Bill
Okay, okay.

00:45:10.46
Mike
Yep. Yep. Yeah. It fenced in, you know, some of them are bigger, you know, um but yeah, they were all pretty big. ah Yeah. It was, it was just very cool.

00:45:21.10
Mike
i Yeah. you know And, and the ride up there through the inlet um there's beluga whales in there. We actually saw a couple.

00:45:28.91
Bill
Right.

00:45:29.69
Mike
Yeah. Yeah. You know, I mean, they don't like, you know, jump into the air. It's not SeaWorld, you know, Shamu jumping for fish or anything. But, ah but yeah, you know, we saw them break of the water and it was, it was very cool.

00:45:42.65
Mike
Yeah. So saw whales out in the wild and yeah, I don't know. It was just, it's, it's beautiful up there. You know, I mean, we were in the Anchorage area, so we weren't out, you know, in the tundra or anything,

00:45:56.49
Bill
right

00:45:57.03
Mike
Um, we're in the city. Anchorage is a cool little town, uh, little city, you know, it's, it's, it's, um, you know, about the size of Akron.

00:46:07.15
Bill
Well, and that's was going to ask. I had no idea how big Anchorage was.

00:46:11.36
Mike
Not very big. Yeah. I mean, it's, you know, it's spread out a little bit and whatever, but yeah, the actual city itself is, yeah, it's, it's Akron. Yeah.

00:46:24.05
Bill
But I mean, you know, just ah a couple of the pictures that, and I saw the, obviously the wildlife, that refuge area. And first of all, I'm looking a couple of pictures. I'm like, I'm like, that's fucking cool, but no fucking way. And then I realized there's a refuge, but I'm still, I'm like, God, they're, they're still these fucking wild animals.

00:46:35.29
Mike
Right. Yeah. Yeah.

00:46:38.35
Bill
I would, I would still, I think that'd be so fucking cool.

00:46:41.33
Mike
Yeah.

00:46:41.33
Bill
But, um, I mean, i suppose a little bit, I mean, they're, again, they're still fucking wild animals that you're, that you're close ish to, right?

00:46:48.01
Mike
Oh, yeah. Right. Yeah. I mean, we, um, ah you know, they were telling us, I mean, yeah, we could go drive up to this one spot actually on the base on like the back part of the base. Cause base is huge.

00:46:59.12
Bill
Right.

00:46:59.55
Mike
Um, it's actually a dual base. It's, uh, half of it's the air force and half of it's the army, which is pretty rare. Um, yeah. So, I mean, it's, it's big. They actually live on base.

00:47:10.96
Mike
It's like a whole little subdivision suburb kind of part that they live in.

00:47:16.26
Bill
Right.

00:47:17.30
Mike
um Yeah. And, uh, but they said you could drive to the back and like, if we sat there for a while, you know, we'd see some moose, we probably see some bears, you know, there, yeah, we didn't actually see them out in the wild, but we weren't kind of out that much, you know, we were doing stuff specifically.

00:47:32.98
Mike
So we were only there for three days. So yeah.

00:47:36.36
Bill
Right.

00:47:37.11
Mike
Um, but yeah, you know, I guess the Northern lights, it was cloudy. Unfortunately, the, the, night that they were going to be real visible. But, um, yeah, I guess if it wouldn't have been cloudy, it would have a pretty damn cool show.

00:47:50.10
Bill
Right.

00:47:50.73
Mike
well, you know, it was just, and plus it was nice to just hang out with Cam and the family and the kids and all that stuff. So we good stuff.

00:47:57.08
Bill
Right. Yeah. I mean, it's again, I'd love to I'd love to be up there. Weather wise. I mean, it was chilly, but not like brutally cold or anything yet this time of year.

00:48:04.70
Mike
No, no, no. I mean, no, I held couple days. It got up to like 70, 75, think one day. Yeah.

00:48:09.37
Bill
Oh, really? Okay.

00:48:09.88
Mike
seventy five i think one day yeah You know, not for long. And, and you know, the wind would kick up and it'd drop back down 10 degrees and whatever. but yeah, no, it wasn't was bad.

00:48:21.09
Bill
Well, there was, and I think it might've been either the last day you were there or maybe the day you got back. I can't remember when, when it happened, but did you hear the story about the lady that got dragged out of her garage by a bear up in Alaska?

00:48:30.71
Mike
no

00:48:31.17
Bill
Yeah.

00:48:33.68
Bill
Yeah, and this is a true fucking story. and either I can't remember what day it happened. They were just doing the follow-up on it, talking about the recovery she's got to go through and and how it happened and the fact they haven't found this bear yet. um But I don't i don't remember. i don't know if it was around Anchorage or not. doesn't matter.

00:48:48.18
Bill
It was in ah like a subdivision area, and all she did, she like opened up her garage. She was going to go out for a jog and got attacked attacked by a bear, and this bear dragged her out into the street, part of the time by her fucking head.

00:48:59.65
Mike
nice Yeah.

00:48:59.82
Bill
Um, so just random in the middle of a fucking neighborhood. And, I don't know how I, I didn't hear or read the whole story, but, um, I'm like, Jesus Christ. Yeah. I mean, and it could, I mean, anywhere there are active, you know, bear, like bears like that.

00:49:14.67
Mike
sure

00:49:14.66
Bill
i mean it can happen anywhere. doesn't that didn't It just happened to be in Alaska either like right when you guys were leaving or whatever.

00:49:19.79
Mike
Right.

00:49:20.08
Bill
And I'm like, but like, wouldn't that suck?

00:49:20.35
Mike
Oh, hell no. Yeah.

00:49:21.82
Bill
Cause you're not even going out for a jog. Let's say you're walking out.

00:49:23.87
Mike
Right. Yeah.

00:49:24.37
Bill
They haven't got going out for a goddamn cigarette. The bear just grabs you by that big fucking melon.

00:49:27.89
Mike
yeah

00:49:29.36
Bill
Yeah.

00:49:33.32
Bill
doing anything. You're not trying to do anything. Got a cigarette hanging out of your mouth and you're being dragged dragged down to the street by a fucking bear.

00:49:37.47
Mike
right

00:49:43.15
Bill
But, uh, yeah, that's ah not, not on, not on anyone's to do list, but, uh,

00:49:47.25
Mike
yeah

00:49:47.32
Bill
no, like I said, the, the pictures that I saw and everything, and I was kind of wondering about the travel, but, uh, I, I couldn't remember, um, if I would have thought about it, cause I'd make some phone calls, um, uh, to Alaska, you know, from, for work and stuff like that.

00:49:59.01
Bill
Very few, every once in a while, one out to Hawaii. And I've always got a, cause I, I, I don't think about the time difference. You know, I know it's a difference, but I usually just Google it.

00:50:05.08
Mike
Right.

00:50:07.58
Bill
What fucking time is it in Alaska? You know, that type of thing.

00:50:09.59
Mike
Right.

00:50:10.19
Bill
It's like, oh, okay. I can call now. But, um, But yeah, so yeah, well, yeah, well, three hours from here, four hours from, from Cleveland. So that's, that's crazy.

00:50:16.82
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:50:17.94
Bill
That's a big difference. I mean, even, even Pacific time, you know, going, going when, I mean, years ago, I traveled out to Portland a couple of times and, you know, even living Wisconsin, it's still two hours and there's a, you know, depending on when you're flying at a two hour different makes a difference, you know?

00:50:19.05
Mike
Yeah.

00:50:26.97
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:50:30.95
Mike
Right?

00:50:34.84
Mike
Yeah.

