SoberNotMature - Episode 183 (Coming Out Of Those GD Uptempo Records)

00:00:01.50
Bill
All right, everyone. Welcome once again to another episode of Sober Not Mature and... Oh, come on now.

00:00:10.00
Mike
I'm back. Oh,

00:00:11.95
Bill
wait Hang on. Hold on. Welcome back.

00:00:15.06
Mike
oh no, no, no, no. Right, right.

00:00:17.27
Bill
Dreams will you take it out.

00:00:20.14
Mike
Sure. Sure.

00:00:21.75
Bill
Does anyone... was thinking about that. It kind of popped into my head. I'm like, yeah, i'm Mike's back today. I'm like, welcome back, blah, blah, blah. I'm like, does anyone... I'm like, you know what? John Travolta was in it, so it's possible.

00:00:31.92
Mike
right right

00:00:32.91
Bill
you know and it's kind of the same thing as you know fucking Bosom Buddies. I mean, Tom Hanks was in Bosom Buddies, so...

00:00:38.63
Mike
sure

00:00:39.72
Bill
Somebody might know, but anyhow, yes, that was the, that was a bad version of the first, ah the first two lines of, of welcome back Cotter from 1975.

00:00:47.26
Mike
listen

00:00:48.88
Bill
by

00:00:49.99
Mike
ba Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think maybe, yeah, something like that.

00:00:51.19
Bill
ish

00:00:55.50
Mike
um Right, yeah, John Sebastian from the Loving Spoonful.

00:01:00.34
Bill
Was it? You know what? And I thought you were going to throw the line at me like, who sings that?

00:01:02.96
Mike
Yeah.

00:01:04.26
Bill
And I'm like, I don't even know. So that my answer was going to be me because I'm the one.

00:01:08.78
Mike
here

00:01:09.93
Bill
I didn't know who sang it. But yeah, you know, and that just reminded me, too, that that was back in the day when, I mean, all these TV shows, they were they were radio songs.

00:01:17.75
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:01:19.16
Bill
I mean, all the songs.

00:01:20.37
Mike
Right.

00:01:21.13
Bill
Happy Days. Welcome Back, Cotter. um

00:01:23.24
Mike
Yeah.

00:01:24.08
Bill
God, I'm trying to think.

00:01:24.20
Mike
yeah Laverne and Shirley was fucking a single on the goddamn radio.

00:01:29.03
Bill
yeah Yeah. And was it was it the was a love boat theme on there? i mean... okay

00:01:33.36
Mike
God, not any stations I was listening to.

00:01:36.14
Bill
I know, but you know, it's everything was the greatest American hero. That's the other one. I thought liked that.

00:01:40.19
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

00:01:40.79
Bill
I liked that show. And that was, I heard that song. Um, I don't know, within the last year, again, some fucking Spotify mix. I'm like, this serious. This is the song from the greatest American hero, which I used to watch that goddamn show when I was doing my homework.

00:01:53.12
Mike
Right. Sure.

00:01:56.04
Bill
So, but, uh, I don't know, but,

00:01:56.41
Mike
Yeah. Right. Yeah. ah Believe it or not, George isn't at home.

00:02:05.32
Bill
yeah Right. But um yeah, no, it is. I mean, it it is. it's good It's good to have you back. It was, you know, everything went fine, you know, last week with ah Ian was a good guest.

00:02:11.93
Mike
Good.

00:02:14.67
Mike
Good.

00:02:15.26
Bill
if If you guys have not listened to Ian's episode, um good story. Interesting, interesting guest. um You know, he's been very, he's been sharing obviously shit, you know, since, you know, since um obviously we did the episode last week and stuff.

00:02:28.43
Bill
So very active. And um he's actually,

00:02:30.07
Mike
Cool.

00:02:31.94
Bill
He's going to be um hopefully doing some stuff with the with the sober curator because he met with Elise.

00:02:36.05
Mike
Right.

00:02:37.45
Bill
And I asked him that on the on the episode too. The way that they he found her was because they they both live in the Seattle area, which I didn't remember until until Elise mentioned it.

00:02:44.24
Mike
Right.

00:02:47.62
Bill
But um he was doing some searching on speaking opportunities, this and that, whatever. and he goes, this lady's name keeps popping up. And then he's like, he's like, I couldn't get away from it.

00:02:58.30
Bill
He's like, I got to meet this person. So I said, well, it's her, I said, it's her goal. I said, she's very good at, you know, this whole search engine optimization shit.

00:03:05.25
Mike
sir

00:03:05.51
Bill
And I'm like, oh yeah, i said, sober curator. I said, when they do this episode, cause she's going to put that episode plus the book review up on the, up on the website. But I'm like, I'm like, yeah, it's um it, it gets some play.

00:03:15.03
Mike
Cool.

00:03:18.09
Bill
So, so yeah, they might, they might do some stuff.

00:03:18.71
Mike
Right.

00:03:20.41
Bill
So we, we may see him around.

00:03:20.68
Mike
Well, good. I'm glad you guys had fun and got along without me. Uh-huh.

00:03:24.88
Bill
Yeah, you know what? I'll be honest with you. and nothing No offense to, I mean, the conversation went fine. I wasn't uncomfortable anything like that.

00:03:31.83
Mike
hu

00:03:32.60
Bill
um But it's just, it's fucking weird, you know?

00:03:35.35
Mike
yeah Right.

00:03:36.04
Bill
And i when I opened up the episode, just so you know, I said, you know, Mike, Mike's not here tonight. I'm like, don't worry about it. Nothing's wrong. He's okay. And I told Ian, I'm like, he's not dead.

00:03:44.24
Mike
Right.

00:03:46.45
Bill
And I said, the reason I said that is because we basically said the only reason we wouldn't show up is if we're drunk or dead. And I'm like, he's not drunk and he's not dead yet.

00:03:51.43
Mike
Right. I was neither.

00:03:53.78
Bill
Work shit going on.

00:03:54.55
Mike
Yeah.

00:03:55.06
Bill
yeah So, you know, um it was just, yeah, it was odd because I'm like, yeah, it's like we're 182 episodes in and, you know, it's the first time either one of us had to call in sick.

00:04:01.35
Mike
yeah

00:04:04.38
Bill
So.

00:04:04.41
Mike
Right, yeah. Right, mentally ill, yes. You know, there was a part of my sick alcoholic mind that wished he was drunk or dead, but... um

00:04:15.61
Bill
Yeah.

00:04:15.73
Mike
But not really. yeah right. no So thank you for covering for me. And right, well, I'm sure, I mean, we can get into it now and whatever. I mean, yes, work was definitely a part of it.

00:04:27.97
Bill
Right.

00:04:28.05
Mike
um It was ah was a shit day at work. um Unfortunately, um the the real reason, i because I probably still could have, you know, made it work because I've done it before.

00:04:38.11
Bill
Right.

00:04:39.00
Mike
Yeah. But no, Chris, you guys know my girlfriend, that fiance. I'm still trying to get used to this.

00:04:45.98
Bill
Fiance.

00:04:46.80
Mike
I know I'm still trying to get used to saying that. i mean, I feel it my heart, kids. But yeah, it's just weird saying out loud. But anyway, yes, her her oldest and dearest and number one cat, ah Poop.

00:05:00.45
Mike
ah Unfortunately, we had to put him down. He got real sick real fast, and it was the humane thing to do, but it was not fun.

00:05:09.70
Bill
Right.

00:05:09.83
Mike
um you know Yes, that's a wonderful example of having to do the right thing, and it sucked really fucking bad.

00:05:17.54
Bill
right

00:05:17.63
Mike
um So, yeah, it was a rough night. It was a rough weekend. it's you know She's still... Ah, she's, you know, slowly, you know, getting a better, but, um, yeah, it's a real fucking drag. Poop was, uh, Poop was a special cat.

00:05:34.68
Mike
If that, yeah, he was, uh, do you have, you met Poop, didn't you?

00:05:38.46
Bill
um Yeah, I think when I was over there the one time, he was just kind of lounging at the time I was there.

00:05:40.58
Mike
Right.

00:05:42.26
Bill
I didn't get a lot of time to like hang with him, but yeah, I did.

00:05:42.26
Mike
Yeah. Okay.

00:05:45.36
Bill
Right.

00:05:45.68
Mike
Yeah, right. He was a huge 22 or 24 pound, a big motherfucker, all white, blue eyed cat, just beautiful, loving, wonderful animal.

00:05:52.00
Bill
yeah

00:05:58.04
Mike
And yeah, just, I mean, it happened quick and fast and and and yeah, it was... have Fuck, it sucked. So that's that was ah that was the main reason.

00:06:06.50
Bill
Right.

00:06:08.80
Mike
There was a death involved. so So we could put mark that off on the list of why Mike missed an episode. oh

00:06:17.35
Bill
Well,

00:06:17.49
Mike
But it was not mine.

00:06:17.90
Bill
and yeah And you know, the the thing of it is I didn't, it that wasn't my story to tell. So I didn't bring that up.

00:06:23.43
Mike
Right.

00:06:24.02
Bill
um You know, I just mentioned the work thing. I'm like, ah you know, just, you know, work out of way and it's a life thing.

00:06:26.15
Mike
and Yeah, right.

00:06:28.26
Bill
So, you know, and like I said, it was, I wasn't sure if, if you would bring it up, I wasn't even going to mention it this time, you know, just the the work thing, but.

00:06:34.72
Mike
Right. Yeah. But yeah, it was, uh, yeah, you know, and I mean, I had to, I got to be there and hold her hand and, and, you know, what, yeah, be there.

00:06:45.19
Mike
You know, that's such fuck.

00:06:45.40
Bill
Right.

00:06:46.67
Mike
What the hell was I going to do? Um, I was there, um, because that's what we're supposed to do. And so that's what I did. And, um, yeah.

00:06:54.11
Bill
Right.

00:06:56.03
Mike
So yeah, death in the family, unfortunately.

00:06:59.50
Bill
Yeah. And i I'll tell you what I mean, when it, when it came to, you know, them having to put Ty down and he was ah he was a special dog to me, but I, I'm glad I haven't been there.

00:07:04.36
Mike
Mm-hmm. Sure.

00:07:09.01
Bill
Cause I mean, we've had animals in our, in our family for years, you know, that have been put down the one dog that we had for you.

00:07:11.76
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:07:14.28
Bill
She just, she just died in the family room where our, our old house was in, in Wales. You know, she just kind of, ah she was sick the day before.

00:07:19.73
Mike
Yeah.

00:07:22.21
Bill
And it was like, it was Easter when she Easter Sunday and my

00:07:22.63
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:07:26.00
Bill
Our mom took her, took her in. And then it's like the next, the next day she just went over to the coffee table and just died.

00:07:31.52
Mike
Wow.

00:07:32.17
Bill
Yeah. Um, but he, the vet said, he's like, yeah, she's, she's all messed up, but yeah kind of gave it a couple of days to see how it was. And literally the next day, I mean, it's like she had complete organ failure is what happened.

00:07:38.49
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:07:41.81
Mike
Right.

00:07:42.53
Bill
I mean, complete every fucking thing, you know, but, um, but yeah, i mean, I haven't had to be there and,

00:07:43.49
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

00:07:47.86
Bill
Um, I, I couldn't, uh, I'll be honest. I couldn't imagine, you know, I mean, it's, uh, I, I know what she's going through sort of, but not really, I've never been, I've never had to be there when that happens.

00:07:53.84
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

00:07:57.45
Bill
So, but, um, yeah, it's, uh, it's, I'll tell you, you know, it's, it's not like it was years ago.

00:07:57.94
Mike
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

00:08:03.39
Bill
Not that we didn't all love our animals, but, uh, animals are, they're a whole, literally a whole different, it's a different thing these days, you know, it really is.

00:08:05.42
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:08:10.12
Mike
Sure. And, you know, and, and Chris is extra special when it comes to that. So yes.

00:08:16.65
Bill
but yeah.

00:08:17.12
Mike
um Yeah.

00:08:17.20
Bill
Yeah.

00:08:17.72
Mike
You know, I mean, she, she's caper. So she raises them and she, I mean, she's bottle fed a ton of them and um yeah, you know, she, I mean, she worked in the vet industry for years and,

00:08:24.01
Bill
Right.

00:08:28.74
Mike
Yeah, you know, I mean, they' it's very important to her. And this one just really sucked. I mean, it wasn't, you know, she's, i mean, she's got a bunch of cats. We've all talked about that. She's got a lot and she's got ferals outside and, um but poop was like the one.

00:08:46.38
Bill
right

00:08:46.40
Mike
i as So it's, it's been rough for her, but you know, like we get through it because that's what we do.

00:08:54.08
Bill
Right. Well, all of our, all of our thoughts go out to go out to her. And again, I know it was I know it a tough thing.

00:08:58.57
Mike
listen

00:09:00.67
Bill
It's you know no better way to put it.

00:09:00.91
Mike
It was.

00:09:02.35
Bill
So, but yeah, so I, I've actually got, I've got a, I just found out today.

00:09:02.94
Mike
Right.

00:09:08.52
Bill
I'll bring it up maybe after the break since we've downed everyone out. I, I figured either way I'd bring it out after the break, but just found out a ah really, really good friend of mine died.

00:09:11.52
Mike
Right.

00:09:16.37
Bill
um

00:09:16.53
Mike
Oh, wow.

00:09:17.51
Bill
And you, you don't know her, but you'll know her once I, once I tell you, but yeah,

00:09:19.95
Mike
and Okay.

00:09:22.15
Bill
I figured that, you know, we'll get through it. I didn't know if you'd bring this up, but now we brought everyone down with this.

00:09:26.18
Mike
so Right.

00:09:27.49
Bill
we we definitely want to bring them back up. After the break, everyone, be prepared.

00:09:30.52
Mike
Goddamn dead dog story.

00:09:30.86
Bill
I'm going

00:09:32.44
Mike
Right.

00:09:32.93
Bill
Yeah, we're going to come out of our snappy commercials and i'm going to bring you back down with the death of a good friend.

00:09:35.47
Mike
Right. Wow. Uh-huh.

00:09:37.22
Bill
And then we'll, don't worry, we'll bring you back up again. It's going to be a fucking roller coaster.

00:09:39.58
Mike
right

00:09:40.93
Bill
But you know what? it's It's only fitting. This is the season finale, season seven finale.

00:09:46.48
Mike
wow

00:09:48.68
Bill
Fucking death.

00:09:48.95
Mike
ah fast

00:09:51.76
Bill
God damn. Welcome everyone to another episode of Death Not Mature.

00:09:53.10
Mike
ah

00:09:56.55
Mike
Right.

00:09:57.88
Bill
Fuck. okay But yeah, it's, I, I made a note. I don't even know. I, I, every once in a while it starts to come around. So I know February into February is when we started. So it just kind of like in my head, I'm like, God, when does that episode?

00:10:09.63
Bill
And I looked, I'm like, fuck, ah I, I counted out like two months ago, figured out when it was going to be roughly.

00:10:09.99
Mike
No.

00:10:14.08
Mike
huh

00:10:14.59
Bill
And then this message came up and I had it set for, don't know, last weekend. I'm like, oh fuck. I'm like, this is the, this is like the, the end of the season. Not that any of that matters, but yeah,

00:10:21.94
Mike
wow no

00:10:24.20
Bill
Quite honestly, the the only reason that we started separate, you probably forgot about this, is that we saw other people doing it. And then on our website, but actually it actually, you can search by season.

00:10:35.63
Bill
So it it blocks them into into basically 26 episodes each because we do it you know half a year each type of thing.

00:10:39.65
Mike
Right.

00:10:41.57
Bill
But that's the only reason. It makes it cleaner on our website. That's the only fucking reason. Other than that, it could be season 47 for all we fucking care.

00:10:46.06
Mike
ha

00:10:49.16
Mike
Good.

00:10:49.33
Bill
I just need to just need to separate it.

00:10:50.43
Mike
Right.

00:10:51.21
Bill
Yeah.

00:10:52.33
Mike
Got to keep them separated.

00:10:55.23
Bill
The offspring said that at one point, I guess.

00:10:56.34
Mike
i believe they did.

00:10:58.23
Bill
Hey. Yeah. Okay. Anyhow. um Okay. So what, but yeah, but but obviously I'm serious that I did. I did hear about a friend the other day. We've got a Chippewa Lake. We can talk about obviously that wrap up.

00:11:08.48
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:11:09.44
Bill
We haven't talked since then. I've got another little dating thing. I got an update on that fucking crazy ass hiker that, that murder hiking thing.

00:11:17.31
Mike
Yeah, nice.

00:11:17.82
Bill
um And, and sobriety stuff to sprinkle in. So it's ladies and gentlemen, it's not just going to be about death.

00:11:23.90
Mike
Right.

00:11:23.95
Bill
Okay. It's not.

00:11:25.17
Mike
It's a cornucopia.

00:11:27.71
Bill
we We brought the episode in with, you know, a fucking 70s show that nobody knows.

00:11:31.96
Mike
Sure.

00:11:32.22
Bill
You know, brought you down.

00:11:32.29
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:11:33.30
Bill
We're going to bring you back up. Mike's going to his reading, some inspirational shit, talk about some nonsense, bring you back down again.

00:11:36.58
Mike
ah hu

00:11:39.30
Mike
huh

00:11:39.41
Bill
And then we've got we've i mean an inspiring story about a murder, a hiking murder.

00:11:43.79
Mike
Nice.

00:11:46.39
Bill
fuck What do we do? What are we doing here? Why are we here?

00:11:49.03
Mike
I don't know. Right. And we're recording a day early because I've got to go do a radio show tomorrow.

00:11:54.57
Bill
Yeah, you know what? And I was actually going to start fucking around with that. I made a note to just say, hey, by the way, Mike, how was your radio show last night?

00:11:59.68
Mike
Uh-huh. Yeah. right

00:12:02.83
Bill
Because this episode's not coming out until Saturday. but

00:12:04.76
Mike
ah hu

00:12:05.62
Bill
So did you see all that? i've been I've been grabbing your things on Facebook and throwing them up on Instagram.