00:50:35.38
Bill
Um, cause I think the same thing I left a couple of times, like six, seven o'clock in the morning and you know, you got a four hour flight by the time you get there, it's, it's like eight o'clock and you're like wait a second, let me do the math, two, three, whatever.

00:50:39.74
Mike
Yeah.

00:50:44.03
Mike
Yeah, we did.

00:50:46.08
Bill
Like Jesus Christ, it's only eight in the morning.

00:50:48.43
Mike
el

00:50:49.84
Bill
But, uh, yeah, four, that's a little bit more significant, but I'm, yeah, I'm glad you had a nice time, you know?

00:50:52.83
Mike
listen

00:50:56.17
Bill
And, uh, and once, once again, these, uh, I guess taking it back to the sobriety thing, you know, that what, what will we do?

00:50:56.25
Mike
yeah we did

00:51:02.25
Bill
What will we do?

00:51:02.36
Mike
Right.

00:51:03.13
Bill
Yeah.

00:51:03.47
Mike
ah Yeah,

00:51:05.10
Bill
yeah I'm going to go to fucking Alaska. No, first I'm going to get engaged. Then I'm going to go to Alaska.

00:51:09.62
Mike
right.

00:51:12.40
Bill
But yeah. um So yeah, the, my, my little trip, but no, no wildlife refuge. I didn't see any moose or anything like that. um But it's funny, this little place that I stayed and it was, and I was, it was a Shawnee national forest. It's in just outside of a little town called Ava, Illinois.

00:51:28.78
Bill
um So AVA, Ava, Illinois, just little fucking podunk town.

00:51:31.51
Mike
Yeah.

00:51:33.61
Bill
Not too far from Kentucky, right down in that area. Pretty much not too far.

00:51:36.33
Mike
Right.

00:51:37.69
Bill
i't I don't even think it's... I didn't go that i didn't go that far south from there. um But I don't know, probably half hour of that. But um beautiful.

00:51:45.15
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:51:46.70
Bill
I mean, really beautiful area. But the the the cabin that i that I stayed in... so And I knew this. You drive through the parking lot of this restaurant that the the people that have the Airbnb owned, there's two cabins back there.

00:51:58.50
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:51:58.47
Bill
And as I pulled up, there was somebody in the other cabin. And distance-wise, it's probably... Uh, in your neighborhood, it'd be like taking out your neighbor's house and then having the other house next to you type of thing.

00:52:09.53
Bill
Maybe a little bit, a little bit further than that, but I mean, close-ish, maybe a a lot, a lot and a half away where the other cabin is.

00:52:09.70
Mike
Gotcha. Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

00:52:16.45
Bill
Um, and I saw the guy, he's just a, know, guy in the truck, whatever. It was a nicer truck. So not look like some fucking hillbilly, hillbilly anything.

00:52:24.07
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:52:24.06
Bill
Um, and i didn't really see much of the guy. i mean, I was only there. I got there Saturday at three and I left, uh, know, early on Monday morning. Um, but so right the back of the parking lot, the restaurants open, i think Saturday, it's Friday, Saturday, and Wednesday.

00:52:37.53
Bill
So people coming in and out, um, some people hooting it up and hollering it up on, on Saturday a little bit, but nothing big, nothing out of the ordinary.

00:52:37.87
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:52:44.89
Bill
Um, cabin was nice, but it funny when I first got there, you know, so i usually do a speed test, not that I had to work, but I did it anyhow, curiosity.

00:52:52.22
Mike
Sure.

00:52:52.49
Bill
Um, and the internet connected at, um, at 15, um, fifteen 15.

00:52:58.70
Mike
Yeah.

00:52:59.04
Bill
And I'm like, so I reset the modem and I hit it like a whopping 20. Okay. okay

00:53:03.21
Mike
ah Oh.

00:53:04.36
Bill
which is Which is fine until you try to start doing something.

00:53:07.54
Mike
Right.

00:53:07.59
Bill
So watching, you know, like like streaming a TV show, no issue whatsoever.

00:53:08.22
Mike
Right.

00:53:11.89
Bill
But um it's a good thing I didn't have to, I couldn't have recorded there. I mean, i wouldn't I wouldn't have stayed there.

00:53:16.11
Mike
Right.

00:53:17.50
Bill
I couldn't have worked there. I couldn't record there. um I wouldn't have stayed there. I'd have been under that circumstance with that speed. um Because i don't I don't stay any place that's less than 100 because that's what I need to run things efficiently.

00:53:29.09
Mike
Sure.

00:53:29.28
Bill
back to Back to efficiency, right? Yeah.

00:53:31.06
Mike
Right. Yeah.

00:53:31.63
Bill
um But even loading up, like ah I was doing our episode clip and I was sitting out on the porch and I, you know, try to like basically download and upload these episode clips that I was doing. im like, I'm sitting there looking at it and I'm like, Jesus is fucking Christ.

00:53:44.42
Bill
It's taken for fucking ever. I'm like, ah you know, again. First world problems, right? You know, i'm sitting there.

00:53:49.18
Mike
Yeah.

00:53:49.97
Bill
Jesus Christ. You know, it took two three minutes to upload a goddamn clip where it usually take 30 seconds, but not a big deal.

00:53:53.91
Mike
Uh-huh. Right.

00:53:56.36
Bill
um Very nice. Very comfortable with the weather was great. The the trails and stuff I went on with, everything was nice.

00:54:01.90
Mike
Cool.

00:54:01.98
Bill
um But on on the way back, because I went, I hit these two different trails. It was like five miles of of walking that I did between these trails on and Saturday. And on the well, first of all, on the way down there, um because I mean, I had a full tank gas when I left here and I could have gotten and I did actually got all literally all the way down there, you know, before I had to get gas.

00:54:22.71
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:54:24.43
Bill
But I'm looking for this place to get gas. And I stopped to get groceries in this town about 45 minutes north because there was an Aldi and a Walmart there. Yeah.

00:54:32.16
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:54:33.48
Bill
So I pull into this, you know, Circle K, you know, you've heard of a Circle K before, you know, easy enough gas station.

00:54:37.49
Mike
Yeah.

00:54:38.50
Bill
You and I used to go to them on the way to what do you call it?

00:54:39.81
Mike
Yeah.

00:54:40.94
Bill
Who do you know? So, you know, popular enough gas station, right?

00:54:41.82
Mike
Yeah. What do you call it? Who do you know? Same thing.

00:54:46.06
Bill
Yeah, that's what said. What do you call it? Who do you know?

00:54:49.12
Mike
Right.

00:54:49.17
Bill
I did say I did say who. Yeah, we went to what do you call it?

00:54:52.00
Mike
but What do you call it?

00:54:55.91
Bill
What's that Friday night meeting you guys go to your home group?

00:54:57.48
Mike
Yeah. What do you call it

00:54:58.69
Bill
Eh, it's a whatchamacallit. It's a so what do you call it?

00:55:00.68
Mike
Yes.

00:55:02.51
Bill
But so I pull in there, get out, now do the whole thing. go I actually swiped my card and then i look at it and like right to the left side of the tag, not even right.

00:55:13.70
Bill
They should have had this this sign like above where you swipe your card, but they didn't.

00:55:17.78
Mike
Yeah.

00:55:18.55
Bill
So I swipe my card and stuff and it says regular and diesel. I'm like, so it's on this other side of the pump. I'm like, does it mean like, I'll just try it. So they had no premium gas, no mid grade gas, just diesel and regular.

00:55:30.21
Bill
And I'm like, yeah.

00:55:30.61
Mike
isn

00:55:31.47
Bill
So I moved to another pump there, their entire, all nine pumps or whatever. It's just, they had,

00:55:35.44
Mike
Yeah. Yeah. They had two takes on the ground.

00:55:38.53
Bill
Yeah, well, I mean, no, it's just they had to have been out. The tanks were the tanks were correct, so if they would have had them filled, it's like they were they were out of premium and out of mid-grade.

00:55:40.53
Mike
Yeah. Ah.

00:55:47.05
Mike
Ah.

00:55:47.15
Bill
They only had only had that available.

00:55:49.95
Mike
I see.

00:55:50.35
Bill
So, but to your point, the next gas station, this little fucking podunk gas station I stop at, um, another one, only, only regular gas, 87 grade. I'm kind of, I can't get that.

00:56:01.03
Bill
Second one I stop at only 87.

00:56:01.17
Mike
Right.

00:56:02.75
Bill
I'm like, Jesus fucking Christ.

00:56:04.42
Mike
Wow.

00:56:04.44
Bill
I ended up finding gas, but they ended up, I paid $4 and like 55 cents for a gallon of gas.

00:56:08.68
Mike
All

00:56:09.47
Bill
Yeah. was fucking ridiculous. Um, but on the way back after I was hiking and all that stuff, I'm like, man, I can really, just, a lot of times I'll stop at a gas station, grab a Gatorade, something like that.

00:56:18.97
Mike
right.

00:56:19.60
Bill
Um, I can't find a fucking gas station. I drive into, into town, into Ava. There's fucking nothing. There's two bars, no, three bars in there.

00:56:26.88
Mike
course.

00:56:27.59
Bill
You know, in this little fucking town, I'm like, Jesus Christ, where's a goddamn gas station? Then on the way out, I saw that where that where a dollar general was. I'm like, well, shit, I could have went in there yesterday. But um nice little town. Very, very nice. I had everything I needed.

00:56:41.04
Bill
um They had a grill, which I didn't use because they didn't want to just go through all the hassle of fucking using it.

00:56:45.04
Mike
Sure.

00:56:45.38
Bill
But this, this guy that was next door to begin with, I thought it might've been a family there, but it was just him. And he's, you know, I, I go out on the porch and obviously, you know, I did my readings out there the one morning and I'm hanging out. Obviously if I had hit my vape or something like that, I'm sitting out there just chilling, whatever.

00:57:01.48
Bill
Um, not every time, but specifically on, um, Sunday. Yeah. Sunday. Oh yeah. Cause I, yeah, I went hiking and all that shit on Sunday. So Sunday afternoon, by the time I got back and ate dinner and whatever, this guy's, this guy's out on his porch.

00:57:15.37
Bill
And I mean, from this was like from Sunday morning before I left, um, until like it ended up like the entirety he's out there working out stuff like that, which is fine.

00:57:19.51
Mike
ah her

00:57:23.94
Bill
He's got these little weights. He's doing this. He's got this whole fucking program. Um, But then when I got back later, he's just like standing on his porch. He's always out on his porch. He's like looking up at stuff and he's looking over by me. It's just fucking weird, you know?

00:57:35.16
Bill
And I'm like, I'm like, what the fuck is with this dude? You know, he was just really fucking strange. Look like a normal enough guy. But of course, serial killers usually do look normal.

00:57:41.84
Mike
Yeah. Yeah, right. Exactly.

00:57:45.52
Bill
I'm like, fuck me. Well, I guess it's been a good run. This, this motherfucker is going to come in.

00:57:48.93
Mike
Yeah.

00:57:51.25
Bill
I'm like, I got a knife. I got plenty of knives in here, but, but I'm like, yeah, was just fucking weird.

00:57:53.21
Mike
Sure.

00:57:56.58
Bill
You know, it just, uh, I don't know. Just the entire, he's like, didn't go anywhere. Just like, seemed like he was there just standing on the porch the entire fucking time.

00:58:05.01
Mike
All right.

00:58:05.89
Bill
Yeah.

00:58:06.27
Mike
What'd you do on your vacation?

00:58:08.36
Bill
Yeah, I stood.

00:58:09.33
Mike
Sit on the porch.

00:58:10.37
Bill
and stood on a porch and he had his, it's like he had his, like, it looked like he was dressed up to go run, you know, but he didn't go run anywhere.

00:58:16.63
Mike
Hmm.

00:58:19.30
Bill
he yeah He had running shoes on and what looked like running shorts. He had a tank top on, but he's doing his little workout, whatever. But then it was just, it's fucking weird. Just fucking weird. So anyhow, um I don't know.

00:58:30.02
Mike
all right.

00:58:30.49
Bill
It was, it was worth it. But the thing of it is, is that they, the one trail that I was on and I told Kathy this, they called it the, the little grand Canyon trail. And there's, All the searches I've done, there's a bunch of them that, you know, say the Grand Canyon of this or the Grand Canyon that, whether it's the state or the area like the where you and I went south of Amarillo, not you and I together, but Palo Duro.

00:58:44.95
Mike
Right. Uh-huh.

00:58:50.41
Mike
Yeah, right. Yes. Right.

00:58:52.65
Bill
That's that's called a ah mini Grand Canyon, you know, the Grand Canyon of Texas.

00:58:55.29
Mike
Yes.

00:58:57.13
Bill
And it looks like the I've never been to the Grand Canyon, but I've seen pictures.

00:58:57.22
Mike
Yep.

00:58:59.46
Mike
Yeah. Uh-huh.

00:59:01.18
Bill
You know, quacks like a duck and, you know walks like a duck.

00:59:03.22
Mike
Yeah.

00:59:03.92
Bill
It's a fucking duck there in Texas, you know, and it does.

00:59:05.27
Mike
It's a canyon.

00:59:07.52
Bill
it It looks like other people that have seen those pictures like, God damn, that's, you know, but this was a this was a gorge ish area, kind of a ravine. It was nice.

00:59:18.37
Bill
Really, really kind of like dry down in there. All the creek beds and stuff like that are dry. I think it'd be a lot. It would add a different element to it if it were, you know, obviously more rain and more water flowing through it.

00:59:28.91
Mike
Sure.

00:59:30.19
Bill
Don't get me wrong. It was nice hike. It was a nice area. It was cool. um But note to sell or note to the people of the Shawnee National Forest, it is not a mini Grand Canyon.

00:59:39.33
Mike
he

00:59:42.06
Bill
it's like It's like calling my car. Well, my car is like a Ferrari.

00:59:46.89
Mike
Sure.

00:59:46.91
Bill
no it No, it's not.

00:59:48.33
Mike
Yeah. It's like my car's a Challenger.

00:59:48.98
Bill
and

00:59:50.18
Mike
No, it's not.

00:59:51.64
Bill
yeah No, yeah. Like your car is a ah Corvette or something. It's not.

00:59:55.13
Mike
Yes.

00:59:55.49
Bill
It's just, no. No, it's just not. dude Maybe Corvettes come in that color blue, but it's not a Corvette.

01:00:01.39
Mike
Right.

01:00:02.78
Bill
So anyhow, it was a nice truck. No regrets or anything like that. It just, folks out there, are the they need to watch it with the names. That's just crazy.

01:00:10.35
Mike
Yes.

01:00:11.11
Bill
not It's not a Grand Canyon at all.

01:00:13.36
Mike
No, it's neither Grand nor a canyon.

01:00:17.56
Bill
It's a nice gorge, nice ravine.

01:00:18.70
Mike
Yes.

01:00:20.41
Bill
It's a nice ravine. so So anyhow, so good trip. Good trip on your end.

01:00:23.64
Mike
Yep.

01:00:24.18
Bill
Decent enough trip on my end.

01:00:24.36
Mike
Yep.

01:00:25.22
Bill
So, well, that's cool. Well, I'm i'm really glad that you guys got to get up there and obviously see those guys too. So how long are they stationed there?