00:12:08.25
Mike
yeah

00:12:09.97
Bill
And um yeah, I saw that. I'm like, oh, fuck. I went into scramble mode to get everything in shape.

00:12:13.08
Mike
You

00:12:14.69
Bill
But not that it took that much. But then he changed the goddamn time and fucked up my AI things that I did. I'm like, son of bitch.

00:12:21.58
Mike
Right. Yeah. Well, that was...

00:12:23.04
Bill
Yeah.

00:12:24.82
Mike
um i was at We were having a group chat, figuring some shit out. ah Myself, Bill Peters, and John Roddy, the guy who's actually going to be in studio with me tomorrow because Bill's still on the mend from hiking.

00:12:36.10
Bill
Right.

00:12:36.45
Mike
See, hiking's bad for you. um We told that story a few episodes ago.

00:12:42.00
Bill
Right.

00:12:42.07
Mike
Anyway, but he's still not going to make it in, so we were going back and forth with some stuff, and John was like... I don't care, man. cook Get in here whenever you get in here, man. You have the whole damn show. I don't care.

00:12:53.99
Mike
So I'm like, okay, cool.

00:12:54.30
Bill
but

00:12:55.39
Mike
so So I get a free half hour or two. Fuck with you people.

00:13:00.89
Bill
Well, that's nice.

00:13:01.72
Mike
Yeah.

00:13:01.92
Bill
And and we'll we'll do the, I mean, next week we're recording early on Wednesday, I think.

00:13:05.92
Mike
We are.

00:13:06.08
Bill
But but we'll talk about we'll talk about the wrap-up of this.

00:13:06.15
Mike
We are.

00:13:08.99
Bill
I mean, because again, I mean, this your your radio show literally we're we're fronting because we're talking we're talking ahead. Technically, it's Saturday as anyone is listening to this.

00:13:15.51
Mike
we are sure

00:13:17.21
Bill
But, um you know, fuck them.

00:13:19.26
Mike
Right.

00:13:19.78
Bill
You can listen again next week and then hear the hear the real wrap-up after it's you really done.

00:13:23.02
Mike
Yeah. Some time travel shit. It's actually tomorrow, but as you're hearing it, it's yesterday and it was great.

00:13:31.60
Bill
Exactly. It was fucking wonderful. It was fucking wonderful.

00:13:33.51
Mike
Right. Some goddamn back to the future part two shit back and forth and back and forth and back and forth.

00:13:35.66
Bill
yeah yeah

00:13:40.70
Bill
So I go back and bet on something.

00:13:41.91
Mike
Alternate timelines and yes, all kinds of good stuff.

00:13:44.16
Bill
yeah Just bet on some shit so I can fucking make some goddamn money and just just just.

00:13:47.29
Mike
yeah and Right? So I can stop working and...

00:13:51.11
Bill
Yeah, just walk around in the goddamn woods all fucking day. and Well, until I get killed, until I get killed.

00:13:54.33
Mike
o Well, until you break your leg and then you can't do your radio show.

00:13:59.24
Bill
Yeah, but I didn't, I haven't broken my leg yet. So yet.

00:14:02.04
Mike
Yet.

00:14:02.87
Bill
remind me Remind me, I bought a knife.

00:14:02.85
Mike
We are...

00:14:04.75
Bill
James told me I should have some protection in the woods.

00:14:06.81
Mike
ah

00:14:09.49
Bill
Anyhow, I'm getting way ahead of myself. You know what, why?

00:14:11.66
Mike
we are

00:14:13.29
Bill
Let's bring this back down. Settle the fuck down, everyone. Settle down.

00:14:16.65
Mike
Jesus. I know. What the fuck's wrong with you people? We're about to do a reading, man. Get your fucking heads right. All right.

00:14:21.94
Bill
Should we play some music? Hang on.

00:14:25.76
Bill
There, settle down, everyone. It's okay. Calm down.

00:14:29.77
Mike
You're just kind of getting me up. Get up. Shake your rumpa.

00:14:35.84
Bill
Well, here's the, hang on, here's the other one since we're fucking around. This is the one that's just too slow. This is more like the walk. I should have done this. Welcome back.

00:14:45.90
Mike
Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Right.

00:14:47.32
Bill
That's the background music for that, isn't it?

00:14:49.23
Mike
sure

00:14:50.94
Bill
I swear to God, people, i we're we we are sober.

00:14:54.14
Mike
ah yeah

00:14:55.50
Bill
It's fucking crazy. That's all. Okay. You know what?

00:14:57.33
Mike
yeah

00:14:58.00
Bill
I'm done. you Not done, done, but I'm going to shut my mouth so you can do a reading, okay?

00:15:00.23
Mike
right all right, let's do a goddamn reading. Jesus Christ, we're fucking 15 minutes into this thing. and We haven't done shit yet. All right, here we go. ah ah Yes, good thoughts that aren't ours. Imagine that.

00:15:15.69
Mike
God grant me. This is August 10th because, you know, I've had a couple of weeks to build these up. And here we go. ah We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best we can find in our travels is an honest friend, Robert Louis Stevenson. I believe he wrote some stuff.

00:15:37.19
Mike
All right. Addiction destroyed many of our relationships, or not all. all um it took our It took away our ability to get close to others.

00:15:48.74
Mike
The above quotation reminds us that real friends are more important than the people we hung out with while using alcohol or drugs. Recovery is all about bettering our relationships.

00:16:03.30
Mike
Our lives depend upon this. We find honest friends in recovery. We are not alone anymore. We are honest with each other about character defects and work to help each other have better, ever closer relationships.

00:16:18.54
Mike
Our lives also depend upon this. We work to help each other find a way out of the wilderness or at times just survive in the wilderness. Over time, we see that even though people can be a pain at times, friendships and relationships are the best things in life.

00:16:38.16
Mike
Prayer for the day. Higher power. Teach me how to be a good, honest friend. Comfort me as I travel in the wilderness of life Today's action.

00:16:49.60
Mike
Damn it, we got to do stuff. Today I will think about what makes a good friend. Then I will do an honest inventory of what type of friend I am. Am I there for others in the bad times as well as the good times?

00:17:04.91
Bill
and what? It's kind of funny. i was ah As you were kind of reading up that that last, the the prayer part of it, talked about the good, honest friend. And I was going to ask about that.

00:17:11.55
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:17:12.53
Bill
So I'm glad that the action was exactly that. So, um I mean, I think that, I mean, both of us in a serious, I was going to say we think highly of ourselves as good people, but I mean that seriously.

00:17:15.11
Mike
Ha, ha, ha, ha.

00:17:20.77
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:17:23.88
Bill
You know, we're we we're better than we used to be. And obviously we we try our best to be good individuals and good human beings, making our little corners of the world a better place.

00:17:25.83
Mike
Yeah.

00:17:28.82
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:17:32.76
Mike
Right.

00:17:32.87
Bill
Okay. Okay. But based on that action, um I mean, what does it say? ah How are we a good friend or are we a good friend? And are we there for people in the good and bad, correct?

00:17:39.73
Mike
hmm. Right.

00:17:42.41
Bill
Okay, so over to you, Mike. Let's ah let's start with you. Okay.

00:17:47.17
Mike
Right. Um, well, um, I, could I be better? Absolutely. That's first and foremost, you know, am I, am I living up to my potential? No.

00:17:58.01
Mike
Um, But, you know, i mean, clearly I was sitting in a veterinarian office of last Friday night, you know, um i didn't want to be there.

00:18:10.96
Bill
Right.

00:18:12.49
Mike
You know, last place I wanted to fucking be. And yet there I was. um Yes. You know, being there for others, um, in good and bad times. Absolutely. Um, doing things you don't want to do going through difficult things that, um, you know, inflicting others pain on yourself, I think is kind of the best way I can put it. Um, you know, do you do that? Do you take others pain and, and, and put it on yourself and and and go through things with them and,

00:18:45.97
Mike
You know, pain that, you know, quite frankly, you know, as alcoholics and addicts, we try to avoid pain as much as possible. um And I think, you know, as we grow in this program, we we certainly learn to Shoulder our own pains um i better, clearly.

00:19:08.91
Mike
um But I think, like like the reading said, you know, the whole point of recovery is is to be there for others and to to build relationships with other people. That's really the the big goal. Yeah.

00:19:21.95
Mike
And, you know, and, you know, I mean, the buck talks about, you know, higher power, you know, as I always say, power is greater than are myself. oh That's, that's a part of it. That's a huge part of it.

00:19:32.28
Bill
Right.

00:19:32.81
Mike
You know, having these relationships with other people, that it is being a part of something bigger than yourself, um which is the goal of recovery. Right. So, yeah, um you know, yes.

00:19:42.87
Bill
Right.

00:19:45.73
Mike
am i Am I great? No. Could I be a better friend? You know, I mean, my circle's clearly very small. I know yours is too. um But for those people that I have in my circle, yes, I think...

00:20:01.06
Mike
I think, yeah, I'm there. You know, I certainly, a again, you know, I use it ah use it it as an example.

00:20:05.23
Bill
Okay.

00:20:08.74
Mike
I also, I know I use it as an excuse. You know, you can't drag people off bar stools. I don't chase people down. um I could be better at reaching out to others. You know, hey, how are you doing? How things going? Blah, blah, blah.

00:20:23.41
Mike
Um, that I don't do as much as I probably should. Um, but you know, I'm certainly, i don't shy away anymore, which I used to do. i used to run away.

00:20:33.77
Mike
I used to hide. I used to, you know, right.

00:20:35.63
Bill
Right?

00:20:36.70
Mike
Yeah. You know, I mean, if you reach out to me, you bet your ass I'm going to be there and I'm going to do everything I can. Um, I could probably do better at reaching out first, taking that initiative.

00:20:47.77
Mike
But, um, and like you said, man, I'm hell of a better than I used to be. And yeah, said it's It's enough for today.

00:20:55.04
Bill
Right. You know, and ah actually when, when I ended up asking that question about being a good friend there at a good times of bad, that's exactly what I was thinking about. The fact that, you know, what, what you started off with the fact that you were sitting there in a veterinary clinic.

00:21:05.87
Mike
Yeah.

00:21:07.20
Bill
I mean, that's just a classic fucking example of what, I mean, what we should do, what we need to do and what, you know, you have,

00:21:12.10
Mike
Okay. Yeah, what normal people just do. Yeah.

00:21:15.75
Bill
Right. But I mean, that's I mean, that's kind of that's that's a great example. I mean, a great example, you know, and I say it all the time when when people are going through ah troubles and I've been developed this honest statement that I that I use in a lot of cases because I don't know what else to say to people.

00:21:20.16
Mike
yeah

00:21:32.19
Bill
If somebody is going through some really bad shit, I literally, you know, because everyone says, hey, you need anything, let me know.

00:21:34.64
Mike
Right.

00:21:38.50
Mike
Right.

00:21:38.90
Bill
OK, everyone says that I don't.

00:21:40.14
Mike
Right.

00:21:41.09
Bill
I say that I'll be honest with you. I have no idea how I can help.

00:21:43.82
Mike
Yeah.

00:21:44.57
Bill
I don't even know what I can do. But please know that you could at least reach out to me and I'll do what I can.

00:21:46.36
Mike
right

00:21:49.60
Mike
he

00:21:51.59
Bill
But I try to add that extra thing because I don't want to be it's not even I don't want to be like everyone else. I just want to be honest.

00:21:57.17
Mike
sir

00:21:58.14
Bill
I seriously I don't have a fucking clue what I could do for you.

00:22:00.26
Mike
right

00:22:01.59
Bill
I don't know.

00:22:02.78
Mike
yeah

00:22:02.93
Bill
You know, do you just want me to sit there with you like you sat there with Chris? Do you want me, you know, do you want me to just listen to you?

00:22:06.52
Mike
Right.

00:22:08.67
Bill
We talked about this before. and Somebody's going through a bunch of garbage and they just, you know, they just want to vent. And you and I, you and I have done that with each other.

00:22:14.78
Mike
Yeah.

00:22:17.21
Bill
I mean, I've plenty of times we've had these conversations like you don't need to, I don't need a solution from you, but, but Hey, I need to get some shit off my chest. I'm,

00:22:24.86
Mike
Right.

00:22:25.44
Bill
all i need to do is fucking say it out loud sometimes to realize that um either i figured out myself or it's not that big of a deal whatever the case is you know um

00:22:30.99
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right? I'm fucking stupid.

00:22:35.81
Bill
Yeah, I mean, really, you know, but there's a, I've got, I've got a friend of mine that a friend of mine that I met on Instagram that lives in Texas.

00:22:37.12
Mike
Yeah.

00:22:41.85
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:22:42.12
Bill
She lives with her mom and has been taking care of her and blah, blah, blah. And I just, every once in a while, I mean, when we're chatting back and forth, im like, how's your mom doing? She's like, ah, you know, she's her, she's having struggles, you know?

00:22:52.03
Mike
Right?

00:22:52.57
Bill
And, um you know, I'm just like, Hey, I said, I know what you're dealing with. I said, same deal. You know, let me know anything that I can help with.

00:22:58.16
Mike
Yeah.

00:22:59.25
Bill
Got another friend lives out in like Connecticut now, Vermont, wherever the hell she is now.

00:22:59.21
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:23:04.99
Bill
And she was going through some shit. At one point I'm like, I'm like, Hey, I've told you before, you know, if you, even if you just want an ear, you know, type of thing. And it was like two, three months ago, she texted me and she says, tell me something inappropriate. She goes, tell me a joke or something inappropriate. I I'm having a really rough day and I need a laugh.

00:23:23.52
Mike
Right.

00:23:24.10
Bill
and i i went into my phone and i kind of did the whole you know flip of my pictures i looked at him i found the perfect it was just disgustingly ridiculous you know and i sent it back to her then i'm like oh on top of that it was like this weird fucking name that i had ran across at work that day so i gave her two things and she she texted it back and she said

00:23:30.54
Mike
Right.

00:23:34.49
Mike
Yeah, right. Yeah, right.

00:23:46.10
Bill
I appreciate that. She said, you made me laugh. That's all I needed.

00:23:47.96
Mike
yeah right

00:23:48.86
Bill
I'm like, yeah have a good night, you know, type of thing. And, um, again, I, I don't know. i have no fucking idea what, what I don't, I don't know what I bring to the table, but I'm going to be, I'm going to be sitting there if somebody needs me to, you know?

00:23:53.51
Mike
yeah right

00:23:57.82
Mike
assistant Right. Exactly. Exactly. That's, yes, I'll be sitting there.

00:24:05.53
Bill
Yeah, I mean, I'll be at the fucking table. I don't i have no idea what what I'm bringing along with me, but I'll be at the table if you need me to be. um you know And that that's kind of all we can do. But yeah, like you said, it's um I could always be better at anything and everything.

00:24:19.40
Bill
I know that much.

00:24:19.77
Mike
Sure. Right.

00:24:20.72
Bill
Um, you know, but the, the same thing is that, um, if, if nothing else, if we do, if we take, we can take comfort in the fact that, you know, hopefully we're better than we were yesterday, certainly better than two, three, five, 10 years ago.

00:24:32.49
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:24:34.93
Mike
Right.

00:24:35.29
Bill
Um, hopefully, you know, and that's what the fuck more are we supposed to ask for?

00:24:37.09
Mike
Yeah.

00:24:39.14
Bill
You know?

00:24:39.98
Mike
I don't know.

00:24:43.60
Bill
But I mean, the other part of the reading talked about, and I like where it said, you know, help help finding a way out of the wilderness or helping somebody when they're in the wilderness, you know, surviving, which I thought was kind of cool.

00:24:52.20
Mike
Yeah. Right. Just surviving in the wilderness. Yes. Mm-hmm.

00:24:56.25
Bill
yeah hi I don't know the way out, but I'll hang here with you, you know, and we'll we'll figure this shit out together type of thing. um But it also talked about being honest with each other and our character defects. And, you know that's something that I don't know that I think the people who are in recovery can understand it. But we've mentioned it before plenty of times on here, but I don't think you're your normal everyday walking around the street human being understands that ah dear most of us, most of us,

00:25:23.44
Bill
depending on the person are not going to get offended by somebody, you know, calling us out on our bullshit. You know um if they're in recovery and they get it, I don't like to hear it from some random fuck, yeah but, but one of us, it's probably because it's like, well, yeah you know, he knows, she knows what I'm dealing with.

00:25:27.64
Mike
Right.

00:25:30.24
Mike
Mm-hmm. Now. ah

00:25:38.65
Mike
Yeah.

00:25:40.33
Bill
So I respect that individual, but I mean, does that make sense?

00:25:40.54
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:25:43.68
Bill
Obviously with that, no.

00:25:44.46
Mike
Oh yeah, absolutely. Right. Yeah. I'm, I'm with you a hundred percent there. Right. Yeah. So Miranda fucking tells me what's wrong with me. i Fuck you. um

00:25:53.36
Bill
right

00:25:54.17
Mike
but yeah, if it's somebody in the rooms that's working a program and tells me what the fuck's wrong with me, I'm going to go, Hmm. Okay. And I'm take a look at it and be serious about it and, and, and take it in a positive way.

00:26:06.54
Mike
but i don't know why, but again, it's part of the problem. I don't need to understand everything. I just need to fucking be a part of it. And, um, Yeah, that is one thing I don't understand. Like, yeah, Eddie Rando says that. Fuck you.

00:26:19.62
Mike
um help But somebody in the rooms, yes, I'm going to take it to heart for some damn reason. And I guess, like you said, because, you know, they understand because they're just like me.

00:26:30.55
Bill
Right.

00:26:30.65
Mike
and i And I understand that part more than anything else that, you know, I'm i'm not unique. I'm not different. and I'm not special. Damn it. um

00:26:41.33
Mike
Yeah. So, yeah i yeah, that is important. And it's, again, you know, we're not alone, which is the huge thing. You know, the the relationship thing is ah is a two-way street. You know, I have to be there for other people. But when I do that, other people are there for me, which is kind of cool.

00:26:59.19
Bill
yeah

00:26:59.46
Mike
That doesn't make sense, but there it is.

00:26:59.87
Bill
Well,

00:27:03.24
Bill
Yeah. And that's, ah that is, that is true. You know? Oh, it's just kind of funny. ah and we We'll talk about more about the Chippewa Lake thing, but it just reminded me of this kind of like this give and take thing. um Derek on the, on the way out. Cause I, I had told him, I said, I said, you know, keep an eye out for whatever it was. I asked him which way he was going to take blah, blah, blah. And,

00:27:20.78
Bill
um I said, just watch out for this that way, other is like, oh, he goes, I took the I took the tollway. He goes, like he goes, we got routed through Chicago. And he goes up like, oh you did you go over the skyway? He's like, yeah I'm like, but you got probably get hit with a twenty dollar toll.

00:27:32.75
Bill
He's like, I guess we're because I saw more fucking tolls than I knew what to do with.

00:27:32.81
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:27:35.95
Bill
He goes, I think we're really racked up your account. I'm like, I don't care.

00:27:39.27
Mike
Right.

00:27:39.67
Bill
And I said, I said, here's the thing. I said, I'm just being completely honest with you. I said, I don't mind the 20 bucks. I said, one way or the other, it's not a big deal. But I said, on top of that, you're going to spend that 20 bucks on me someday.

00:27:48.16
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:27:52.03
Bill
You know, I said, you're going to, it's, you're going to be taking care of my ass at some point.

00:27:52.19
Mike
Sure.

00:27:55.82
Bill
So I'm like that 20 bucks fucking well worth it.

00:27:56.13
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:27:58.62
Mike
Right. What does a pack of depends go for these days?

00:27:59.81
Bill
it Yeah. He just started laughing and shaking his head. He's like, you good boy cause

00:28:07.03
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:28:08.08
Bill
but I don't know. It just, it it is, it's it's such a give and take. And um I don't know. There's so many more important things to to worry about in this, whether it's 20 bucks or whether it's a little thing.

00:28:17.67
Mike
right

00:28:17.77
Bill
um I don't know. and And again, it's these relationships, the fact that we've had this um disability. and And again, um i mean I'll talk about it more with, I had, I don't know, i want to say revelations over the last few days, but I've had some thoughts after I found out about that person.

00:28:31.86
Mike
hey

00:28:32.28
Bill
that I'll talk about a little bit. But um all these, all these things that we've been able to um just, I don't know, it's, it's mind blowing, you know, again, go back to 15 years is 15 years, blah, blah, blah.

00:28:40.77
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:28:43.55
Bill
But, um and you know, life is not perfect for any one of us or either one of us.

00:28:43.84
Mike
Right.

00:28:48.63
Bill
um But God damn, you know, there's, there is, and I hate to say it sometimes, but I don't need to bitch as much as I do.

00:28:48.62
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:28:54.76
Mike
Right. Yes.

00:28:55.27
Bill
yeah

00:28:55.36
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:28:56.14
Bill
And I should just be fucking, I should just just shut up and be fucking grateful for God damn

00:29:00.01
Mike
right

00:29:00.44
Bill
You know, for once. Or maybe, maybe twice.

00:29:02.31
Mike
yes

00:29:03.40
Bill
I am once, maybe twice or three times. I should be more grateful.

00:29:06.21
Mike
oh

00:29:07.40
Bill
Fucking asshole. That's what I am.

00:29:08.53
Mike
Yeah.

00:29:09.50
Bill
yeah

00:29:09.73
Mike
Right.

00:29:10.64
Bill
But the other thing I wrote down in the beginning, it was talking about, I think it was talking about alcohol or, you know, obviously alcohol abuse, whatever the deal is, took away, I wrote down, took away ability to get close.

00:29:21.11
Bill
Was that, do you remember?

00:29:21.49
Mike
Hmm.

00:29:22.59
Bill
Was that just, a I mean, ability to get close to people or whatever the situation is?

00:29:22.60
Mike
yeah

00:29:26.54
Mike
right

00:29:26.78
Bill
um and i And I think so. I mean, do you, I mean, granted, I know we have better relationships now, but, you If you think back, did you have really close relationships with people? Maybe not at the end, but in in the middle of your drinking or or how was that?

00:29:40.69
Mike
I mean, yes and no. I mean, I certainly thought I did. um hu

00:29:46.32
Bill
Right, right.

00:29:47.10
Mike
Right. um yeah and And yes, but ah but so was there's that barrier you know there. you know the the The act of addiction is is always there. It stops you from fully connecting with someone because there's something in the way.

00:30:04.04
Mike
it's that's just the way it is you know it doesn't matter yes i was close with people yes i cared about people whatever but not fully i couldn't because there was something in the way always you know drugs or alcohol or whatever it was that was you know that was first and and yeah you know there there was always something between me and other people always you know and and again you know and thankfully that's been lifted you know i mean

00:30:10.55
Bill
right

00:30:26.48
Bill
right

00:30:32.83
Mike
Um, I, I probably don't get as close as I could, but that's just, um, you know, still working on that.

00:30:37.94
Bill
So, you still that.

00:30:40.64
Mike
Um, but yeah, you know, uh, with the active addiction with the active, whatever, yes, there was clearly a physical, mental, spiritual barrier there.

00:30:53.52
Mike
Always, always.

00:30:55.98
Bill
Right. Yeah. And you know what it's got to think it back at it and the same thing. I mean, like Kathy and I have always had a decent relationship.

00:31:02.57
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:31:03.38
Bill
I mean, toward towards the end. And she talked about it on when we had her around. I mean, I was just I was in my own fucking world because I was loaded all the time.

00:31:06.75
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:31:09.34
Bill
But I'm trying to hide, trying to hide everything.

00:31:09.53
Mike
Right.

00:31:13.36
Bill
um I mean, mom and I had our ups and downs. So that was through everything. Even when I got sober, we had our ups and downs. But, you know, you and I would take a look back at, you know, I think Dawn is a good.

00:31:23.57
Bill
that relationship with Dawn is a good barometer because it happened at a point in my life where it was, you figure I was, I met her when I was 31 and we split up figure when I was 37 or 38, somewhere in that area.

00:31:38.42
Bill
And I got sober at, you know, 41. So although the last four years were terrible, at least the, the last half of our time together was bad.

00:31:48.09
Mike
Right.

00:31:48.49
Bill
you know, and I was bad, you know, so again, lying and hiding and all that stuff. But I just think that that relationship is a good barometer of, of who I was, you know, of what I had in front of me.

00:31:58.98
Mike
Right.

00:32:00.49
Bill
And, you know, the, again, it's, that wasn't even the material stuff. Yeah. We had a house. We made some money and all that stuff, but we had, we had kids and we had a life and we had all these different things. And, um You know, I I'm the one that fucked all that stuff up.

00:32:12.39
Bill
You know, I mean, all all the shit.

00:32:12.59
Mike
Right.

00:32:14.04
Bill
The catalyst was me. It doesn't matter what else happened. The you know, that I was the match with a can of gasoline.

00:32:19.38
Mike
Right. Right.

00:32:21.68
Bill
And I'm like, hey hi there. yeah

00:32:24.45
Mike
Yeah.

00:32:25.96
Bill
Let me fuck up your life today, you know, quietly, but I'm going to fuck it up one way or the other.

00:32:27.97
Mike
right

00:32:31.06
Mike
yeah

00:32:31.20
Bill
And you're going to, you're going to back six years later and figure, what the fuck did I get here? Not me, her, you know?

00:32:35.68
Mike
Right.

00:32:38.14
Bill
So I don't know. it just a goddamn, I'm a, obviously I know it's a, it's an understatement, but fucking glad I don't have to live that goddamn way anymore, you know?

00:32:46.32
Mike
Mm hmm.

00:32:48.02
Bill
So, um, anything else with that reading, anything else that popped out?

00:32:51.61
Mike
Well, I think we covered a lot.

00:32:54.37
Bill
Yeah, I think so too. That was a, I liked that one. That was a, that was a really, really good one, especially talking about, i just relationships in general, I think was, was good.

00:32:57.29
Mike
hmm.

00:33:00.68
Mike
Right.

00:33:02.33
Bill
So, um you know, why don't we, what do you, think about doing the the Chippewa Lake little wrap up. I mean, that was, that was fun.

00:33:08.63
Mike
Yeah, we could do that.

00:33:09.47
Bill
That was a, that was a nice thing.

00:33:10.97
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:33:11.09
Bill
Okay. Folks, we had a, we had an inspirational, I'm just kind of tracking everyone here, keeping you, keeping on the up and up. Cause when we take our break, we're going pull you back down into our pit of despair, but that's okay.

00:33:17.05
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:33:21.46
Bill
going to bring you back up again.

00:33:22.86
Mike
Life on life's terms.

00:33:23.07
Bill
So fucking a right. All right. So, um, God, when was that? Was that two weeks ago, three weeks ago now, two weeks ago.

00:33:30.16
Mike
Yeah, I'm up to you.

00:33:32.76
Bill
God, it seems like four or fucking ever, doesn't it?

00:33:33.79
Mike
but I know. Yeah.

00:33:35.32
Bill
Because I'm i'm sitting not sitting up here. you know i'm um I'm not quite in Canada, but it's ah it's been like in the upper 50s here you know in in the morning.

00:33:42.67
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:33:43.60
Bill
And um i I froze my ass off when I went up to Picture Rock last weekend.

00:33:48.89
Mike
Yeah.

00:33:49.43
Bill
You know, something shorts and a t-shirt, no big deal. Oh, I'm on Lake lake fucking Superior with the wind going.

00:33:52.07
Mike
Uh-huh. Yep.

00:33:54.59
Bill
And I'm like, oh.

00:33:54.95
Mike
in hey

00:33:56.79
Bill
But it it warmed up. It warmed up a little bit. But, I mean, was in the low 60s when I got up there with the wind. was fucking freezing. But, um but yeah, i mean, it was so nice. The weather was nice. We got everyone together.

00:34:07.10
Bill
You came down on Friday night, Saturday.

00:34:09.07
Mike
hu

00:34:10.04
Bill
my son My son got there late on Thursday.

00:34:10.00
Mike
yep

00:34:11.96
Bill
Obviously, I came out with Kimmy. But and we got to see. Ivan, when's the last time that you we saw Dave and Jan? I can't remember.

00:34:18.19
Mike
Um, proof well, I didn't, but, um, right. I know they're, yeah, they they weren't there.

00:34:21.22
Bill
Oh, shit, that's right. Oh, gosh.

00:34:23.62
Mike
I was kind of bummed.

00:34:26.92
Mike
I mean, I saw the pictures. I knew they were there and yeah, I got there Friday and but they were gone. Um, but yeah, I mean, prior, geez.

00:34:32.22
Bill
God, yeah, I forgot about it. but Yeah, that was that was that's right. That was Thursday that they were there.

00:34:37.69
Mike
Um, I mean, seriously, mom's funeral.

00:34:40.79
Bill
Oh, yeah. Yeah, so, okay, yeah.

00:34:42.07
Mike
Yeah.

00:34:42.83
Bill
Okay, yeah.

00:34:42.87
Mike
Yeah.

00:34:45.00
Bill
But yeah, it's been and I don't know what they, they had stuff going on, I guess, during the week. I forgot about that.

00:34:48.69
Mike
Sure.

00:34:49.28
Bill
I got kind of lost track of days, which was wonderful.

00:34:50.60
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:34:51.87
Bill
It's been, I can't remember the last time that I've, because I mean, when I, well, everyone knows, not everyone, but when I, when I travel, mean, I just, I got these packed fucking weekends.

00:34:52.05
Mike
Sure.

00:35:00.65
Bill
I drive on a Saturday, I jam in a Sunday if I'm there for two weeks, i but I'm running around.

00:35:02.98
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:35:05.34
Bill
There's never, there's never a day when I could just sit around and like have fucking nothing to do, no place to go.

00:35:09.70
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:35:11.11
Bill
It's a, you know, it's a goddamn Thursday, you know, or Friday morning, and it feels like Sunday. I don't know what fucking day it is.

00:35:16.17
Mike
Right.

00:35:16.77
Bill
I don't know where I...

00:35:16.86
Mike
yeah i know. Yeah. You mentioned that several times.

00:35:19.57
Bill
I'm like, seriously, because every time I'm like, what fucking day is it? You know?

00:35:22.15
Mike
Right.

00:35:22.91
Bill
um But it was wonderful. And yeah, I mean, we just got got everyone together. And I don't know, just it was, we did nothing in particular, but had a whole lot of fun, right?

00:35:34.68
Bill
It was just, it was just nice. It was really nice getting getting everyone together.

00:35:35.94
Mike
Yeah, absolutely. It was.

00:35:38.22
Bill
And um' I'm glad that i'm glad you guys came down again on Saturday. I know it was kind of up in the air on what you were going to do, but I'm glad you guys came down there.

00:35:43.67
Mike
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, well, everybody was there. What am I going to do? 40 minutes from my house. What am I going to do? I don't know. it's It's a bit much.

00:35:54.87
Mike
Again, mail back to the relationship thing and showing up and doing. and Yeah. I'm going to sit in my fucking living room while you guys are 40 minutes away from me.

00:36:05.32
Mike
Yeah, that that'd be that'll work.

00:36:08.38
Bill
I was actually just going to say, wait, didn't we just talk about that?

00:36:10.94
Mike
Right.

00:36:11.31
Bill
um You know, you know yeah it it is what it is what it is type of thing, you know.

00:36:15.71
Mike
Practicing these principles in all of my affairs.

00:36:20.07
Bill
Yeah, because it was he was pretty fucking warm while we were there, too, which was, i I mean, obviously, which was nice. But, yeah, and then that the whole, you know, like, beach area and stuff like that.

00:36:30.75
Bill
I mean, I was kind of surprised that there weren't – there were – I thought there'd be more people around the whole place. I mean, that – because you figure what – I mean, that was, you know, first week of August.

00:36:36.48
Mike
Right.

00:36:40.08
Bill
yeah I mean, now all the kids are, you know, either have gone or are going back to school and stuff like that.

00:36:40.18
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:36:43.81
Mike
Right.

00:36:44.28
Bill
But um I don't know. Maybe people were elsewhere, you know, rather than just sitting in – in that community. But I, I really wonder now if, I mean, a lot of older folks we saw around, you know, cruise around to their golf carts and whatever.

00:36:56.17
Bill
i wonder percentage wise, if that's more of a um, just a more of an elderly community now than it is, you know, people getting out there with younger kids and stuff. I don't, I guess I don't even know.

00:37:05.23
Mike
Right.

00:37:05.90
Bill
Yeah.

00:37:06.38
Mike
Yeah. um but but I don't know. i don't i've spent I've been there twice. ha, ha, ha, ha.

00:37:13.21
Bill
Yeah, that's, again again, good point. Yeah, I guess, i why the fuck am I asking you?

00:37:17.33
Mike
here

00:37:18.46
Bill
Well, we got to fill a little bit of time doing something.

00:37:20.01
Mike
Sure.

00:37:20.37
Bill
So, hey, Mike.

00:37:21.79
Mike
yeah I don't know. Chippewa Lake. Google it.

00:37:27.38
Bill
But did I tell you that I looked up a house there? I found one of the cottages for sale there. It was, it was curious because when, and just so everyone knows. So Chippewa Lake is a community. It's this, it's not like a gated community or anything like that, but it's um a lot of the, the homes there, they are, they're older cottages.

00:37:40.07
Mike
No.

00:37:45.56
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:37:45.61
Bill
Most of them, I would, i don't even know. The one that um ah Gail's parents had years ago where we used to go there.

00:37:52.21
Mike
Right.

00:37:52.34
Bill
I don't believe that was, that wasn't year round. I don't think that that was winterized or anything like that or,

00:37:57.00
Mike
Right.

00:37:57.61
Bill
I don't think if I remember correctly, I'm sure I probably didn't even have fucking air conditioning back then. was a God, it was a goddamn seventies, you know?

00:38:01.71
Mike
Right. right

00:38:04.37
Bill
Um, but I would think at this point, I don't know if all of them are, but it's a minimum there. They're their're summer cabins. They're nice. They're older homes though, but there's some right along the water and it's a small lake. I, what would you think?

00:38:14.40
Bill
I mean, acreage wise, I didn't look, but, um,

00:38:16.83
Mike
I think we looked it up when we were there the first time. And yeah, I want to say 30.

00:38:20.46
Bill
did we?

00:38:23.45
Mike
Does that right? 30 acres.

00:38:28.48
Bill
It could be. It could be.

00:38:29.35
Mike
Yeah.

00:38:30.12
Bill
Because I know that, kind of again, we have we have fucking Google. I should look.

00:38:33.28
Mike
I know.

00:38:34.05
Bill
and I'm not going to look it up right now. It's fine.

00:38:35.45
Mike
Right.

00:38:36.24
Bill
Everyone, Google Chippewa Lake and figure out for yourself. And then email info at silvernotmature.com.

00:38:38.81
Mike
Yes. Yeah. Yeah.

00:38:42.57
Bill
Now, don't even bother. Don't fucking bother.

00:38:43.69
Mike
yeah

00:38:43.98
Bill
It's fine.

00:38:44.06
Mike
and

00:38:44.94
Bill
But, um you know, smallish lake and whatever, but all the most of the homes along the the water, which are not up to the water, there's road that separates whatever. But but still, some of these you can tell. I mean, they've been these have been teardowns and then rebuilds.

00:38:57.46
Bill
And um so that's what I was looking up.

00:38:57.67
Mike
Sure.

00:38:59.44
Bill
I was trying to see if I get the price of some of those homes, just curiosity wise.

00:39:02.72
Mike
Right.