01:00:32.89
Mike
Another couple years.

01:00:34.60
Bill
Oh shit. Wow. Okay.

01:00:35.60
Mike
Yep.

01:00:35.64
Bill
Okay. Well, that's cool.

01:00:36.51
Mike
Yep. Yep.

01:00:38.13
Bill
Well, good. We're, they're going to get to get to know the whole area.

01:00:41.09
Mike
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, she's been stationed up there before. So she knows that.

01:00:44.71
Bill
Oh, really?

01:00:45.41
Mike
Yeah. ah Yeah. Before they got together, she was up there. know, they've both been in the Air Force for quite a while.

01:00:51.53
Bill
Right.

01:00:51.59
Mike
um And um yeah. You know, and actually, side note, that summit between ah Trump and Putin, that's where it was at.

01:00:59.04
Bill
Right. Really?

01:01:01.59
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

01:01:03.13
Bill
um

01:01:03.34
Mike
Yep, it was on that Air Force base.

01:01:05.59
Bill
I didn't, I had no idea.

01:01:06.57
Mike
Yeah, so like a week or so before we were up there, couple of dickheads were there.

01:01:12.41
Bill
That would have been a fucking mess, wouldn't it?

01:01:13.64
Mike
Oh, yo yeah. Well, I don't think we would have been able to do what we did. I mean, we had to, you know, get passes and approved. And it was, it was funny. And actually we're standing in like this little office area thing. Cause we had to get passes for the time we were there.

01:01:30.61
Mike
And cause we were staying on base and um yeah, you know, it was, it was taking them a while. I mean, the guy like was in the computer looking and looking and looking us up and Chris and I understand are standing there looking at each other going, Hmm, wonder if they're going to let us on.

01:01:48.00
Mike
yeah our nefarious past is coming back to haunt us.

01:01:51.62
Bill
Right.

01:01:52.41
Mike
Yep.

01:01:53.58
Bill
Yeah.

01:01:53.64
Mike
But, nope, they did.

01:01:53.74
Bill
Or.

01:01:54.80
Mike
Eventually, they went, yeah, here you go.

01:01:58.84
Bill
Yeah. So we went to the only time I was on the base was um years ago and it would have been, and know what it was. It was like May of 2005. two thousand and five Dawn and I and the kids and her mom and dad went down. Her brother, Mike graduated from the army at, or, uh,

01:02:16.07
Bill
bootcamp he did or be his basic training he did at Fort Knox. So we went down there and, you know, the same thing.

01:02:19.98
Mike
Okay. Yeah.

01:02:22.26
Bill
I mean, I, I, again, I didn't realize that Fort Knox was a base. i mean you always see Fort Knox and you know, there's gold isn't stored there.

01:02:26.34
Mike
Sure.

01:02:28.37
Bill
Like everyone thinks and blah, blah, blah.

01:02:28.75
Mike
Right.

01:02:29.72
Bill
It's all that.

01:02:29.81
Mike
Right.

01:02:30.51
Bill
It's just, it's a like, kind of like, it sounds like what you were talking about. It is. It's like you drive in there, you're, you're in this city, you know, this, this small city and you're like, Jesus Christ, fucking cool.

01:02:36.78
Mike
Yeah.

01:02:40.04
Mike
Yeah.

01:02:41.58
Bill
But yeah, going into there and you to figure again, 2005, closer to the terrorist attacks and all this sort of shit, whatever.

01:02:41.79
Mike
Yeah. Sure. Sure.

01:02:48.12
Bill
And um I remember, I don't remember um how, I remember waiting at the at the thing and knowing it was going to be a little intense getting in there. But um I don't remember the process that we had to go through, you know, to get in.

01:03:00.10
Bill
But I do remember it was a process, you know,

01:03:02.29
Mike
Yeah, right. And I mean, yeah, and every time, you know, we'd go off and do something when we come back home, you know, we'd have to show our passes and go through the thing and, yep, have have my ball us.

01:03:13.43
Mike
Yep. Standing there with guns, you ready to kill us.

01:03:17.59
Bill
Right. don't you Don't you remember me? I'm the guy with all the stuff.

01:03:21.14
Mike
Yeah, right. Yeah, right.

01:03:22.52
Bill
You know, I got the tattoos and all the metal and no hair.

01:03:23.22
Mike
Uh-huh. ah ha

01:03:25.19
Bill
You remember me, don't you? I was here this morning.

01:03:26.23
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:03:27.98
Bill
i'm ah I'm okay. I'm doing well. I'm i good.

01:03:31.90
Bill
Yeah. Well, anyhow, i'm I'm glad you guys had a good time. It sounds like a nice time.

01:03:34.52
Mike
We did.

01:03:36.24
Bill
All right. So this is from um obviously, again, we're in the ninth month, ninth step. This came from Keep It Simple. I will never be able to make direct amends to some people. I know we've talked about amends stuff, but I think this is something a little bit different. it was just from a reading a little bit ago, um not too long ago, because, again, it's only, you know, what, September? What day is it today? September fifth

01:03:56.99
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:03:57.01
Bill
um

01:03:57.19
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:03:57.93
Bill
I will think of other kinds of amends I can make to them. And this is my my notes. It also focused on the fact that the second part of step three is, or the step is, accept when to do so would injure them or others.

01:04:09.87
Bill
okay

01:04:10.33
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:04:11.29
Bill
So my question is, did you amends to um first of all, where you knew it would hurt somebody, and if so, what did you do instead? And again, I'm never asking, and I think you know this, but I'm like, I'm not asking, letting everyone know, I'm not asking for my friend Mike to say, well, my friend Jim, I fucked his i fucked his wife in the ass and wasn't quite sure how to tell him.

01:04:23.64
Mike
You're right.

01:04:30.15
Mike
Sure. Hmm.

01:04:34.86
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:04:36.59
Bill
Sorry, honey. So anyhow, if that happened, that that's a hypothetical, as far as I know.

01:04:40.40
Mike
ahha Sure. but As far as you know.

01:04:42.43
Bill
yeah yeah So anyhow, amends that you that you knew might have hurt somebody, and if so, what did you do instead? Or I guess what would you would would you do instead in that circumstance?

01:04:53.58
Bill
Okay.

01:04:53.85
Mike
Um, yeah.

01:04:59.30
Mike
Um, you know, uh, what, to you know, right. Specifically now I'm thinking about things. Um,

01:05:08.17
Bill
hey

01:05:09.98
Mike
no, um, D you know, you, you, did you, you do what you can, right. You, you, you, you're are a good person, you know, the living amends part, you know, which we've talked about out here.

01:05:20.17
Bill
Right.

01:05:23.12
Mike
Yes. You, you just, you, You don't continue that bad behavior. um You know, yeah, sometimes you can't make things right. Sometimes going back and, you know, we talk about muddying the waters again.

01:05:36.46
Mike
Hey, the waters are clear, man.

01:05:36.95
Bill
right

01:05:37.74
Mike
You know, don't fucking stir shit up. oh Yeah, you don't stir shit up. You know, you certainly don't continue to hurt anybody. You don't make things worse for anybody. And that's sometimes the best thing to do is just...

01:05:51.84
Mike
You know, live with it, man. You know, you know what you did was wrong.

01:05:53.60
Bill
Right.

01:05:55.76
Mike
And, you know, but um the best thing to do is, okay, I've got to deal with it. I've got to forgive myself and and move on. And that's that's pretty much what I've done in those sort of situations.

01:06:07.61
Bill
Right.

01:06:09.20
Mike
Yes, I'm not going to go stir shit up to make myself feel better. That's not the point.