00:39:03.57
Bill
And was some of them I could see in areas not really right along there, but, you know, three, four hundred thousand. I'm like, and it's I mean, it's it's pricey, you know, but not terrible.

00:39:08.90
Mike
Right. Right.

00:39:12.08
Bill
But there was a um down at the other like pass where the beach would be like however that road goes down. So on the other end of the lake, so way ah on that end, like farther down from the beach.

00:39:22.72
Bill
um, a few blocks off or a couple blocks off, like the place we were in. And it looked like a, like a decent enough cottage, not run down. I think it was 190,000 something like that, which, I mean, when I looked at i'm like, God, that's not, that's really not that bad for a community like that.

00:39:37.81
Bill
Um, now you compare to, I mean, I know what you paid for your house, you know, so it's, you got a hell of ah

00:39:41.50
Mike
Right. Well, I got it. I got to steal. Right.

00:39:46.67
Bill
Yeah, but but still, I mean, for what you for what you have or what you paid for, you could fit you know two of those little cottages and in your house.

00:39:53.37
Mike
isn'

00:39:53.71
Bill
um but But I'm like, God damn, that's really not that bad. But I'm sure some of the ones along the water are just crazy expensive.

00:40:00.11
Mike
Yeah. Right.

00:40:01.03
Bill
But you know the the thing of it is, though, it just it is. It's quiet. The place that we stayed was the same place that we stayed when our mom died. and there was another... Another house that they rented where some of the people stayed, just more space, and Kathy had her dogs there, and actually Kylie Ardees had her dog there.

00:40:14.21
Mike
Right.

00:40:16.92
Mike
Right.

00:40:17.27
Bill
um But i mean I don't know. It's just you know people kind of coming and going as they please and hanging out, and you know we had more than enough fucking food, you know obviously.

00:40:23.40
Mike
Yeah. Mm hmm.

00:40:24.12
Bill
Yeah. Did you, did you see, so after the one night, um, our cousin, our cousin, Jody, your husband, James, um, he's a dude from, from Ireland. He's out there and he's grilling and he's fucking hot dogs and hamburgers and all shit.

00:40:36.39
Bill
And I'm thinking to myself, like this dude's going fucking overboard. You know, he's just, he's out there for what seemed like an hour, you know, cooking this shit.

00:40:39.23
Mike
Right.

00:40:42.07
Mike
Uh-huh.

00:40:43.17
Bill
You know how many hamburgers were left after that? Like for the next day, like three.

00:40:47.81
Mike
Yeah, right. Well, yeah, because I went in Saturday evening to grab a burger and there weren't any. Yeah.

00:40:56.13
Bill
yeah Oh, yeah. Yeah, they got they get eaten over lunch, I think, the next day.

00:40:59.12
Mike
Yeah.

00:40:59.71
Bill
And, um you know, he said he said there was only – made like 20 or 24 or something like that.

00:41:04.51
Mike
Yeah.

00:41:04.82
Bill
I'm like, oh, when you put the numbers, it just – it seemed like he was there for fucking ever making food, you know?

00:41:08.23
Mike
Right.

00:41:10.04
Bill
um But I don't know. I mean, we all we all chipped in. We all chipped in for not only cost of the Airbnb for folks who were staying there, but, you know, cost of food. And I don't know. It's been – The last time that I think all the family got together, with the exception of of mom's funeral, was um had to have been Kylie's graduation.

00:41:25.31
Bill
So that would have been two thousand summer of 2019, right?

00:41:25.38
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:41:27.99
Bill
Yeah.

00:41:28.66
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:41:29.98
Bill
yeah So I don't know. It was just fucking nice. And then again, just going back to that, the relationships and all that shit.

00:41:33.47
Mike
It was. Uh-huh.

00:41:37.97
Bill
And that's what That's what it's all about, right? Yeah.

00:41:40.67
Mike
Yeah, absolutely.

00:41:40.84
Bill
that's what it's all about right

00:41:42.98
Mike
Yeah, it was great. You know, everybody was there. and Yeah. You know, and then we vowed to do it again in two years. We're going to try to, we're going to try to do it every couple of years, which I think is going to be great.

00:41:54.63
Bill
Right. Yeah, but I think that, I mean, the fact that you that you said, you know, we're not having a reception or anything like that, but you all are invited.

00:42:01.80
Mike
Yeah.

00:42:01.87
Bill
you know, I think you're going to get a you're going to come quite a few people.

00:42:04.30
Mike
Yeah, I know.

00:42:04.39
Bill
You're to get quite a few people up there.

00:42:05.74
Mike
Yeah, Chris and I talked about that. Well, I mean, yeah, clearly, clearly you know, Jody and Gail and James and Ed told, say, I'll live in Boston, which is, you know, a half hour away from Salem.

00:42:15.41
Bill
Mm-hmm.

00:42:17.64
Mike
And, um yeah, you know, and then Kathy's just jumping right in. Oh, yeah, I'll be there. you know, she's looking for excuse to hang out in Boston. I know that. ah hey

00:42:26.80
Bill
ah

00:42:28.20
Mike
You know, and then we should say it on here. I made my friend Bill cry.

00:42:34.20
Bill
Yeah, so um and so we're standing we're standing outside, and and Mike's like ah he's like, hey, so what do you know we're talking about all this shit, and he's like telling everyone, he's like, yeah, we're not having a reception, but you know you can come. He goes, we're just not doing anything specific.

00:42:45.66
Bill
goes, you can hang out, whatever.

00:42:46.08
Mike
Right.

00:42:47.17
Bill
And then, um yeah, we're standing out back, and then he's just like, hey, what are you doing a year from now? I don't fucking know.

00:42:52.50
Mike
Right.

00:42:52.73
Bill
And then he's like, would you know want to be my, or you might I think you did say that, would you be my, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:42:56.25
Mike
I said I need a best man.

00:42:58.61
Bill
And I'm like, really? And then, yeah, I got verklempt.

00:43:00.53
Mike
Yeah.

00:43:01.38
Bill
I got verklempt.

00:43:01.35
Mike
I know. And it kind of, I know, and it blew the moment because I wanted to look at you and say, I guess you'll do.

00:43:02.40
Bill
Yeah.

00:43:07.41
Bill
yeah Right.

00:43:08.40
Mike
yeah

00:43:10.71
Bill
and And you know what? After the fact that I thought about that, because figured we'd talk about it on here.

00:43:14.09
Mike
who

00:43:15.37
Bill
that's That's exactly what it is. Because what you said to me, you're like, well, who else am I going to pick? you know

00:43:19.16
Mike
Right.

00:43:20.31
Bill
so But yeah, I blew the moment with my with my emotion. But it did.

00:43:24.51
Mike
Yes.

00:43:24.84
Bill
and And it was just...

00:43:25.40
Mike
That choked me up too. You got teary-eyed. I got teary-eyed. It was beautiful.

00:43:30.38
Bill
It's just, it was, I don't know. I mean, first of all, um you know, we're, we're so outside of the wedding age, you know?

00:43:35.83
Mike
Right.

00:43:36.55
Bill
I mean, yeah i I look at like Katie's mom and um her husband, Neil, all the time on Facebook, you know, Katie and Derek were talking about that. We're like, yeah, we're in the wedding season. They got, they're coming up.

00:43:47.67
Bill
They got like two weddings in one day that they got a hit, you know, I mean, but they're in their twenties, you know?

00:43:50.39
Mike
Right. Yeah, right.

00:43:53.91
Bill
And the same thing as her, um, her mom and Neil know a lot of these kids, a lot of their friends. So they're all invited to these weddings.

00:43:58.33
Mike
h Right.

00:44:00.13
Bill
So, and I'm like, i haven't been, i mean, I've been to a fucking wedding and it's been years, you know? I mean, I just, I, I mean, again, all of our friends are either, either divorced or they're dying.

00:44:05.82
Mike
Right.

00:44:11.54
Mike
Right.

00:44:14.54
Bill
Lead into the dead friend story coming up.

00:44:15.94
Mike
Right. Right.

00:44:16.62
Bill
How's How's that? Huh? Lead in with little humor.

00:44:17.46
Mike
hey as i for a t-shirt

00:44:21.02
Bill
Jesus, what the fuck is wrong with me?

00:44:23.66
Mike
he

00:44:23.97
Bill
yeah And you, Silva, thank you.

00:44:25.91
Mike
right

00:44:26.52
Bill
Thank you. um But yeah, just, I don't know. It, I wouldn't have expected that, two things. I didn't think about it, you know, number one, which is part of the, part of the fun.

00:44:34.51
Mike
yey Sure.

00:44:36.75
Bill
um But I wouldn't, if somebody would have told me, you're like, yeah but if this ever happens, you're going to start getting all fucking welled up and almost crying.

00:44:42.72
Mike
I know.

00:44:43.31
Bill
I'm like, ah youre why, why, why would I do that? I mean, I'm happy, but no, it did.

00:44:47.97
Mike
Right.

00:44:48.35
Bill
It just, it really, it touched me. It touched me in a really, really good way. And it was nice, you know?

00:44:54.12
Mike
It was.

00:44:54.38
Bill
So, so yeah.

00:44:54.60
Mike
Yes. ah know. it And he said yes. So there you go, kids.

00:44:59.03
Bill
He said, yes, we should get a, we should have got a picture with you holding me.

00:45:03.48
Mike
yeah

00:45:04.49
Bill
he, he said, yes. God damn it. What's wrong with us?

00:45:06.57
Mike
who was with this This show is entirely too short to get into all that.

00:45:06.91
Bill
hey Again, what's wrong with us in a good way?

00:45:13.67
Bill
but then But then after all said and done, I gave Mike a hug. And all of a sudden, I thanked him.

00:45:17.21
Mike
Yeah.

00:45:18.30
Bill
And then he's like, he goes, well, you know, you got to dress up like I want you to. I'm like, I don't give a fuck.

00:45:22.43
Mike
Sure.

00:45:22.50
Bill
i'll wear I'll wear whatever you want. And he's like, really? He's like, you ever seen Pulp Fiction? So yeah. And I'm like, ah he's, yeah. i'm like, oh, yeah somebody else was there. I think Evan had said, he's like, oh, that'd be cool.

00:45:33.35
Bill
i'm like, oh, yeah. The John Travolta look. at He's like, no, the gimp.

00:45:34.98
Mike
sure

00:45:35.83
Bill
Yeah.

00:45:36.80
Mike
Right.

00:45:37.97
Bill
And I'm like, God damn it. I'm like, I don't know. I said, i might am I gagging the ball gag? And you're like, well, that's a goddamn point. So ladies and gentlemen, I might be dressed like the gimp for Mike's wedding, but what what am I willing to do to stay sober and help out my friend?

00:45:42.86
Mike
Right. Yes. Yes.

00:45:46.69
Mike
Yes.

00:45:49.26
Mike
right yeah

00:45:51.68
Bill
Back to the relationship thing, right?

00:45:53.56
Mike
yes

00:45:56.30
Bill
So, yeah, no, it was just, it was really fucking nice. So I just, I do, I appreciate it.

00:45:59.69
Mike
yes

00:46:00.68
Bill
And I don't know, I just, it it hit me it hit me more than I thought I would, but no regrets, no regrets at all.

00:46:07.45
Mike
Absolutely. Yeah,

00:46:10.35
Bill
All right. So um on that note, what do you think there, brother?

00:46:12.74
Mike
on that gushy, mushy, emotional fucking note.

00:46:16.66
Bill
yeah

00:46:16.67
Mike
Right. Well, we'll be back with another dead dog story right after these words from our sponsor.

00:46:31.54
Bill
All right, everyone. Welcome back. And yes, you know, and i guess I'm going to preface this whole thing with ah um I'm laughing about this because I don't know what else the fuck to do, you know, and it really that's what it comes down to.

00:46:35.89
Mike
he

00:46:43.81
Mike
Right.

00:46:46.64
Bill
I mean, it's ah it's whatever i suppose of a therapist is out there, you know, fuck you. This is my process. I'm I know I'm deflecting. I understand what I'm doing. I'm not I'm not fucking delusional.

00:46:56.51
Mike
Right.

00:46:56.61
Bill
You know, I'm i covering my emotions with jokes. So my friend Mike, um have a dick joke handy just in case this gets too goddamn deep or something like that.

00:47:04.82
Mike
All right.

00:47:05.17
Bill
So, all right. So um you remember my friend Sarah I talked about for years and years?

00:47:09.59
Mike
Sure. Yeah.

00:47:10.23
Bill
Yeah, shes she died. So, um, Wednesday, Wednesday. Oh yeah. It was fucking yesterday. I sit down at lunch and that's one of the times that I scroll through Facebook while I'm eating my lunch.

00:47:22.00
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:47:23.12
Bill
So, you know, just on my phone and it's all propped up and I flip, I flip open Facebook and I see this, um, collage of pictures. And then I saw Sarah's name and, and it said, uh, you know, dear friend of mine passed away.

00:47:34.47
Bill
So first thing I'm thinking is, you know, a friend of hers and I'm thinking, well, that sucks.

00:47:37.69
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:47:38.43
Bill
And then I look in the collage of pictures are it's Sarah. you know a collage of all her pictures that it's her friend that's posting this and i'm like what the fuck so i scrolled and i had like there was three other people um that tagged her in the post in in a post so getting this three times i'm like what the i'm trying to read all these fucking comments no indication whatsoever um nothing at all it's just that you know she's fucking dead you know

00:47:42.52
Mike
Yeah. Mm-hmm.

00:48:04.90
Mike
Right.

00:48:05.45
Bill
And she's my age. Literally, she was two months younger than me. um I couldn't remember what her birthday was. It was November of 68. sixty eight So she literally was two years younger than me.

00:48:16.21
Bill
You know, so 56 years old, blah, blah, blah. That's the start. And then here's the other part was I'm i'm like, I'm like, fuck me, because it was literally a week ago Thursday. Because what will happen? You know, talk about reaching out to people, right?

00:48:29.53
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:48:30.27
Bill
And she's one that um she and I met 10 years ago and we met on a sober dating app um data for a little bit.

00:48:36.08
Mike
Right.

00:48:37.82
Bill
She's the one that when, ah for if anyone's been around listening for a little while, she's the one that I was, I was hanging out with and dating at the time that she was drinking. And I, I smelled alcohol and tasted it, blah, bla blah, blah.

00:48:46.91
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:48:48.52
Bill
had to walk away from her. And then we got over that reconciled. And, you know, we had a ah nice relationship over these last 10 years

00:48:56.11
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:48:56.49
Bill
And, you know, if you've ever, if anyone's paid attention me talking about my, you know, they these levels of love that I can have for people, um she would have been one of those people that was a female specifically that was on the higher level of love.

00:49:11.64
Bill
You know, and, and I did, I cared about her deeply. She was a good friend of mine. Um, so we'd keep in touch this and that she moved out back to lacrosse. I don't know, six, 70 years ago, whenever it was, can't remember, lived in a small town out there.

00:49:23.46
Bill
And just every once in a while I'd see her on Facebook, she'd see something on Facebook. One of us would reach out just that sort of thing, you know?

00:49:28.61
Mike
Right.

00:49:29.07
Bill
And, um, it was And I look back and it was like a month ago that I had sent her a text about something. there's a And I know you don't like the band Maroon 5. That was one of her favorite bands.

00:49:37.04
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:49:39.08
Bill
And again, listening to Spotify and the song came up and I did a screenshot of it and I sent her a text. I'm like, hey, this song came up. Made me think about you. How are things? Blah, blah, blah. didn't hear from her.

00:49:46.77
Mike
Right.

00:49:47.34
Bill
forgot about it. And then, um, last week, Thursday, so the 14th is when I, I sent her a message and then realized she never got back to me after the 18th, like July 18th.

00:49:57.30
Mike
Right. Right.

00:49:58.70
Bill
And then like later that day, I sent her a message on Facebook and I'm like, Hey, I said, uh, you know, couple of texts you hadn't got back to me. I said, i just want to make sure, you know, number one, make sure you're okay.

00:50:06.77
Mike
Yeah. Hmm.

00:50:09.07
Bill
And then, you know, how are things type of thing?

00:50:09.18
Mike
Hmm.

00:50:11.00
Bill
So, um Through all this all this stuff that I'm trying to read through, and I caught a name of one of her friends that I recognized just from Sarah talking about her and up you know them posting together over over the years.

00:50:23.98
Bill
So I'm like, fuck, man.

00:50:24.05
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:50:25.02
Bill
i'm like it it's It's killing me. I'm like, what the fuck happened, you know?

00:50:27.59
Mike
Mm-hmm. Sure. Right, right.

00:50:30.63
Bill
Um, in the, you know, none of the posts, a couple of people like, Hey, if any, what happened, if anyone knows DM me, I'm like, yes, I want to fucking know.

00:50:37.96
Mike
Right.

00:50:38.62
Bill
And I'm not trying. I mean, part of it, I, I hope everyone, I don't even care if everyone realizes it wasn't trying to be nosy, but it's a, it's a dear friend of mine. What the fuck happened? You know?

00:50:47.94
Mike
Yeah, right, yeah. You want to know.

00:50:48.67
Bill
Um,

00:50:49.22
Mike
You have a little closure.

00:50:50.65
Bill
Yeah, exactly. So I just messaged his friend to hers. I'm like, hey, I said, I'm I was a very, very good friend to Sarah's. We've been I told her I've been sober dating app years ago, friends for 10 years. I'm like, if you don't want to answer this question, if you don't want to answer me, I understand I'm just some random dude.

00:51:03.39
Mike
Right.

00:51:05.40
Bill
But do you have any idea what happened and left it at that? And she messaged me back and she's like, ah she's like, I don't know. She's like, there's not a lot of details, just that they they found her um on Monday, which would have been this past Monday, the 18th, did a wellness check.

00:51:17.47
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:51:18.93
Bill
So somebody must have called and did a wellness check.

00:51:20.89
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:51:21.26
Bill
um She said the weird part, though, was she goes, well, first of all, no details. But she said there she goes there the the the wind kind of in the wind type of talk is that um it might have been she might have been there a week you know before they found her, which means when I texted her last Thursday and same thing when I messaged her on Facebook, that the message was never opened.

00:51:40.66
Mike
Right.

00:51:40.90
Bill
So she was dead on Thursday in a fucking minimum last Thursday.

00:51:44.20
Mike
Right. Right. Yeah.

00:51:45.57
Bill
and that Jesus fucking Christ. Um, so all said and done, the last post that was on, was on Facebook. And I remembered seeing it, um, cause the air quality, she's in lacrosse, you know, the Canada shit, whatever.

00:51:56.62
Mike
Hmm.

00:51:56.67
Bill
Um, she said she went out for a, went out for a walk and the air qualities, whatever. and she's like oh, i get asthma. was kind of, you know, fuck with me a little bit, just a post on Facebook.

00:52:03.64
Mike
Right.

00:52:03.72
Bill
Now I didn't remember that she had asthma. Um, you know, but I know she, a few years ago, uh, had some sort of cancer scare. I don't remember if it was what, what type of deal it was, but I, I vaguely remember that, that she had to go through all that stuff.

00:52:17.78
Bill
um She was one of us, and she had about five years sober at the time that we had met. Clearly, ah you know at that point, it relapsed kind of back and forth. She went into rehab a couple of times. Over the last handful of years, I've never directly asked her, hey, are you still keeping sober type of thing?

00:52:32.99
Mike
Right.

00:52:33.24
Bill
but um i don't know you know um i know she never slept well that was one thing she'd post about that um i don't know how her life was i don't know if she was happy um i don't know what the deal is you know so then um was it today or late yesterday and again popped on facebook and then there's another post where they're tagged in it so it was her family like her mom and dad and then uh her brother and like a sister-in-law whatever

00:52:35.80
Mike
Yeah.

00:52:40.08
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:52:43.16
Mike
right. right.

00:52:53.24
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:52:58.58
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:52:58.69
Bill
And then like, oh, you know, we appreciate everyone reaching out and, you know, understanding, you know, the family at this time, blah, blah, blah. um Just, you know, and here's here's a link to the obituary. And I look it up because so sometimes that's a telltale. Right.

00:53:12.03
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:53:12.93
Bill
So first of all, it's it's about as bland as you can be. You know, the obituary is died in her home. Here's the date um survived by. And it says survived by her kids. Didn't have her kids names in there.

00:53:26.10
Bill
And I know her, I know her, I don't know her kids, but I know their names.

00:53:28.48
Mike
Right.

00:53:28.70
Bill
so I'm not going to say them on here, but then her mom and dad had her mom and dad's name in there and then her brother and his wife.

00:53:29.04
Mike
Sure. Right.

00:53:34.85
Bill
And then um no mention of what, you know, obviously um no donations to whatever, just like a plant a tree type of thing if you want to.

00:53:38.88
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:53:42.23
Mike
Right, right, right.

00:53:43.18
Bill
And then, you know, any, any services or future memorials, nothing's planned right now. ah We may do something in the future. I'm like, ah, man, that's not good.

00:53:53.06
Mike
Yeah, right.

00:53:53.13
Bill
You know, because you you know what I'm thinking, you know, either either she drank or drugged herself to death or she killed herself.

00:53:55.70
Mike
Right, I know, yeah.

00:53:59.31
Bill
And there's just no better fucking way to say it, you know, um because that's usually in the here's the other kind of fucked up thing with with the kids part.

00:53:59.58
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:54:08.00
Bill
That's what caught me because I you know, the fact that her kids weren't mentioned.

00:54:09.21
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

00:54:11.48
Bill
And her kids weren't on the the little family post. And I'm like, oh, Jesus Christ. I haven't heard much about her kids, but again, didn't ask her when she talked back and forth.

00:54:15.70
Mike
Yeah.

00:54:19.11
Bill
No real posts about her kids on Facebook.

00:54:19.65
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:54:20.83
Bill
And this is for the last probably three, four years. So I don't know if she was estranged with her kids, um which again could have meant that she's up to, you know, some shenanigans here and there.

00:54:25.78
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:54:30.54
Bill
um but But on top of that, um no memorial service, this and that. We've had, how many times have we had that happen where we know somebody that is one of us and the family's just like, we just need to, we need, literally need to put this to rest, you know, and be done with it.

00:54:41.48
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:54:45.63
Mike
Yep. Yeah.

00:54:47.74
Bill
And we we know what happened or you see um donations to, you know, the suicide prevention hotline, donations to the Ed Keating Center. So you get an idea how that person passed away.

00:54:58.99
Mike
Right.

00:54:59.40
Bill
Um, but there was nothing, fucking nothing, you know?

00:55:01.07
Mike
Yeah.

00:55:03.55
Bill
And, um, and I'm just like, Jesus Christ. But did I tell you about her ex, her, her kid's dad, what happened to him

00:55:11.52
Mike
and Maybe.

00:55:12.86
Bill
Okay. um He died. Okay.

00:55:14.83
Mike
huh.

00:55:15.58
Bill
So like six months ago, and I remember when it was, whenever I went up to Two Rivers last, I think it was February. I was up there for a week and i I can't remember the kids were doing something. I was up there for some reason. um But so I was up in Two Rivers and I i had actually reached out to to Sarah. i like, hey, I've got this planned.

00:55:32.82
Bill
you want to get together, what's your schedule? Whatever she was doing, she was working kind of remote. She's going to come out and see me. And then she ended up getting COVID, but also right before that, a couple of weeks prior, um her her ex-husband, his wife, so these kids' dad and their stepmom of years, right, um they died in a car accident.

00:55:50.24
Mike
yeah yeah Yeah, I do remember that.

00:55:50.53
Bill
It was... Yeah, they were in a Tesla, couple other another couple at least, two other people, possibly three, so either four or five people in a car. Lost control, hit a tree, and all fucking burned up, you know?

00:56:02.97
Mike
Yeah.

00:56:03.91
Bill
So then I'm looking at these goddamn kids. You know, i I'm not these goddamn kids. That's the wrong way to say These poor kids, you know, they lost, you know, dad, stepmom, and now mom in six months.

00:56:09.23
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:56:13.03
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm.

00:56:13.91
Bill
I'm like, ha, ha. again, you know? Um, but, uh, I, I tell you, I mean, all, all said and done, I mean, what, what it, I was texting, uh, my friend with my friend, Kathleen today, we're talking about some other stuff.

00:56:24.98
Bill
I'm like, oh, you know, by the way, cause I i planned on bringing it up on here again. Um, you know, it's one of those things where do I want to talk about this shit?

00:56:28.68
Mike
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

00:56:31.57
Bill
No, but I need to, you know?

00:56:32.72
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:56:33.31
Bill
Um, so, but I, I mentioned it to Kathleen and I said, uh, I said, yeah, I said this little side note thing, blah, blah, blah. She had the same type of circumstance, a friend of hers. She was telling me that story in all text messages. And I said, you know what?

00:56:45.53
Bill
I said, the bottom line with all of this is I said, as unfortunate as these things are, and we've talked about it, you know, fucking gratitude just slaps me in the face again, you know?

00:56:55.30
Mike
Yeah.

00:56:55.97
Bill
um And she's like, Kathleen, God love her. She's just like, that's such a healthy way to look at things.

00:57:01.50
Mike
Yeah.

00:57:01.65
Bill
And I said, it's 15 years of fucking sobriety drilled into me, you know, and I'm like, I don't i don't have a choice.

00:57:02.12
Mike
Right. Yeah. Right.

00:57:07.03
Bill
I have to look at it that way.

00:57:08.44
Mike
yeah

00:57:08.92
Bill
um You know, the no bad examples type of thing. It doesn't matter really what happened. um But then I think about, you know, and this is where I said I had not some revelations, but some things that I thought about over the last couple of days.

00:57:20.25
Bill
Literally, it's been a day and a half since I found out.

00:57:20.58
Mike
ah right

00:57:22.74
Bill
um You know, because, you know, all the posts on Facebook, you know, I mean, she, her personality and she lit up the room and she did. I mean, she was one of the most, you know, yeah I always talk about, you know, Kathy and Jody being some of the, you know, and Kimmy being some of the most sincere and, you know, best human beings on the planet.

00:57:30.48
Mike
Right.

00:57:39.38
Bill
it

00:57:39.69
Mike
Right.

00:57:39.98
Bill
um She could be in that mode. You know, she was that type of person, you know.

00:57:41.68
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:57:43.52
Bill
um And, you know, just ah grateful to have her, you know, have spent the time with her over the years and just a wonderful person.

00:57:48.80
Mike
Right.

00:57:50.04
Bill
you know and then But I'm thinking, I'm like, okay, so if one of these other things happen, which again, I'm not trying to speculate, but I can't help myself.

00:57:57.46
Mike
Mm-hmm.

00:57:57.78
Bill
um you know that just It bums me out realizing you know when the the unhappiness with people, I can't do anything about it, but we know that happiness is a byproduct of of how we're living our lives.

00:58:03.97
Mike
Yeah.

00:58:08.29
Mike
Right.

00:58:09.23
Bill
You know, so then, then I got to start fucking examining my life over the last 24 hours.

00:58:12.62
Mike
Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

00:58:14.14
Bill
yeah And I'm like, I'm like, okay, how's my personal life? It's fucking good. You know, I get out and again, you know, I talk about money, whatever, money, whatever that's that, that is what it is.

00:58:18.84
Mike
Yeah.

00:58:23.21
Mike
Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

00:58:24.21
Bill
But the things I do in my personal life, you know, i can get out and see all these things. I do these things. That's wonderful. The relationships, you know, people like you and Kathy and all of, all of my family, my kids, um,

00:58:29.84
Mike
Right.

00:58:32.97
Mike
Mm hmm. Right.

00:58:36.16
Bill
All that's good. I got new issues with anyone. My job, not so much.

00:58:40.18
Mike
ah

00:58:40.38
Bill
And, you know, I sat there and think about it. I'm like, and I wasn't getting irritated about it, but I took a solid look at myself for a minute and I'm like, why am I, I mean, I think to myself every once in a while and I've said it, I'm like, it is a vehicle for me to do the things I want to do.

00:58:54.30
Mike
Yeah, exactly.

00:58:54.64
Bill
Okay. You know, but part of me is like, do i why can't I be happier with this vehicle?

00:58:59.93
Mike
Yeah, I don't know. Right? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

00:59:02.48
Bill
You know, I'm being serious, you know?

00:59:03.73
Mike
yeah i don' know

00:59:05.00
Bill
And I don't know, I mean, I'm not going to quit my job tomorrow, um but I think I'm going to start focusing on that and figure, because at this point, and they using the word deserve is the wrong way to put it, um but I have the ability to make every part of my life the best it could be.

00:59:07.87
Mike
right

00:59:22.23
Mike
this is

00:59:22.44
Bill
And if that turns out to be, to bring me happiness in all parts of my life, I don't say I deserve it, but I have the, I have the ability to, um, in, in the, thank you.

00:59:30.90
Mike
to earn it.

00:59:32.44
Bill
I was trying to think of the word without saying I deserve it to earn it.

00:59:32.72
Mike
Yeah.

00:59:35.20
Bill
Yeah.

00:59:35.45
Mike
Yeah. Right. Yeah. Right. We have the, you have the ability to go out and earn it, to work, to make things better. Yeah, absolutely. We all do. I know.

00:59:44.29
Bill
Right. Right.

00:59:44.71
Mike
I mean, I'm, I'm, trust me, I'm the same way. I mean, you know, I don't hate my job, but you know, don't fucking love it either. I mean, yeah, I, I'd love to not be able to work, you know, to be able to not work.

00:59:58.37
Bill
Right..

00:59:58.37
Mike
um that would be fantastic um it's not fucking reality i have to do something to earn money just

01:00:06.26
Bill
yeah

01:00:08.93
Mike
right so and this is what i do so i guess i'll well actually i won't get up and do it tomorrow because i took tomorrow off because fuck it um ha yeah Way too much shit going on. And I'm like, you know what? I'm not pressuring myself.

01:00:24.37
Mike
You know, again, doing the radio thing tomorrow. I'm going in a half hour earlier than I planned on and all that. I'm just like, you know what?

01:00:30.01
Bill
you what, not myself.

01:00:30.30
Mike
I'm not killing myself.

01:00:31.13
Bill
myself all week. it has been stuff, but I mean, it's been, I have a chance.

01:00:31.72
Mike
I've been killing myself all week. all You know, and it hasn't been all bad stuff. But, I mean, it's been, i haven't had, haven't had a weekend in like a month you know mean you know yeah chris and i went and celebrated our anniversary and then um you know and then chip on lake which i mean it's all been great stuff it's just fuck man um but i need i need to lay it down for a minute

01:00:59.45
Bill
Right. Right.

01:01:00.86
Mike
You know, not that I'm going to tomorrow, but um but yeah, I just like, I'm not going to work because I got other shit to do and I need to take care of myself. You know, boundaries, man. So I don't end up in a room by myself laying there for a week before anybody fucking finds me.

01:01:16.79
Bill
Yeah.

01:01:17.29
Mike
Yeah.

01:01:18.60
Bill
Yeah. hey that was in the you know that that's

01:01:19.47
Mike
Again, ability to earn your happiness. Right.

01:01:22.93
Bill
yeah

01:01:23.46
Mike
Yeah. Yeah. You know, go ahead.

01:01:25.05
Bill
And I, yeah, I, no, I'm sorry. I don't mean, i'm I'm kind of, I didn't mean interrupt you.

01:01:29.04
Mike
I know.

01:01:29.19
Bill
I'm just kind of, um I'm agreeing and rambling in my head.

01:01:29.48
Mike
Right.

01:01:31.95
Bill
It just, it just came just came out of my mouth.

01:01:31.92
Mike
Yeah, exactly. he

01:01:36.00
Bill
yeah We do so well not interrupting ourselves that I just let my, I just let my mumbling head come out of my mouth for a minute.

01:01:38.62
Mike
ah know.

01:01:41.70
Bill
So sorry about that.

01:01:41.95
Mike
It's okay. i' No, I mean, I understand.

01:01:43.07
Bill
hey

01:01:44.19
Mike
I mean, I kind of hijacked a bit too. I mean, this is your you're processing your shit right now. I'm just trying to help a little bit.

01:01:50.54
Bill
No, yeah you don't have to apologize for that. I need that.

01:01:52.47
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:01:52.70
Bill
Because here's the thing that I don't, I don't know, part of me, it's like, I don't need to just talk.

01:01:52.90
Mike
Right.

01:01:57.02
Bill
I love to hear but you're going through too, you know, whatever.

01:01:59.05
Mike
Right.

01:01:59.75
Bill
and um But yeah, when it comes to the job and um and I'm like, you know, I don't know. I'm looking at there, there's parts of my day in and don't get me wrong because the, there's no way that I could do what I've done for the last year and a half.

01:02:13.14
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:02:13.56
Bill
If I didn't have a remote job with no residency restrictions, that's what this job does for me.

01:02:17.54
Mike
Mm-hmm. Sure.

01:02:18.67
Bill
Okay. But what it also does is bring a little bit of the, the juvenile attitude of this industry that I've dealt with my entire fucking career.

01:02:27.71
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:02:28.04
Bill
um you know, for 35, well, I was, I was 20, 21, 22, 22. ah was twenty twenty one twenty two

01:02:33.72
Mike
Yeah.

01:02:34.36
Bill
You know, 33 years I've been doing this.

01:02:35.84
Mike
Yeah. Right.

01:02:37.13
Bill
33. With some exceptions. I mean, I did a few other things, you know, some sales shit, and whatever, but call it every bit of fucking 30 years, you know.

01:02:38.71
Mike
Sure. Right. Mm-hmm.

01:02:43.89
Mike
Yeah.

01:02:44.14
Bill
um and a And I get it. Like today, today our my manager sends out an email to everyone. It's getting, you know, it's towards the end of the month and this is the rah, rah, rah time and blah, blah, blah.

01:02:52.37
Mike
Yeah. Right.

01:02:53.34
Bill
And I'm pretty good at just, you know, if you want to call it car compartmentalizing or just fucking ignoring the shit.

01:02:55.16
Mike
Yeah. Right. yeah Right. Right.

01:02:59.37
Bill
Um, whatever you want to call it, the, the nice word is compartmentalizing and I call it, I'm just going to fucking ignore it. You know, even if I'm part of the problem where, you know, if they're not part of the problem and what I'm trying to do, but if, you know, call volume is down or money's down or whatever.

01:03:04.86
Mike
yeah right

01:03:11.12
Mike
right

01:03:13.92
Mike
Right, right, right

01:03:14.18
Bill
Um, and today, today I was, I, I had a, I had a slow day, you know, and so I was part of this problem, but,

01:03:17.44
Mike
right.

01:03:19.54
Bill
He sends out he sends out this this email after lunch and it's like it's like, OK, so, hey, slow morning, um you know, we got to pick it up. You know, let's go with an explanation point.

01:03:30.23
Bill
And then have you ever seen the movie Jerry Maguire?

01:03:32.64
Mike
No.

01:03:33.31
Bill
Okay, so there's a part of it where just look it up on YouTube. Just look up Show Me The Money, and it's Jerry Maguire screaming, show me the money.

01:03:38.44
Mike
Yeah, right. Uh-huh. ahha

01:03:41.28
Bill
He's got that picture in there with ah with a list of where we got where we are numbers-wise. And i'm like in my I'm like, fuck you, you know?

01:03:47.81
Mike
Right. Right.

01:03:48.74
Bill
and And literally, I'm just like, fuck you.

01:03:50.91
Mike
Right.

01:03:51.27
Bill
And then, you know, he'll do that every once in a while that, you know, a certain number of calls will be down and he's like, oh, this and that we got calls or whatever. And in the same thing, every time i would love to be able to because I've been on the other side of things, I know what to look for and I know what they're looking at.