01:06:14.27
Bill
Right. Yeah. And, you know, I know a lot of people talk about, and I think it's a, there's a story in the, ah probably a couple of stories in the big book, if I remember correctly.

01:06:21.86
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:06:22.88
Bill
And they, they did, they talk about, you know, infidelities and things like that. So, you know, did you, do you go and blow somebody's marriage up just to make yourself feel better?

01:06:26.32
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:06:29.59
Mike
Right.

01:06:30.55
Bill
And the answer is no, you shouldn't do that.

01:06:30.94
Mike
Yeah. Of course not.

01:06:32.87
Bill
Um, you know, or, um, I don't know. I mean, I've heard people even talk about, you know, possibly they, they committed some sort of crime yeah yeah and, you know, I mean, I, I believe some people have probably came and, you know, did take their lumps or, you know, they try to make some sort of amends and like a backdoor type way.

01:06:41.31
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:06:47.55
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:06:51.17
Bill
Speaking of fucking each other in the ass, fucking with the ass.

01:06:52.08
Mike
Hey.

01:06:54.22
Bill
um You know, like a make make the restitution some way, donate money or do whatever it is, you know, basically do that.

01:06:55.83
Mike
Right. Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

01:06:59.81
Bill
So you're not walking back in and like you said, stirring shit.

01:07:00.35
Mike
Right.

01:07:03.45
Bill
Right.

01:07:03.80
Mike
Right. and and And again, you know, part of that is, you know, well, okay, so you go take the lumps, but it fucking affects your family, your kids, you know, you got to go get fucking locked up for 10 years.

01:07:11.99
Bill
Right.

01:07:14.50
Mike
um yeah Right. I mean, it's, that's why, again, you, you talk to other people, you know, you talk to, cause we've all done shit. ah You know, how did you handle it? You know, you talk to somebody that's got more time than you. Imagine that.

01:07:28.95
Bill
Right.

01:07:29.09
Mike
and You know, what did you do? What, you know, what do you think I should do? What, Yeah. You know, again, if you're going yes, you're going to clear up the wreckage of your past, but you're going to fucking cause more wreckage. In the meantime, you can't do that.

01:07:43.38
Bill
right

01:07:43.54
Mike
You know, so you've got to, yes, it's going to leave alleviate your guilt, but so, you know, you're you're not the fucking center of the universe anymore. Um, you know, if if it's in the past and you got away with it, um, don't think that you fucking can anymore because you can't.

01:07:58.59
Bill
yeah Right.

01:08:02.60
Mike
Um, but yeah, so you don't continue to behave. Well, I got away with it. I can continue to do that. No, of course not. You stop doing it. And, um, yeah, you know, you make,

01:08:13.58
Mike
you make the best amends you can, whatever that is, you know, um like you said, donate money to, you know, if you stole from a children's home or something, you know, fucking to give money back anonymously, you know?

01:08:24.12
Bill
right

01:08:28.10
Mike
ah yeah Yeah. There are ways to make things right without fucking blowing the entire world up.

01:08:33.45
Bill
Right.

01:08:34.06
Mike
Yeah.

01:08:34.41
Bill
Well, and you know, um I'm sorry.

01:08:34.46
Mike
So you talk to other people.

01:08:36.21
Bill
Go ahead.

01:08:36.48
Mike
No, you talk to other people and you figure out how to fucking do it and you make things right in the right way.

01:08:43.13
Bill
Right.

01:08:43.92
Mike
Yeah.

01:08:45.35
Bill
And, uh, you know, and it's funny, we don't again, talk about interrupting. I thought, I thought you were done. You took it, you took a beat and I jumped in there.

01:08:50.39
Mike
Yeah.

01:08:53.00
Bill
Sorry about that. Um, but yeah, I mean, like ah we talked about, you know, when people, people are dead. You know, I mean, I, I, I felt a, I, I would have, you know, made amends to my dad for the way I acted, but you know, it it was at his funeral.

01:09:04.11
Bill
So it's kind of an obvious thing that you can't make amends to a dead man.

01:09:04.81
Mike
Right. Right.

01:09:08.56
Bill
But then again, um i made peace with myself and obviously have learned to live a better life based on that, that revelation that I had, you know, and,

01:09:09.08
Mike
No.

01:09:11.94
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:09:15.94
Mike
Sure.

01:09:17.22
Bill
And that sort of thing. And the same thing, you know, I talk about, um I don't know, maybe even some of the things that I know for a fact. I mean, it's not like I sat down with, you know, with mom and with Kathy and certainly not with Dawn and said, okay, um I'm going to make a list here.

01:09:33.60
Bill
And let's, ah I made a list.

01:09:33.75
Mike
Right.

01:09:35.24
Bill
um I'm going to tell you, here's all the ways I fucked you over that you you don't even know about and you never will.

01:09:35.37
Mike
Here's all the shit I did to you. Right. Right.

01:09:40.92
Mike
right isn

01:09:42.81
Bill
um But here we go. Number one. Yeah.

01:09:44.71
Mike
right

01:09:46.01
Bill
And, you know, like ah like with Don, I mean, Don was I've said that a hundred times. and Anyone who doesn't know, it's my it's my son's mom, my second ex-wife, um even my first wife, you know, with Pam.

01:09:55.39
Mike
Right.

01:09:56.48
Bill
Either one of them. There was plenty of things that I made. i made my peace with them to begin with.

01:10:02.98
Mike
h

01:10:03.35
Bill
And then I continued, like you said, that that living amends and and specifically neither one of them.

01:10:06.49
Mike
Yeah.

01:10:08.81
Bill
um Like what Tam, I said, I owe you a conversation. I think I did it. I wrote her a really nice email and then I talked to her a little bit. um Kind of detailed everything out about basically just this.

01:10:19.71
Bill
This is how I was and I get it. And I don't want to be that way anymore. It was, you know, that the gist of my amends to them and everyone else, you know.

01:10:23.04
Mike
Right.

01:10:27.37
Bill
um But, you know, Dawn even said it a number of times. She's like, I have no desire to rehash.

01:10:33.54
Mike
Yeah, right. Yeah.

01:10:36.38
Bill
And even though I wasn't necessarily trying to rehash, um she just made it really fucking clear.

01:10:36.49
Mike
Yeah.

01:10:41.03
Bill
i don't

01:10:41.24
Mike
Yeah.

01:10:41.96
Bill
I don't want to rehash and he anything.

01:10:43.12
Mike
Yeah, right. that's Yeah, exactly. okay

01:10:46.85
Bill
I, I'm,

01:10:46.99
Mike
Wow. Those normal people, they know how to leave the past in the past.

01:10:50.85
Bill
yeah, I think she said something along the lines of, I fucking made it through all this stuff. I don't need to, don't need to revisit it.

01:10:55.04
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

01:10:56.70
Bill
And, you know, same, same thing.

01:10:57.07
Mike
Exactly.

01:10:59.32
Bill
She's like, ah keep doing what you're doing. You're fine. She goes, I, I, I forgive you, but and I've said this before.

01:11:01.99
Mike
see

01:11:04.75
Bill
She said, I forgive you, but I will never forget.

01:11:05.14
Mike
Yeah.

01:11:07.71
Bill
I'm like, what, what more can I ask for?

01:11:08.04
Mike
Yeah.

01:11:10.84
Mike
Not a damn thing.

01:11:10.85
Bill
Exactly.

01:11:12.02
Mike
Yes. Yup. Yup.

01:11:13.77
Bill
Exactly. I was like, okay, thank you very much. I'm going to come back tomorrow and be a better person.

01:11:16.27
Mike
yes

01:11:17.93
Bill
How's that?