01:04:03.43
Mike
ah sir right

01:04:06.62
Bill
But if you you can't just look at fucking numbers. And your the numbers don't lie, but they don't tell the whole story with anything, you know.

01:04:14.05
Mike
right

01:04:16.55
Mike
Yeah.

01:04:17.28
Bill
And especially in this type of thing. Now, i've I've had people that I've managed over the years that I was blown away how fucking lazy they were with the money opportunity they had, you

01:04:26.41
Mike
Mm-hmm. Sure.

01:04:27.78
Bill
you know But in most cases, I'm sure 80% of the the people that work in in our department, this group of people we have, 80% of them are not fucking around because they have this opportunity.

01:04:34.92
Mike
Yeah.

01:04:38.73
Bill
they're They're fucking themselves if they're fucking around.

01:04:38.72
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:04:41.04
Mike
right

01:04:41.83
Bill
So, but anyhow, um but yeah, I mean, I don't know. i don't know what I'm going to do, but I think I'm going to start focusing on that. I just, because I, I, there's no reason in the world where I don't need to settle for anything anymore.

01:04:53.29
Bill
You know, and that may sound, I'm not trying to be, ooh, I'm not, I don't want to be that way.

01:04:53.38
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:04:56.71
Mike
Right, right. i

01:04:59.16
Bill
Again, like you said, we have the right to earn our our happiness. That's what we do.

01:05:02.41
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:05:03.22
Bill
Doing things that that bring joy to us and making our corner of the world and being good to other people. um i there's i There's no reason for us to to have to do things that that don't bring us some sort of the end result is joy or happiness, you know?

01:05:15.51
Mike
Sure. Yeah.

01:05:16.73
Bill
And, and shit like this, man. I mean, you know, to, um, like you said, I was going to bring that up too. Um, it, it pains me to think that, that she, again, not that she was there, you know, but it, it, it's painful to think that anyone, um, goes undiscovered for potentially a week.

01:05:27.77
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

01:05:33.19
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:05:36.66
Mike
Right.

01:05:36.76
Bill
you know, or even five days, you know?

01:05:38.83
Mike
Yeah.

01:05:39.85
Bill
And then I thought about it. I'm like, okay, so I'm out the middle of fucking nowhere half the time, blah, blah, blah.

01:05:44.09
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:05:44.30
Bill
um But ah and I mean, honest question though, I don't think it'd go more than, well, okay, even even if it's a weekend. yeah Okay, so I don't, would have work climbing up my ass because if I didn't show up for work, my boss would try to call me.

01:05:50.94
Mike
Right. Right, right. Mm-hmm.

01:05:56.36
Bill
Then he'd go for my emergency contact with Kathy.

01:05:58.07
Mike
right right mm-hmm right

01:05:58.52
Bill
And then you guys, everyone always said, you guys always have my address where I'm at. I'm sure I'd be i'd be found pretty quickly. Okay. But let's say it's a, it's a Saturday, you know, and I don't post as much on social media on a Saturday, but um I've got a routine. I always post a reading. I always post our episode clip in the morning.

01:06:17.37
Bill
I think maybe it would go 24 hours until, until one of you guys, you know, said, you know what, there's been nothing from Bill in 24 hours.

01:06:26.65
Mike
yeah right

01:06:29.04
Bill
He's either drunk or dead.

01:06:30.36
Mike
Right.

01:06:32.53
Bill
I mean, am I wrong?

01:06:33.71
Mike
No, no, not at all. Yeah. I mean, the same with me too. You know, as you're talking about it, I'm thinking about it. I'm like, yeah, there's no way i could, you know, I wouldn't go that long. I've again, goes back to the reading, goes back to relationships and stuff. I've, you know, I built these relationships that,

01:06:49.49
Mike
you know Yeah, there was a time in my life where, yeah, I could have easily gone a week and nobody would have fucking cared. you know And I'd have been happy about it.

01:06:55.24
Bill
Right. Or no, yeah.

01:06:57.83
Mike
It's kind of the way I built my life. It was it was the goal all to to be able to go a week where nobody was going to miss me. um uh right but yeah no not today i couldn't you know i mean well clearly chris i mean i talk to her every day i mean we text each other constantly through the i mean we send each other emojis during the work day you know just bullshit stuff but it's just you know constant every few hours it's you know hey thinking about you blah blah blah whatever

01:07:26.64
Bill
Right.

01:07:26.63
Mike
um You know, that's that's her and I. um But I mean, yeah, i just in general, in the world, yeah, I couldn't go 24 hours of radio silence without people going, where the fuck is he?

01:07:39.67
Bill
right Yeah, exactly.

01:07:39.70
Mike
Which is kind of cool.

01:07:42.27
Bill
And I, you know, I thought about the same thing, you know, that, uh, um, I mean, it is, we're, we're accountable these days, you know, and I mean, I'm,

01:07:49.31
Mike
And I can't believe I just fucking said that it was cool out loud. Because like I said, for years and years, my life was built on, yeah, let's see how long I can go before anybody fucking says, where the hell is he at?

01:08:01.20
Bill
Right. Yeah. And it's, I mean, it it is different these days, you know, social media and whatever, but I mean, there, there's people that, you know, on ah friends of ours, Facebook, Instagram, whatever, I don't see for, you know, a number of days and wouldn't think about it.

01:08:05.80
Mike
Right.

01:08:10.21
Mike
Right.

01:08:12.56
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:08:12.84
Bill
But, but I mean, I've, I, like I said, you obviously with you and Chris, it'd be impossible, you know, I mean, cause that sort of thing.

01:08:17.28
Mike
Right.

01:08:19.29
Bill
um If I was in Indiana, it'd be impossible because I'm in Indiana.

01:08:22.95
Mike
Right.

01:08:23.04
Bill
But I mean, without doing this sort of thing, you know, I just I just don't think it'd take that long in that. I mean, that's that's sad, you know, that it took whether it was um I'm convinced now based on the fact that, you know, the Facebook message was never opened.

01:08:35.60
Mike
Right.

01:08:35.87
Bill
And that was Thursday at, you know, whatever it was, two, three in the afternoon, you know, and that was that was last Thursday and they didn't find her until Monday. So at a minimum, that's that's there, you know.

01:08:43.21
Mike
Right. Yeah.

01:08:46.02
Bill
That's sad, you know, and it's, and again, you know, knowing her and all that stuff.

01:08:46.85
Mike
Yeah.

01:08:49.41
Bill
And again, I know, I know that she had her, her troubles and her struggles and all those sorts of things. And then like, we always talk about, not that I'm special, not that anyone out there is special, but same thing when, you know, like when, when, when Dubs, when we found out about him, you know, and ah the number of other people, it was just the first one that came to my mind.

01:09:02.57
Mike
Yeah, right. Yeah.

01:09:07.05
Bill
You're like, God damn.

01:09:07.38
Mike
Yeah.

01:09:08.39
Bill
I mean, we're not, I'm not mad that she didn't reach out to me. um I wish she would have treated, regardless of what happened, I wish she would have reached out to somebody.

01:09:12.21
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:09:15.92
Bill
you know, um or or same thing that Pat would have done that or or anyone that's that gets to be in that state, reach out to somebody.

01:09:15.91
Mike
Right.

01:09:19.81
Mike
Yes.

01:09:23.22
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:09:23.66
Bill
There are people out there to to help you. And I guess that's my that's my point for anyone that's this, you know, listening that, you know, one way or the other, um whatever you think, whatever you're fucking going through.

01:09:26.20
Mike
Yeah. Yes.

01:09:34.59
Bill
um and We've had this we've had shit like this happen in the family. I can't even tell you the number of people that we've known in 15 fucking years that have died.

01:09:39.75
Mike
Right. Mm-hmm. Right. Right.

01:09:43.05
Bill
Um, some, you know, tragically by an overdose, not necessarily meant to be or meant to happen.

01:09:43.14
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:09:48.67
Bill
Um, others on purpose and, um, you know, just, it's, uh, it's fucked up, you know, whatever.

01:09:48.66
Mike
Right. Yes.

01:09:54.15
Bill
If you're, if you're thinking something like that, just fucking reach out to somebody, you know, that's, I don't know.

01:09:57.60
Mike
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

01:09:59.01
Bill
And I'm not, it's nobody deserves to be reached out to, but maybe you deserve it, you know?

01:10:03.04
Mike
Yeah. Yeah, right. You know, and right, exactly. Well, the Jerry Stahl quote, man, you know, yes, suicide is always an option, but unfortunately the blood splatters on the living.

01:10:13.98
Bill
yeah Right. Yeah. And that's ah i only giggle at that because it's it's so fucking true. You know, it really fucking true.

01:10:18.32
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:10:19.64
Bill
And just to make it clear, I don't know what happened, but I can't I just can't imagine. um I mean, nothing was mentioned. would it's It's just all the signs indicate that something fucking wrong happened.

01:10:30.19
Mike
yeah Yeah, it's not good. Yeah, absolutely.

01:10:32.14
Bill
Right. You know, because I mean, the same thing. I mean, how how many people have we known that have passed away, you know, from cancer or something like that? And like, you know, after a long battle with whatever, this person passed away, you know, because that's ah that's all about awareness and whatever.

01:10:41.80
Mike
Right. Yeah.

01:10:46.14
Bill
But I mean, this this disease, if it was, you know, whether it's mental health or whether it's alcohol or drugs, this this fucking disease of ours, you know, that that people want to stifle.

01:10:51.30
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:10:55.83
Bill
I don't like that. You know, i don't get it.

01:10:57.67
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:10:58.12
Bill
um But same thing happened. You know, we had it happen on a family level where just wanted to be quieted down a little bit.

01:11:01.44
Mike
Right.

01:11:03.26
Bill
um And I mean, I get it. I understand it. It's a whatever. it It is what it is, but it doesn't change the whole thing. And I'm rambling now about the whole thing. But by the bottom line is, is that, you know, I mean, she meant a lot to me and I'll miss her.

01:11:12.17
Mike
Right.

01:11:17.56
Bill
So that's that.

01:11:17.63
Mike
Yes.

01:11:20.46
Mike
And again, grateful that it said we it couldn't happen to us today.

01:11:25.85
Bill
Yeah, exactly.

01:11:26.39
Mike
Yeah, yeah.

01:11:26.66
Bill
you know

01:11:28.09
Mike
Which is pretty good.

01:11:28.21
Bill
But for the grace.

01:11:28.69
Mike
But yeah, exactly. And, and but and and you know, that we've we've done the work to make it so that that couldn't happen to us today. It could happen in the future, but not today.

01:11:40.96
Bill
Right?

01:11:41.46
Mike
Yeah.

01:11:43.09
Bill
Yeah, exactly. Exactly.

01:11:44.39
Mike
listen and and ah so And that just kind of reminded me, i um and when you had mentioned Derek's name earlier, I ran into ah Daryl's son.

01:11:45.39
Bill
Okay.

01:11:55.02
Bill
Oh, really?

01:11:55.28
Mike
Derek. Yeah.

01:11:56.13
Bill
Nice.

01:11:56.66
Mike
Yeah. i showed up at Puritas on Sunday.

01:11:56.87
Bill
Nice.

01:11:58.78
Mike
Yeah. Just, you know, he's doing good. He's doing great. You know, he's doing the thing. Yeah. Mm hmm.

01:12:05.09
Bill
Yeah, and you know what? um and It's been a while because I'm not on Facebook all that much, but probably yeah within the last couple of years, um he came up as a friend's suggestion on there.

01:12:12.80
Mike
o

01:12:13.92
Bill
you know and i looked I'm like, oh, that ah there he is. you know and yeah It's been a long time.

01:12:16.27
Mike
yeah

01:12:18.26
Bill
I've seen him in a couple of meetings. at Well, shit, he was at Hootie. When I led that one time and I'm fucking talking about his dad and then his son walks up.

01:12:22.16
Mike
hu

01:12:25.57
Mike
right no no right

01:12:25.78
Bill
I didn't say anything bad about his dad. I was fucking torn up when Daryl died. I was just so fucking, I was just like, God damn it. You know?

01:12:32.75
Mike
mm-hmm yep yeah exactly that part never stops mm-hmm there is

01:12:33.53
Bill
Same goddamn thing. You know, we were dealing with whatever it was 10 fucking years ago. You know, yeah, it fucking doesn't. But i don't know, man, there's a there's there's a better life out there is all is all that we is all that we can say. And as dark or as grim as it may look right now, at you you don't have to live that way. And for all the fucking around that we do, um that's fucking serious.

01:12:57.08
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:12:57.21
Bill
So.

01:12:57.98
Mike
And again, i I wanted to bring that up because he's he's a great example of, you know, family history and blah, blah, blah, blah blah and all that.

01:13:04.91
Bill
Right?

01:13:04.95
Mike
and you know And, you know, he's a firefighter too.

01:13:08.75
Bill
Right?

01:13:09.15
Mike
Yeah, you know, and all that. I mean, ah literally following in his father's footsteps, but um doing the program like his father never did. And that's, yeah.

01:13:20.06
Mike
So he's he see's doing the thing with all the exact same history. The solution is there for all of us. And he wass he's a great example of it.

01:13:27.10
Bill
Right?

01:13:28.64
Mike
And I wanted to bring that up because, yeah, the solution is out there, kids.

01:13:32.70
Bill
Yeah. And that's, ah that's the thing. And that was ah the one thing with Daryl and I'll never forget that at the, and it was, it was a dance meeting, you know, he's just like, like this, he fucking flat out said, man, was like, goes, I'm okay when I get to this.

01:13:38.93
Mike
Yeah.

01:13:42.96
Mike
Yeah.

01:13:44.89
Bill
And he goes, I just can't, I can't believe that I'm, that I'm powerless and and if my life's unmanageable.

01:13:48.41
Mike
Yeah.

01:13:49.33
Bill
I'm like,

01:13:49.41
Mike
Right. you couldn't surrender. Couldn't do the first step.

01:13:53.77
Bill
yeah. And then fucking Dan, he's, Daryl's asking all these goddamn questions, trying to figure out how he could do this. And Dan's like, he goes, he goes, go out there. He goes, you can talk to, he goes, go talk to 10, 12, 20, 30, 50 people.

01:14:04.82
Bill
He goes, sooner or later, you'll find, you'll find somebody to sponsor you who will agree with you.

01:14:08.84
Mike
Right.

01:14:08.97
Bill
He goes, you're not going to do any better, but he goes, you'll find the right, you'll find the right answer.

01:14:09.18
Mike
Uh-huh. Yeah.

01:14:12.47
Bill
If you keep asking enough fucking people. And I'm like, God damn it. And again,

01:14:16.36
Mike
Uh-huh. You'll find somebody to co-sign your bullshit.

01:14:20.24
Bill
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yep.

01:14:21.08
Mike
Yep.

01:14:21.20
Bill
Yeah, but that's that's a good point, though. I wasn't thinking about that Derek is, yeah, same, you know, again, lineage, hereditary, all that stuff, you know, the same occupation, doing all the things, but um he's actually, you know, taking the, yeah, actually does we does what does what he's supposed to do, which is, but yeah that's ah yeah, that's the way to put it.

01:14:26.99
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right. Yep.

01:14:32.37
Mike
But he works the program. said

01:14:38.10
Mike
does He's done what is suggested.

01:14:42.76
Mike
Yes.

01:14:42.95
Bill
Yeah, not supposed to do.

01:14:43.56
Mike
I try.

01:14:44.43
Bill
Done what done what has been suggested. That's a good point, so.

01:14:46.34
Mike
yes

01:14:49.14
Bill
All right. So enough of ah enough of that. All right, guys, we're we're about to we're about to bring you back up. We left it with a with a word of a thing of hope. Mike just gave us a thing of hope with.

01:14:57.15
Mike
yes i try

01:15:00.16
Bill
yeah So I guess yeah somebody, this is but a couple of these things have nothing to do with anything. But um do you you remember AOL, right?

01:15:09.08
Mike
Sure.

01:15:09.84
Bill
Okay. do you remember what it stands for?

01:15:11.63
Mike
America online.

01:15:14.60
Bill
I wanted you to say it too, because a lot of people out there don't, don't know what it is, but so two things. Did, did you even know that they were still around?

01:15:22.19
Mike
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I've heard, I've heard the story, right?

01:15:26.47
Bill
yeah The most recent one.

01:15:27.99
Mike
Yeah. Yeah.

01:15:29.29
Bill
Okay. So about their dial up service.

01:15:31.42
Mike
Yeah. Right. there Yeah.

01:15:32.13
Bill
Oh,

01:15:32.38
Mike
There's still like 250,000 people on

01:15:35.81
Bill
Yeah. And I'm like, I'm like, what the fuck, man?

01:15:36.37
Mike
yeah

01:15:38.56
Bill
So yeah, they're ending their dial dial up service at the end of September. um And yeah, they they still have yet this certain number of like thousands of people on there.

01:15:45.39
Mike
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:15:46.12
Bill
I'm like, you fucking kidding me? The only reason I even knew AOL was still around is because some of these people that I work that I deal with on a daily basis, some of these businesses, um they have AOL emails.

01:15:54.54
Mike
of Have emails.

01:15:58.55
Bill
And I every time I look at them, I'm like, they're still fucking around.

01:15:58.77
Mike
Yep.

01:16:02.08
Bill
you know, cause the first thing I thought was it was old. I was talking to one of the business owners one time and I said that we've got three different email addresses, which one he's like, Oh, the AOL one. I'm like, really? And he's like, yeah. I'm like, ah I never would've thought, but, um, so yeah, just, it, it amazed me.

01:16:13.13
Mike
Right?

01:16:15.70
Bill
It just, that, that just fucking surprised me. I didn't, uh,

01:16:17.88
Mike
Well, I mean, I'm still rocking hotmail, so, you know.

01:16:21.85
Bill
Yeah, but I mean, Hotmail, Gmail, Yahoo, those ones are always, I know a lot of people dropped into the whole Gmail thing, you know, just because it was what it was.

01:16:29.60
Mike
Right.

01:16:29.97
Bill
um But I mean, you know, Hotmail and Yahoo, I mean, those have been around for a long time. I mean, there's, I'm trying to think of the other ones that are like MSN, they're still like msn.com, you know, like those email addresses, or you'll see like Prodigy, remember Prodigy?

01:16:43.17
Mike
Right.

01:16:44.34
Bill
Yeah. you know I'll see one of those and I'm like, ah it's got to be fucking old now. but um I just don't yeah i don't know. i just aol ah had no fucking idea. yeah anyone i mean if you have We had to deal. not again not to it was The internet was fucking great when it first came up and being able to dial into anything.

01:17:00.06
Bill
you know so i'm not We weren't complaining about it, but yeah compared to now, it's that literally, it's like it's not even like walking versus driving a car.

01:17:02.52
Mike
Right.

01:17:08.81
Bill
It's like crawling on your knees versus being able to drive a Ferrari now.

01:17:13.02
Mike
Right, yeah, yeah, flying in a jet.

01:17:13.10
Bill
you know That's

01:17:16.44
Bill
Yeah, that's a better example. you get ah You get to fly in a jet these days and we were we were crawling on our knees.

01:17:19.12
Mike
Rocket to the moon.

01:17:24.52
Mike
Yep.

01:17:24.57
Bill
ah Back in our day, we we had to crawl on our knees.

01:17:25.42
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:17:30.50
Bill
Just fucking stupid. but All right, so... um This one, now that maybe this kind of goes along with what we were talking about, but in a positive way. This is just a note that I wrote down from Keep It Simple. I really, I'll just say it right off the bat. I really have nothing, you know, much to go along with this, but I like the saying.

01:17:45.64
Bill
And I know I've heard it before, but it just from Keep It Simple, it said, if there is no wind, row.

01:17:51.56
Mike
Right.

01:17:52.41
Bill
Which, I mean, that's kind of what, it's kind of what we're taught, right? Yeah.

01:17:56.39
Mike
Yeah. Oh, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, yes. ah You know, the wind's nice and you know, but you yeah you still have to harness it. You still have to do something, um but it's certainly easier.

01:18:06.64
Bill
Yeah.

01:18:08.89
Mike
But yes, when there is no wind, then fucking pick up a paddle and start pushing some water.

01:18:16.19
Bill
Yeah, fucking do the work. and i But I do, I like that because the, um like you just said, i mean, it's ah everyone everyone likes to have a little wind at their back every once in a while.

01:18:18.36
Mike
No.

01:18:24.99
Mike
No.

01:18:25.61
Bill
But but you know what? God damn it. Fucking not everything, not everything happens that way on ah on a goddamn daily basis.

01:18:32.49
Mike
No.

01:18:33.80
Bill
You know, it just doesn't. I like it to most times.

01:18:36.10
Mike
so

01:18:36.36
Bill
but But then again, to go back to what you were talking about, you know, it's, All of this stuff, you know, i mean, it's ah the fact that we have done the work and earned it. um It does.

01:18:46.79
Bill
It makes a difference, you know?

01:18:47.89
Mike
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It means more.

01:18:51.19
Bill
Right.

01:18:51.24
Mike
Right. Yeah. You know, I mean, getting to that destination, rowing versus laying on your back and having the wind take you. um it's It's a lot better when you get to the destination. You worked for it.

01:19:04.06
Mike
It means more.

01:19:06.79
Bill
and You were just talking about not having a weekend that you wanted to lay down.

01:19:09.40
Mike
Yeah, I know. Well, and trust me, I'm not laying down for... I got plenty of shit to do, but yes, I get to be a bit more leisurely at it, which is... I needed, you know, and that clearly the following weekend we're going to fucking Alaska, so...

01:19:27.52
Mike
ah

01:19:27.62
Bill
Right.

01:19:29.82
Mike
Yeah, I just, I needed a break, man. And, you know, um I'm actually going to get a nice break this weekend. of Not that, you know, whatever. It's going to be, I get to be a little selfish this weekend.

01:19:42.24
Mike
Chris is going away for a girls weekend and I get to get caught up on some stuff. So that's nice.

01:19:48.72
Bill
and Nice. little bit ah little bit of time.

01:19:50.17
Mike
Yeah. Yeah. No.

01:19:54.71
Bill
But no, I mean, I get it. i did I think I told you I took off tomorrow too, didn't I?

01:19:58.50
Mike
No.

01:19:59.34
Bill
Yeah. i ah when When I originally booked, because I mean, I don't even know if I'm not that it fucking matters. I'm in Niagara, Wisconsin, same place I stayed last week, which or last year. But um again, you know, same thing. I mean, this place is it's it's fine. It's comfortable. And I went up to Pictured Rocks. I'll be honest in this.

01:20:15.76
Bill
This might not be a popular opinion, but it maybe be it's because I think the the best way to see Pictured Rocks is from the water.

01:20:23.60
Mike
It's from the water. Yeah.

01:20:24.66
Bill
Yeah. And ah the trail that I wanted was ice nice, nice, nice overlooks. I went on this waterfall thing, which is fucking beautiful.

01:20:31.27
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:20:31.69
Bill
That was a little bit down from, from where I was. I kind of stayed in the same area. um But I mean, those two trails, i mean, was like five miles of walking. There was this one trail that would have been to get to this. It was something point that's supposed to be the most beautiful area.

01:20:45.00
Bill
Cause a bluff comes out this and that, but you know what?

01:20:46.63
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:20:47.97
Bill
It's five fucking miles just to walk out to it.

01:20:50.65
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

01:20:52.38
Bill
And I'm like, okay, so I'm literally drove, you know, I mean, four and a half hours of driving.

01:20:57.31
Mike
Right.

01:20:58.04
Bill
And I'm like, that's three hours that they're saying like to go back and forth to 10 miles. It's, you know, three hours, you know, whatever it is.

01:21:03.54
Mike
Sure. Yeah.

01:21:04.78
Bill
And I might want to look at some stuff while I'm out there. I'm like, God damn, it's a Sunday. Like, I'm i'm not going to do that. Plus on top of that, 10 miles. and That's a lot, you know.

01:21:14.54
Mike
It is.

01:21:15.45
Bill
Then I'm like, i don't want to walk. i literally walking five miles through the woods. I want to go see some shit. But anyhow, um, you know, the nobody could have been, not nobody, but it would have been tough to be out on the water for anyone that day.

01:21:25.85
Bill
The wind was kicking up, blah, blah, blah.

01:21:26.95
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:21:27.57
Bill
Um, I still, I'm not, no regrets on going out there, but, um, I just think it would have been, it would been nicer to be able to get out on the water.

01:21:27.60
Mike
Right.

01:21:34.75
Bill
Plus it cost me $25.

01:21:37.11
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:21:37.80
Bill
which again, fine goes in national parks. I'm fine with it. No complaints, but this place I'm, took off tomorrow.

01:21:40.69
Mike
Right.

01:21:44.31
Bill
Cause I, I figured ah um ah same thing. Like you just said, run it all over to place. And I'm going down to Appleton on Saturday to watch Ollie play soccer and then babysit for him Saturday night.

01:21:50.96
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:21:53.87
Bill
then I haven't lunch with Kimmy and, or I'm sorry, Derek and Katie on the way back.

01:21:54.19
Mike
Nice.

01:21:59.00
Bill
um But I'm like, you know what? I'm, I've already been off two days this month. and I'm like, fuck it. You know, I'm going to take a day off and I'm, I'm up here.

01:22:04.39
Mike
Yeah. Right. Nice. Cool.

01:22:07.28
Bill
It's still nice out. Nice ish chance of rain a little bit tomorrow, but i don't know.

01:22:08.41
Mike
right

01:22:11.97
Bill
We'll see. But um there's this little, it's called this something Canyon Gorge thing. It's like this four mile trail that I might go on tomorrow. um It's supposed to be It's to be cool. So and yeah, I get, I get some time to kick around and and do that.

01:22:21.90
Mike
nice ah

01:22:24.88
Bill
But um I had no idea where I was going with any of that. Was I, was I saying something else?

01:22:28.08
Mike
I don't know.

01:22:29.29
Bill
Yeah.

01:22:29.63
Mike
I don't know, man. Yeah. Well, I'm going to the BMV tomorrow, so there's that.

01:22:35.30
Bill
Yeah, you got that. Okay. Okay, cool. Cool.

01:22:36.97
Mike
Yeah. Got to get my plates transferred.

01:22:39.15
Bill
Oh, yeah, yeah. So, um yeah, all so all said and done, I was kind of surprised.

01:22:40.35
Mike
yep

01:22:42.98
Bill
I was going to ask you when you were there. i'm like, doesn't Ohio must not do the same? They must do the same thing that fucking Carvana does where they don't transfer your plates when you buy a car, hu

01:22:50.74
Mike
Right. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you got to wait for the, uh, for the registration to come. So they emailed it to me a couple of days ago. So yeah, gotta go. I mean, I don't know. I might be able to do it online, whatever.

01:23:01.15
Bill
Right.

01:23:01.96
Mike
I'm going to go in. It'll be a weekday. Hopefully it won't be bad. And yeah, throw them some money and, and put my plates in my car.

01:23:07.91
Bill
Yeah, well, that's.

01:23:11.44
Bill
Yeah, well, like like I said, I mean, all all said and done after all the shit that I was waiting for, because again, and unless ah that lady wouldn't have directed me to the area of the website, I would have never found it.

01:23:18.99
Mike
Mm-hmm. Right.

01:23:20.12
Bill
um But yeah, man, got it done. Didn't have to do a second emission test. Didn't cost me anything. It's just within minutes they emailed me by registration. I'm like, fuck, that was Yeah.

01:23:28.94
Mike
Okay.

01:23:29.79
Bill
yeah So all good. But yeah, so anyhow, so I'm out tomorrow. You're out tomorrow. That's all good. There was something else I had on here. There was a, oh, I know what it was. So Chris, um Chris sent this meme to me and the, hang on. What was the, was the meme said?

01:23:46.78
Bill
OK, so the meme said dating someone and saying you just want to be friends, then responding with I'm glad you said at first I didn't want to hurt your feelings. So Chris sent me that meme.

01:23:56.31
Mike
okay

01:23:56.60
Bill
So it's like, you know, is ah again, in quotes, as oh, you're dating, dating somebody and saying or them saying you just want to be friends that you respond to them. Oh, I'm glad you said it first and I'd want to hurt your feelings in the the part. The second part of that is saying that, you know, you didn't want to ah basically you're going to cause them to be self-conscious, you know.

01:24:13.88
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:24:14.42
Bill
So what I did is I posted it and then I put a note. I'm like, this literally happened to me um on a dating app like a week ago when I was telling you about that, that chick that just all a sudden out of the blue.

01:24:20.55
Mike
Hmm.

01:24:23.07
Mike
Right.

01:24:24.72
Bill
And I'm like, oh, I might have to use this line. Ha ha type of thing. So just fucking humor, you know? So some, some random person pops on and they're like, they're like, oh, if you've got a problem with somebody telling you they just want to be friends, what do you want them to do?

01:24:40.67
Bill
Lie to you?

01:24:41.54
Mike
Hmm.

01:24:41.82
Bill
And I'm like, I'm like, oh, fuck me. I should have just left it be, but I'm like, I'm like, you know what?

01:24:45.89
Mike
Right. Uh

01:24:47.51
Bill
I said, it's a meme. It's not my reality. And left, left it at that.

01:24:50.03
Mike
huh. Right.

01:24:51.62
Bill
And I, I don't have notifications going on there. So whatever it was, a couple hours later when I popped back in there again, so it's during a work day, you know? Um, so I popped back in there and person's like, well, you stated in your, and I'm like, oh, and I look at, it's this, this chick and she's probably in her early twenties or something like that.

01:25:06.85
Bill
Just by looking at her. It's like, well, you said specifically that this just happened to you and whatever. So I messaged this. I actually responded to it. And again, I'm like, like, this is a joke.

01:25:19.05
Bill
This is, that I wouldn't really say this. I mean, I'm explaining myself and I hit send. Then I exited either of there. I'm like, you know what? Fuck this. I went back in, deleted the comment, blocked her, deleted her. Yeah.

01:25:29.40
Mike
Right. Right.

01:25:30.55
Bill
And know I'm like, why, again, why do I have to fucking live that way?

01:25:35.27
Mike
Right.

01:25:35.42
Bill
It's my own, it's my own goddamn fault.

01:25:36.17
Mike
yet

01:25:37.55
Bill
You know, the the fact that I got involved in that, I posted something that I thought it was fucking funny. Everyone else, every fucking buddy else got a lot of laughs, lot of interactions with that one.

01:25:43.29
Mike
right

01:25:46.89
Mike
ah

01:25:48.31
Bill
Just if anything else, just a lot of, lot of front of people and laughs and likes and whatever, you know?

01:25:53.03
Mike
right right right right

01:25:54.92
Bill
And, um, you know, this one fuck,

01:25:55.69
Mike
Yeah. Hit a like button and move on Or don't and move on.

01:25:59.76
Bill
Right. Thank you.

01:26:02.70
Mike
if

01:26:02.91
Bill
Or don't. Or don't. And move the fuck on.

01:26:05.88
Mike
Yes.

01:26:05.97
Bill
But you know what? it's not It's not her fault. She's got every right in the world to make a comment. It's not like I not like i say nobody's allowed to comment on here or anything like that.

01:26:14.03
Mike
Right.

01:26:14.72
Bill
She's got every right to comment on it. I don't have to put up with it, though.

01:26:16.45
Mike
Uh-huh. Right.

01:26:18.71
Bill
I can do exactly what I what i ultimately did. And literally, I deleted her comment. I'm like, that's not enough. I blocked her. i'm like, that's not enough.

01:26:25.10
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:26:25.72
Bill
Then I just, oh, I unfriended her because she was she followed us.

01:26:25.78
Mike
Nice. Right.

01:26:29.30
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:26:29.81
Bill
So I unfollowed her and then fucking blocked her.

01:26:32.22
Mike
nice

01:26:32.81
Bill
And I'm like, there you go. Fucking two fingers at you, you fucking whore.

01:26:36.75
Mike
yeah yeah

01:26:37.89
Bill
And again, it's ah it's not her fault. I just, you know, I don't i don't need this fucking bullshit.

01:26:39.58
Mike
right

01:26:42.20
Bill
You know, I don't need to deal with it. I don't need to be involved with it.

01:26:44.73
Mike
sir

01:26:44.94
Bill
But, you know, I think about that the podcast that I was talking to Ian about that I got of brought up brought up about that podcast where those two individuals just stopped, you know, their podcast member a year ago, whatever it was.

01:26:54.50
Mike
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:26:55.76
Bill
And what what the the female used to say, actually, both of them used to say, especially the female on TikTok, because they had, I mean, they had tens of thousands. I mean, like 100,000 followers. they had It was crazy number of people that follow these guys um on their TikTok pages.

01:27:05.31
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:27:09.60
Bill
So every once in a while, this, uh, this, this chick would mainly get the weird comments and she's like, especially to begin with an early sobriety. Cause she was like two, three years sober at the, at the end of their run, um, with a podcast.

01:27:19.49
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:27:21.22
Bill
Um, she's like, you know what? She goes, I, I, she goes, I, I block and bless.

01:27:25.86
Mike
Right. Mm hmm. Mm hmm.

01:27:27.62
Bill
And that's, that's what she would do. She's like these people, she goes, I used to get so tied into it. She goes, especially when I first got sober, cause these people would get under my skin. And then finally she's like, she goes, i don't even comment on I don't, ah don't even comment.

01:27:38.86
Mike
right

01:27:39.99
Bill
If I read the comments, she goes, that's number one. That's my fault to begin with. But she's like, if I read the comments and they affect me, she said, that's a problem.

01:27:46.47
Mike
hu

01:27:47.38
Bill
But if it really bothers me, but yeah, she used to say that all the time. She goes, I blocked him, blocked and blessed him. I'm like, It's fucking awesome.

01:27:52.89
Mike
and sir

01:27:55.98
Mike
It is.

01:27:56.26
Bill
It's just fucking awesome. But um yeah, so anyhow, that was that was us getting our getting our fun on there. But last thing here real quick. So you know a fella by the name of Marc Maron, don't you?

01:28:08.22
Mike
I've heard of him.

01:28:09.25
Bill
and ah And a fella by the name of Jim Gaffigan?

01:28:11.68
Mike
Yeah, heard of him too.

01:28:13.23
Bill
So they, Marc just posted a thing that they did. They did this Q&A thing at some ah theater in in New York, I guess, after they did screening of off as a screening of his documentary or movie or maybe even that or maybe it was a comedy special whatever it was but they did the screening this back and forth so um they were talking back and forth about people's attention span you know and the i think jim is the one that brought it up because jim was asking him some questions they were in front of an open audience whatever or open openly in front of an audience

01:28:42.86
Mike
Right.

01:28:43.14
Bill
And then he said that, you know, they were talking about these days, mainly comedians do like three minute clips and then like these 34 minute specials in both, you know, Jim and Mark are like, they're like, whatever happened to the fucking hour, man, do the work, do the hour.

01:28:56.93
Mike
All right. Mm-hmm.

01:28:58.07
Bill
And Mark's going fucking nuts.

01:28:58.11
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:28:59.27
Bill
He's like, he goes, it took me two fucking years to get this hour in shape.

01:28:59.78
Mike
right

01:29:02.59
Bill
And he goes, but I did the hour.

01:29:04.25
Mike
says

01:29:05.34
Bill
And then it just kind of made me laugh. But then they went on about the fact that Mark had said that he said he doesn't think that people have lost their attention span, which I thought this was interesting. Nobody's talked about that yet.