01:11:18.03
Mike
ye

01:11:18.87
Bill
yeah or Or fucking try to be. going to try to be a better person.

01:11:21.20
Mike
Exactly.

01:11:22.08
Bill
so

01:11:22.17
Mike
Exactly. And I mean, in a big part of it is is being available, you know, being there.

01:11:26.01
Bill
Right.

01:11:26.95
Mike
If for some God awful reason they do decide somewhere down the line to sit your ass down, you got to be ready for it.

01:11:37.42
Bill
Right.

01:11:37.66
Mike
You know? Yeah. You know? And I think, I think we are. I think we are, you know, whoever that those, you know, again, same experience for me, but pretty much everybody was like, yeah you know, just quit being a dick and we're cool, you know, right.

01:11:40.91
Bill
Right.

01:11:51.92
Bill
yeah

01:11:53.31
Mike
You know, but again, you know, if somewhere down the line, any of those people come up to me and say, Hey, you know what? There is this one thing that I really want to you know, have fuck. Okay.

01:12:04.89
Mike
You know, then we have to be available and ready to do that. Yeah.

01:12:09.43
Bill
Right.

01:12:09.80
Mike
But that's on their terms. It's not about us. It's about them. And if they want to do it, cool. And if they don't, even better.

01:12:17.93
Bill
Yeah, because I mean, I tell you, I just, I, and even, you know, kind of on a funny side note, even when, you know, as Derek was kind of, you know, growing up a little bit, you know, because again, he was nine when when I got sober and he's, you know, almost 25, you know, going going through those teenage years, um you know, with him and, you know every once in a while, you know he's getting his ass in trouble and doing all these different things.

01:12:29.04
Mike
Sure. Right.

01:12:38.34
Bill
And he's, you know, he and I would have these conversations and he'd be telling me certain stuff. I'm like, I'm not getting in the middle of it. You know, I said, whatever, um, whatever she, um, I said, whatever she, you know, imposed on you as a, as a punishment or a thing or, or whatever thing is, I'm like, I, I'm not getting involved in it, you know?

01:12:45.27
Mike
Right.

01:12:54.56
Mike
Right.

01:12:57.65
Mike
Yeah.

01:12:58.54
Bill
I'm like, quit fucking up and then you won't have deal with any of it.

01:13:00.37
Mike
Exactly.

01:13:01.91
Bill
I mean, that's that's what I told him.

01:13:03.03
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:13:03.98
Bill
But I'm like, why do um'm like why do you?

01:13:05.34
Mike
Where'd we learn that?

01:13:06.49
Bill
yeah Yeah, I said, yeah.

01:13:08.16
Mike
Quit fucking up and you don't have to deal with it.

01:13:10.65
Bill
I'm like, why do you do that to begin with? You know how she's going to react.

01:13:12.85
Mike
Yeah. Mm-hmm.

01:13:14.20
Bill
i'm like I'm like, I get it. I'm like, good but I said, but my days of pissing her off, I'm like, you're fucking done.

01:13:15.89
Mike
Sure. Right.

01:13:20.78
Bill
I'm like, um I can't. I said, even if I wanted to, which I don't, I said, you know, I can't go against whatever she's asking you to do. you know I'm not going to, you know, and he understood, but I'm like, dude, this is your fight, man.

01:13:29.53
Mike
Right.

01:13:33.35
Mike
yeah

01:13:34.65
Bill
you know, I mean, I, I, maybe I'll make a suggestion if the door opens a little bit for it, but I'm like, I'm not sticking my foot in that fucking to hornet's nest.

01:13:39.83
Mike
listen

01:13:42.53
Mike
right

01:13:43.43
Bill
Oh, God damn way. I've done my time.

01:13:47.35
Mike
Yeah.

01:13:48.80
Bill
But yeah, that's what, that's kind of what, and we might have talked about that before. I just couldn't, I couldn't remember, but I don't know. Amends, you know, are always, they they could be, ah I know ah ah slippery slope, a tricky road or whatever you want to call it for a lot of people.

01:14:01.74
Mike
hmm. Mm

01:14:03.17
Bill
And um I think both of us were very fortunate, at least up to this point, you know, any, any of those conversations that we, that we had to have or not had to have that we were able to have, I guess, better way to put it.

01:14:07.62
Mike
hmm.

01:14:11.45
Mike
Right. Mm hmm.

01:14:14.29
Bill
um And I don't know, fortunate. i was going to say lucky, but I just think fortunate that we've had, um you know, people that have given us the the space, you know, to to just be better people, you know?

01:14:22.93
Mike
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And, you know, and we'll finish up with, hey, guess what? That ninth step never ends. You never finish it.

01:14:33.38
Bill
Right. It keeps going on forever and ever.

01:14:35.92
Mike
Yeah, yeah.

01:14:37.36
Bill
Right.

01:14:37.82
Mike
Right. I mean, I'm pretty sure I told the story on here, you know, um the guy that was in and out of the Keating Center, we were kind of close to for a while. um I picked him up and took him back to the Keating Center at one point.

01:14:49.23
Mike
This is years ago, 10, 11 years ago.

01:14:52.35
Bill
Right.

01:14:52.60
Mike
and You know, so he's like two weeks sober again, whatever. And he gets in my car, I'm taking him to a meeting and he's going on and on and on about how he needs to finish his ninth step.

01:15:04.83
Mike
Right. Two weeks fucking sober, you know, again, because he's been through it and he's, you know, yeah, he's got it all down.

01:15:07.03
Bill
Right.

01:15:09.47
Bill
Right.

01:15:12.96
Mike
I got to finish my ninth step. I got a guy and I'm letting him go and letting him go and let him go. Yeah. We get to the meeting and Foxy Don sitting there guy who's got a 46 years now.

01:15:20.67
Bill
um

01:15:24.83
Mike
He just had, um, anyway. And so he had what, you know, 30 some at that point, almost 40. And, uh, and ah We walk in and I just, you know, he's still running his mouth, this guy I picked up. And we just walked in and I looked and we walked through the door. I said, hey, Don, just clear, cold, out of the blue. No intro, no nothing. I said, hey, Don, when you finish your ninth step?

01:15:48.23
Mike
And he didn't even look up. He said, I haven't yet.

01:15:51.61
Bill
Hehehehe. yeah

01:15:53.34
Mike
And I went, well, there you go, asshole. Yeah. Yeah.

01:15:57.65
Bill
Yeah, it's a, it is, it's a, it's, it's a trip. You know, you think about it like, you know, we've, we've talked about it before, but yeah, you've always got to be like you said, um even if it's somebody that we've made our, our piece with, at least we thought we did.

01:16:01.71
Mike
yeah

01:16:09.26
Mike
Sure. Mm-hmm.

01:16:10.40
Bill
And, um you know, i I mean, I, yeah, well, again, we thought we did, but then, you know, yeah, somebody sits us down like and like, you know, listen here, this, I just found something in my craw.

01:16:11.31
Mike
Yeah, we thought we did. Yeah.

01:16:21.01
Mike
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, just...

01:16:22.25
Bill
I'd like to speak to you. Yeah.

01:16:23.55
Mike
Yeah. Okay. Mm-hmm.

01:16:26.51
Bill
There's something in my side and I think it's a thorn and it's you.

01:16:30.22
Mike
Right.

01:16:32.35
Bill
i need a conversation. Well, okay.

01:16:33.92
Mike
Yeah. Uh-huh.

01:16:34.79
Bill
Let's, let's hit it. Let's go.

01:16:36.47
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:16:36.45
Bill
Let's go.

01:16:37.79
Mike
No, we already did this. my I'm done with my ninth step. Fuck you.

01:16:44.08
Bill
Yeah. Didn't hear that guy in the car with Mike. I mean, he's, know, he's done.

01:16:46.50
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:16:47.55
Bill
He finished it.

01:16:47.74
Mike
Yeah, he's done. He got it done in two, three weeks. Right. I've been doing this for 15 fucking years, man. What do you mean? No, my ninth step's done. I've moved on.

01:16:56.03
Bill
Yeah.

01:16:56.39
Mike
um I'm on 12. Don't you know? Yeah.

01:17:00.15
Bill
Right. All the other ones are all all done. All finished.

01:17:04.09
Mike
Yep, exactly.

01:17:04.65
Bill
All finished.

01:17:04.81
Mike
I have completed the steps.

01:17:08.73
Bill
Maybe if I get a minute off there, maybe I'll do them again someday.

01:17:11.89
Mike
No. Fuck no. I did them.

01:17:13.47
Bill
Oh no. Oh, okay.

01:17:14.21
Mike
No, no, no, no.

01:17:14.43
Bill
They're done.

01:17:15.21
Mike
They're done. There's nothing more to do.

01:17:16.37
Bill
Oh, they're done.

01:17:18.56
Mike
I'm cured.

01:17:18.72
Bill
Okay.

01:17:19.62
Mike
I used to be an alcoholic. Now I'm not. I used to be a drug addict and now I'm not. I went to Malibu.

01:17:27.60
Bill
Right. Oh yeah. Recovered, recovered past tense. But no. So like I said, I thought we had talked about before, but I'm glad, I'm glad I, I'm glad I brought that up again.

01:17:37.59
Mike
Yeah.

01:17:39.30
Bill
That was a, that was a good, that was a decent conversation. So, um, ah okay. Fun, fun one here. Another random question again, something on the morning show. How many times this is based on a, on a study. Okay.

01:17:53.90
Bill
How many times does the average person drop their phone in a year?

01:17:59.28
Mike
Mm.

01:17:59.46
Bill
Their cell phone, obviously.

01:18:00.66
Mike
right ya Right.

01:18:01.98
Bill
Not their house phone.

01:18:02.05
Mike
Yeah, Right. Their pay for

01:18:05.01
Bill
yes God damn it, I dropped my fucking payphone again.

01:18:08.63
Mike
it

01:18:08.91
Bill
Shit. How stupid am I? Yeah, by the way, it's the cell phone I'm talking about.

01:18:14.35
Mike
of Anyway, um on average, how how many times a year? um but i i don't know. Two dozen.

01:18:24.83
Bill
So on average, it said 10. Okay.

01:18:27.92
Mike
and Okay. Okay.

01:18:29.05
Bill
And, and at the time, um, and this was, i don't know, a couple of weeks ago, I think when I, when I heard this, I'm like, I think I dropped it three times this past week.

01:18:34.52
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:18:37.33
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:18:37.65
Bill
And then,

01:18:38.15
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:18:38.58
Bill
And then I know I've dropped it. I probably dropped my phone five times since I wrote this down.

01:18:43.59
Mike
Wow.

01:18:43.57
Bill
And, you know, just again, you're wearing shorts that are maybe a loose pocket or a pair of sweats. I go to put it in there, miss the pocket on the floor, getting out of my car, hands full. I mean, 10, may drop my phone five times in a month.

01:18:53.22
Mike
Wow.

01:18:56.98
Mike
wow

01:18:57.10
Bill
And that might, that might be a light month. I don't know. It's just, it 10 seems like that's not even once a month. Really?

01:19:03.21
Mike
Right.

01:19:03.50
Bill
Yeah.

01:19:04.19
Mike
Hmm.

01:19:04.30
Bill
I don't know. It's just, i I don't really think about it that much, but I, um um I'm, I'm on the, I'm higher than average. Let's just put it that goddamn way.

01:19:11.52
Mike
but Okay.

01:19:11.75
Bill
But you, but even you said a couple of dozen, that's,

01:19:13.98
Mike
Yeah, right. I was figuring twice a month, right? You know, yeah.

01:19:17.96
Bill
I mean, i think,

01:19:18.04
Mike
that That seems average. That seems about right. I mean, I'm probably a little below. i don't drop my phone very often. um But yeah, I would imagine twice a month it somehow gets out of my hand one way or another.

01:19:31.60
Bill
Right. I think, I think that that 24 would be, I think a good average.

01:19:35.80
Mike
Yeah.

01:19:36.04
Bill
um I think I can live with that, but I, you know, seriously, I think I've dropped my phone three times in the last week.

01:19:36.17
Mike
Alright. Yay. Uh-huh.

01:19:41.48
Bill
I do. I mean, I literally, I think I have, but um I don't know, just, it was just fucking random. So that's just another thing my list.

01:19:49.09
Mike
yeah

01:19:49.07
Bill
Nothing to do with anything.

01:19:50.34
Mike
ya

01:19:50.60
Bill
All right. So um last thing here, because I think if I'm doing the math correctly, we're getting pretty goddamn close.

01:19:56.87
Mike
ahha

01:19:57.35
Bill
This is something I think we we may have talked about this before, but I heard this on ah on a podcast. And the person was talking about when ah she first got sober. I'm just kind of going on and on about how wonderful she felt immediately after she got sober.

01:20:12.78
Bill
And I mean, she's talking about physically and mentally. I mean, everything just he just kind of felt that.

01:20:15.02
Mike
Yeah.

01:20:17.95
Bill
So. I don't remember if we talked about this or not, but when right after you got sober, did you just feel better all over the place, like physically, mentally, everything all good right away?

01:20:32.20
Mike
Mm hmm. Um. Well, let's see. Physically, yes. um No, no. I mean, did I feel better than I did, you know, two weeks before I got sober? Yeah, of course I did.

01:20:47.09
Mike
um Was everything fucking wonderful? No.

01:20:53.94
Mike
You know, I mean, yeah, clearly, you know, yeah, I wasn't fucking hung over and poisoned and bobh blah, blah, blah, but... was still fucking shaky. That's for damn sure.

01:21:03.52
Bill
Right.

01:21:04.76
Mike
all Certainly couldn't, you know, I wasn't thinking clearly, um you know, 30 days after I had my last drink. I mean, was it quite up to speed yet? No.

01:21:19.35
Mike
of No. Yes. Was it better? Sure. was Was it wonderful? Fuck no.

01:21:26.05
Bill
Right. Yeah. And you know what? When I, when I heard that, the reason I wrote it down is cause I'm like literally the, and how do you remember? I mean, how long was it? How long were we in the Keating center until all it, until the wave of that fucking Keating crud went through?

01:21:40.35
Bill
Was that 30 days or the first few weeks?

01:21:42.06
Mike
Probably.

01:21:42.94
Bill
So you figured, I mean, 30 days sounds about right.

01:21:43.31
Mike
who Yep.

01:21:46.39
Bill
Okay. And then you figure all of us, it took another at least week or so to feel better. Right.

01:21:51.54
Mike
Right.

01:21:51.76
Bill
In a minimum.

01:21:52.75
Mike
Yeah.

01:21:53.30
Bill
So I think at that point, okay, and I mean this seriously, that's when I knew how good I felt is when I came out of that.

01:22:03.26
Mike
Right.

01:22:03.46
Bill
Because, or or as bad as I, as soon as I got sick, that's when I realized that I felt had felt better. And then coming back out of it, then realizing this is what it's, this kind of what, but and I say, quote unquote, normal feels like coming out of that that sickness, you know?

01:22:18.35
Bill
Because anytime I was sick, I would just obviously continue to drink whatever. And even though I get over the cold, you never really know where that separation is coming out of it.