01:29:16.60
Bill
um He basically said that, you know, all that people have done is You know, yeah, I mean, people people run on, um you know, these little clips and things like that. And everyone's telling us that everything needs to be run in two and three minute clips or one minute clips.

01:29:30.17
Mike
Right.

01:29:31.38
Bill
Like, for instance, what I do, our opening, I ah usually try to make art the the one that I post on on Saturday at the opening of each episode. I try not to let it run longer than two minutes um because then because I know what the again, what the supposed algorithms are with Instagram because I've read the shit.

01:29:42.39
Mike
Right.

01:29:48.74
Bill
But now the one with when we talked about Heidi and her anniversary, that conversation went on for just, I think just over three minutes.

01:29:55.84
Mike
Okay. Mm-hmm.

01:29:56.42
Bill
And i I posted that entire clip. Okay. And when I went to post it, the pop up on Instagram said, just so you know, this is over three minutes. It will not, it will not be shared with anyone outside of your followers.

01:30:05.62
Mike
Right. Right. Yeah.

01:30:10.68
Bill
No new followers, anything. And I'm like, fuck you.

01:30:12.19
Mike
ah

01:30:12.65
Bill
I don't care.

01:30:13.53
Mike
right

01:30:13.98
Bill
You know, this was a, we're talking about our friend. So fuck you, you know,

01:30:16.22
Mike
right yeah

01:30:18.12
Bill
um But so basically what Mark was talking about, it wasn't that people have low attention spans. He goes, he goes, really? He goes, you're trying to tell me that everyone out there can't think for more than two minutes. He goes, you're telling me that somebody can't sit down in front of a TV and watch a, watch a half hour show and that somebody can't watch ah a movie in a theater for two hours.

01:30:35.44
Mike
Right.

01:30:35.54
Bill
He goes, it's, he goes, it's fucking bullshit. You know, so he was talking about long form stuff.

01:30:38.29
Mike
Uh huh. Right.

01:30:40.77
Bill
And then it just kind of made me think of it. I'm like, everything that, you know, we were told to begin with, don't make your episodes longer than 20 minutes. Don't do this.

01:30:47.18
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:30:48.09
Bill
run these thing clips.

01:30:48.08
Mike
Mm hmm.

01:30:49.30
Bill
Instagram saying that I read the one thing the one time where Instagram saying it's a 30 second clip. It'll go out to all these people. 60 seconds. Anything over 90 seconds is only going out to certain people. Anything over two minutes will not go out to whatever.

01:31:01.95
Bill
And finally, I'm like, fuck it. Because I'm running, I'm trying to run, yeah run a 60 second clip of this.

01:31:05.06
Mike
Right.

01:31:10.19
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:31:10.96
Bill
gets me gets either one of us clearing our throat

01:31:13.84
Mike
Yeah, a clear fucking thought. A complete thought. How about that?

01:31:18.22
Bill
yeah yeah so um i don't know it just kind of made something like that and it's just he was just talking about you know obviously a little bit about the podcast and um you know the uh everything that he did and you know kind of the same thing you know like ah we had talked a little bit i mean we're not comparing i'm

01:31:18.82
Mike
Yeah.

01:31:33.67
Bill
I'm not trying to compare us to Mark fucking Marin.

01:31:35.39
Mike
Sure.

01:31:35.75
Bill
I'm not doing that. um But some of the things he says makes me feel um really good about what we're doing.

01:31:41.62
Mike
Yeah, little validation.

01:31:42.08
Bill
You know, it it really is. um And again, I mean, we're if we could stay small for fucking ever, you know, but um we're doing what we want to do.

01:31:48.54
Mike
Yeah. Mm-hmm.

01:31:50.94
Bill
Not not what anyone else is telling us to. And it's not an egotistical thing. It's just a point of personal freedom, I think. Right.

01:31:56.66
Mike
Yeah, absolutely.

01:31:57.41
Bill
Um, and, um, you know, we're, we're not out there hurting anyone. We're actually hopefully helping some people along the way, but we're not going we don't have to conform with this new thing.

01:32:07.94
Bill
And, and I don't think we're being, you know, uh, obstinate about the whole goddamn thing. It's just, it's a matter of, this is the way that we want to express ourselves and there's nothing wrong with it.

01:32:15.96
Mike
Yeah.

01:32:18.01
Bill
There's a, there's an audience for it and either they'll find us or we'll find them or we fucking won't.

01:32:22.69
Mike
the Right.

01:32:25.61
Bill
Yeah.

01:32:25.71
Mike
We're still going to do it our way. We're still going to have complete fucking thoughts. That's right. We're going to spend some time because time matters, motherfuckers.

01:32:35.98
Bill
Yeah, it really does. The the only thing that I'm going to say, and I don't, did you listen to that two episodes ago when the whole editing thing, when I dropped out and stuff like that?

01:32:43.88
Mike
You know what I did? i actually, because I wanted to hear it I wanted to hear what it sounded like.

01:32:45.29
Bill
Okay.

01:32:48.63
Bill
Okay, what's your opinion on that?

01:32:50.18
Mike
i loved it. Yeah.

01:32:51.26
Bill
Okay. Did you? Okay. Because I was going to say it it it was a lot, you know, I think maybe for somebody listening to it.

01:32:56.84
Mike
yeah yeah

01:32:59.24
Bill
um But the the only thing I, because I thought about them like, eh, maybe if something like that happens again, we we might want to save the listener and cut it out. But but I don't know. I mean, it's that's a long...

01:33:08.06
Mike
i found I found it entertaining, man.

01:33:10.45
Bill
Did you really? Okay, good, good, good.

01:33:11.00
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:33:11.73
Bill
Okay.

01:33:11.76
Mike
Yeah.

01:33:11.96
Bill
Okay.

01:33:12.32
Mike
You know, I mean, i um yeah. You know, if i was if I listened to and was invested in, you know, because I do. I listen to podcasts. I listen, well, a couple and and whatever.

01:33:21.47
Bill
Right.

01:33:23.01
Mike
and it's something like that, you know, again, the stuff I listen to generally tends to be rural. I mean, the main one I listen to is, you know, basically formatted like a radio show and because he's a radio guys and, um, you know, yeah, you know, something fucks up.

01:33:34.27
Bill
Right.

01:33:39.14
Mike
You just keep going, man. You know, I mean, that's the way it works with live radio, you know, and that's kind of, it's why I like the way we do this because it's, it's set up that way.

01:33:43.74
Bill
Right.

01:33:49.81
Mike
Yes. We could stop. Yes. We could start over. Yes. We can edit things, but fuck it, man. We're, we're, we're getting on and we're doing what we do.

01:33:55.31
Bill
ah

01:33:57.99
Mike
And this is the way we do it. And um again, you know if if I was invested, I was listening to something and it was something that I liked and something like that happened. It's fucking entertaining, man.

01:34:09.52
Mike
i You know, I liked it.

01:34:11.27
Bill
OK. Well, in, right.

01:34:11.86
Mike
I didn't continue to listen to the episode because I know what the fuck happened. Again, i know I listened to it because I wanted to hear what it sounded like. I knew what happened, but I wanted to, you know, as a listener, I wanted to hear what it sounded like.

01:34:22.68
Mike
And I loved it. I thought it was entertaining.

01:34:23.82
Bill
OK.

01:34:24.60
Mike
And yeah, so there.

01:34:26.27
Bill
Well, in that and i'm and i'm glad I'm glad you did because I was i was actually going to say that you it it was one of those, and I think maybe what it is is that I'm umm too close to it sometimes with the um with putting the stuff together and whatever and and realizing, and and I got very anxious when i was when the when it was the internet was down and I couldn't get back up there.

01:34:36.36
Mike
isn Right.

01:34:44.63
Mike
Right. ah i Right.

01:34:46.59
Bill
You know, so maybe that was, I was just too close to it, but okay, no, that's fine.

01:34:49.77
Mike
Yeah. Oh, I mean, I was fucking anxious, fucking padding for time and, you know, trying to figure out what the hell was going on.

01:34:49.98
Bill
That's... and

01:34:55.37
Mike
And like I said, you know, you said you were offline, so you couldn't even stop it. So I kind of had to keep going. And yes, it was uncomfortable as as fuck, but I loved listening to it.

01:35:02.37
Bill
yeah

01:35:06.02
Bill
Right. Well, yeah.

01:35:06.95
Mike
who

01:35:07.00
Bill
And that's, that was just a funny part because, and I don't, I think the, um, and I'd have to look into it. I, I might, we, we, I'll look into it and figure it out.

01:35:16.06
Mike
ah

01:35:16.21
Bill
I'm, I'm wondering if, um, I think I could make you, whether it's a co-host or something, there's another, another level that I can make somebody.

01:35:23.04
Mike
yes

01:35:24.55
Bill
Um, but okay.

01:35:25.31
Mike
it sounds that sounds a lot like adding another book

01:35:26.73
Bill
And,

01:35:30.08
Mike
f f f f

01:35:30.34
Bill
Okay, then we don't know we don't know if it ever happens again, we'll deal with it same way. It doesn't really matter. It's a worst-case scenario. You just unplug your...

01:35:38.01
Mike
you just have to call You just have to call quicker so I can put the phone up to the microphone.

01:35:40.92
Bill
yeah

01:35:42.16
Mike
and ah yeah

01:35:43.35
Bill
Well, and that's the thing now I know I didn't, that didn't even occur to me. And then I'm like, Oh, i should pick up my phone. So I will, I'll, I'll do that next time. Cause that, that was actually funny. Once I got on the phone, that, that kind of made, that made me laugh.

01:35:52.16
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:35:54.06
Bill
That part made me laugh, but, but whatever it was, it was like, cause that was a total of like eight minutes.

01:35:55.24
Mike
Exactly.

01:35:58.66
Bill
I think it was, and it was the first, it was like the first four, three or four, um, were leading up to that.

01:35:58.95
Mike
Yeah, I know. Yeah.

01:36:05.39
Bill
Then we're three or four, obviously trying to get back on there. But, uh,

01:36:08.11
Mike
is

01:36:09.03
Bill
But that's, yeah okay, I'm glad. i um I'm glad I asked. I almost forgot to ask you about that.

01:36:13.32
Mike
Right.

01:36:13.60
Bill
But, you know, just to me, it it felt uncomfortable, but maybe that that was why it was entertaining.

01:36:17.19
Mike
but Oh, yeah. Who cares? Right. Who cares what we felt?

01:36:20.13
Bill
Okay.

01:36:23.02
Bill
Yeah, that's that's a good point. we'll just do it for that We'll just do it for the listener, which is the the point anyhow.

01:36:27.40
Mike
Right. But I think we started off saying something about, you know, taking on other people's pain, making yourself uncomfortable for the betterment of others.

01:36:37.80
Bill
Right. Exactly.

01:36:39.72
Mike
yeah

01:36:40.80
Bill
All right. So, I mean, I've got, there I've got, so actually I actually had some articles and things like that, but I don't know.

01:36:44.60
Mike
Nah.

01:36:45.08
Bill
We got, we got Wednesday. We got, we got plenty of time.

01:36:46.53
Mike
We do. We got, yeah, exactly. well We got to figure out to fill it Wednesday, man.

01:36:50.28
Bill
Yeah. We're.

01:36:52.47
Mike
That's going to be an interesting one. So, yes.

01:36:55.51
Bill
Now there'll be, ah yeah, there'll be, I still, I, I get, I literally to what I had to sobriety things I brought up on here. We got plenty, we got plenty to talk about, but, um, Oh, let, well, last, last, last thing, uh, listening to a podcast and the person, uh, and I thought that this was kind of fun.

01:37:03.33
Mike
Yeah.

01:37:10.43
Bill
I think both of us can relate to it. They were talking about, uh, as they got sober, blah, blah, blah. And how they, how they stayed the way they were for the longest time.

01:37:17.47
Mike
hu

01:37:17.65
Bill
And the person said, I got comfortable living in the sadness.

01:37:21.80
Mike
ahha

01:37:22.56
Bill
And I was like, Fuck.

01:37:25.62
Mike
Uh-huh. Uh-huh.

01:37:26.63
Bill
I'm like, that's fucking powerful.

01:37:29.82
Mike
Mm-hmm.

01:37:30.93
Bill
It's true. Fucking it true.

01:37:31.93
Mike
Oh yeah, absolutely. Well, yep comfortable laying in your own shit. We've talked about that plenty of times, right?

01:37:35.96
Bill
Yeah.

01:37:37.69
Mike
Exactly. Comfortable living in the pain, comfortable. That's why a lot times when you get sober, you miss sitting in your own shit. You miss being miserable because that's what you're used to.

01:37:48.81
Mike
Yeah.

01:37:49.01
Bill
Right.

01:37:49.09
Mike
I mean, that's part of the growing pains when you first get sober and getting out of this. Fuck. I feel happy. What the hell, man? I mean, you talk about it plenty that you still deal with it sometimes. Why am I so fucking happy? Yeah.

01:38:01.08
Bill
Right?

01:38:01.56
Mike
Yeah, I mean, I do too. You know i don't know, every once in a while it hit me, God, I'm i'mm in a good mood. What the fuck's wrong with me?

01:38:07.86
Bill
I know. And it's a, I tell you, it's a, it, ah I, I know when I'm in a funky mood. I may not know why, but I know when I'm in a funky mood and I never questioned it.

01:38:15.34
Mike
Right?

01:38:16.67
Bill
I'm just like, well, this is where I fucking live, you know?

01:38:19.13
Mike
Yeah, right.

01:38:19.49
Bill
Cause I mean, i I was walking around here the other day and it was before I found out that Sarah died. I was just, I was grumbling about something. I don't know what the fuck it was again, but two days ago.

01:38:25.43
Mike
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

01:38:28.27
Bill
And I have no idea what the fuck I was grumbling about.

01:38:29.52
Mike
Right.

01:38:30.07
Bill
Imagine that.

01:38:30.42
Mike
Right. Right.

01:38:31.50
Bill
Then I'm like, like, God, I gotta get my fucking head on my ass.

01:38:33.99
Mike
Why not?

01:38:34.29
Bill
You know, so that's, that's my normal thing where I got, where I say that to myself, not, you know, it's like, Jesus Christ, I'm in a really fucking, what the fuck?

01:38:34.41
Mike
Yes, we are. We are very done. right

01:38:42.40
Bill
Why am I happy?

01:38:43.58
Mike
right why not

01:38:47.45
Bill
Why the fuck? All right, man. So, you know, I think that, uh, what do you think? are Are we done? Are we done?

01:38:53.47
Mike
yes we are we are very done

01:38:56.85
Bill
right, man, your turn. Hey, everyone, you missed this shit last week. I just i just told everyone, I'm like, i I don't know what the fuck he goes into.

01:38:59.93
Mike
Hi

01:39:03.47
Mike
there.

01:39:03.94
Bill
I said, I know up and I don't have it memorized. I'm not going to fucking look it up.

01:39:07.50
Mike
um

01:39:07.55
Bill
I kind of rumbled through the you know the whole rolling into the commercial. I laughed when I was going into our little sponsor break. And I'm just like, yeah I said, keep on listening. I said, we got the recorded part.

01:39:18.76
Bill
You'll hear Mike in a minute.

01:39:19.79
Mike
ha

01:39:20.60
Bill
Something like that. so So ladies and gentlemen, I present to you once again, we present our friend Mike.

01:39:28.01
Mike
hi there No, thank you everyone for listening to yet another episode of Sober Not Mature. As always, be kind to each other, be good to each other, go out there and do something nice for somebody else this week, and don't tell anybody that you did it.

01:39:46.47
Mike
Now, from the bottom of my heart to the depths of my soul, from the beginning of time until the ends of the earth, always and eternally, fuck you.

01:40:02.09
Mike
Now it's time, kids. Ooh, it's time. It's time for you to fuck off. Then keep fucking off. Keep fucking off till you get to a gate with a sign on it saying, you cannot fuck off past here.

01:40:18.10
Mike
Climb over that gate. Dream the impossible dream. And keep fucking off forever.

01:40:27.35
Bill
Sounds like somebody missed us.

01:40:29.48
Mike
ha ha ha ha.

01:40:32.92
Mike
Right.

01:40:33.76
Bill
I was fucking laughing through that entire thing.

01:40:35.18
Mike
po the

01:40:37.09
Bill
I'm like, this dude's fucking performing for us.

01:40:39.98
Mike
Right. Ook.

01:40:40.78
Bill
Dance, motherfucking monkey. Dance. Yeah.

01:40:43.51
Mike
Ook. Ook.

01:40:45.96
Bill
That was a good one. That was a good one. But seriously, ah welcome welcome back.

01:40:47.53
Mike
Yeah. don

01:40:49.38
Bill
And yeah, I guess ah we're we're just going to go ahead. what What fucking day is it today? We're going to go ahead and do this again in a handful of days.

01:40:53.82
Mike
I don't know.

01:40:55.95
Bill
But you know what?

01:40:56.14
Mike
We are.

01:40:57.08
Bill
Everyone out there, um I don't know. i was gonna I got nothing else to say. I was going to say, out we'll try not to talk about all the grim stuff.

01:41:04.77
Mike
ha

01:41:04.92
Bill
This fucking life happens again. But fuck, it is what it is.

01:41:07.52
Mike
but It is.

01:41:08.57
Bill
It is what it is.

01:41:09.62
Mike
We talk about what it is.

01:41:11.74
Bill
Yeah.

01:41:11.82
Mike
So there it is. is.

01:41:14.01
Bill
What it is is what it is. So it is.

01:41:16.08
Mike
It is.

01:41:16.59
Bill
Fuck me.

01:41:16.62
Mike
love you

01:41:19.90
Mike
We shall.

01:41:20.08
Bill
All right, man.

01:41:20.28
Mike
Bye.

01:41:20.99
Bill
I love you, brother. We'll talk soon.

01:41:21.58
Mike
i love you too we shall

01:41:25.30
Bill
Bye.

01:41:25.93
Mike
by