01:22:21.83
Mike
Sure.

01:22:26.47
Bill
um And even going into it you know was was a different story. But I think when I when i literally, if if that was at 30 days... that's when I realized how good I felt physically. Cause I was, I was really sore.

01:22:38.35
Bill
Um, when, when I first came in and, and I was sore walking and doing all those sorts of things for that first, you know, few weeks or maybe even that first month.

01:22:42.60
Mike
Right.

01:22:45.73
Mike
Right.

01:22:45.85
Bill
Um, I mean, cause again, to begin with, just as a rewind in, in detox, I mean, I couldn't walk. you know, what whatever they were doing, um literally I couldn't, my my legs didn't work, you know?

01:22:50.71
Mike
Yeah.

01:22:55.52
Mike
Yeah.

01:22:56.12
Bill
And it was like three, four days before I could before i could walk. I mean, they had me in a wheelchair because I was so fucking pissed off. I'm like, fuck it, A-man. I'm going to go through all this stuff.

01:23:06.79
Bill
I'm not going to be able to drink anymore and I can't fucking walk.

01:23:09.54
Mike
That's a good decision.

01:23:10.66
Bill
That's when I tried to escape and I got tackled and I fell. You know, it was like I couldn't walk. I tried to escape and I couldn't fucking walk.

01:23:15.90
Mike
for her hers good decision

01:23:18.41
Bill
i know, you know, but again,

01:23:19.17
Mike
I can't walk, but I'm going escape. Uh-huh.

01:23:21.27
Bill
I was going to do it. you I was in a lockdown facility, too. There was a whole but whole brain trust going on inside of this melon over here.

01:23:24.87
Mike
Yeah.

01:23:27.63
Mike
Oh, yeah.

01:23:30.14
Bill
But um so physically and and again, mentally, i and I was all fucked up. I didn't want to be there. I think it probably was.

01:23:35.32
Mike
listen

01:23:36.15
Bill
So physically, it had to have been 30 days.

01:23:38.35
Mike
Right.

01:23:38.52
Bill
And then it might have been the first. I think I came to grips with everything from a mindset maybe a couple of months in. But um I just didn't. I don't. I know for a fact I didn't allow myself to realize how that I felt better until I felt bad enough to realize what that difference was.

01:23:52.17
Mike
Right.

01:23:54.56
Bill
And that was.

01:23:55.02
Mike
Right.

01:23:55.67
Bill
the getting sick part of it, you know?

01:23:56.87
Mike
Right.

01:23:56.91
Bill
So I don't know. It just, it made me laugh when I was, I'm like, Oh yeah, sure you did. Okay. I just felt so much better physically, mentally, everything.

01:24:04.21
Mike
right la la la

01:24:05.97
Bill
well Life is good.

01:24:09.92
Mike
right

01:24:11.58
Bill
Fucking four days sober living my best life. Hashtag blessed. Hashtag blessed.

01:24:17.55
Mike
right

01:24:20.78
Bill
All right, motherfucker. On that note, what do you think?

01:24:22.24
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:24:23.06
Bill
Hashtag blessed. Should we be fucking hashtag done?

01:24:25.65
Mike
Yes, we are.

01:24:28.31
Bill
right, man.

01:24:28.69
Mike
Oh, God damn.

01:24:28.95
Bill
Go ahead.

01:24:29.45
Mike
Wait a minute. Nope, nope.

01:24:33.32
Bill
What? Are you trying to clear your...

01:24:34.49
Mike
but I had to mute. um Yes. i Hey, we made it through. Look at that.

01:24:40.93
Bill
We did.

01:24:41.75
Mike
I survived. Good Lord. All right. Well, thank you. hum Thank you, everyone, for listening to another episode of Sober Not Mature.

01:24:54.06
Mike
always, be kind to each other. Be good to each other. go out do something nice for somebody else this week, and don't tell anybody you did it Now, from the bottom of my heart, to the bottom my lungs, to the depths of my soul, from the beginning of time until the ends of the earth,

01:25:11.46
Mike
Always and eternally. Fuck you Now it's that time, kids. It is that time. It's time for you to fuck off. Then keep fucking off.

01:25:22.73
Mike
Keep fucking off till you get to a gate with a sign on it saying, you cannot fuck off past here. Climb over that gate. Dream the impossible dream.

01:25:33.19
Mike
And keep fucking off forever. Uh-huh.

01:25:37.18
Bill
Yes. What he said, but actually, you know what I'm, I am.

01:25:38.84
Mike
hu

01:25:40.19
Bill
ah Can I just say this? I'm proud of you. You got through this,

01:25:42.50
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:25:43.57
Bill
Flying fucking colors. Cause I, I texted Mike earlier today. I'm like, Hey, your day going? Tell me you're sick. He's like, you know, not sick for a few days. You're going to have to all the heavy lifting. I'm like, don't worry about it. We got a guest anyhow. And he's like, right.

01:25:53.68
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:25:54.08
Bill
And then, yeah, so now we don't have a guest and I don't know. I think, I think he did really well. So last thing, and I just saw this note real quick. Did you happen to, if you didn't, it's not a big deal. Cause I, I forgot to cancel HBO.

01:26:05.29
Bill
So I got it for another month. Did you watch the Mark Maron thing or no?

01:26:09.35
Mike
Now.

01:26:10.17
Bill
Okay. If you, if you do get the chance, the only thing I was going to mention on that, and I wrote this note a while ago, um He talks about a lot in his, po obviously his podcast episodes, but um how proud he is of this episode and how tight it got, whatever it was.

01:26:20.58
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:26:24.42
Mike
Right.

01:26:24.76
Bill
And I just, it's really, it's really cool. So he had talked about the fact that um he was only going to do like 15 minutes of, you know, his, his normal bitching about, you know, the politics and blah, blah, blah.

01:26:35.39
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:26:35.89
Bill
And talk about entertaining people. And the funny part was, is that he, he was talking, he was working on that for that entire time, working up to the special At 15 minutes, he wanted to do a switch and then do this more entertaining thing.

01:26:43.02
Mike
Right.

01:26:47.29
Mike
Uh-huh.

01:26:47.33
Bill
And literally when when he switched and when he was leading into the switch, I looked at on the pod or the not the podcast, the the special.

01:26:55.24
Mike
Yeah.

01:26:55.34
Bill
It was ah it was at 17 minutes was really much really lines up um with what he had said, figure opening and whatever. He was fucking right on with everything.

01:27:02.18
Mike
Right. Yeah.

01:27:04.33
Bill
And he just talked about how literally how tight the special was. He was feeling one of the, some of the best work he's ever done. It was good. just, it was good in the fact that think the subject matter was good, but just his, I don't know, his competence level.

01:27:11.31
Mike
Cool.

01:27:17.41
Bill
um

01:27:17.93
Mike
Yeah.

01:27:18.28
Bill
I just, it was, it's good. So anyhow, so that's that, that's that it is what it is.

01:27:20.64
Mike
Yeah.

01:27:23.29
Mike
All right.

01:27:24.36
Bill
And I think we're good. You know what? Maybe we'll get at this again next week. Cause it is just us again next week, next two weeks, next two weeks now.

01:27:29.33
Mike
Yes. All right. Cool.

01:27:31.81
Bill
All right, man.

01:27:32.54
Mike
All right. Cam can listen.

01:27:34.27
Bill
yeah Exactly. I love you, brother.

01:27:37.34
Mike
Love you too

01:27:38.43
Bill
We'll talk soon.

01:27:39.44
Mike
We shall.

01:27:40.91
Bill
Bye.

01:27:41.77
Mike
Bye.